I did point this out in the thread before it started, that all should be posted in one place. There is already the ST thread, an unofficial SP20 thread and my SP20 thread. That's fine, its 2 1/2 for one product. But adding another 10.... no other product or company would be allowed to do that. And unfortunately ck has been put in a compromised position by receiving one (outside the competition). If he moves or consolidates them then he will seem ungrateful, if he doesn't he will seem biased.

Lets take for example the Antminer S3. There have likely been 6 figures of S3s sold into the world, yet they only have 2 1/2 threads [S3 tech, mine and for a bit Sushi's]. If Bitmain threw out 10 to the community to make 10 threads, they'd be immediately locked / moved / banned because its spam / pay to spam. Unless of course the SP20 is being used to set an admin precedence.... and which point now every other company is free to spam review threads. 10 'review' threads for each of Bitmain's products, that's no different right?

Ps this thread should head over to meta once its got a bit more of a soak here.

Not for all products, no. Its other staff's job to monitor this thread (even if they don't post).

No one gets an FF any more, only Fs. Just left it in the criteria in case people find fragments on archive sites.

We're in the 2nd gen.

And this is likely a list, asking price. Who knows what someone could close it at.

As we discussed at length, nothing has changed in the criteria. Preorders are a critical measure and as such have always had a time historical lag as well as additionally considering the business model. It is not justifiable for you (or BFL, or any other company) to sell $30M of hardware [random numbers to illustrate] via preorders and then to sell $3M from overstock and claim that you don't use preorders. The entire business model is based off preorders, and there is a 90% chance that made up scenario's company will return to using preorders as soon as they announce the next generation.

And as such, they can only receive an interim 'does preorder and doesn't preorder - mixed' rating, until they can prove that their business model does NOT rely on customer funds via preorders. That reliance is demonstrated during the announcement of the next generation, which for ST is likely to be 0-6 months as opposed to 7-12. If you sell the next generation via preorders, you're running a preorder model business and so receive a 'Yes'. If you sell the next generation from hand and are committed to a no preorder business model then you receive a 'No'.

tldr nothing has changed, you can't sell a few older units from stock and claim you are an 'in stock company' until you demonstrate that your entire business model isn't designed around preorders.

So there are 0 reports, as you've confirmed, everything else is conjecture and not something you can justify destroying a company's reputation over. And again, they already have a lower score of 55, in the same league with Bitmine, BFL and KNCMiner. I assume even if they had a rating of 20 you'd still be flaming for a lower score in the same regard.

So you're flaming me because I won't 'make up' an ethics modifier for the last possible 4 points... why exactly? I already applied the -5, that's as high as it goes [now] without a regulatory body's involvement.

Blackarrow is joint 2nd last, ahead only of a totally bankrupt company, I'm not sure what you expect to happen.

No I didn't, look at the quote.

If you don't like Antpool, Bitmain or anything else then that's fine - just keep it civil.

See alternate subnet change instructions to connect with your laptop here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=846095.0#post_section4

We've been though this so many times... Show me an ethics score modifier that I can actually apply to BA.



Apart from they're delivering Apollo and Ares orders absolutely fine, and there are ZERO reports of the Zeus being 'dodgy'. If you're absolutely 100% sure its a scam, then I'll take you up on a 10 to 0 escrowed btc bet. If their Zeus boards are even remotely close to as they claim, I get 10btc. If not, you get an I told you so. ....Which will happen right, because you're 100% sure?

If you're not, then you shouldn't be flaming me for not marking a company a scam which has ZERO reports from CUSTOMERS about Zeus boards being bad.

You mean like you already did

Apart from I was the one that passed your message on to them to make them aware, and galvanise the response in the first place. I quoted the message to confirm it was indeed a BITMAIN employee as it was the first post on that account.

I really don't understand the hostility here.

PS, Black Arrow deleted my post in their moderated thread, the only company to do so.

I understand now, its okay. If you look at the abuse I get for simply updating the guide [being accused of being biased against / for every company, in both directions, simultaneously], you'll understand why updates don't always take top priority on the to do list.

Me commenting on how they were treated in a different thread has nothing to do with this thread, don't try and put words in my mouth. They have asked questions, HashCoins has replied and it will either turn out that they were falsifying x y z or they weren't. It shouldn't be up to us to persecute them as if they're guilty of some huge scam when all there is is conjecture. Neither of those two people have seen a Zeus board and so can not - to appropriate standards - provide its non existence.

As I said before, if there was a Zeus customer who turned up and said ".....fml I've been scammed" it would be a different story. But there hasn't been one, and they've been selling the Zeus for a while.

Looks like it /speculation.

I think with the current problems with getting things stable, that the most sensible solution would be a smaller board. If it dies but you've got 15 others in a miner, the consumer is going to mind a hell of a lot less than if you had 4 and 1 was bad. Think Avalon1, mini modules within modules.