CoinTerra announces its first ASIC - Hash-Rate greater than 500 GH/s

[crazyearner]

Any options to do local pickup for warehouse or office complex ie pay on arrival at company and pay in person or maybe to do a deposit on order and then rest on collection?

[Ytterbium]

I don't really get why people take XCrowd seriously. It seems scam-y as hell.

The issue I have with them is the high level of design.. weird, i know.  But no other company has put so much effort in design at their stage other than BFL.

The other thing keeping them talked about is the ability to escrow the funds.

Their designs make no sense at all - they look like they'd be really expensive to manufacture, compared to something like the Avalon case, anyway.

Maybe their plan is to lock up a bunch of money in escrow, then use that as an asset to get a loan from someone? Maybe they'll scam people with their multi-sig escrow for large BTC purchases. Or it's possible they really do have a ton of money and no idea what they're doing. In which case I don't see the need for escrow.

[cointerra]

Any options to do local pickup for warehouse or office complex ie pay on arrival at company and pay in person or maybe to do a deposit on order and then rest on collection?

Yes, such options are available. We will release the details on our website during the product launch by end of this month.

[WastedLTC]

Round 3 is likely to crash and burn, methinks--if KNC ships there's going to be blood in the water everywhere else. Customers will melt away even at the cutthroat prices offered, and companies will be skinned to the bone on profit and not want to bother continuing for but little remuneration.

If you have a miner that's paid its hardware costs by November, you're in a pretty good position and it becomes a drawn-out efficiency game until the price of bitcoin either goes up considerably again or some new and more efficient tech comes down the pike.

Completely agree...    god I hope KNC ships on schedule!   

[eve]

Round 1
Avalon, BFL, ASICMiner

Round 2
BitFury and KNC

Round 3
HashFast, XCrowd, Cointerra, Avalon v2

The pricing in round 3 is going to be cut throat.  XCrowd priced at $16k for 2.4 THs units.    So far that is the best price; right?

Round 3 is likely to crash and burn, methinks--if KNC ships there's going to be blood in the water everywhere else. Customers will melt away even at the cutthroat prices offered, and companies will be skinned to the bone on profit and not want to bother continuing for but little remuneration.

If you have a miner that's paid its hardware costs by November, you're in a pretty good position and it becomes a drawn-out efficiency game until the price of bitcoin either goes up considerably again or some new and more efficient tech comes down the pike.

The lower the prices the better.

[Anenome5]

The lower the prices the better.

Sure, but the rate of difficulty increase is flying so high right now that the value of X gigahash/sec is being cut in half by the month. So there's only so many more months until the difference between profit and market value is zero. I mean, this is crazy, I've never seen anything like this in any other industry. Profitability is a matter of weeks right now! We're certainly living history. Maybe this will be known as the great gigahash-crash of '13. Who knows. The market glutted with gigahash that can't pay for their purchase price and/or can't pay for their electricity costs if run, and hardware companies stuck with machines they can't sell anymore. That's bound to happen.

If Cointerra isn't careful they may be stuck with unsellable inventory.

Remember initially they were going to have their NRE all paid for up-front. So what changed? I imagine their investor(s) looked at where the market and difficulty was going and decided it was way too much risk for however many million and backed out and Cointerra decided to offload risk to pre-order customers and continue with the venture.

But despite their awesome experience and bona fides, it may simply be too late to make an impact, especially if KNC ships.

Wait too long and the only price someone will buy a Cointerra machine for is less than it costs to produce the device. Wait a bit longer and even the chip will be worth less than it costs to run it on electricity.

Well, Cointerra's chips will likely have world-class efficiency, so perhaps they'll always have chip-buys in the end, but it will be at a marginal profit at best, not BFL or Avalon profit. Those days are gone.

[Ytterbium]

Remember initially they were going to have their NRE all paid for up-front. So what changed? I imagine their investor(s) looked at where the market and difficulty was going and decided it was way too much risk for however many million and backed out and Cointerra decided to offload risk to pre-order customers and continue with the venture.

That was HashFast, I think. Cointerra said they were going to do pre-orders but had spent like 1.5m already...

[Anenome5]

Remember initially they were going to have their NRE all paid for up-front. So what changed? I imagine their investor(s) looked at where the market and difficulty was going and decided it was way too much risk for however many million and backed out and Cointerra decided to offload risk to pre-order customers and continue with the venture.

That was HashFast, I think. Cointerra said they were going to do pre-orders but had spent like 1.5m already...

Someone showed a photo of their original presentation, I think to investors? somewhere earlier in this thread where they'd been planning to do upfront NRE themselves and sell finished products. That then changed and they affirmed the pre-order model.

[Flying Hellfish]

Remember initially they were going to have their NRE all paid for up-front. So what changed? I imagine their investor(s) looked at where the market and difficulty was going and decided it was way too much risk for however many million and backed out and Cointerra decided to offload risk to pre-order customers and continue with the venture.

That was HashFast, I think. Cointerra said they were going to do pre-orders but had spent like 1.5m already...

Someone showed a photo of their original presentation, I think to investors? somewhere earlier in this thread where they'd been planning to do upfront NRE themselves and sell finished products. That then changed and they affirmed the pre-order model.

Why would any company risk their own, or investors money when they can risk your money for nothing? 

Economics 101 people:

Business model A, fund entire business with owner/investor capital.  Company is successful and owners/investor make a killing.  Company flops, goes bankrupt etc owners/investors lose all/majority of investment

Business model B, fund as little of the start up as possible while still retaining all/majority ownership, round up investomers to pre-order and bare majority of risk.  Company is successful and owners make a killing, investomers simply get a product they paid for that they will be lucky to break even on and WILL be obsolete in a few months. Company flops, delays delivery, goes bankrupt etc and owners are out only initial funding (at worst, possible owners actually profit off bankrupting/delaying delivery LOL) while investomers lose EVERYTHING/majority of +ROI. 

There is a reason why the majority of ASIC manufacture's want you to shoulder the risk FOR them instead of WITH them, look at BFL and Avalon for two big reasons why (SHIT HAPPENS when you don't control every single solitary process and even sometimes when you do!)

[btceic]

investomers  .... Love this FH

[Dimsum]

At this rate the only way CoinTerra is going to be worth is if they produce a 1TH/s machine and price it so good that nobody will even think of KnC. It has to be the same sort of difference like when you see BFLs 500GH/s machine sold for $22k when KnC is offer 400GH/s for $7k - it's a no brainer. Cointerra is going to have to pull off something like this. They openly stated that they want to make it more efficient with smaller chips etc, but with Bitcoin and where the difficulty is headed, that won't matter. Right now being first counts, because at the rate the difficulty is set, by the time the CoinTerra machines arrive, they are just going to be too late and overpriced.

To be honest, ASIC manufacturers should really be talking about 750GH~1TH/s at this point in time.

[cointerra]

At this rate the only way CoinTerra is going to be worth is if they produce a 1TH/s machine and price it so good that nobody will even think of KnC. It has to be the same sort of difference like when you see BFLs 500GH/s machine sold for $22k when KnC is offer 400GH/s for $7k - it's a no brainer. Cointerra is going to have to pull off something like this. They openly stated that they want to make it more efficient with smaller chips etc, but with Bitcoin and where the difficulty is headed, that won't matter. Right now being first counts, because at the rate the difficulty is set, by the time the CoinTerra machines arrive, they are just going to be too late and overpriced.

To be honest, ASIC manufacturers should really be talking about 750GH~1TH/s at this point in time.

Yes, we plan to have > 1TH/s rigs, and Yes, the prices will be much lower than the competition. Our product lineup, specs, and prices are coming out by end of this month.

[CoinHoarder]

At this rate the only way CoinTerra is going to be worth is if they produce a 1TH/s machine and price it so good that nobody will even think of KnC. It has to be the same sort of difference like when you see BFLs 500GH/s machine sold for $22k when KnC is offer 400GH/s for $7k - it's a no brainer. Cointerra is going to have to pull off something like this. They openly stated that they want to make it more efficient with smaller chips etc, but with Bitcoin and where the difficulty is headed, that won't matter. Right now being first counts, because at the rate the difficulty is set, by the time the CoinTerra machines arrive, they are just going to be too late and overpriced.

To be honest, ASIC manufacturers should really be talking about 750GH~1TH/s at this point in time.

Yes, we plan to have > 1TH/s rigs, and Yes, the prices will be much lower than the competition. Our product lineup, specs, and prices are coming out by end of this month.

Can't wait for that.

Good luck from a fellow Texan.  

[bitcoin carpenter]

at this point youd have to be saying $5 and 1 watt per GH to get me to even go to a preorder site

[Anenome5]

at this point youd have to be saying $5 and 1 watt per GH to get me to even go to a preorder site

Yeah, around there, although sub 1GH/watt efficiency is expected at this point from anyone claiming 'full custom ASIC.'

[deadgiveaway]

At this rate the only way CoinTerra is going to be worth is if they produce a 1TH/s machine and price it so good that nobody will even think of KnC. It has to be the same sort of difference like when you see BFLs 500GH/s machine sold for $22k when KnC is offer 400GH/s for $7k - it's a no brainer. Cointerra is going to have to pull off something like this. They openly stated that they want to make it more efficient with smaller chips etc, but with Bitcoin and where the difficulty is headed, that won't matter. Right now being first counts, because at the rate the difficulty is set, by the time the CoinTerra machines arrive, they are just going to be too late and overpriced.

To be honest, ASIC manufacturers should really be talking about 750GH~1TH/s at this point in time.

I also hope that opt to limit 1TH per customer. See that way the rich in Bitcoins cannot stay at an advantage simply because they were in a luckier position earlier on in the mining game. No one wants an elite group in Bitcoin, although it is inevitable as time goes on, the more it is inhibited, the better us small losers have a chance, and this is also healthy for the overall growth/popularity/valuation of Bitcoin. Think how advantageous it is to those early miners who may have 500+ BTC at their disposal to purchase many terahertz of mining power? This creates a huge backlog causing shipments to delay. It won't affect the big sharks because they're already well off, it's the small guy who gets screwed the most ALWAYS. This big sharks versus small sharks situation has to be stopped before it really begins and fucks up Bitcoins mining community. Cointerra can stop this from happening quite frankly. The community will recognize what they have done, in my opinion, and they will end up with much respect from the community. Am I totally off? Am I thinking of this the wrong way? Should those with plenty have more while those with little struggle? Is that what this community is banking on for the long term success of Bitcoin? We'll see. I could be way off. Maybe the little guy really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

[giorgiomassa]

At this rate the only way CoinTerra is going to be worth is if they produce a 1TH/s machine and price it so good that nobody will even think of KnC. It has to be the same sort of difference like when you see BFLs 500GH/s machine sold for $22k when KnC is offer 400GH/s for $7k - it's a no brainer. Cointerra is going to have to pull off something like this. They openly stated that they want to make it more efficient with smaller chips etc, but with Bitcoin and where the difficulty is headed, that won't matter. Right now being first counts, because at the rate the difficulty is set, by the time the CoinTerra machines arrive, they are just going to be too late and overpriced.

To be honest, ASIC manufacturers should really be talking about 750GH~1TH/s at this point in time.

It is so funny that everybody out there (KNC and now CoinTerra too) tries to put as much hashing power as possible in a single package, like a race to say "look, I got the biggest one!". But you know what? At the end it doesn't matter if your ASIC does 10, 100 or 1000 GH/s, the only thing that matters is the total cost of the BOM, including external components.

As such, a $50 power sucking 500GH/s ASIC can easily be beated by an array of 10 highly power efficient 50 GH/s tiny ASICs that cost $3/ea. Ah, the magics of distributed work!

[dan99]

at this point youd have to be saying $5 and 1 watt per GH to get me to even go to a preorder site

$2 to $3 per gh/s at less than 1 watt is better.

[zedicus]

At this rate the only way CoinTerra is going to be worth is if they produce a 1TH/s machine and price it so good that nobody will even think of KnC. It has to be the same sort of difference like when you see BFLs 500GH/s machine sold for $22k when KnC is offer 400GH/s for $7k - it's a no brainer. Cointerra is going to have to pull off something like this. They openly stated that they want to make it more efficient with smaller chips etc, but with Bitcoin and where the difficulty is headed, that won't matter. Right now being first counts, because at the rate the difficulty is set, by the time the CoinTerra machines arrive, they are just going to be too late and overpriced.

To be honest, ASIC manufacturers should really be talking about 750GH~1TH/s at this point in time.

Yes, we plan to have > 1TH/s rigs, and Yes, the prices will be much lower than the competition. Our product lineup, specs, and prices are coming out by end of this month.

Got an eagle eye on this thread.

[Anenome5]

at this point youd have to be saying $5 and 1 watt per GH to get me to even go to a preorder site

$2 to $3 per gh/s at less than 1 watt is better.

Thus the problem, because that figure pushes up against the cost of the machine itself, outside very large volume. At some point there's no more 'cheaper' to go to. And the worst part is, the chip still loses half its value a month later.