That fpga deal was for people who believe asicminers wont come out anytime soon I believe . I for one hand believe they already started shipping so the ROI on that fpga is getting longer and longer everyday but a person does not believe that and believes there is at least 2-3 months before enough asicminers will come to change the difference on the difficulty of bitcoin mining so they can look for a better option that is currently available. So you are talking about two different mind set customers , you are both right on different levels. I wanted to check some fpga system for low price so I may get some crazy discounts like : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW1hFQndX2I this guy. Otherwise if am going to pay 1000$ish I would buy 3-4 5gh butterfly and wait for them to arrive and when they arrive I will have about 20ghash for 1000 which will have horrible but would be 20 times of 1ghash for the same price. That guy on 'youtube' is a jack-off merchant, the tech he is holding is so out of date (look at the size of the RAM chip!! & the card date 01/12/00), you could possibly...... possibly mine at a couple of Mh/s, IF you could interface the chips together in a reasonable configuration. Unless you went 'Solar' it would use more electricity than it would pay for. Look I can see where you are coming from.. but the heady "get rich quick" days of bitcoin are OVER. Keep your $1,000 and wait till BTC crash down to $50-$60 each then buy some (MTgox), then sell high, you will make way more money. Once Avalon start to ramp up production (they are already shipping and even with 900 units have totally fucked the BTC 'difficulty level' from 3 million to 11 million) and when BFL start to ship, the whole thing is going to be a shit-storm as the difficulty crashes out into oblivion. If I can knock up an FPGA rig in a day.. then why am I not filling my house with them? (I recently turned down a lot of 50 V6 Xilinx FPGA @$20 bucks a card), it would have been about 15GH/s for $1,000usd and 5 days work to commission them, power usage would have been about 1Kw I'll tell you why... because most pools are getting rid of PPS and the other 'shares' are paying so low that it is not worth it, unless you are into tens of GH/s |
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I.E if I have an algorithm that takes 1mS to execute, then it does not matter if my processor/logic is operating at Thz speed..
How do you calculate this 1ms run time if it's not a product of clock frequency? Ye gods...... Ok....Ok... count to 10 Take for example the access of Drams/Srams where the setup times and charge times are a function of the architecture NOT the overall clock frequency of the system. I.E lets say the 'setup time' of the address is 3ns, it is still 3ns no matter how fast the central clock is going. (unless I specially select temperature or dies and pull out chips that can manage the 'setup time' in 1.5ns) What this means is that by designing in certain requirements into the algorithm, I can to a larger degree make the overall clock rate irrelevant. |
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LOL..... from the site: http://www.raspberrycoins.com/calcwhat a crock of shit....... The fantasy.......  The reality......  This is EXACTLY what I am talking about Bitcoin getting a bad reputation for scammers...... |
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Not defensive , just lack of research gets my back up...., because noobs enter the site then think they are going to get rich
by spending several grand on kit that has ROI about the same time as the sun is due to go cold.
This does nothing for the long term goals of Bitcoin.
The SCRYPT reference was to highlight the mostly incorrect statement about Clock speed.
Since we were talking about FPGA, clock-speed and parallelism, it is not specifically related to bitcoin but rather design.
I.E if I have an algorithm that takes 1mS to execute, then it does not matter if my processor/logic is operating at Thz speed..
But if I can parallel that algorithm to get 1,000,000 at a time, then even though it takes 1mS I am actually getting a theoretical throughput of 1ns 'each'.
I have a BFL logo on my site?
Are you ill?, that was a web link to Butterfly labs...
All that aside... the difficulty climbing at more than 20% a month, most sites are dropping PPS, which means that your solution will not pay itself back any time soon..... no matter what price the BTC is at.
And yes my rigs WILL mine litecoins via FPGA but I'm still working on the memory interface ,because the pure FPGA implementation currently has a shite throughput
Ohhh. and your 'website' is down.
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and yet the non DMG strat is fine with no dropout:
Can you give me the exact servers you are connecting to. There is no "non DMG strat" anymore. K there Is something wrong. IF I submit EVERYTHING on the PPS section (yep i know it does not exist as PPS) mmpool.bitparking.com:15098 my mining rate and credit is WAY higher using the same equipment (it is currently creeping up >1.65GH/s) Because I have a couple of boards out I'm working on. It should settle just < 2.0GH/s for this rig with a full load of boards. stratum2.bitparking.com:4333 (what I call DGM) gives all the errors and about 1GH/s, even with a full complement of boards (which is why I Fruitlessly spent the last 3 hours faultfinding) stratum2.bitparking.com:3333 is also 'fine' if not loaded up with work, I.E if I start throwing load at it, then it starts to fail PING stratum2.bitparking.com (50.116.38.44): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 50.116.38.44: icmp_seq=0 ttl=56 time=228.456 ms
64 bytes from 50.116.38.44: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=229.857 ms
64 bytes from 50.116.38.44: icmp_seq=2 ttl=56 time=229.272 ms
64 bytes from 50.116.38.44: icmp_seq=3 ttl=56 time=229.027 ms
64 bytes from 50.116.38.44: icmp_seq=4 ttl=56 time=229.550 ms
^C
--- stratum2.bitparking.com ping statistics ---
6 packets transmitted, 5 packets received, 16.7% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 228.456/229.232/229.857/0.477 ms
PING mmpool.bitparking.com (206.71.179.116): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=0 ttl=53 time=194.617 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=1 ttl=53 time=193.556 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=2 ttl=53 time=194.526 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=3 ttl=53 time=194.527 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=4 ttl=53 time=194.383 ms
^C
--- mmpool.bitparking.com ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 5 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 193.556/194.322/194.617/0.390 ms
PING stratum.bitparking.com (206.71.179.116): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=0 ttl=53 time=193.621 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=1 ttl=53 time=193.632 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=2 ttl=53 time=194.077 ms
64 bytes from 206.71.179.116: icmp_seq=3 ttl=53 time=194.533 ms
^C
--- stratum.bitparking.com ping statistics ---
4 packets transmitted, 4 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 193.621/193.966/194.533/0.376 ms
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I think if you don't sort out your pool soon, then I will be forced to switch. It was mining fine at a consistent 1.8GH/s until you started to fool about . Now Your stratum is continually starving my rigs of work and it is down by 50%. Really if you are going to roll out serious modifications, then you should be doing so on a test rig rather than just throwing them at a live server. 2013-05-02 10:53:58.237 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully authorized Stratum worker razorfishsl
2013-05-02 10:53:58.264 [200] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Received unexpected Stratum response: {u'id': 10000, u'method': u'client.get_version'}
2013-05-02 10:53:58.735 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully subscribed to Stratum service
2013-05-02 10:54:02.462 [200] Worker_102: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:04.541 [350] Worker_104: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM:00000002a17e1045791e442eaa009f8deea1e67f6c8a4bf850c32cc60000018e000000003dbaf8e de3b2f661db9796ced5ec3cae20d12b3f94e46c9a657d49b60551dd965181d5151a01aa3d:380712aa
2013-05-02 10:54:04.584 [350] Worker_107: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM:00000002a17e1045791e442eaa009f8deea1e67f6c8a4bf850c32cc60000018e00000000f16b670 e908afb03d426faec72e865c2af83c8c7657072e162470b8fa224a9e15181d5131a01aa3d:e83cdac2
2013-05-02 10:54:05.006 [250] Worker_104: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM accepted share 380712aa (difficulty 1.43710)
2013-05-02 10:54:05.275 [250] Worker_107: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM accepted share e83cdac2 (difficulty 1.92376)
2013-05-02 10:54:05.338 [200] Worker_103: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:06.554 [350] Worker_108: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM:00000002a17e1045791e442eaa009f8deea1e67f6c8a4bf850c32cc60000018e000000008f508d2 17634e141205c903dbb33db1f9386eb6a648805fb2ebdb49291d158645181d51e1a01aa3d:98746db7
2013-05-02 10:54:07.015 [250] Worker_108: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM accepted share 98746db7 (difficulty 3.67269)
2013-05-02 10:54:09.006 [350] Worker_104: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM:00000002a17e1045791e442eaa009f8deea1e67f6c8a4bf850c32cc60000018e000000003dbaf8e de3b2f661db9796ced5ec3cae20d12b3f94e46c9a657d49b60551dd965181d5151a01aa3d:b978a7d4
2013-05-02 10:54:09.470 [250] Worker_104: Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM accepted share b978a7d4 (difficulty 6.70452)
2013-05-02 10:54:10.994 [200] Worker_107: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:13.551 [200] Worker_104: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:14.163 [200] Worker_108: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:16.521 [200] Worker_106: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:25.298 [200] Worker_101: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:27.653 [200] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Stratum connection died: Traceback (most recent call last):
013-05-02 10:54:29.793 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully authorized Stratum worker razorfishsl
2013-05-02 10:54:30.090 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully authorized Stratum worker razorfishsl
2013-05-02 10:54:30.105 [200] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Received unexpected Stratum response: {u'id': 10000, u'method': u'client.get_version'}
2013-05-02 10:54:30.106 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully subscribed to Stratum service
2013-05-02 10:54:30.106 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully subscribed to Stratum service
2013-05-02 10:54:30.585 [400] Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM: Successfully subscribed to Stratum service
2013-05-02 10:54:30.603 [200] Worker_103: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:37.838 [200] Worker_107: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:40.395 [200] Worker_104: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:41.007 [200] Worker_108: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:47.200 [200] Worker_106: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:52.993 [200] Worker_102: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:54:55.869 [200] Worker_103: Exhausted keyspace!
2013-05-02 10:55:00.122 [400] Worker_106: Mining Razorfishsl_stratum_DGM:00000002a17e1045791e442eaa009f8deea1e67f6c8a4bf850c32cc60000018e00000000096c1c9 7cfa4008c3f7d17e5b37f635013a38577af7393a8683542abcb39f70c5181d5811a01aa3d
2013-05-02 10:55:01.090 [200] Worker_101: Exhausted keyspace!
2
and so on....... and yet the non DMG strat is fine with no dropout: 2013-05-02 10:38:18.494 [400] W1: Mining Razorfishsl_stratum:0000000251a32bfab86ac0c766db8f910005de035934d48fc99a9dfa0000007400000000c75e309 013d9096e61d369916fd52dba970f6c238cc6f3bd3c941e384296877d5181d17e1a01aa3d
2013-05-02 10:38:21.889 [350] W1: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum:0000000251a32bfab86ac0c766db8f910005de035934d48fc99a9dfa0000007400000000c75e309 013d9096e61d369916fd52dba970f6c238cc6f3bd3c941e384296877d5181d17e1a01aa3d:a82f4d22
2013-05-02 10:38:22.347 [250] W1: Razorfishsl_stratum accepted share a82f4d22 (difficulty 1.22497)
2013-05-02 10:38:29.267 [350] W1: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum:0000000251a32bfab86ac0c766db8f910005de035934d48fc99a9dfa0000007400000000c75e309 013d9096e61d369916fd52dba970f6c238cc6f3bd3c941e384296877d5181d17e1a01aa3d:bd6ffe6c
2013-05-02 10:38:29.726 [250] W1: Razorfishsl_stratum accepted share bd6ffe6c (difficulty 4.75615)
2013-05-02 10:38:36.869 [350] W1: Found share: Razorfishsl_stratum:0000000251a32bfab86ac0c766db8f910005de035934d48fc99a9dfa0000007400000000c75e309 013d9096e61d369916fd52dba970f6c238cc6f3bd3c941e384296877d5181d17e1a01aa3d:bad706ba
2013-05-02 10:38:37.317 [400
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If the power supply says it is rated for continuous 850 watt, it is good for 850 watt DC electricity 24/7/365, otherwise it wouldn't be called "continuous".  An 850W 80plus GOLD power supply is 100% spec when you are drawing approximately 965 watts at the wall. You are fine. For what its worth, I drew 910 watts AC from a NZXT HALE90 750 watt, approx 8% over spec. It didn't break a sweat. er no......... 3R system as an example..... GOLD rating , but the internal components are only designed for <50% of the product STATED full load capacity. Some manufacturers overrate the components, others are just bottom feeding scum that use industry terms to scam people. Also 'Continuous' is a relative term and depends on the background ambient.... |
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Once ASICs start coming out, I think it will feel like a big waste of money  Why do you need to take your mining rig with you? As long as you have a closet somewhere, just park it and let it do it's thing. They usually don't require constant monitoring... I am a MFC model so I will leave 2 computers at home running and then this one is what I take when I travel anyways. I also think BFL is a scam.... Then you are a very silly little girl and in exactly the right profession...... stay away from BTC because you are loosing money. |
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STOP PRESSS......
Luke -JR receives a second unit.......
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If you want to run fast and efficiently on an FPGA, you need to maximize clock rate, and throughput rate. This essentially means a hash every clock cycle, and you fully pipeline the design (which introduces latency, but preserves throughput) to run at the max toggle rate of the FPGA. Statement of the obvious with some gobbled de gook thrown in to look good...... (actually you need to maximize parallelism) SCRYPT is an example of WHY a faster clock rate will not come up with the goods on an FPGA...... You won't find these boards for $50. YES YOU WILL if you know where to look.......... I'm looking at putting together a dual Cyclone V based FPGA board. This is 28 nm technology, which means I should be able to run at 250-300 MHz, and the chips are 301K LC each, so I should be able to run at about 1000-1200 MHash/sec. If I get it going, I'm thinking of shipping units at $900 per 1000-1200 MHash/sec. Have you even bothered to simulate it? it is still costing you close to 1k for 1.2gh/s To generate $7us a day!!!! (or about 50 cents an hour, less than an Indian worker) http://tpbitcalc.appspot.com/?difficulty=10076292.8834&hashrate=1200.00&exchangerate=121.56&bitcoinsperblock=25.00&rigcost=900&powerconsumption=80.00&powercost=0.10&investmentperiod=355Like I said I can build a STABLE ~2 gh/s (non-ramped) for $300us, which is 6gh/s for your 1gh/s but both are 3 times the cost of a similar BFL product (5GH/s@274usd)........ except mine gets closer to the hash rate!!! Plus by the time you cloud source and do your pcb it is going to be July Why bother? |
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It is not worth it.
Consider that even if you pick up a V5 110 for about $50 bucks
Jobs
1. trace out circuit in an attempt to find where to tap into FPGA
2. Hope to GOD that :
A. The vias you need on the pins are big enough to be soldered
B. The important pins are not tied to gnd or to existing circuit
C. There is a clock circuit and it is accessible
D. you design Suitable USB/RS232 I/O
E. The PCB powers up.
OK you have a rewired working PCB
1. System to LOAD the FPGA
2. mining software to support the IO YOU have to design
3. Layout of existing scrap PCB is suitable for the power & frequency you need...
Hurray.... step 3
Design a switched mode PSU to handle the kit, yep the PCB *may* have SM on it, but you still need to supply that with the output of another power supply..
Step 4 hurrayyy.......
You are mining @ 100-200 Mh/s
In several months you can make your $50 bucks back.......
If you have 1.7GH/s you can make 10 bucks a day when bitcoin is at 100USD each....
I have this down to a fine art.... (I can build a 2GH/s rig in a DAY!!!)
Even buying FPGA at $30USD each.... it is barely worth it with the difficulty changing 10% twice a month.....
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If you dig about on 'github' you will find miners for both Bitcoin & litecoin in Java.
The litecoin one is *very* badly implemented, threads are setup incorrectly. Whoever wrote it had little knowledge of how java 'implements' objects. (it actually looks like it is from a c implementation.)
But the implementations are fairly clear.
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Gave it a test...
Threw 50Kh/s at it , and it reported 10..........
Did the same to "us.litecoinpool.org" and it reported 55kh/s
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Don't waste your time...... http://www.hardkernel.com/renewal_2011/main.phpuse one of these.. Available NOW, works with current mining software, 2GB RAM Quad cores and rock steady. I have a couple I use for running mining rigs, even running the python version they use less than 5% resources with 20 rigs. Oh ya there are dozens of lil ARM CPU sticks that you can use for mining. I use a MK802 II to run my BFL Single, but mine can be had for <$40, where as it's surprising how many are upwards of $100. Such small chips fail once you start adding capacity, I have a couple of 400Mhz units and they max out at about 3 miners and start dropping connections, with the ~$100USD I can take it to over 20 miners and not even break 3% of resources. Try to remember that many of these cheap shitty chips chain ALL the external communication off the USB core, so basically you end up competing for resources against the ethernet infrastructure..... |
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May I know the hashing power? 10 or 20 mg/s?
It is not bitcoin.. for FPGA it should be in the KH/s, even multiple graphics cards only give you low MH/s Wrong. FPHA has nothing to do with it. It's because LTC is SCRYPT, and I am assuming the goal of the FPGA's would be to reach into MH/Sek otherwise why design them? FPGA's are likely to continue to lag behind GPU for litecoin, currently there are no products I know of that can produce in the MH/s range for a single unit. I.E a single GPU/ FPGA (even with multiple cores), and the reason to design with FPGA are numerous, I will give you two. 1. lower power consumption 2. Ebay scrap. (this works fine for individual miners, but not if you want to build and sell to the public.....) So even if I cannot match GPU:FPGA on a 1:1 basis, I can out purchase on a 1:n basis |
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May I know the hashing power? 10 or 20 mg/s?
It is not bitcoin.. for FPGA it should be in the KH/s, even multiple graphics cards only give you low MH/s |
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Don't waste your time...... http://www.hardkernel.com/renewal_2011/main.phpuse one of these.. Available NOW, works with current mining software, 2GB RAM Quad cores and rock steady. I have a couple I use for running mining rigs, even running the python version they use less than 5% resources with 20 rigs. |
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K some VERY VERY preliminary verifiable measurements. (verifiable from my side).
Iv'e had code for some time that takes about 1ms to do ONE round (no laughing at the back there), which would make it about a 1kh/s.
This is actual code on an FPGA, yes it has not been optimized yet and yes it is a SINGLE core.
.
.
.
This is not a 'get rich quick scheme' but rather a pure research task, possibly the first images of an FPGA product running litecoin.
Crypto currencies are of interest to me, but I really will be surprised if people can break into high double figures with a single core on an FPGA.
Interesting stuff. Thinking about having a play around with this myself. Is there any opensource Scrypt VHDL out there? Or should I just roll my own with the SHA1 and mod the Salsa20 that is up on opencores site? I'm not thinking about mining or anything just to get some throughput data/energy costs etc and also work out what the problems are people will face who want todo it properly. If all else fails I'm thinking of running it on top of a NIOS II implementation. Completely pointless but got to be worth a shot just for the laughs. You will need to roll your own, the implementations are not too good. |
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Personally I have great difficulty believing some of the figures that are being bandied about for litecoin FPGA.
Can you share a link to the threads with your bandied about numbers? I haven't seen anybody say anything that outrageous here. learn to use google...(that magic thing you can Copy& paste sections of text into, to track down stuff) https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=98535.5;wap2But specifically it is the 80% free I take exception to. Anyway I finally received some 50A TI power modules, so I can run Bitcoin & Litecoin research boards together. |
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NO.... I cannot see FPGA beating 8750 or 8790
But the real issue is no one is sharing any Litecoin FPGA figures, considering all these 'prototypes' floating about ......
It is the 'Tom'/ BFL fuckfest all over again..........
Personally I have great difficulty believing some of the figures that are being bandied about for litecoin FPGA. I've see statements such as
"Spartan6 XC6SLX150 fits only 8 scratchpads. If BRAMs are not used for bitcoin computations, it is possible to implement LTC mining for XC6SLX150 at about 50 - 100 kh/s per chip with about 80% of slices free."
Quite frankly I find this very difficult to believe.. Because I'm seeing figures of about 3k flipflops & 5k =LUTS for a SCRYPT engine.
Xc6SLX150 is specd at 23,000 slices each slice contains 4 LUTS & 8 FF
so ~23,000*4 =~98k LUTS
So just taking into account the LUTS:
8 cores = 8*5k =~40k LUTS, which in no way leaves "about 80% of slices free", and NO way am I seeing anything near 100Kh/s.
To have ~80% free you would need to implement 8 engines in ~20k LUTS ,~2.5K LUTS per engine.
Sorry but for a SCRYPT engine I have to call bullshit...
Then suddenly I see this sort of thing in the same discussion.
"multiple smaller DRAM chips working in parallel will do best job... Allowing about 500 mega-transfers for low-cost / mid-cost fpga, that is 500 giga-bits per second or 60 gigabytes per second. Overall cost of DRAM will be about 150 EUR- and of FPGA to handle that about 300 EUR-. If works in fully-pipelined manner it would give about 500 kh/s mining performance for litecoin application."
So ABRACADABRA... we have a 5 fold increase in performance, and not a SINGLE analysis on actual cycle times any place to be seen.
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