List? What list?
Most likely the donations where not spent at all. I am sure the costs to run the forum has been covered by advertisement revenue.
(...)
TL;DR No matter what you say, the case is pretty clear: donations were collected and not used for the intended purpose.What is your example of the donations not being used for their intended purpose? |
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(...)
TL;DR No matter what you say, the case is pretty clear: donations were collected and not used for the intended purpose. List what donations have been used on. Hopefully short enough for you. |
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contracts do not have to be "physHical" to be valid. and no.... he has to use the money for what he said he would.
taking donations and speeding it on hookers and blow would not be legal. this would be called fraud.
I am indeed aware of this, techically, Theymos' only verbal contract was that donator's money would be used on forum upgrades. Donations were indeed not spent on anything except forum upgrades which you might consider overdue, but that should be irrelevant legally and morally. I know your hookers and blow example wasn't literal, but the funds were not spent on hookers, blow, personal expenses, etc. I cannot give my opinion as to whether Theymos is morally obligated to refund donations, as morals are very variable from person to person. I can only respond to legally liable to refund donations, of which he is not. Will he refund donations, I have no idea, I'm assuming he will address it as well as your and other's other questions. I don't blame him for not discussing his possible ideas with anyone, as they seem to get leaked ASAP. I am a Lawyer, and you can be sure that theymos DOES NOT have the OBLIGATION to prove on what he have spent DONATIONS he received without any kind of agreement (digital or paper).
And now is really the end of this history.
Regardless of if that is true or not, which pretty heavily relies on how the forum is registered (I don't want to disclose any details because I'm not personally sure) he has proved what the donations he recieved have been spent on. That comes in the form of donation money not leaving the forum's funds for the last two years, and the impending announcement of new forum software. Had he not told anyone about any of it until Monday when he said he would release the info to the public, we wouldn't be having this discussion. |
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One of Goat's questions in the other thread that this was split from, is will donations be refunded? Well, maybe since the forums has enough ad revenue to support itself now, but there is no legal entitlement to a refund.
Legal, not so sure that is black or white. Morally it is pretty black and white. These potential refunds, this is your idea or something Theymos is thinking about doing? Exactly, you dont have a physhical agreement or a contract , and because of that, theymos could have spent the bitcoins on wahtever he wanted on the forum. If I am correct, Goat is under the impression that Theymos SHOULD return the donations, as a moral obligation as he stated in the post above. Agusto is under the assumption he HAS TO return the donations. |
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One of Goat's questions in the other thread that this was split from, is will donations be refunded? Well, maybe since the forums has enough ad revenue to support itself now, but there is no legal entitlement to a refund.
Legal, not so sure that is black or white. Morally it is pretty black and white. These potential refunds, this is your idea or something Theymos is thinking about doing? No, I was referencing your original questions to Theymos, I have no idea what he is considering, but I'd imagine he will answer the questions you and others provided in the other thread when he said he will.
To make sure that I cover everything on Monday: What things exactly do you want explained?
Thank you theymos for asking this question. This suggests to me that you are interested in bringing transparency to this issue. Below is a list of question that I and a few of my friends would like answered. I do hope that others will post their questions in the thread as well so we can resolve this as much as we can on Monday. Who is the owner of the forum? Who is the owner of the BTC collected by the forum? Is bitcointalk a registered not for profit? Why do you think we needed to spend so much for software when there are free or much cheaper option available? What special features will the forum have? The $350,000 was just a down payment or the full amount owed? If it is not the full amount how much more could this end up costing us? When will the software be finished? I know you like to claim that you invested the money well and thus created more wealth for the forum, but did you not just neglect your duties and force us to use this software despite our donating more than enough to accomplish our goals? Let me point out that the forum was hacked after the time we should have had this resolved and lots of our data could have been stolen. Is our privacy worthless? Can you tell us about the decision making process and who you consulted with to use this firm Slickage? If this was a unilateral decision why did you think it would be good to spend at least $350,000 with out telling anyone? How are you sure Wangbus is able to accomplish this task? Have you seen any work that he is done, and if so can that work be made public? Why does his company not have a website? Has he ever done any projects before? Do you have a legal contract with Wangbus and if you do would you be willing to make it public? Are you getting a kick back from this operation or do you hold any interest in his company? Because of the cost of this software how much taxes will you be paying the US Govt? It has been clear that the forum was able to bring in more than enough money by selling adds. Since you did not use our donations in a timely fashion would you be willing to refund us our money? If not please tell us why. If you will not refund out money will you let us donate it to a charity of our pick? If not why?
If you will demand to keep all of the fund what will you use them for? Do you see this as your personal money? Would you be willing to set up a non profit to distribute the funds of the forum in two directions, one supporting the BTC community by helping start ups and the other to charity work that is promoting BTC? Did slickage accept BTC or fiat? Can we see the transaction in the blockchain? From malevolent 1) Was the $350k paid in advance or is it going to be paid in smaller chunks as progress on the new forum is being made? 2) Could you outline/clarify your responsibilities and obligations regarding the management of the forum funds so that there are no doubts about it? 3) Any plans for implementing some sort of a 2FA in the new forum? (this is especially important for people conducting trades over the forum) 4) What do you think about creating new boards or subdomains for altcoins for a recurring (monthly or quarterly) fee? They could even be excluded from the main forum's statistics, and have their own rules and policies (only retaining a few obvious such as no linking to SR-type onion sites or no trades of goods which are illegal in the buyer's or in the seller's country). Off topic, as a person what other interests do you have in real life. Thank you and I look forward to these answers. |
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LoL, the d00d most likely erased his post in regret.
*Sigh* no, I erased my post to avoid this, not that it matters anyway as the last half of this thread will most likely be split from this topic now. I'll wait for Theymos to do it however, I don't like messing with Meta threads. If you would like me to explain why you are wrong, you can pm me about it. d00d, this is called regret. Nice try, anyway. Here!, one more post to keep you busy. I was given the Ok to split the topic, so now that it is not going off topic, I can now post what I wanted to originally, going back to your church example. I understand that can be bad if you dond even got a subforum for that money but dont you could have made an agreement for that before the donation?? This is like if i open a lawsuit against the church of my town claiming all the donations i have made
It is your right to file a lawsuit against the church of your town if you think the church has been misusing the collected donations. This fall under charity fraud laws. If your church collects donations under the implied agreement to help the poor, they cannot just hold the collected amount to speculate in the financial markets. That was not the intended purpose of the donation and that is certainly not a charitable course of action. Moreover, churches are recognized as non-profit entities, so they cannot use the collected funds to generate profit. It is more like a church using donations for people who you do not agree with. The straight facts are A. You do have a Donators section, any side expectations are not Theymos' obligation. The existance of a Donator's forum fulfils that. And B. the funds would be spent on forum upgrades. The Donated Bitcoins have not been used for anything besides forum upgrades which you cannot deny. There was no agreement clause stating that Theymos had X amount of time to spend the donations or you would be entitled to them back. The coins sat until they were used for the promised purpose, you do not have the ability to say, well it wasn't done in the time I had expected, so I am entitled to a refund. One of Goat's questions in the other thread that this was split from, is will donations be refunded? Well, maybe since the forums has enough ad revenue to support itself now, but there is no legal entitlement to a refund. Please let me know if you think the title of the thread is appropriate, I figured that was the central issue here, but if you think of a more suitable one, it can be changed. |
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LoL, the d00d most likely erased his post in regret.
*Sigh* no, I erased my post to avoid this, not that it matters anyway as the last half of this thread will most likely be split from this topic now. I'll wait for someone else to do it however, I don't like messing with Meta threads, especially ones I'm involved in. If you would like me to explain why you are wrong, you can pm me about it. |
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Donator's section is there, but it may not be what you expected
and the fact that this thread exist obviously means that funds are being spent on new forum software. While you may disagree with parts of those features, you cannot dispute that A. There is a donators subforum and B. Money is being spent on new forum software.
That sub forum is not what he sold us and you know it. Quit trolling. Also doing so years after the fact is negligence. There really is a valid claim for fraud here. Pretending there is not is just silly. Am I going to sue theymos? No. But you saying his actions have been outstanding is retarded. I removed my post as it was off topic, hoping no one would get a chance to respond to it. If we want to discuss this further, we can do it elsewhere. Just because you don't agree with me, I'm not "trolling" I just happen to be of another opinion. Saying that Donations haven't been used for what they said they would be for isn't true, people just had different expectations. Theymos didn't say, we will have new forum software on X date, he just said the money would be used for new forum software. Its been sitting unused until now, so I do believe that fulfils his obligation. The question now, is whether he spent those funds unwisely, which we hope he has not, and wont know until he addresses more questions. |
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*Note to other mods and people that might report the thread*
This thread is a combination of meetup/organization of East Coast Bitcoiners as well as project development, please do not move it to the project development board. Thanks.
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The community will be asked for feature suggestions by the firm creating the new forum software fairly shortly. Watch out for a thread regarding suggestions, I'd imagine it will be stickied in Meta.
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I can probably order any phone from amazon for you. Where do you live btw, USA?
Yes I am in the U.S, I had thought about going through Amazon and buying Gift cards on Gyft, but new phones on Amazon are like $200 more than new on other sites. They try to sell phones with new contracts, else the phones are insanely expensive. I'm not looking for a new contract, just a phone that I can pop my AT&T Sim and and get to work. Thank you for the offer, but I'll pass, Im not in a huge rush, I'm just looking for something that has slightly more modern specs. I don't know what I'll need to do with the phone a year from now, and I don't want to have to upgrade in order to run whatever it is I need to run. And a similar response to the one above, thank you for the offer, but I'll pass. |
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Stickied for a day or two  If someone wouldn't mind pming me after the mandatory upgrade date has passed, I'd appreciate it. |
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Hey guys, I'm in the market for a new or very gently used Smartphone, something along the lines of a Samsung Galaxy S4, LG G2, Sony Xperia Z1s, possibly a Nexus 5, or something of similar utility that is not an Iphone (for obvious reasons)
If you have one for sale, or know of or own a site/service that sells phones for Bitcoins, please leave any pertinent info in the thread, or pm me. If you have something for sale personally, what it is, a description of condition, and price would be appreciated, and if I'm interested, I'll ask for pictures afterwards.
I'm more than happy to use a mutally trusted escrow agent, however I ask that the seller accomodates any escrow fees.
*Edit* Ended up buying a LG G2 for stupid fiat currency.
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I dont really see it as a problem, its actually pretty handy. I send pms to myself so I don't forget things, or if someone sends me a Bitcoin address over steam or skype for whatever reason, I can pm myself with the info, so I can use it from any computator or device.
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The 2011 Error Coin has sold. The three 2013 1 BTC Silver and Silver/Gold coins remain. I changed the OP to mention, if you are interested in some sort of trade, please pm me. I've had people offer me some neat stuff in the past, and am always excited and willing to trade stuff around for non traditional payment methods. Feel free to offer me BTC, Cash, Precious Metals, Mining Hardware, Personal Jets, or whatever else you are interested in trading. I am always excited to see a pm showing in my messages when I offer stuff up for trade, because I never know exactly what you guys are going to offer me. Its like Christmas without the scary fat man groping me.
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As I have got the question a few times now, I should mention that I will ship out of the U.S, I just put (U.S) in the title so people would know where the coins currently are at.
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This forum is in Panama. US and UK laws doesn't apply!!
It is Republic of Panama, not the Panama in USA!! This is located in Central America not North America!!
No its not, what are you talking about? All yes we are in Panama, Domain Name:BITCOINTALK.ORG
Domain ID: D162601474-LROR
Creation Date: 2011-06-24T05:19:00Z
Updated Date: 2013-12-26T03:07:53Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2023-06-24T05:19:00Z
Sponsoring Registrar:eNom, Inc. (R39-LROR)
Sponsoring Registrar IANA ID: 48
WHOIS Server:
Referral URL:
Domain Status: clientTransferProhibited
Registrant ID:7e4cc3537cad7b54
Registrant Name:WhoisGuard Protected
Registrant Organization:WhoisGuard, Inc.
Registrant Street: P.O. Box 0823-03411
Registrant City:Panama
Registrant State/Province:Panama
Registrant Postal Code:NA
Registrant Country:PA
Registrant Phone:+507.8365503
Registrant Phone Ext:
Registrant Fax: +51.17057182
Registrant Fax Ext:
Registrant Email:
Admin ID:7e4cc3537cad7b54
Admin Name:WhoisGuard Protected
Admin Organization:WhoisGuard, Inc.
Admin Street: P.O. Box 0823-03411
Admin City:Panama
Admin State/Province:Panama
Admin Postal Code:NA
Admin Country:PA
Admin Phone:+507.8365503
Admin Phone Ext:
Admin Fax: +51.17057182
Admin Fax Ext:
Admin Email:
Tech ID:7e4cc3537cad7b54
Tech Name:WhoisGuard Protected
Tech Organization:WhoisGuard, Inc.
Tech Street: P.O. Box 0823-03411
Tech City:Panama
Tech State/Province:Panama
Tech Postal Code:NA
Tech Country:PA
Tech Phone:+507.8365503
Tech Phone Ext:
Tech Fax: +51.17057182
Tech Fax Ext:
Tech Email:
Name Server:DNS1.REGISTRAR-SERVERS.COM
Name Server:DNS2.REGISTRAR-SERVERS.COM
Name Server:DNS3.REGISTRAR-SERVERS.COM
Name Server:DNS4.REGISTRAR-SERVERS.COM
Name Server:DNS5.REGISTRAR-SERVERS.COM
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
DNSSEC:Unsigned Bitcointalk is hosted in either the U.S or UK, where the domain was registered doesn't matter. |
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Just change your password to something incredibly secure. Account aren't deleted.
I want this because of my user name I used here. Could you rename it to a random string of characters/numbers, so nobody can find this account through the username, please? FYR: Possible to have username changed? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=437444.0TL;DR: No one will change it for you, unless you pay 50BTC to be a VIP You can ask Theymos to change your username. Quite frankly its not his highest priority, and he is very often busy, so it might take a while. VIPs can indeed change their names themselves. |
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This forum is in Panama. US and UK laws doesn't apply!!
It is Republic of Panama, not the Panama in USA!! This is located in Central America not North America!!
No its not, what are you talking about? so basically im stuck with it purely because this guys a douchebag and loves to rip on newbies unless i decide to try my luck the legal route and potentially waste money and get nowhere?
one thing that is in my favour is he mentions paypal and i do not intend on using paypal (not that anyone would accept it anyway).
maybe instead of chasing it up legally and potentially hitting a wall i would probably be better to simply pay people a small amount of BTC to put a nice message pertaining to him and his attitude towards all new members in their signatures and just keep doing things like that until i wear him down and he removes it.
honestly, i will not stop until he removes it. if i were going to give up on it id have done so by now..
I think your best bet, is to just roll with the punches, and prove that you are an honest trader. Statistically speaking, the majority of new users are indeed scammers. People make accounts and go straight to the lending/market section either attempting to scam, or just not knowing the history, and are almost immediately labeled scammers by one person or another. The only thing you can do is just prove that you aren't a scammer yourself by brushing it off and sticking with your account. Vod may remove his feedback in time. |
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