What I'm saying is that a tremendous, parabolic move in BTC/USD followed by another crash is going to seriously undermine the stability of Bitconomy. We don't want another sprint to $30 or beyond followed by a crash... that'd be bad news. I want to see the natural ebb and flow of the market.
I think parabolic moves up and crashes are the natural ebb and flow of tiny markets, though I am not an expert. |
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Is it me or is looking at the inflation rate or the real interest rate of 1 country, then comparing it to a globally traded commodity a flawed way of thinking?
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it can be done better.
What is stopping you? Clearly you can make a lot of money by being an early adopter of a currency? Or if money does not interest you, think about how you will save all future bitcoin users from this horrible bitcoin experiment. |
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of course we're going to get a pullback at some point but i strongly disagree with the characterization that it could be "very bad for the BTC's long-term future". all it will be is trading volatility.
No, I'm saying a well-behaved correction would be a good thing for BTC/USD. I said that another huge parabolic move / bubble (and the ensuing breakdown) would be bad for BTC/USD. We don't want another repeat of 2011. It would make a lot of people start to worry that Bitcoin is just a speculators toy and seriously undermine the stability (and utility) of the currency. Remember, Bitcoin was designed for gradual, long-term deflation. It wasn't made to be a high-performance trading vehicle for savvy day traders to pwn its users. If that's what it turns into I'll be happy to make money off of it but it will raise a lot of questions about the stability of the Bitconomy. Regards, --ATC-- I agree that price stability would be good for merchants and commerce, and would increase more adoption, but as this adoption will increase the price, you see this is not a stable system yet. Gradual long-term (price) deflation only happens when bitcoin is already fully adopted. Right now the inflows and outflows are just too big to allow for a stable currency. Given the tiny spot that bitcoin occupies in the currency space, it will remain quite volatile for some time to come (although volatility should improve somewhat). |
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Procreation of the most greedy, or "survival of the fittest", is a myth perpetuated by sociopaths who don't understand evolution. On both a biological level and a societal level, the rule of thumb is "survival of the most cooperative." Mutual aid and benefit is the only way organisms thrive in an environment. It starves and goes extinct if it eats the last bit of its food source, so for long-term success it must act in a way that is mutually beneficial to its food source.
Same with humans; acting greedy might be advantageous in the very short-term, but to thrive long-term requires acting in cooperative ways that are mutually beneficial to the social environment. If not, you'll be a societal outcast and have nobody to trade with, and you'll starve if you aren't jailed/killed.
"the rule of thumb is "survival of the most cooperative." Mutual aid and benefit is the only way organisms thrive in an environment."
Fittest means those most adapted to ensure offspring survival. This can aided by cooperation, greed, intelligence, stupidity, physical strength or whatever, it all depends on the local environment at that point in time. This is what the greedy bitcoin community needs to learn. Selfishness is a virtue if you realize that helping other people is a act of selfishness. If the quality of life of your neighbor is better your quality of life will be better. Markets reward the individuals that do the most good for other people and punish the greedy and selfish. If you think you are going to game the system and hoard the coins and make millions you are a fool the market will punish you.
I'll admit I am a greedy pig that wants to get rich easy. Honestly, who doesn't? But bitcoin in itself is a system which I value greatly principally as well. What problem do you see with a decentralised open-source, non-inflatable-to-oblivion kind of currency? Also, peoples opinion on who does good and who is selfish varies greatly. Some would say the person who has a large company is a selfish fat-cat that profits on the labor of his workers, others believe he created the framework to employ a lot of people and provide valuable services to the community... While I am personally inclined to the second opinion, I suppose the real answer is somewhere in between, but relies mostly on the details of each particular case. |
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Bitcoin-24 isn't a scam site. It's a legitimate exchange and my preferred choice, due to the 0% trading fees and that the support is German.
Also, I don't think candoo is the owner of Bitcoin-24, unless he is a sockpuppet created 1 1/2 years ago with the purpose to promote a (in that time) not existing exchange.
Don't be paranoid guys.
Oh, ok. How do they make money then if they have 0% fees? EDIT: nvm, found it. some fees on deposit and/or withdrawal. If they are secure and legit, this sounds like a good deal. |
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You are all over the place man. You want a free market? You want a new currency? You want stability? You better choose two of three, because all three simply won't fit together.
You want a new, stable currency? It's going to be regulated by someone, not floating on the free market.
You want a stable, free market currency? It's got to be mature enough to have passed the volatile price discovery phase.
You want a new, free market currency? It's going to be volatile as hell while we discover the price.
You talk about manipulation and the exchange rate being too high in the same breath. Think about what you are saying! Someone with a spare couple hundred thousand dollars can move the market several percent. There are plenty of people in the world who consider this pocket change. You can bet some of them are going to try and manipulate small markets for their own ends. The higher the exchange rate goes, the harder it gets to push the price around and the less manipulation the market will see.
If volatility and manipulation scares you, you probably shouldn't involve yourself with Bitcoin for another 20-30 years, because it's going to be a wild ride. If you think alternative free market coins which add nothing of value will fare better, you are fooling yourself. At least Bitcoin is in the realm of the free market and anyone attempting to manipulate the price will be exposed to market forces, just like the rest of us, not protected by governments and lenders of last resort.
Yet again I find myself agreeing with you... I want a new, stable, market regulated currency.
But you can't have it. If people cant use it it has no value what so ever
People already use it. And a growing market cap will lead to gradually smaller volatility, which will increase the possible uses for bitcoins. The free market is regulated..... by the members of the market. Bitcoin can be forgotten just as fast as it was spawned. , if a better coin comes along bitcoin will just be a memory.
True, which is why bitcoin is currently trading at a very significant risk premium below its potential. |
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Anyone notice the penny-bot just reversed? It is now selling buying 0.01 BTC
Edit: now selling again... crazy
You all get so bored that you start watching penny bots?  That, or playing with pencils...  |
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Wow, can you imagine being the guy who sold this website? How hard do you hit yourself on the head? (though I believe he did it because he didn't want legal issues in his life, which is a legit reason to me)
Something tells me he's okay with the outcome  Didn't you buy it from somebody else (in a more basic look)? I am assuming you are still a majority shareholder (not that it is any of my business). |
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NOOOoooooo !!! Stop jinxing the rally dude! What, you want to buy in again or something?   You're right. Should we delete our posts?  How bout we just stop bumping it, and let it sink in the sea of information that is bitcointalk.org. *bump* |
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Or rather we are all nervously watching the price movement.
Honestly, I don't feel the least bit nervous. As long as we don't get bad fundamental news, I don't really care if we correct back to $15 or whatever, we 'll end up going up anyway (though I realize we can't keep up this pace for a very long time). I might take some profits after $25 though. Depends a bit on exactly how fast we get there. |
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NOOOoooooo !!! Stop jinxing the rally dude! What, you want to buy in again or something? |
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We are at $22.45 and nobody is going to post? Everybody a little bit bored? Gee, you people are getting complacent |
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Wow, can you imagine being the guy who sold this website? How hard do you hit yourself on the head? (though I believe he did it because he didn't want legal issues in his life, which is a legit reason to me)
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I see a rise to $25-$30 in the next 4 weeks. then a correction. If no correction then a huge spike to say $50 then crash to $22-23...maybe even $19.50.
We will see.
Seems plausible. Don't think $25 will take 4 weeks either, more like 4 days... |
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In my eyes thats a really big spread. Even with 0.5% fee that trade would be successful. Do I miss something? This happens quite often, yesterday the EUR was ahead (16€ was touched when USD was at 20$-20.27$). Any idea on how to use this gaps?
You need to have btc & fiat in both places, so that when the opportunity arises you can take advantage of it. I would be doing this except I just dont trust the other exchanges' security enough to make the benefit/risk worth it. Yeah, I trade in euros (although I actually follow the market in USD). Can be frustrating when you buy and the EUR BTC price is quite a lot higher than in USD. Liquidity and spread is worse too... I don't understand why gox doesn't do this arbitraging themselves. I mean, they don't even need to pay the trading fees (although they would still have to pay FX conversion fees of course). |
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Not much use to you now, but you might want to use a Yubikey on gox in the future.
They offered me 1 for free, don't know if that offer still stands or if you have to pay for it nowadays.
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Just sold my remains. If my analysis is correct, we should be doing >$22 today! Congrats everyone.
Thank you! Please let us know when you are buying back in .... |
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Me too. Best strategy for me BY FAR has been buy and hold. Anything else is too risky in this market.
From my experiences with gold and silver I know this is the smartest thing to do. However, because I have been right on the bitcoin market for the small duration that I have been involved in it, I have grown overconfident, so I am going to try and do some trading anyway (but always hold at least half my coins for longer term). This will probably last until I end up being horribly wrong, slap myself on the forehead for being so stupid, and swear to stop trading. It isn't wise, but it's more fun . |
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUqYrWYrc8o&list=UU0RJJ_Wm7jyOU9eY10LgcwA&index=18Still: I basically have a lot of trouble being comfortable with Bitcoin. Number one, it was hacked about two years ago. Number two, although it purports to be decentralized money and everybody says 'oh, the security features make it impossible to control centrally,' you know, I just... I have no facts to support it, I just, I'm uncomfortable with the situation. Anyone who says nonsense like that has no credibility. Why can't people just say, " I don't know enough about it to make a comment". Just recently that kind of BS has been filling the comments in bitcoin press articles too, my tinfoil hat tells me the disinformation machine has been fired up again. No need to look for conspiracies when plain ignorance and lack of due diligance is sufficient to explain this. |
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