I will delete everything so far...

...soon


This is a motion to get back to the original Altcoin Observer, and there most of the coins were labeled as copy, shit, p&d and even scamcoins from the onset. This seems to be the truth so there is no way out of it.

It is but natural that the supporters of those coins want to gain publicity and legitimacy that they are being discussed here. For the same reason I want to moderate them away, as the mention of them is already helping their cause.

It's quite normal that the OP decides which coins are allowed. In DOGE thread they talk about DOGE, etc..

Since my understanding of the altcoins may need update, now is the time to promote your coin. Before wasting your time on promoting something that does not fulfill my criteria, consider the following "beauty points" where "NaC" means that something is not a coin in my opinion and does not belong here:


1. Is the coin delivering a relevant technological breakthrough as the first legitimate instance of the code?
yes - 2 points
whether "relevant", "first" or "legitimate" applies, is still not clear - 1 point
no - 0 points

2. Does the coin have a developer team of several people, with at least 2 public people?
Yes - 2 points
Lacking - 1 point
Single pseudonymous dev - 0 points

3. Is the software open source?
Yes - 2 points
Mostly, with good reason - 1 point
Lacking - 0 points

4. Involvement of Bitcoin whales/legendaries/hero members?
Yes, so much that it inspires both awe and hate - 2 points
Yes, non-insider w/l/h members have bought into the coin - 1 point
No, or less than in other coins with same market cap - 0 points

5. What % of the eventual market cap is held by the 3 largest staked devs?
<3% - 2 points
3-10% - 1 point
>10% - 0 points

6. Was there a premine/instamine/ninjamine/..?
0-1% - 2 points
1-5% - 1 points
>5% - 0 points

7. What % of coins are mined in the first year?
<20% - 2 points
20-50% - 1 point
50-100% or non-mineable - 0 points

8. Was there lying/deception at any point in the launch, eg. concerning pre(etc.)mine?
no - 2 points
issues were so insignificant as to not want to group them with the real scammers - 1 point
yes - 0 points

9. What's the marketcap?(* free float only)
TOP-5 marketcap - 2 points
TOP-20 marketcap - 1 point
less - 0 points

10. What's the trading volume?
TOP-5 volume - 2 points
TOP-20 volume - 1 point
less - 0 points

11. What's the emission (daily inflation measured by mktvalue)?
TOP-5 emission - 2 points
TOP-20 emission - 1 point
less - 0 points

Now I calculate that my picks, Bitcoin gets 21 points and Monero gets 18 points.


Soon the list of allowed coins will be fixed and locked.

It takes a long time to tell, and to be useful for the reader, requires a mindset of appreciation (open mind).

Until so far, I haven't felt that giving this information out for free in the forums (any more than what I do already in my posting, often enough to be an object of hate) is the priority or even a smart thing.

By the way I did make a list of at least 10 bulletpoints just when we talked about the matter in my Wall Observer. It is there, you could find it and link it here for reference that I have been quite open about it.

The thread needs to be reset due to average post quality going down, a phenomenon that seems impossible to be reversed with or without hurting feelings.

So may I present to you: The thread in the original spirit of the Altcoin Observer. With thoughtful analysis, fact-based conclusions, actual research, and the like.

No shilling of copycoins, no trolling, no hate, no chatter, no technical problems. The reason why Altcoins are Observed in this thread is to allow readers to develop a factual understanding on how to allocate your cryptostash between coins. It seems investor-oriented. But that is only because that is the only decision most of us can make (apart from talking).

As usual, the moderation will be really strong in the first 50 pages, to the point that posts are deleted based on being too long and too short and what not. It is the enhance the reader experience. The unedited version as usual is on bitcointa.lk.

I am also among the first members of this.

I could not find a way to connect with the writer of this. All I need to say that her coming to the forum coincided with my conversion to Monero supporter. Previously I did receive hatespeech where everything was the same, except Bitcoin substituted for Monero.

I do have grounds to believe that some people feel convicted when I talk about "scammers", "scamdevs", "scamcoins" are hurt. Then these people lash out on me often through sockpuppets. But even here, it is not necessary that I am right. I come from a traditional background where much less deviation from truth and sound business practice is labeled as "scamming" as it might be in the altcoinland.

I only came to altcoinland in late May. I don't mean I want to start to accept, support, or do scam, but it's important for me to understand if something - let's say forging the timestamps of BCN and releasing the CN code with obvious backdoors - is generally regarded as "scam" or is it just me judging wrongly?

Being jealous is not terrorism. I would not mix it with this.

Yeah now there's a break because 425 wall was attacked by a big salvo. The rest (that in my calc belonged to 3 if not 4 traders) was quickly pulled. Now bid side is about 413, no meaningful ask until 450, suspected to be fake.

One trader claims to have bought 15k today. Warz who started it all has not commented.

There's a growing wall in 400 so truce might not last long.

The action has been going on for 2,5 hours.

- 39,000 XMR have been traded
- Price from 380k to 434k
- Many players with big stacks of BTC making buy walls
- No any dumps over 5,000 XMR during the whole exercise
- Action continues with BTC187 bid wall standing at 425k.

I tried to read it as an outsider, a person who comes to the thread first time. It sounded nazist and was hard to understand why.

I took it away.

Now I don't understand anything at all, including how the two parts belong together.

I was shocked to see that there is so much hate towards me in the forums. This is not a joke but an honest attempt to ask what is most wrong with me in your opinion. Then I can answer if it's something I'm also ashamed about. Or defend the thing if I think it is right and good despite the criticism. No self-moderation. No fanbois. I may not be able to answer all but try to pick some questions that represent a larger audience. I try to not be a prick in this thread.

So Monero can immediately handle 5 million accounts and 100,000 tx/day?

I am also a business angel, funding people's things ever since 2004. One of the reasons I bought the castle is that people wanting to have funding can come there and make their way to my presence. After some time, I may discuss with them about financial cooperation. Such deals have already been done on these "castle terms" and results are expected to be announced in this month.

This is the way I want to make business and yes, many try to approach me via other channels and start communication by asking money, a loan or whatever. I try not to be rude towards them but the answer is "no", because there is no way for me to evaluate the other guy that way.

I am fine if you don't want to come to my castle but that is the necessary condition if you want to deal with me. Good thing is that world has millions of people with more money than me and you can ask them instead.

I feel that you are needlessly patronising me. I try to find a place to function to the best of my ability, and in this case a little bit of creating that place also. This way I am happiest, and most productive. Not all the world needs to embrace the result, and as you said - potentially it does not even scale such high. It does not mean it is wrong, or even waste of time.

If you feel that I have tried to control you against your wishes, I am sorry. Every help that I have offered has come from the blessing I have received by being in Bitcoin in the right time.

With the high regard that I have to some devs of some coins, in economic matters I trust much more those who have actual success to show in being shrewd with money - entrepreneurs, successful entrepreneurs, self-made men, the ones that have not succeeded by bootlicking governments, but who rather have a track record that governments have continued to attack them, closing their businesses, confiscating their assets, accused them in court on charges based on their own anti-competition laws, yet they have not lost heart, and still have an unwavering spirit to accompish what yet needs to be accomplished. The type Ayn Rand wrote about. The little that we must yield to central management of any kind, I would like to hand over to these men. If there are concentrations of private wealth in this world, I would sleep most happily if it is in the hands of these men.

Up to 80% of the world's physical gold is commanded by the banking cartel, and they have also been campaigning for the demonetization for 1.5 centuries at least.

The plan until crypto was probably that fiat money regime earns them the best fees, but even if they lose control, they have the control of the only alternative also.

I don't believe that a sufficient number of wealthy entities ever discards gold totally, and therefore its monetary premium will stay forever. Only 1% need to care, for gold still to have a high value.

smooth said that soon they will be reset to "a new normal" which is based on the tx size in blockchain. A typical tx should cost 0.01 XMR which compares favorably to Bitcoin's BTC0.0001 ($0.02 vs. $0.05).

It is possible that you are very right and this is a great insight. There is a kind of group that I feel connected to, consisting of people like aminorex, NewLiberty, (I don't want to add the names of not-so-public supporters), and people whom I know locally in Finland. The defining characteristics are that we are typically not old money, so the Bitcoin rally in 2010-2013 has changed our life, but we are also not nerds, just ordinary 30-50 yo adults who could invest a few thousand and not panic about it, resulting in that we still have hundreds if not thousands of BTC.

The willingness to change the world is a great motivation in us. Now Bitcoin has given new resources. Many have been searching for altcoins, but what's been offered did not interest us for a long time, as with a few exceptions, all altcoins have made terrible loss in their lifetime, and the high hopes of newcomers typically gone in vain. We have been able to see if there is no staying power, and invested only little, if anything, and watched the scene in sadness.

Then Monero comes and either analytically or intuitively sweeps our market niche with a promise of an anonymous coin, with potential to change the world, with an upright devteam and fair distribution. Knowing the mind of each other in our "group" (the "group" is just defined by being a set of people that think likewise) we rush to buy Monero, since the others will certainly do the same and of course we make money by doing it first My buying only really started in July when the 231 bottom was made. The previous months I was observing, very positive, but unwilling to commit.

This accumulation to long-term hoards has continued all this time, price has been very stable, and volume brisk. My predictions that our group's purchasing pressure overwhelms the inflation from mining have been unfounded, and likewise the doomsayers' predictions of lower and lower prices have not materialized. What has happened instead, is massive concentration of price in BTC0.004, which is the all-time-average, the current price, and the wedge closing point from the trends of higher lows and lower highs. Technically, it will soon break. Up or down, but with a massive move. Unless it stays in exactly BTC0.004 forever.


This is not really the way things happen in life. It is part luck (to be born in 1st world), but most part your choice to hang out with friends who follow tech. Then they tell you about Bitcoin. It is part luck (if you are minor and absolutely broke), but most part your choice to have money to invest and developed skills to understand it. It is part luck (if this is your first investment ever in something you don't understand) but most part your choice to throw money in fringe projects in carefully calculated small quantities, and then not worry about it.

It is no part luck if you were able to see Bitcoin was conquering the world in 2011. For most of us, it was about the choices that we had made in life that accumulated and made it much more probable to invest in 2011, and then hold through the days that took the price to half even twice the same day, and other things that the newbies don't know. My involvement in Bitcoin was certainly not luck, I take a methodical approach in investing and even in 2012, I lost $80,000 in several investments that went badly. Without investing into these stuff several times a year, I would not have invested into Bitcoin either.

Maybe somebody got in lucky, first buying, then losing the keys being thus unable to sell until now.

But my odds were stacked in 10,000:1 in my favor. And after that guy has sold, I still own them.



You also have 1 sigma higher IQ than me, it is not fair to use yourself as an example. Also I don't rejoice in your sickness.


I have outlined above what kind of sound, established, (moderately) wealthy, intellectually curious, people started to concentrate in Bitcoinworld in 2011 and who have now changed the big toe of their right foot to Monero with 1-5% of their capital, ready to give that leg more weight if Monero can take it. We believe the leadership is there and MEW is one initiative to create an actual, functioning, governance in a coin, based on the wishes of the owners.

As for hackerdom, I am not too much into it. I am building an economy that grows bigger and is able to absorb the imploding dollar economy as soon as possible. I admire the hackers similar way as engineers - if they create something that works, and does it elegantly.


It is only your lack of experience that you think I am not doing useful work.


Once MEW gets up and running, we will have to select people to be the community public speakers. If the real opinion of the community is that I should limit speaking, I may do it. Voting does cost money, and requires that you own moneros, and that you are reputable. When these people decide somehing, I am very prone to listen. Currently obfuscation is the name of the game and all the trolling against Monero could have been bought by $500. MEW is really the answer to this.



By subscribing to a destructive ideology, yes. Those "whales" are a sad species, though. They are like "sheep-whales", led to slaughter by their puppet-masters. (Maybe I really need a new term, yes - ) my whales are dynamic, well-conncted humans, who know how things are handled in the outside world, cunning as a fox, innocent as a dove. The Leaders. The ones that anything, whatever it is, needs, to have any chance to succeed in this evil world that is quick to snuff all initiatives that threaten the status quo.

I have no idea what is XMR pump fest. Perhaps you can refer to some specific time in the market or anything..?


I cannot make it untrue that 50% of monero are also owned by 1% of the people. There is no mechanism that would preserve people's liberty and produce a different wealth distribution.

What is the source of this hate? I am among every 1% that can be calculated. I have never in my life scammed anyone or done non-voluntary transactions, or any other crime against other people. Everything that I own I have earned in trade with other people, typically so that they come to me. Why do you hate me?

Also greed is that "you desire something greatly that others have" Of course sometimes I catch myself from this sin, but never has the object of the greed been money or anything that money can buy. How about your greed? You ever wished to have something that does not belong to you?

So - once I estimated that the whole blockchain (100GB) was for sale for $41k and deemed that too cheap. Now the price is per kB, and it works out to $1 million, a 25-time increase. This sounds indeed much better and while $1M is still very little, the coin's market cap is also small.

It is telling how concentrated the blockchain usage is towards manual transaction that a 20x increase in fees resulted in only 30% reduction in tx. This means that if the blockchain growth will need to be limited in the future, the fees have to be raised really high to compel off-chain activity.