Gun free zone

[augustocroppo]

Just going sane in an insane world.

Yeah, as I told... In the moment you think you are sane person in a world of insane people, you are certainly fucked up.

And I'm sure the dead victims would have liked to been able to defend their lives, as well.

Yeah, as I told... In the moment you think that dead children would like to defend themselves with lethal weapons which they were not taught to use, you are certainly fucked up.

Myrkul, seriously, I am sure you are a person with good intentions in everything you try to do. Get out of this forum for a while. Enjoy a whole week with your children, they need you more than this forum needs you.

[myrkul]

And I'm sure the dead victims would have liked to been able to defend their lives, as well.

Yeah, as I told... In the moment you think that dead children would like to defend themselves with lethal weapons which they were not taught to use, you are certainly fucked up.

The moment you think I would give five year old kids guns - especially without training them - you are certainly fucked up.

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

"Why isn't anyone shooting back?"
"Because they can't. The school's a gun-free zone."

Of course, teenagers are another matter...

[FirstAscent]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

[myrkul]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

I'm sure being beaten to death is much preferable to being shot.

[FirstAscent]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

I'm sure being beaten to death is much preferable to being shot.

If you can't think through your hypothetical scenario to the end, then you're an idiot.

[myrkul]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

I'm sure being beaten to death is much preferable to being shot.

If you can't think through your hypothetical scenario to the end, then you're an idiot.

Go ahead and walk through it for me. You already think I'm sub-moronic, so I don't think this will much change your attitude.

[FirstAscent]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

I'm sure being beaten to death is much preferable to being shot.

If you can't think through your hypothetical scenario to the end, then you're an idiot.

Go ahead and walk through it for me. You already think I'm sub-moronic, so I don't think this will much change your attitude.

Guy walks in and starts beating kid. All the other kids run out door. Teacher screams, calls 911. Other teachers come in and wrestle offender off of kid.

Duh!

[myrkul]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

I'm sure being beaten to death is much preferable to being shot.

If you can't think through your hypothetical scenario to the end, then you're an idiot.

Go ahead and walk through it for me. You already think I'm sub-moronic, so I don't think this will much change your attitude.

Guy walks in and starts beating kid. All the other kids run out door. Teacher screams, calls 911. Other teachers come in and wrestle offender off of kid.

Duh!

Guy walks in and shoots a kid. All the other kids run out the door. Teacher shoots the offender.

Duh!

The reality is that attackers like this will get weapons. Whether they use baseball bats, knives, or farm implements (fun fact: almost all melee weapons are modified farm implements), they will have something to put them at an advantage to an unarmed defender. Your little fantasy of teachers swarming the guy to take him down doesn't even hold much water even if everyone (attacker included) is unarmed. Academics are not known for their fighting ability.

[augustocroppo]

Teacher shoots the offender.

Academics are not known for their fighting ability.

School teachers also are not known for they shooting skills.

[Lethn]

Guy walks in and starts beating kid. All the other kids run out door. Teacher screams, calls 911. Other teachers come in and wrestle offender off of kid.

If you seriously think that unarmed teachers are going to be able to do anything when people decide to get violent in a school you definitely haven't been to my previous schools, I hope all the other gun control advocates are as stupid as you are because once the initial shock of the Connecticut wears off people are all going to think you're morons.

[FirstAscent]

But I bet they sure wished somebody besides the crazy fucker were armed.

I bet they wished that crazy fucker wasn't armed at all.

I'm sure being beaten to death is much preferable to being shot.

If you can't think through your hypothetical scenario to the end, then you're an idiot.

Go ahead and walk through it for me. You already think I'm sub-moronic, so I don't think this will much change your attitude.

Guy walks in and starts beating kid. All the other kids run out door. Teacher screams, calls 911. Other teachers come in and wrestle offender off of kid.

Duh!

Guy walks in and shoots a kid. All the other kids run out the door. Teacher shoots the offender.

Duh!

The reality is that attackers like this will get weapons. Whether they use baseball bats, knives, or farm implements (fun fact: almost all melee weapons are modified farm implements), they will have something to put them at an advantage to an unarmed defender. Your little fantasy of teachers swarming the guy to take him down doesn't even hold much water even if everyone (attacker included) is unarmed. Academics are not known for their fighting ability.

I'm not sure the offenders in these scenarios were known for their fighting abilities either. Nor would I be so naive as to convince myself that teachers cannot be brave. Even if everything played out the way you describe it above, I'd take any and all scenarios above over assault rifle armed offenders. Are you too blindsided by your sick desires for a anything goes society to see that? It's obvious you are.

[FirstAscent]

Guy walks in and starts beating kid. All the other kids run out door. Teacher screams, calls 911. Other teachers come in and wrestle offender off of kid.

If you seriously think that unarmed teachers are going to be able to do anything when people decide to get violent in a school you definitely haven't been to my previous schools, I hope all the other gun control advocates are as stupid as you are because once the initial shock of the Connecticut wears off people are all going to think you're morons.

If you wish to move beyond speculation and proceed to hard numbers, feel free to do so.

[myrkul]

Hey, which takes less time to learn?

A martial art, such as Karate, or how to hit a man-sized target at less than 10 feet?

[myrkul]

Also, I found an interesting study:
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.1086/340507?uid=3739256&uid=2&uid=4&sid=21101467503853

[augustocroppo]

http://www.public.iastate.edu/~ucw/HistoryofWomenatISU/Women's%20Athletic%20Association.html



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[myrkul]

http://www.public.iastate.edu/~ucw/HistoryofWomenatISU/Women's%20Athletic%20Association.html

It's highly amusing that you actually spent time in order to argue my point.

[organofcorti]

This is a little OT, but I think it fits with the overall discussion.

According to this the US homicide rate is more than four times higher than that where I live, and indeed most other Western or developed nations.

I keep reading comments here that "we need to keep firearms to protect ourselves". With such a massive homicide rate I can understand why everyone in the US is (probably rightly so) scared of everyone else, to the extent that they fear for their lives constantly. I'd like to know why it is that in such a modern country the homicide rate  is so high. If this could be solved, gun control would be less of an issue.

[myrkul]

I'd like to know why it is that in such a modern country the homicide rate  is so high.

The study I linked above presents an interesting theory.

[organofcorti]

Also, I found an interesting study:
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.1086/340507?uid=3739256&uid=2&uid=4&sid=21101467503853

Do you have access to the whole article? The abstract isn't very enlightening I'm afraid.

[Lethn]

Hey, which takes less time to learn?

A martial art, such as Karate, or how to hit a man-sized target at less than 10 feet?

Practising martial arts for 8 years now, still learning it and still have much to learn, a gun is definitely easier Also, I wouldn't bother arguing with FirstAscent, despite his claims he tends to ignore hard statistics and like many people in this world blame inanimate objects for the problems caused by human error.