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Author Topic: BFL fucked us over again (redux)  (Read 93268 times)
PuertoLibre
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June 11, 2015, 01:48:48 AM
Last edit: June 11, 2015, 02:57:24 AM by PuertoLibre
 #481

Actually, he is right, but the context is wrong.

If you sell GH/s by the piece meal, yes, you can make money off your customers. No matter what happens, BFL got yours.

Now if you are the one buying it, then no, like Luke-Jr (Top [Paid] BFL Bitcoin developer) said, you'll never make any money.



I'd challenge BFL to show that any single customer has made a positive return on their purchase of "Mining by the GH/s" product in the last year of it going live.
A strict easy to understand example.

A set amount of USD goes into their "Mining by the GH/s" product and the result is any positive return on that investment in mining for the customer.

What is a positive return?
Let me define that for those with ample weasel words to shoot off.
It means if I invest $200, by the end of my invested contract of 1 year, I got at least $200 which I invested and more than 1 cent from mining. Simple and easy to understand.

-----------------

We all absolutely know they will never (EVER) do this publicly, because it won't happen with what BFL is selling at their current price point.
Josh himself hinted in various open comments online that they couldn't have shipped volume and still made their customer happy with respect to the difficulty. He already knew since that time, that they were pretty much selling a pipe dream. (In my opinion)

This was very obviously contrary to his earlier discourse aimed at customers on this and other forums where he openly asserted that people would make a positive return on their investments. I still remember the many times he said that on just this forum alone.

Does anyone else remember all those times he said that as an employee working at BFL and hawking their products?


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Leeroy Jenkins
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June 11, 2015, 02:23:48 AM
Last edit: June 11, 2015, 02:38:35 AM by leeroyjenkins
 #482

Is Josh saying that mining bitcoins = making money as a small concession to the FTC that he and BFL fucked over their customers by preventing them from being able to make money?

Who woulda thunk? Cheesy

I tell you, though, I don't think anyone would have sunk money into them had it been made know that all the VC funding amounted to was $8K.

.























Federal Trade Commission vs Butterfly Labs













Made ya look. ; )



























brush242 ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=199652 ) aka TheBitcoinimist aka Rush Reid aka Ken Hunlenton aka Steve Reid aka perfectlycromulentword aka Stephen Mark Reid says: "BFL is fucked" READ THE EARTH-SHATTERING COMMENTARY AT >>>> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=150803.msg9614841#msg9614841 <<<<
Gleb Gamow
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June 11, 2015, 08:01:02 PM
 #483



Never before seen pic of Jody Drake and John Mutrux's children of their first litter.
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June 11, 2015, 10:24:46 PM
 #484



Never before seen pic of Jody Drake and John Mutrux's children of their first litter.
Why do you bother to attack them personally?

They have enough "issues" to point out as it is. No need to insult their children. (or lack of any children?)

=====================

Why not Focus on the relevant stuff that this forum would actually care about. Like for example if BFL moved any money after they stopped paying employees and/or customers. Or filed for bankruptcy protection.

Just because they stopped paying their employees (allegedly) that does not mean they didn't have the money to do so. It could just be some kind of way of conserving funds until the next court date.
(I know, if we were talking about a normal company, you would assume they laid everyone off simply because they ran out of money. But in BFL's unique case that may not be the actual story?)

Why not ask the folks who worked at BFL to produce the NDA they were asked/forced to sign. That would probably be an eye popping thing to read...


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June 12, 2015, 01:23:40 AM
 #485

I think the last person we need to tell to focus on anything "relevant" would be Gleb, the Scam Buster Extraordinaire. I don't see anything wrong with Bruno voicing his thoughts on these scamming thieves.

Puerto, you are also someone who had to deal with Josh on a personal level, right?

.























Federal Trade Commission vs Butterfly Labs













Made ya look. ; )



























brush242 ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=199652 ) aka TheBitcoinimist aka Rush Reid aka Ken Hunlenton aka Steve Reid aka perfectlycromulentword aka Stephen Mark Reid says: "BFL is fucked" READ THE EARTH-SHATTERING COMMENTARY AT >>>> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=150803.msg9614841#msg9614841 <<<<
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June 12, 2015, 01:51:09 AM
 #486

I think the last person we need to tell to focus on anything "relevant" would be Gleb, the Scam Buster Extraordinaire. I don't see anything wrong with Bruno voicing his thoughts on these scamming thieves.

Puerto, you are also someone who had to deal with Josh on a personal level, right?

Protection Order to not visit Jody's children at the KC Zoo in 5...4...3...
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June 12, 2015, 06:54:06 AM
Last edit: June 12, 2015, 10:47:57 AM by PuertoLibre
 #487

I think the last person we need to tell to focus on anything "relevant" would be Gleb, the Scam Buster Extraordinaire. I don't see anything wrong with Bruno voicing his thoughts on these scamming thieves.

Puerto, you are also someone who had to deal with Josh on a personal level, right?
What? You mean the incident with the W[r]ong statement made by Josh on behalf of the court case against BFL?

I only know of the statements made by Josh made the news sites on Google. No idea if the guy was approached to comment on his exuberant statements.

Reference:


He seems to think that I gave him up to the FTC/***/*** in the way of "information".
All I do know is that I didn't pull a "Judas" on him. He really did it all himself.

Bruno, is another story though.

====================

By the way, leeroyjenkins/Gleb, why is BFL (allegedly) laying off all their employees if they won the court case only a couple of weeks ago...?
Well, I REALLY don't understand? Did BFL make an accounting error?

I dunno, I am not the smartest tack on this site. I just feel/know looking at all these events in hindsight that if Josh had been fired a long time ago, BFL would have probably have alot less problems today. Actually, all in my opinion, I think the products would have probably have come out on time and ahead of schedule if they had found someone with more experience to be the driving and interacting force behind the company.

Subtract Josh's shenanigans from the equation and you end up with a healthier looking company.
Add Josh's shenanigans to the equation and you end up with shuttered BFL. (Hum, interesting story really!)

Jody was a smart gal when she saw nothing wrong. Now she just has to appear in court to prove that was the smartest decision as a general manager. I am absolutely sure she knows what she is doing, even right now. Right?
I have ample confidence that her decisions are the right ones.

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June 12, 2015, 12:53:36 PM
 #488

tl;dr: The FTC are poopie-heads that were picking on BFL, and BFL don't owe them any receivership costs from when they were made to wear dunce-caps, and sit in the corner of the class for a few months.

http://ia802308.us.archive.org/32/items/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531.330.0.pdf

DEFENDANT/COUNTERCLAIM PLAINTIFF BF LABS INC.’S SUR-REPLY
IN OPPOSITION TO THE FTC’S MOTION
TO DISMISS DEFENDANTS’ COUNTERCLAIMS
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June 12, 2015, 12:56:08 PM
Last edit: June 12, 2015, 01:35:04 PM by PuertoLibre
 #489

In my opinion.
Owning BFL hardware is like owning a butterphone.

It's pretty on the outside, but damn, pretty much fooked in every sense of the word.


Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mz31OFDDdk

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June 12, 2015, 01:39:02 PM
 #490

tl;dr: The FTC are poopie-heads that were picking on BFL, and BFL don't owe them any receivership costs from when they were made to wear dunce-caps, and sit in the corner of the class for a few months.

http://ia802308.us.archive.org/32/items/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531.330.0.pdf

DEFENDANT/COUNTERCLAIM PLAINTIFF BF LABS INC.’S SUR-REPLY
IN OPPOSITION TO THE FTC’S MOTION
TO DISMISS DEFENDANTS’ COUNTERCLAIMS


Thanks Chris, not only for the update and the TL;DR but certainly also for the smile!  Grin

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June 14, 2015, 02:49:30 PM
 #491

Just so I'm clear, are you guys saying it would be an unwise idea for me to take the refund I luckily received from BFL for my order and NOW reinvest it in the lower cost, wonderfully awesome BFL Monarch gear?

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June 14, 2015, 05:24:13 PM
 #492

Just so I'm clear, are you guys saying it would be an unwise idea for me to take the refund I luckily received from BFL for my order and NOW reinvest it in the lower cost, wonderfully awesome BFL Monarch gear?

H@shKRaker

No! Take your money and run. They are talking bullshit. Bullshit!
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June 14, 2015, 11:30:33 PM
 #493

Just so I'm clear, are you guys saying it would be an unwise idea for me to take the refund I luckily received from BFL for my order and NOW reinvest it in the lower cost, wonderfully awesome BFL Monarch gear?

H@shKRaker

No! Take your money and run. They are talking bullshit. Bullshit!

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June 15, 2015, 12:27:02 AM
 #494

Just so I'm clear, are you guys saying it would be an unwise idea for me to take the refund I luckily received from BFL for my order and NOW reinvest it in the lower cost, wonderfully awesome BFL Monarch gear?

H@shKRaker

No! Take your money and run. They are talking bullshit. Bullshit!



There is no BULLSH!T here.  I really received a refund and I REALLY am applying satire when I ask "should I reinvest in BFL gear".

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June 15, 2015, 02:13:37 AM
 #495

There is no BULLSH!T here.  I really received a refund and I REALLY am applying satire when I ask "should I reinvest in BFL gear".

H@shKraker



Y u no purchase precious from BFL?
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June 15, 2015, 08:59:07 AM
 #496

[...] I really received a refund [...]

The relevant question for a lot of readers here would be: when did you receive that refund? (And when did you apply for it?)

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June 15, 2015, 10:05:06 AM
 #497

[...] I really received a refund [...]

The relevant question for a lot of readers here would be: when did you receive that refund? (And when did you apply for it?)

yeah did anyone get a refund for their 65mm stuff from late 2013? (prob not)

my refund was only due to despearation upgrade of my very late never to arrive 65mm in 2013 for a 1.9k fee to Monarch(s) 1 small 1 large 8.6k it was
more or less

I got my refund due to that (drink the kool aid) upgrade 1 year and 3 days late from my order due to BFL for around 3 weeks from my recollection
trying like hell to refund in order to

1) please the judge on sonny's probation hearing

2) put off the fed investigation

but the Feds jumped in and 'poof' no more refunds

so in my case it was dumb dumb luck from back in the day ..when I got the refund I actually called the bank thinking the odds were better they TOOK 8.6k out of
my account rather then it being a refund...I was that dumbfounded


but again any one have any luck with refunds via feds or otherwise on their 65mm 2013 late arriving stuff?

 

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June 15, 2015, 02:28:35 PM
 #498

[...] I really received a refund [...]

The relevant question for a lot of readers here would be: when did you receive that refund? (And when did you apply for it?)

All,

I applied for my refund July BEFORE the FTC raid.  The FTC thing put a kink in the timing and then once BFL resumed their operations I contacted BFL, asked again for my refund and VIOLA, it showed up.  Keep in mind, any time i corresponded with BFL I copied Helen Wong on the emails so she'd have a nice complete history of my consumer experience.  If you're corresponding with BFL I HIGHLY recommend you ALWAYS copy the FTC so they have a record of your efforts and of BFL's responses.

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June 15, 2015, 02:53:41 PM
 #499

[...] I applied for my refund July BEFORE the FTC raid.  The FTC thing put a kink in the timing and then once BFL resumed their operations I contacted BFL, asked again for my refund and VIOLA, it showed up.  Keep in mind, any time i corresponded with BFL I copied Helen Wong on the emails so she'd have a nice complete history of my consumer experience.  If you're corresponding with BFL I HIGHLY recommend you ALWAYS copy the FTC so they have a record of your efforts and of BFL's responses.[...]

Thanks H@shKraker, this is very important information for everyone who is in similar circumstances...

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June 15, 2015, 05:09:19 PM
 #500

Oh, how we pine for the good ole days!


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