Or possibly the same price for batch 4 as it was for batch 3 with less time before block halving on batch 4 than for batch 3.  Only time will tell.

If that happened, Bitmain, would simply raise the price of the S7.  IMHO

My guess is every S7 sold helps them net 3.0 to 3.5 BTC minimum at present price of the S7.

I'm not wanting to come across as though I'm attacking you cause I'm not.

I just don't think that type of accusation promotes a healthy relationship between BITMAIN and the miners they sell rigs to.  I would rather refrain from such accusations without proof.  There may have been proof in the past in some cases.  However, that does not mean they would do it now.

I agree with you 100% on everything you said in this post.

For the record:  I only encouraged someone to gain access [if possible] to 240 Volts instead of 120.  I did not know their situation or the particulars regarding where they lived (apartment, single family home, conjoined home with other homes, etc...), which would result in further questions.  We never got into any particulars.  I did say there is no limitation on a main service panel like there is for circuits inside of walls and/or conduit at 70 to 80 percent.  Then gave an example:  If a Main service is rated at 200 amps, that's the maximum it can do (200 amps).  dance191 and I simply got into a misunderstanding.  I can see where my statement could have been taken the wrong way by a newbie to electrical work.   Hence his reasoning for his statement.  While I was still stuck on not limiting the main service panel to 70 to 80 percent like the circuits connected to the main service panel.  Even though I was stuck on that, I should not have used the tone I had with him and I probably should have taken it to a PM.  

I also stated that I was pursuing getting my master's electrician license at one time to start my own business and stopped just shy of taking the test for my journeyman's license.  I saw how easy it was to get outbid by a competitor when starting my own electrical business while working for Marathon Electrical Contractors.  So, I ventured into a business partnership with my father training telephone technicians.  After all, I was in that line of work in the Marine Corp.  So, it was obvious I'm NOT a certified electrician.  You probably came in late in the ball game and never saw the posts I deleted.

I did send 2 or 3 PM's to you but you may have been busy at the time.  I did not know how to take the phrase "training gig."  I didn't know if you were being sarcastic or what.  I obviously took it as sarcasm.  Forgive me for jumping to conclusions.  When I did not receive a response from you via PM, I assumed I had offending you with my tone towards a fellow miner.

Most all of my posts on the subject were deleted by me except for the occasions where you may see someone quoted me.  I always make it clear I'm not licensed.  I have 3 years experience in electrical [All of it commercial; not residential] while working for the 2nd largest electrical contractor in the State of Alabama from May, 1994 to July, 1997.  Will I do electrical work for someone?  No, I'm not licensed, nor do I have insurance.  I don't want to be sued if something were to go wrong.  I'll do it for myself and that's it.

I'm actually paying for Marathon to add another 200 amps to my house in December.  I want something that major to be done by a licensed electrician and certified by an inspector so that I'm covered in the event something was to go wrong.  Especially, when I sell my house at some point in the future.  I will run all of my circuits from that new panel myself inside conduit to my mining closet.  I would rip out the conduit with their circuits before I move; leaving only the new panel still on the wall in the garage.  I want to take the 240V/30A outlets with me when I move as well.  This also means I would demo the mining closet and finish the downstairs recreation room where it's located before selling the home.  I may still keep the home just to have somewhere to stay if we should ever come back for any reason.  Might rent it out.  I'm just not sure yet.

But again, forgive me for jumping to conclusions about sarcasm after no response to my PM's.  I suppose I should have been more patient and waited for a response.

Good luck with the dress hunt.

ROLL TIDE!

Yes, I totally agree with you.  I've done this myself before my kilowatt meter went out on me.  I've also seen this on youtube with fans hooked up to a meter.



I could go along with that.  However, I'm sure there are multiple reasons why the rig runs better at a certain range of temperatures than other temperatures outside of those ranges.  Adjusting the fan speed while monitoring the hash rate and HWE's reveals this.

But yes, I could see the importance of fans at high enough RPM's to keep the temperature from going so high as to make the heat sinks fall off due to possible vibration.

What I'm about to say is only speculation:

I'm pretty sure the fans will draw more current as the temperature rises.  When the fans turn at higher RPM's it results in more current draw.

As for higher hash rates and lower HW errors; this one blows my mind as well.  I know in the wire-line telephone industry, the amount of resistance we have in the cable per foot changes with temperature.  The cooler the temperature [Due to contraction - getting smaller in diameter] the wire would have more resistance per foot.  The warmer the temperature [Due to expansion - getting larger in diameter] the wire would have less resistance per foot.

I'm sure it probably gets more deep than just the resistance changing with temperature.  That's why I said someone with more experience in electronics might be able to elaborate on the subject.

The only thing I can "speculate" on is with the warmer temperatures and expansion of material and components in the blades possibly resulting in less resistance to impede transmission.  However, there is a breaking point at how hot is too hot where the material and components can break down.  I'm sure others with more experience would be able to elaborate on this with a more informative explanation than mine.  I'm only speculating.  That's it...

I know manufacturers of ASIC's have implemented circuits that are programed to throttle down an ASIC once it gets to a certain temperature and even shut the ASIC down once it gets to an even higher temperature to avoid potential meltdown and/or fire.

Edit: Once the rigs get above a certain temperature and potentially that creates even more expansion of materials that could be enough to affect the capacitance in the blades.  For example, the two copper wires with a poly-etholine coating on them in the wire-line telephone industry are twisted together.  These two wires are in essence a capacitor, which is at least 2 metal plates separated by an insulator(s).  Three things that affect the value of a capacitor is the size of the metal plates, distance between the plates and the material between the plates.  As the capacitance increases [Due to expansion - larger metal plates] higher frequencies are affected by this increase in capacitance.  I will not elaborate on how and why [Taking up too much space in the forum] but it does affect them.

So, the only thing I can speculate on is the resistance in the materials used in the blades decreases with temperature rise because of expansion.  This reduced resistance increases the hash rate and reduces the hardware errors.  However, if the temperature continues to rise to a point of creating considerable expansion of those materials to change the capacitance, it can affect the impedance in the blades so much that it reduces the hash rate and increases the HWE's.  Again, this was only speculation.

I know hybrids in carriers in the telephone industry have to be a certain impedance: 640 ohms for non-loaded pairs and 900 ohms for loaded pairs.  If we ever have a customer's line not loaded properly, it can change the impedance on the line [Making it not balanced with the hybrid in the carrier] and can potentially create echo-return-loss or reflection in the signal in certain situations.  That could be what is occurring when the temperature gets too radically hot above the high 60's or 70's; creating echo return loss or reflection of the transmission between components [because of a change in capacitance], which could increase errors and reduce hash rate.

That was my two cents.  It was given to encourage discussion and thought on the subject.  I promise, I will not curse out anyone this time if anyone was to chime in.  

I was totally out of line.  I could not see his face nor hear his tone or lack there of.  I just flat out misunderstood what he was implying and got worked up over it and lost my shiznit.  If we were on the phone or talking face to face, the entire thing could have been avoided.  I apologized in a PM and deleted my post shortly after the PM.  I learned a valuable lesson from all of this.  I really feel bad about the whole thing.  The important thing is I have learned from it and will try not to make the same mistake again.



I agree with this 100%

I've obviously said things that have rubbed people in this forum [Like yourself] the wrong way.  I apologize to you and anyone else in this forum I have rubbed the wrong way.  As for advice on ANYTHING technical in these forums:  You, or anyone else, should be quite relieved not to hear anymore from me about anything "technical" from this day forward.  I leave that to you "professionals."

I apologized to dancer191 in PM's, deleted previous posts of mine to keep from trashing up this forum.

Everyone have a good day and may the blocks be with you!

If one is that concerned about it, they can always block out all but the last 4 digits of the MAC IP.  However, a NEW password works wonders other than root, root.

I agree with you dogie, your claim is relevant to the thread.  I believe your claim against Guy and SPT.  I really don't believe you would make false claims against them at all.  I have your back on this one and I appreciate all you have done and continue to do for the community.

People should not blindly trust the leader of a company just because they like some of their gear.  I frankly did not appreciate them identifying the SP20 as a 1.7 TH +/- 5% or 10% rig.  I don't remember whether it was 5 or 10 percent.  Bitmain, has better quality gear in my opinion.  Yes, SPT did have a better and faster user interface at the time.  However, BITMAIN, has come around to having one just as fast now.

Cheers M8

It's quite easy...

All 44 of my S3's, S4's, SP20's and S5's were sold on eBay.  I posted screenshots of the "Miner Status" page for each rig AND the "Network Settings" page for each rig.  This way, they new by the MAC IP ADDRESS assigned to each rig by bitmain on the assembly line is the actual rig they will receive.  It's like an SSN for each rig to identify it.  They also see several days of the rig mining consistently at 4.8+ TH/s at 600 MHz with low HWE's.

I also let them know since this rig is running super as proved by screenshots, that also shows the date the screenshot was taken, there will be no returns for the rig(s) they purchase from me.  I did all 44 of my various models of mining rigs this way without a hiccup.

In regards to shipping or in regards to testing each board for its quality?  Batch 1 & 3 are the same in specifications with different price and shipping dates.

I would think they would want to give everyone who ordered batch 1 [Expecting 4.86 TH/s] priority by shipping [As soon as possible] new rigs coming off the assembly line that were quality control checked to a total of 4.8+ TH/s.  Batch 1 held priority for shipping.  There hands were full with testing boards [Separating 4.8 from 4.6] and shipping out the 4.8 batch 1's first without having to compensate not only for being late but also for not being up to stated specs.

That still isn't bad.  Overall, I'm impressed with the quality of the build and the performance.  All of my S7's continue to mine at 4.8+ TH/s with a very low HWE rate.  It may be that we will see that 4% gain as expected [When over clocking] with future batches.  Only time will tell.

I believe the batch 2 are batch 1 rejects.  They were not mining to specifications they laid out for Batch 1.  However, they should work fine at 575 MHz instead of the 600 MHz originally quoted for Batch 1.

Batch 3 is 4.86 TH/s @ 600 MHz and Batch 2 is 4.66 TH/s @ 575 MHz.  200 GH/s difference and 1160 watts for Batch 2 verses 1210 watts for Batch 1 and 3.  They are both still 0.25 watts per GH

Good to hear.  Happy mining!

And may the blocks be with you.  As long as you are mining on the same pool I'm mining. 

Just kidding.

Very true.  I was once an electrician.  I was on my way to certification but never did get certified.  I quit just short of taking my test for my Journeyman's License.

I, by no means, am suggesting to turn a 15 amp (14 AWG) circuit into a 240 Volt 20/30/40 Amp Circuit.  Is that what you took from my statements?  I don't see this implication in my statements.  If your statement was simply to inform them they cannot do what I just stated, then ignore my question wondering if that is what you gathered from my previous post.  I was prepared to assist in letting them know what to do if they wish to hook up their rigs to 240 Volts.  One can have 240 Volts on 20/30/40/50/60 Amp circuits.  One could also have 240 Volt/15 Amp one poll breakers but that depends on the supplied voltage for each bar in the Main Panel.  You and I both KNOW they do not have 240 Volt on one bar in their main panel at their house if they live in the U.S.

I was going to suggest Tandem breakers to make room for 2 poll 240 Volt breakers if they have no room in their Main Panel.  Their Main Panel might be in a garage.  If not, they might have an attic to run the proper wiring.  It depends on the amperage they want or the length of the run, which would determine what gauge wire they would use.  They may want PDU(s).  They may prefer to make whips.  Who knows?

I just don't know their situation.  Hell, they might be in an apartment on the lower floor of a tall building.  There was simply no need for me to go into details if they have no desire to gain access to 240 Volts.  Some are just fearful of doing any electrical work at all.  I've helped several in this thread [With no experience at all] via PM's to get going with 240 Volts for their rigs.

If your wiring is running through walls, you are not to exceed 70% to 80% of the circuits amperage.  If your wiring is outside of walls and laying on a concrete slab with whips, you would be safe to run the circuit up to full amperage with the proper gauge wire.  No where in the electrical code will you see a limit on how much you can run your main panel.  If your main panel is a 200 Amp main panel, that is its limit (200 Amps).  The limitation is placed on each individual circuit inside of walls or small conduit, not the main panel.  Hence, the reason there are limits on how many circuits [Depending on the gauge(s)] can be in a particular diameter pipe and the material the pipe is made of [Rigid, PVC, Galvanized Steel, etc...].  There are just so many variables.

It's more worth it to do whatever it is you have to do to get access to 240 Volts then buy the BITMAIN 1600 Watt PSU or buy used server PSU's, such as the IBM 2880W with breakout board.  You are able to run twice as much hardware with 240 Volt verses 120 Volt.

Will do...

I will be checking out the links after my wife and son go to bed.  I'm still spending time with them this last day of the weekend.