Quickseller escrowing for himself

[Vod]

QS lied and he should be giving refunds to everyone he scammed without them having to ask.

No. Where did I say this?

Where did you say what?  

Edit:  Ah, I see your deleting your old posts here.  Trying to make me look a loon posting to myself.  

Nope. And you can ask BadBear this. (although I did delete one recent post when I had responded to something that I read incorrectly)

This is the first time I had asked BadBear of anything regarding this thread, so if someone had claimed that I said to ask him something they were lying.

Yes, you are deleting posts and we don't need Badbear to prove it.  Simply click on my (second) quote link above to see it goes no where.  You lie a lot dude.

[Vod]

I'm thinking out loud here, but does the escrow necessarily need to be a third party?

Yes, an escrow should be a third party.

If you wanted to trade with a high ranking member for the security/trust/privilege it provides, trade with them directly.  Why pretend to have a third party?

[tarsua]

Looks like BayAreaCoins left QS deserved negative trust.

QS has said that anyone who leaves him negative trust (BayAreaCoins) will be removed from Default Trust.

Let's see what happens.

I under stand this but look on tomatocage's profile, he also left (undeserved) negative trust there which i think should be retracted quickly

If they take bayareacoins off the list it will show just how partial this forum is

[Quickseller]

QS lied and he should be giving refunds to everyone he scammed without them having to ask.

No. Where did I say this?

Where did you say what? 

Edit:  Ah, I see your deleting your old posts here.  Trying to make me look a loon posting to myself.  

Nope. And you can ask BadBear this. (although I did delete one recent post when I had responded to something that I read incorrectly)

This is the first time I had asked BadBear of anything regarding this thread, so if someone had claimed that I said to ask him something they were lying.

Yes, you are deleting posts and we don't need Badbear to prove it.  Simply click on my (second) quote link above to see it goes no where.  You lie a lot dude.

Oh that is because I reread your post, and saw that I was responding as if you had said something other then what you actually posted. Although as I mentioned above, I did delete one post

[FrozenOne]

Requested a refund from Quickseller and received it almost instantly with no complaints from him at all. Very trusted user in my book. Will definitely be dealing with him in the future. Definitely. Very cool guy. Doesn't deserve to be treated like he's trying to scam. That is most definitely not the case.

QS lied and he should be giving refunds to everyone he scammed without them having to ask.

Kindly point to the post in which I said this.

Where you said what?  

Where I said that I was going to give refunds to everyone.

You drinking again?  Where did I claim you said you were giving refunds?     You posting on the correct alt?

Hi, Vod! Thanks for your reply. I do understand where you are coming from however my experiences with Quickseller regardless of how negatively it may be viewed have been nothing but positive. Despite what he has done I still consider him trustworthy. He has earned this in my eyes through my dealings with him as an "escrow" and since it was his "alt" I dealt with, then fine. All of my deals which there were 3 with both hims went smoothly, so I trust him. That is all I have to say. This is too big a mess for me. I'm just a guy that's had good dealings with him. That's all. Thanks!

[Quickseller]

Looks like BayAreaCoins left QS deserved negative trust.

QS has posted that leaving him negative trust (BayAreaCoins) will get you removed from Default Trust.

Let's see what happens.

I would not be surprised honestly.

[xetsr]

I'm thinking out loud here, but does the escrow necessarily need to be a third party?

Yes, an escrow should be a third party.

If you wanted to trade with a high ranking member for the security/trust/privilege it provides, trade with them directly.  Why pretend to have a third party?

so as someone else asked, why the double standard? leave neg on one but not the other. I'm sure others are wondering the same thing.

sorry about starting to get off topic now.

[Quickseller]

I'm thinking out loud here, but does the escrow necessarily need to be a third party?

Yes, an escrow should be a third party.

If you wanted to trade with a high ranking member for the security/trust/privilege it provides, trade with them directly.  Why pretend to have a third party?

so as someone else asked, why the double standard? leave neg on one but not the other. I'm sure others are wondering the same thing.

sorry about starting to get off topic now.

Because of groupthink and a mob mentality. It is easier for someone to agree with what everyone else is saying verses to say something that is unpopular, and to strongly argue their point (potentially from multiple views). 

[EcuaMobi]

I'm thinking out loud here, but does the escrow necessarily need to be a third party?

What if I want to trade with a higher trust alt of the person instead? I would imagine that people would pay extra for that privilege.

Even if you do use a third party that is a different physical person that person could still collude with the other person and scam you.

The problem is that the seller and escrow must not collude.

Does it really make a difference if they are the same person? it might increase the risk they collude but even that is kind of hard to say.

To be fair if you agree to use someone as escrow it means you trust him enough to be willing to send first to him. Therefore the risk it not significantly (if at all) increased.

However it's not transparent at all. If any problem arises (and I mean non-intentional problems due to miscommunication, not necessarily a scam attempt) then the escrow (who is an alt of the other party) can't act neutral, he just can't. If the 2 persons who are dealing forget to agree what to do on an specific circumstance each of them may think differently; I've seen cases when they assume completely different things as obvious. A neutral third party could solve this but in this case there's no third party to do it.

As a result I don't think that's a scammy behavior completely (so I don't think it's enough for a trusted negative feedback) but I'd absolutely prefer to use someone else's services as escrow.

Looks like BayAreaCoins left QS deserved negative trust.

QS has said that anyone who leaves him negative trust (BayAreaCoins) will be removed from Default Trust.

Let's see what happens.

And on TC's profile too. It's quite strange to see someone on DT level one with a trusted (by default) negative feedback. I'm curious to see what happens too.

[tarsua]

Looks like BayAreaCoins left QS deserved negative trust.

QS has posted that leaving him negative trust (BayAreaCoins) will get you removed from Default Trust.

Let's see what happens.

I would not be surprised honestly.

Why would you not be surprised? do you believe that you are more trustworthy in comparison to him? And that any negative trust you get shouldn't be visible without searching?

[koshgel]

A lot of red being tossed around in here. Thinking a thread needs to be opened in Meta to discuss this escrowing for yourself business, especially as a member of DT.

[Vod]

And on TC's profile too. It's quite strange to see someone on DT level one with a trusted (by default) negative feedback. I'm curious to see what happens too.

Somebody as active as TC will get new positive feedback to overwrite the negative feedback soon enough.  

I think the system needs to be changed so that one negative feedback cannot cause "? ? ?".  I understand it is meant to be a warning sign like "careful - this account may be recently hacked or something" but it shouldn't stay "? ? ?" forever - maybe a one week period?

[Shadow_Runner]

Quickseller fucked me over and destroyed my reputation and sales for the longest time; with no evidence, and admitted it was his assumption.

You deserve every bit of this. Learn to keep your hands off the keyboard.. you claim to be leaving the forum but all I've seen is you logging between alts. Not everyone is a loudmouth on the forums.. Better know it isn't just me who's digging. Your not even close to as anonymous as you think.

[Tomatocage]

Not the response I was expecting..

Even if your story is believable ( ), you are still controlling all parts of the trade in terms of extraKrispy's side and escrow side. The middleman is supposed to be a third party. You may have been doing it on his behalf, but you are still in control of the coins and trade.

Not that I really care, but just out of curiosity, what were you expecting?

[xetsr]

Quickseller fucked me over and destroyed my reputation and sales for the longest time; with no evidence, and admitted it was his assumption.

You deserve every bit of this. Learn to keep your hands off the keyboard.. you claim to be leaving the forum but all I've seen is you logging between alts. Not everyone is a loudmouth on the forums.. Better know it isn't just me who's digging. Your not even close to as anonymous as you think.

You bought a hero account to buy gain trust. You posting here will not help your case, but only make things worse.

[Shadow_Runner]

Quickseller fucked me over and destroyed my reputation and sales for the longest time; with no evidence, and admitted it was his assumption.

You deserve every bit of this. Learn to keep your hands off the keyboard.. you claim to be leaving the forum but all I've seen is you logging between alts. Not everyone is a loudmouth on the forums.. Better know it isn't just me who's digging. Your not even close to as anonymous as you think.

You bought a hero account to buy trust. You posting here will not help your case, but only make things worse.

I don't have a "case". I make sales daily on cryptothrift or here now. I was stating that I suffered from Quicksellers feedback abuse. You pull the same shit. Assumptions among friends shouldn't lead to trust ratings, but sadly you all seem to do it.

[Vod]

A lot of red being tossed around in here. Thinking a thread needs to be opened in Meta to discuss this escrowing for yourself business, especially as a member of DT.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1174622.0

[Quickseller]

However it's not transparent at all. If any problem arises (and I mean non-intentional problems due to miscommunication, not necessarily a scam attempt) then the escrow (who is an alt of the other party) can't act neutral, he just can't. If the 2 persons who are dealing forget to agree what to do on an specific circumstance each of them may think differently; I've seen cases when they assume completely different things as obvious. A neutral third party could solve this but in this case there's no third party to do it.

You are correct, there are possibilities to have miscommunication issues. This is a risk that is being taken when escrowing your own deals. However this possibility of this happening is the same as if there is a direct trade between two parties.

If you and I are trading, and you are selling 1 BTC for 240 dollars, then what is the difference between you sending me 1BTC, and me sending you CAD$240 from QS, verses me sending you CAD$240 from an alt? Even if the fact that what currency is being used is not documented properly (an escrow agreement should do this), it is still a scam in both instances. If this would be done as a direct trade, then it would be possible to weasel your way out of it, however if you were acting as an escrow, then your reputation as an escrow would be damaged because you did not properly gather all of the facts prior to advising that it is safe to send money

[BayAreaCoins]

Looks like BayAreaCoins left QS deserved negative trust.

QS has posted that leaving him negative trust (BayAreaCoins) will get you removed from Default Trust.

Let's see what happens.

I would not be surprised honestly.

Everyone else is "scared" of being removed off the trust system for calling out untrustworthy people... not me sir.

The free cookies for being on DT aren't worth letting you do what you are doing.

Edit:  The "you what you are doing" is aimed at Quickseller.  Not Vod in way, shape or form.

[Tomatocage]

Why the double standard?

Tomatocage did the same thing with his alt extraKrispy but he has seen as one of the most trustworthy people here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=793183.0

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=257307

I'm not saying I don't trust tomatocage but what's the deal with double standards and witch hunts?

Well, Krispy really is an actual person, though I admit I probably (accidentally) posted from his account as much as he actually did. Dude is a co-worker who was having some bad luck, so I rented out my guest room to him. Those coins that I escrowed for mysel.. oops I mean Krispy really were his coins though. Very convenient explanation, right? I wish it made for a more exciting story, but that's pretty much all there was to it.

I'm not sure what to tell you then. That it's my alt and I was escrowing for myself? Is that what you were expecting to hear?