[Top Posting for effect] What they are leaving out is how small the pool got in the last few months.. which really screws up balance. One day of a big pool = 2 or 3 months here. That wasn't the case until recently... So one bad day at a big pool means come back in 3 to 4 days to see if it evens out.. but here, you have to come back about 9 months from now just to see if the 'luck works out' for a similar dataset If you don't think that means anything, then I guess you think every 38 spins of a roulette wheel will always pick all the numbers once. That is the mentality here that 'luck evens out' even with a tiny pool. yup.... Since I'm new to Kano, I wanted to find out what the average bitcoin payout has been over the last month or so. I'm trying out Kano based on all the reviews, however I'm used to somewhat instantaneous results with other pools showing their payout rates and paying out every few days. I understand the premise of Kano being smaller but with bigger rewards per miner, but I'm curious what the historical payout rate has been.
Sounds like your used to PPS, Pay Per Share, Pools. This pool is PPLNS, that is a major difference so you'll need to study on that. PPS has a flat rate regardless of luck. PPLNS is luck based. So if the pool has really good luck you can get paid allot more, the flip side, of course, if luck is bad then you can get paid less. Over long periods of time you'll be allot better off here. PPS pools have a habit of going broke due to bad luck and leaving people unpaid when that happens. That won't happen here. Do you actually mine in KanoPool? You seem to spend enough time in here reading and talking down on it, I'm wondering what your intentions are by poking your head in to only deter people from mining here. He seems to be rather confused based upon this signature as well... oh well, to each their own. |
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I keep checking the website about every hour it seems. I’m so anxious to see if we found another block.
Get yourself one of the smart phone apps and the Zach Monroe CKPool Monitor. Then you can get text and email notifications of found blocks and down miner notifications  From Kano's first post on page 1 of this forum topic: Except that doesn't work on Android. I've never got a block notification from it, or a hashrate notification. Hasn't worked for a couple of updates ago Did you ever try the CKPool Monitor by Zach Monroe? It is web based and it does work to send you both email and texts for new blocks and down or under-performing miners. You can configure it to let you know if any of your miners drops below a hash threshold of your choosing. you know I had gone there, got an account and never did anything with it... Just finished that process so we'll see how that works  ... Thanks for the reminder, I do know the Android app is busted, but I had forgotten about the last link. |
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Since I'm new to Kano, I wanted to find out what the average bitcoin payout has been over the last month or so. I'm trying out Kano based on all the reviews, however I'm used to somewhat instantaneous results with other pools showing their payout rates and paying out every few days. I understand the premise of Kano being smaller but with bigger rewards per miner, but I'm curious what the historical payout rate has been.
Can you spend a few minutes reading back through this few posts as well as the page prior... Seriously we get this question at least 10 times a day, the answer isn't want you'll expect and it may not be what you want to hear. But those that are here are here because we know the benefit. Good, bad, and ugly. But please just read back through a few pages worth of posts and on the kano.is site make sure you understand the help->payouts link in the upper right. |
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I keep checking the website about every hour it seems. I’m so anxious to see if we found another block.
Get yourself one of the smart phone apps and the Zach Monroe CKPool Monitor. Then you can get text and email notifications of found blocks and down miner notifications From Kano's first post on page 1 of this forum topic: Except that doesn't work on Android. I've never got a block notification from it, or a hashrate notification. Hasn't worked for a couple of updates ago |
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I keep checking the website about every hour it seems. I’m so anxious to see if we found another block.
HAHA - no one will admit it, but *DONT WE ALL!!!* |
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First this is my first writing on this great forum. In advance please apologize my ignorance of the question. I just acquired S9 3 days ago and after reading here and there finally I hook my S9 to kano.is and this my first mining experience. Ive checked on dashboard but I don't understand if my setup is proper because I don't see anything on reward page. Can I ask help kano official looking at my setup if it registered and setup correctly?. Tq.
Welcome aboard! I'm relatively new here too, and I found right off the bat not to waste time mining anywhere else. Thankfully, I have a friend who'd already been mining here for a while, so he gave me a heads up about the whole ramp-up process, which you can start trying to understand by reading the Help>Payouts link in the top right of the webpage. If you're not a math major , just get a visual aide from the Workers>Shift Graph, and take note of the red shaded area that highlights the past 5Nd period. You can tell how "ramped up" you are by seeing how much of that red shaded area you've been mining at full-capacity. The cool part is: the faster we create new blocks, the more double, triple, etc. you'll be given credit for the shares submitted during that rolling 5Nd window. Just be patient, and if you get stumped, feel free to ask a question here on the forum. This is a great group of folks that have more than willingly answered my questions along the way. Mine on! I've looked at payment and block status trying to learn. I see past few month quite blocks were found. Sometime every and sometime it took few days or even weeks. Last January the pool found 8 block, while this month, Feb, so far only 1 block was found. Please correct me if I'm wrong reading it. What still confuse me is 5Nd, does it mean 5 days continuously my S9 running?. I just want to figure maybe any average days when the block to be found. I feel myself so nubie on this mining world. There is no way to predict when a block will be found, at average it's the current published difficulty in # of shares. That means with this pool size, it's approx, well, you just saw it 2+ days. But it could be before it or could be after - e.g. the last block took 2+ weeks and was almost 600% (6x the difficulty in shares). 5Nd is defined here https://kano.is/index.php?k=payout. it is not 5 days, has nothing to do with days only the rates of the pool. Bottom line, a) we don't get paid until we find a block b) you have a 13+ day ramp up period before any payout would be based upon 100% of your shares - this will move based upon what your average shares are (e.g. you add more hash power or remove it). It will also extend past the time you leave on the same principle. c) you are not paid for any shares that might be greater than the 5N period (on in the case of the last block, most of us contributed almost a whole diff in shares that weren't counted) d) you can be paid more or less for shares depending on how frequent the blocks are found (see the PPLNS description in the link above) WHAT IS SAID IN THE POST BELOW!!! |
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Really none of you run the DPS1200's? (not the black connector ones, but the blue connector ones DPS-1200FA-1 A's) - These are the 94% Titanium rated ones and underclocking the 741 to -1, they run amazingly cool to the touch and I've yet to have a problem with them. In fact they came highly recommended. I would *never* run a 741 on a regular DSP-1200FA (the one without the the 1A), they run very HOT and are not 94% rated.
And for the record, I'm talking 240V not 120 (I would never run one on 120v on a 741)
Btw, normally i would agree with you on the head room in a power supply, but these server supplies reach their max efficiency in the upper percentage of use, in fact, they draw more watts at lower utilization as a function of their efficiency curves than they do at the upper range.
You can also get some 1400 PSU's that use the common slot... Maybe I'll have to look into those. I like the 1200's because they don't have a tiny turbine for a fan in them like the sorcerers (which I have but hate)
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ok, I give, how do you share a imgur image? I tried just the link, that didn't work, then I tried wrapping it with the image wrappers and that didn't work... must be a trick I'm missing?
You use the BBCode (message boards & forums)  Ah ha! Thanks, figured it out with that tip. |
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ok, I give, how do you share a imgur image? I tried just the link, that didn't work, then I tried wrapping it with the image wrappers and that didn't work... must be a trick I'm missing? Was testing, but this is my shift graph from the (600% block)... Almost at 100%, but gave some shares to a friend to keep him in the game because he lost AC and had to do dark for half a day.  |
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 here is the shift graph that shows that the average is incorrect how is the average incorrect? The pink block is the 5Nd, you had ~70Th inside the pink area for less than 50% of it. The fuzzy math says, there is your 32Th/s Ignore the red line at 27 something, that is your average across the entire chart, not just the 5Nd |
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Block Block UTC Miner Reward N Diff N Range Pool N Avg Your % Your N Diff Your N Avg Your BTC
508425 9/Feb 20:11 12.44363511 14.378T 366hr 33m 46s 46.80PHs 0.07% 9.925G 32.30THs 0.00858980
however i pointed about 70th/s at the pool since then, and about 5 days in, increased my hash rate to about 87.
also, thank you for explaing the 5nd thing, that makes a little bit more sense but it still doesn't explain the extremely low payout.
I included the 2nd pic to show the start of my mining and the hashing rate. It wasn't exactly 10 days, it was less but the point remains and it seems off
Looking at your screenshots, you've been mining with ~5 miners over that period for the 6-7 days before the pool found a block. Back of my napkin math is: 5 * 7 days = 35 TH average Yours shows 32.3TH which agrees within 10% of my very rough calculation. problem is, if you look at my actual hashing rate, how was the 35th/s calculated? i can send more pics of the rest of the shares for the rest of the block, the average should have been at least double that. will the other 4 payments over the course of the next few blocks be greater than that first payment? is that just the average hash rate for the 1st 1/5th of the payments? Just make this easy on yourself... post the picture of your shift graph, that will tell all the story anyone needs to see what happened |
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I wasn't sure by what it meant ramp up. So essentially pay is held until this time frame has passed?
Whats the point of a ramp up period? It says to reduce variance but how does it accomplish that?
Payment per block is paid according to the number of shares you've sent to the pool over 5x the current difficulty. At current pool hash rate and network difficulty, this works out to all the shares you've submitted over the past 13.5 days. The reward you get is then (Your Shares) / (Total Shares submitted to pool over 5Nd) * (Block Reward + tx fees) - 0.9% Pool fee. So, if you pool hop during the 5Nd period, you're submitting fewer shares to the pool compared to people who didn't at the same hash rate. Edit: This is aimed at reducing pool variance by discouraging pool hopping. I understand this already but my point is being missed. When looking at the shifts, the reward stated was about 0.086. When looking at the payment section, the reward was 10% this amount. I had mined for about 10 days. I hadn't mined since the start of the block but that should be irrelevant because the payout method doesn't base anything on time but rather shares submitted. Has my reward gone missing? Why is there a major difference in the stated reward and the actual payout. Am i not understanding something here? Can someone please actually just explain it instead of telling to the read links that I have already read or copy and pasting something from kanos site? DELETED cuz smarter people than me answered *correctly* below |
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You mention that its uncommon to have unpaid shifts but looking at my shift reward, it says 0.08655 and going into my payments after the block matured, i received 10% of what was rewarded at 0.0085898. I am also not even sure if that was the shift that was paid. In my payments, that amount appeared before the block matured but payment was only sent out after the block matured however the reward information tells me that I only had about 40% my actual hashing. Someone please tell what to do. I have been thwarted.
I seriously doubt you have been thwarted. Did you read - https://kano.is/index.php?k=payoutThere is a 13 day +/- ramp up on this pool (also works to your advantage when you leave as it's 13 day +/- ramp down How many days had you been on the pool when we found that block, if it was less than 13, then you got some percentage less than 100% because you hadn't completely the ramp up |
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NEW POOL RULE: No more >500% Blocks!
In all seriousness, though, if we hit several in a row, we would be technically paid multiple times for the same shares, right?
I guess it all evens out in the end... like everything else, I suppose.
Yep - hitting multiple in a row is great when it happens. Over a long enough period, it will even out. The variance from block to block is high, but over a large sample, it's good. The trick is to be able to increase your hash rate strategically and use cash flow and profit to do that and float costs in bad months. Amazing how this starts to fit together *once you get in the middle of it*... How do the PPLNS payments work?
The 5Nd means the pool rewards 5 times the expected number of shares, each time a block is found.
So each share will be paid approximately 1/5 of it's expected value, in each block it gets a reward,
but each share is also expected, on average, to be rewarded 5 times in blocks found after the share is submitted to the pool.
i.e. if pool luck was always 100% then each share is expected to be rewarded 5 times.
If pool luck is better than 100%, then the average share reward will be better than 5 times.
If pool luck is lower than 100%, then the average share reward will be less than 5 times. ^^ from the PPLNS link on the home page COME ON BLOCKS!!! |
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Wow... So, for all the blocks that are over 500%, no one gets paid for the work their miners did over the 500% mark?
That's disappointing if you're right.
Sorry - that's the way it works on every PPLNS pool. If you don't find a block during the LNS period, you don't get paid for those shares. I had to go refresh my memory as well... it's at the top of the home page. We use PPLNS (Pay Per Last N Shares)
PPLNS means that when a block is found, the block reward is shared among the last N shares that miners sent to the pool, up to when the block was found.
The N value the pool uses is 5 times the network difficulty when the block is found - '5Nd'. Using fuzzy math would this mean that while the block was almost 600% difficulty, we were only paid as if it were 500% (number of shares) and that other 100% was not paid shares? [maybe a gross and missleading point, not sure] |
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Holy Sh**t I actually looked at my reward for last block...  26.31THs 0.00699728 last block january i got for 26.46THs 0.01220075 okay the block in january was 15.06 BTC. But man...nearly cutting the reward in half in 2 weeks?? Did I miss something? The pool hash rate basically doubled - so that's the big difference. Block 505456 we were at 32.68PHs, this last one we were at 46.80PHs. Bigger hash rate plus smaller block, plus more big players = smaller reward. but with the hopes for more frequent blocks. It's the trade off. Need a larger pool size (combined hash rate) means everyones profit per share is lower due to dilution, but with the promise or more frequent blocks. |
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Quick check folks ...
Im fully ramped (N ave 54TH+), for the last block i got 0.0144 BTC for 54TH (4xS9s).
is this amount the 1/5 of 5Nd payout? So i would receive 0.0144 for the next 4 days based on current hashrates? (assuming no additional blocks are found in between)
this is my 2nd month here, so havent seen payouts in action much (other than the little one from the previous block) Thanks.
The payout on this last block is the only payout you will get.... Until the next block, there is no payout for 4 days after the first one... the 5N doesn't have anything to do with days. |
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FEATURE REQUEST:
On these Canaan Miners, an rPi3 acts as a controller for up to 20 different miners.
Would it be possible to take the API information from cgminer, which appears to support all the miners on the rpi, broken out into their own section and show them as individual as opposed to one monolithic miner.
Each with their own temp, stats, etc. Similar to how you break down GPU cards in a miner?
Thanks
do you have the A721/741 showing in awesome miner ? ... I'm assuming you mean the avalon 7series . yes, 721/741/821/841 all use the same basic approach and yes I have 4 miner on one rPi and it's only showing one AV7 which is an aggregated view of the 4, and I'd like to see the 4 individually, they are each reported in the cgminer API In general, Awesome Miner display what the API is reporting. You will not get 4 individual miners as you only have a single Cgminer API running, if I understood your setup correctly. If you want you can send me the API report (toolbar Tools-> Api Report) for this miner and I can verify sent via PM |
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Block Block UTC Miner Reward N Diff N Range Pool N Avg Your % Your N Diff Your N Avg Your BTC 508425 9/Feb 20:11 12.44363511 14.378T 366hr 33m 46s 46.80PHs 0.03% 4.242G 13.80THs 0.00367090 According to this, my s9 is fully ramped up right? I find the reward small for such time... used to make 0.0021xxx BTC on slush daily before I left for kano 16 days ago Or i may be completely wrong?  I hope we crack like 10 in a row in the next days  how many blocks were in that day at BTC? You can't look at payout vs. payout, you have to look at block payout vs block payout. And take the ugly with the good. e.g. I just looked at all my slush blocks and at the same hashrate, I was easily 20% better here, and that was only at 89% ramp. assuming over time, we'll average too 100% difficulty, to compare a single block at 500%, vs multiple blocks in a payout just isn't fair. |
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BF - any update on 821's through customs/shipping?
Just anxious is all
ps. anyone confirmed these will run on DPS1200 PSU? as in replacing 741's on that PSU?
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