Remember initially they were going to have their NRE all paid for up-front. So what changed? I imagine their investor(s) looked at where the market and difficulty was going and decided it was way too much risk for however many million and backed out and Cointerra decided to offload risk to pre-order customers and continue with the venture.
That was HashFast, I think. Cointerra said they were going to do pre-orders but had spent like 1.5m already... Someone showed a photo of their original presentation, I think to investors? somewhere earlier in this thread where they'd been planning to do upfront NRE themselves and sell finished products. That then changed and they affirmed the pre-order model. |
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question is, can they meet the production demand of so many buyers in ~ 2 mths?
No one knows that for sure at this point, not even Sam and KNC. Place your bets! If you had concrete info that guaranteed one or the other outcome, the rational thing to do would be to place a very large bet on that outcome and monetize your info. If you're right you can make a nice chunk of change. Seems most people are skeptical, given what's happened with other ASIC companies (or perhaps just biased by past performance of other companies). Personally I think XCrowd is a scam, Cointerra doesn't have their heart in it and is late to the game, and Terrahash got screwed over by Bitsyncom shipping super late. But of them, apart from KNC, Cointerra would be your best bet, but they aren't shipping until November at the earliest, so good luck! Meanwhile Avalon claims their Gen-2 chip released in October (lol). Possibly few will buy it however, we shall see. I have yet to see any thing that makes me fear KNC won't live up to their delivery promise. What about Bitfury? Hashfast? Bitfury's already a sure thing, they are either already shipping or about to. Quantity is a question and you can't get them directly outside Russia so they're being resold for more than they really should be ($19,000 = lol). Seems like a great chip, though I'd rather have a multi-core approach like KNC. I think all future companies will (or should) go multi-core approach in a blade-friendly form-factor. We shall see. Hashfast, haven't much looked into them. Seems similar to Bitfury. Might be a bit late to the party tho if KNC ships. |
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The lower the prices the better.
Sure, but the rate of difficulty increase is flying so high right now that the value of X gigahash/sec is being cut in half by the month. So there's only so many more months until the difference between profit and market value is zero. I mean, this is crazy, I've never seen anything like this in any other industry. Profitability is a matter of weeks right now! We're certainly living history. Maybe this will be known as the great gigahash-crash of '13. Who knows. The market glutted with gigahash that can't pay for their purchase price and/or can't pay for their electricity costs if run, and hardware companies stuck with machines they can't sell anymore. That's bound to happen. If Cointerra isn't careful they may be stuck with unsellable inventory. Remember initially they were going to have their NRE all paid for up-front. So what changed? I imagine their investor(s) looked at where the market and difficulty was going and decided it was way too much risk for however many million and backed out and Cointerra decided to offload risk to pre-order customers and continue with the venture. But despite their awesome experience and bona fides, it may simply be too late to make an impact, especially if KNC ships. Wait too long and the only price someone will buy a Cointerra machine for is less than it costs to produce the device. Wait a bit longer and even the chip will be worth less than it costs to run it on electricity. Well, Cointerra's chips will likely have world-class efficiency, so perhaps they'll always have chip-buys in the end, but it will be at a marginal profit at best, not BFL or Avalon profit. Those days are gone. |
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question is, can they meet the production demand of so many buyers in ~ 2 mths?
No one knows that for sure at this point, not even Sam and KNC. Place your bets! If you had concrete info that guaranteed one or the other outcome, the rational thing to do would be to place a very large bet on that outcome and monetize your info. If you're right you can make a nice chunk of change. Seems most people are skeptical, given what's happened with other ASIC companies (or perhaps just biased by past performance of other companies). Personally I think XCrowd is a scam, Cointerra doesn't have their heart in it and is late to the game, and Terrahash got screwed over by Bitsyncom shipping super late. But of them, apart from KNC, Cointerra would be your best bet, but they aren't shipping until November at the earliest, so good luck! Meanwhile Avalon claims their Gen-2 chip released in October (lol). Possibly few will buy it however, we shall see. I have yet to see any thing that makes me fear KNC won't live up to their delivery promise. |
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Is the details of you correct ? We never seen you before, so please take some photos of yourself, your partners , your office and your products and post them here. Right now we don't know who you are?? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=248396.msg2641524#msg2641524Founder appears to be a scammer but i will let you be the judge of that. I dug up a bit of info on him. Looks like he spent a lot of time trying to run investment scams in 2008 and 2009. Also found his ebay account which basically has negative feedback for every transaction. He does have a nice website and renderings though. Roll Eyes A little background on the founder:  NAME: Abdi Mahamud AGE: 23 USERNAMES: abz123uk (2009 -2012 Twitter and eBay) rat1on1990 (2008) Ironicarm (2009) miggni (2009) rat1oN (2009) Amelioratr (2009) ratman (2009) Nordstrom (2008-2009) Niles_Touch (2008) EMAIL: info@amelioratecorp.comNordstrom@amelioratecorp.comMAhamud@amelioratecorp.comNiles_Touch@hotmail.co.ukPHONE: 44-7930804630 LOCATION: Currently loctaed in Leicester, UK Originally from Birmingham, UK Company Registered at the following address 2 City Arcade Birmingham, B2 4tx EDUCATION: Master of Engineering (MEng) in Electrical and Electronics Engineering - De Montfort University (2008-2011) (Seems a bit short for a Masters) Golden Hillock School (2001-2006) (High School) PREVIOUS JOBS/EXPERIENCE: 2011 - Present Executive Director, Founder - Terra Group FME Stealth Mode. 2011 - Present Co-founder - Sophia Jennah Ltd (Also from Facebook page he was the "Former Director of Procrastination") 2009 - 2010 Sales Executive - ITSec Pvt Ltd Information Technology & Services 2009 - 2010 Sales Executive - Logoinn Graphic Design to be updated 2008 - 2009 Assistant Marketing Manager - Ameliorate Group Ltd My role is to provides support for the Ameliorate Group to achieve its business objectives and strategies. The primary role of the Assistant Marketing Manager is to oversee the planning, creation and post-analysis of promotions; evaluate the unit, sales and gross profit productivity of new and carryover products; provide direction on new product needs; and provide marketing support on special programs and market-specific requests.Responsibilities* overseeing all marketing, advertising and promotional staff and activities* establish marketing strategies to meet organisational objectives* evaluate customer research, market conditions and competitor data* Assist in implementing the organisations marketing plan* to help manage the Marketing Department budget and deliver all marketing activity within set budget* managing correspondence with media and advertising outlets 2007 - 2008 Project Manager & Sales Agent - E5 Design studios Animation As the Project manager I was an integral part of delivering rapid growth to E5'snew business venture : WebLines Media. I was also responsible for direct marketing, establishing brand awareness in the online market and generating both individual and corporate leads as well as face to face selling. 2008 Chief Marketing Officer - Ameliorate Group Ltd My role is to provides support for the Ameliorate Group to achieve its business objectives and strategies. The primary role of the Chief Marketing Officer is to oversee the planning, creation and post-analysis of promotions; evaluate the unit, sales and gross profit productivity of new and carryover products; provide direction on new product needs; and provide marketing support on special programs and market-specific requests. Responsibilities * overseeing all marketing, advertising and promotional staff and activities * establish marketing strategies to meet organisational objectives * evaluate customer research, market conditions and competitor data * implement the organisations marketing plan * to manage the Marketing Department budget and deliver all marketing activity within set budget * managing correspondence with media and advertising outlets 2008 Owner - Ameliorate Group Ltd LINKS: Facebook Yatedo Profile (Similar to Linked In) eBay Feedback Sophie Jenna Ltd. (Muslim Women's Fashion) Oh this isn't that thread? So he started a new thread after being doxed on that one? Wow. |
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Do you know why your ignore button is getting more yellow by the day? It's because more and more people are ignoring you on this board and for good reasons.
Huh, I never knew that. So clearly you must have a much older account on Bitcointalk.org. What's your main? And if you won't dox your main yet will you do so after launching. Your customers should have full disclosure on who's sock-puppeting this account. |
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Cheers. It came out quite readable on our test but we'll be looking into how to resolve this for future updates.
Who is 'we'? Who even are you? What's your name and position in the company? What's your Skype number? Who in the community has talked to you? What's your bona fides? I know who Josh/BFL, Yifu/Avalon was and even Sam/KNC, who are you? We haven't published anything on the company for the same reason we have limited the released details on our line-up. Since we aren't taking direct payments from the public we reserve the right to disclose (& avoid getting doxed) what we want and when we deem it necessary. Uh huh, fine w/e. Red flag tho. The way I see this going down is you offer escrow, w/e, and either scam some coins or try to get people to just give you coins w/o selecting escrow as an option of your site, or something else like that, maybe upgrades after the main escrow. We shall see! |
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Cheers. It came out quite readable on our test but we'll be looking into how to resolve this for future updates.
Who is 'we'? Who even are you? What's your name and position in the company? What's your Skype number? Who in the community has talked to you? What's your bona fides? I know who Josh/BFL, Yifu/Avalon was and even Sam/KNC, who are you? |
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What is the point of making a town inside of the US? You would still have to follow federal and state law, which defeats the purpose.
Correct, thus /r/seasteading |
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Round 1
Avalon, BFL, ASICMiner
Round 2
BitFury and KNC
Round 3
HashFast, XCrowd, Cointerra, Avalon v2
The pricing in round 3 is going to be cut throat. XCrowd priced at $16k for 2.4 THs units. So far that is the best price; right?
Round 3 is likely to crash and burn, methinks--if KNC ships there's going to be blood in the water everywhere else. Customers will melt away even at the cutthroat prices offered, and companies will be skinned to the bone on profit and not want to bother continuing for but little remuneration. If you have a miner that's paid its hardware costs by November, you're in a pretty good position and it becomes a drawn-out efficiency game until the price of bitcoin either goes up considerably again or some new and more efficient tech comes down the pike. |
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Some of you seem quite angry... here's a meme for you  /thread |
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Tonight, KNC released pricing around single digit levels per GH/s for November shipping. Eh? Oh, yeah mean sub $10/GH/sec? Yeah. Apparently the actual manufacturing cost of the chips themselves is $2 gh/sec, add in the machine, admin, and shipping and parts costs for the rest. Figure, $4.5/gh is the total cost and the rest possibly profit. Still room for cutting the price further, down to, say, $6 /gh/sec. |
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Cointerra comes out with 350W chip doing 500gh and they didn't get half the shit, doubt, and dire that KNC got for claiming 100gh @ 250W max per chip  |
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Be serious, man, there's a million ways things could go wrong for Cointerra too, and ship date is ultimately more important than efficiency at this point.
Actually, I think price would be more important. Something is only a competitive advantage if your competition can't match it. KNC already announced a $5k price in November--the likely earliest ship date for Cointerra. What Cointerra might have on KNC is efficiency, maybe, we don't know exactly yet or by how much. KNC meanwhile has an earlier ship date, and that matters way more unless Cointerra wants to drop their miner's price precipitously in Nov, sub $5k, which I doubt they want to do. |
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I look forward to a cointerra pre order.
Everyone is trying to race to be first, or else it's too late, you will never get roi. You have everything to lose in a few weeks.
Cointerra isn't bothering with this stage of the race, and seems to be starting the next one.
They know full well, as everyone does, that the network hash rate could well be 5 petahash by the time they release their product, and they still feel like they will be competitive. I like that.
I think the steepest part of the difficulty chart would be September to November. A product that comes out when the chart flattens out a little will have an advantage.
But what do I know, I am a 3 post newb.
Be serious, man, there's a million ways things could go wrong for Cointerra too, and ship date is ultimately more important than efficiency at this point. |
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I'd say its worse news for Avalon's new chip than for us. They're selling chips, not full machines, so there's another month lag time at least, and they may not see people buying as much as they hope if KNC ships. The door on ASIC profitability is closing and people who get their ROI covered will be sitting pretty and then it won't make sense for others to jump into the game.
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the important right now is for the announcement, about the chip and the order, hope that it will be positive result.
ya i tend to think it will be.... i think this is his way of reminding us tho, of who's da man lol ") Is there a positive result for any Avalon chip buyers at this point? I'm not sure they can achieve positive ROI. Even Batch3 people who have their complete miners now may not ROI. |
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beside the preorders facts, i ve got a presentation from cointerra where they only shows their interests in mining for themselves and not only selling miners
what is your exact plan?
i ve got a ppt presentation where all this is detailled →i can put it online if someone needs it
That is outdated. We do NOT plan to mine. We only plan retail sales. Because they figured out where the least risky money was to be made :\ On dupes who can't see where the difficulty is going. Cointerra appears to be too late to the party. If KNC ships, they're largely screwed. High efficiency is a luxury only if the device can achieve positive ROI in the first place, efficiency then extends its life against electrical costs. I don't think a device shipping in Jan '14 with these stats can achieve positive ROI unless it's less than $2k, and then that's hardly any profit for the manufacturer so why are they bothering. Late, late, for a very important date. |
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 No mean-spiritedness. We believe in friendly business, healthy competition.
Here at bitcointalk.org, we believe in pitchforks. |
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