Bitstarz Removes 3.45 Btc Balance According to Breaking Bonus Terms

[ndnh]

Hi there,

We have the terms and conditions visible in so many places on the website,
in every email you receive, on the promotions page, etc.

No. I remember quite well that the terms page is the only place you have mentioned the max bet rule till a while back.

So, your take on laws and rules are that they're there, but they're not supposed
to be enforced? That sounds quite contradictory.

I am talking about terms on a website, not laws. What i mean is for example, as TwitchySeal pointed out above, you have 'the right to void all winnings' of players who use 'strategies'. Enforce that and Bitstarz is a scam.

You had also withheld the balance of a player, because he could not provide details of a year old fiat deposit of a small amount because your 'terms' justify that.

the player has the highest responsibility here

Yeah? May be you should start thinking from your players' perspective?

[bitstars.net]

bitstars.net: Serious question. Why don't you enforce all the conditions of your ToS on the server? Most of them are absolutely trivial to do so (e.g. max bets) or  "Sorry, you can only claim the deposit bonus 4 times in a row! Next deposit doesn't allow you to claim it").


The fact that you have:
a) Terms that are easy to enforce from your side, but rely on the player to be careful to not do so
b) If the terms are violated (which can be completely accidental), it works out hugely in your favor.

leads to the inescapable conclusion that you want people to break them  (otherwise you would spend half an hour coding)  so in the off-chance they win some real money, you don't need to pay

Hi there,

Again, we have a big set of terms and conditions and some of them are there to prevent abuse, but
that does not per definition mean that everyone out there is out to abuse us, therefore we do let
some things slip if we make the call that the player genuinely made a mistake.

Again, as a casino, it's better to keep a customer over time and on top of that, and I've repeated myself
I don't know how many times now, we try to put them as clearly and remind as much as possible,
but it doesn't matter how many times you do that, someone will always forget/ignore/miss the terms
and conditions.

Mike

[bitstars.net]

To be completely honest with you, a casino earns more on keeping a player
long term than short term gains.

In  other words, Bitstarz earns more from players that are happy and continue to deposit than from players who stop depositing because you refused to pay them.

Good for you. But really you shouldn't be earning anything from cancelled withdraws. 

A= [(Total Bet*HouseEdge) - Total Bonuses]
B= Cancelled Withdraws
C= Annual Profit

A + B = C

If C=100, what are A and B at Bitstars?

Ethically, you should be doing everything you can to keep B as close to 0 as possible.

Casinos (both online and B&M)regulated by the NJDGE (New Jersey), B always = 0, When funds are seized from players (Banned players, underage players, cheaters etc.) they are surrendered to the state.  This rule is in place to protect players.

When pokerstars seizes player funds they  are donated to responsible gaming charities. (They are still criticized for receiving tax incentives on these donations)

It's terribly obvious that Softswiss terms and conditions are written in a way to make B as high as possible while still keeping a majority of players happy and willing to return to deposit more.

Also, if a player deposits BTC1 and receives a BTC1 bonus, clears the bonus and then has their BTC10 cashout rejected and balance reset to BTC1, you still took BTC9 from him.  It was nice of you to give him BTC1 since you didn't have to.  But all you're really doing is choosing to seize "only" 90% of what you could.  If a player is guilty of a violation serious enough to justify not paying him, their entire balance should be seized and account closed.

If you wish to discuss this further, PM me your number and we can talk it
out over on the phone. I'd be happy to personally answer any questions you might
have!

Would you be willing to come on a podcast to discuss it on Wednesday night?  http://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/radio.php (don't let the name scare you, its more about online gambling in genral - not just the bad and the owner is reasonable)

Hi there,

The Jersey way sounds quite reasonable in my opinion and like quite the fair way to go, but then I'd
recommend presenting that opinion to the other license issuers.

And as for the Podcast, why not? I'm sure there'll be plenty of Bitcointalk guys who want to tune in!

Mike

[bitstars.net]

Hi there,

We have the terms and conditions visible in so many places on the website,
in every email you receive, on the promotions page, etc.

No. I remember quite well that the terms page is the only place you have mentioned the max bet rule till a while back.

So, your take on laws and rules are that they're there, but they're not supposed
to be enforced? That sounds quite contradictory.

I am talking about terms on a website, not laws. What i mean is for example, as TwitchySeal pointed out above, you have 'the right to void all winnings' of players who use 'strategies'. Enforce that and Bitstarz is a scam.

You had also withheld the balance of a player, because he could not provide details of a year old fiat deposit of a small amount because your 'terms' justify that.

the player has the highest responsibility here

Yeah? May be you should start thinking from your players' perspective?

Hi there,

Regarding the fiat money being withheld for not sending in documents, yes, that's something we are obligated to do
in accordance to our license issuer, it's not our rule and has to be enforced, if a casino does not that they're
in risk of losing their license. So if you have concerns about that, I'd recommend contacting the Government of Curacao's
Gambling Commission. If you want to use a card but don't want to send in a copy of it, I'd recommend not using it.

Also, for your information, the player sent the documents in and was paid in full within 24 hours, but maybe you missed
that one. The player also went on recommending BitStarz again and is still an active player in the casino.

Mike

[TwitchySeal]

To be completely honest with you, a casino earns more on keeping a player
long term than short term gains.

In  other words, Bitstarz earns more from players that are happy and continue to deposit than from players who stop depositing because you refused to pay them.

Good for you. But really you shouldn't be earning anything from cancelled withdraws. 

A= [(Total Bet*HouseEdge) - Total Bonuses]
B= Cancelled Withdraws
C= Annual Profit

A + B = C

If C=100, what are A and B at Bitstars?

Ethically, you should be doing everything you can to keep B as close to 0 as possible.

Casinos (both online and B&M)regulated by the NJDGE (New Jersey), B always = 0, When funds are seized from players (Banned players, underage players, cheaters etc.) they are surrendered to the state.  This rule is in place to protect players.

When pokerstars seizes player funds they  are donated to responsible gaming charities. (They are still criticized for receiving tax incentives on these donations)

It's terribly obvious that Softswiss terms and conditions are written in a way to make B as high as possible while still keeping a majority of players happy and willing to return to deposit more.

Also, if a player deposits BTC1 and receives a BTC1 bonus, clears the bonus and then has their BTC10 cashout rejected and balance reset to BTC1, you still took BTC9 from him.  It was nice of you to give him BTC1 since you didn't have to.  But all you're really doing is choosing to seize "only" 90% of what you could.  If a player is guilty of a violation serious enough to justify not paying him, their entire balance should be seized and account closed.

If you wish to discuss this further, PM me your number and we can talk it
out over on the phone. I'd be happy to personally answer any questions you might
have!

Would you be willing to come on a podcast to discuss it on Wednesday night?  http://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/radio.php (don't let the name scare you, its more about online gambling in genral - not just the bad and the owner is reasonable)

Hi there,

The Jersey way sounds quite reasonable in my opinion and like quite the fair way to go, but then I'd
recommend presenting that opinion to the other license issuers.

And as for the Podcast, why not? I'm sure there'll be plenty of Bitcointalk guys who want to tune in!

Mike

That's awesome, just sent the owner a message. Will confirm when I know what's up. (He's this guy)

[bitstars.net]

To be completely honest with you, a casino earns more on keeping a player
long term than short term gains.

In  other words, Bitstarz earns more from players that are happy and continue to deposit than from players who stop depositing because you refused to pay them.

Good for you. But really you shouldn't be earning anything from cancelled withdraws. 

A= [(Total Bet*HouseEdge) - Total Bonuses]
B= Cancelled Withdraws
C= Annual Profit

A + B = C

If C=100, what are A and B at Bitstars?

Ethically, you should be doing everything you can to keep B as close to 0 as possible.

Casinos (both online and B&M)regulated by the NJDGE (New Jersey), B always = 0, When funds are seized from players (Banned players, underage players, cheaters etc.) they are surrendered to the state.  This rule is in place to protect players.

When pokerstars seizes player funds they  are donated to responsible gaming charities. (They are still criticized for receiving tax incentives on these donations)

It's terribly obvious that Softswiss terms and conditions are written in a way to make B as high as possible while still keeping a majority of players happy and willing to return to deposit more.

Also, if a player deposits BTC1 and receives a BTC1 bonus, clears the bonus and then has their BTC10 cashout rejected and balance reset to BTC1, you still took BTC9 from him.  It was nice of you to give him BTC1 since you didn't have to.  But all you're really doing is choosing to seize "only" 90% of what you could.  If a player is guilty of a violation serious enough to justify not paying him, their entire balance should be seized and account closed.

If you wish to discuss this further, PM me your number and we can talk it
out over on the phone. I'd be happy to personally answer any questions you might
have!

Would you be willing to come on a podcast to discuss it on Wednesday night?  http://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/radio.php (don't let the name scare you, its more about online gambling in genral - not just the bad and the owner is reasonable)

Hi there,

The Jersey way sounds quite reasonable in my opinion and like quite the fair way to go, but then I'd
recommend presenting that opinion to the other license issuers.

And as for the Podcast, why not? I'm sure there'll be plenty of Bitcointalk guys who want to tune in!

Mike

That's awesome, just sent the owner a message. Will confirm when I know what's up. (He's this guy)

Cool man! Just send me a PM

[ndnh]

Hi there,

Regarding the fiat money being withheld for not sending in documents, yes, that's something we are obligated to do
in accordance to our license issuer, it's not our rule and has to be enforced, if a casino does not that they're
in risk of losing their license. So if you have concerns about that, I'd recommend contacting the Government of Curacao's
Gambling Commission. If you want to use a card but don't want to send in a copy of it, I'd recommend not using it.

Also, for your information, the player sent the documents in and was paid in full within 24 hours, but maybe you missed
that one. The player also went on recommending BitStarz again and is still an active player in the casino.

Mike

I personally do not have any issues with your terms or fiat deposits or your casino, I lose/lost nothing. All I mean is your competition is better.

Yes, I am fully aware of that. I also know that scared off some of your players who had previous fiat deposits, cards or whatever. You have taken care of the making terms more visible part, but you still have not fairly compensated those players and have not done anything to enforce the terms from your side as RHaver suggests. Take his advice.

...but it doesn't matter how many times you do that, someone will always forget/ignore/miss the terms
and conditions.

which is why you need to do it.

[bitstars.net]

Hi there,

Regarding the fiat money being withheld for not sending in documents, yes, that's something we are obligated to do
in accordance to our license issuer, it's not our rule and has to be enforced, if a casino does not that they're
in risk of losing their license. So if you have concerns about that, I'd recommend contacting the Government of Curacao's
Gambling Commission. If you want to use a card but don't want to send in a copy of it, I'd recommend not using it.

Also, for your information, the player sent the documents in and was paid in full within 24 hours, but maybe you missed
that one. The player also went on recommending BitStarz again and is still an active player in the casino.

Mike

I personally do not have any issues with your terms or fiat deposits or your casino, I lose/lost nothing. All I mean is your competition is better.

Yes, I am fully aware of that. I also know that scared off some of your players who had previous fiat deposits, cards or whatever. You have taken care of the making terms more visible part, but you still have not fairly compensated those players and have not done anything to enforce the terms from your side as RHaver suggests. Take his advice.

...but it doesn't matter how many times you do that, someone will always forget/ignore/miss the terms
and conditions.

which is why you need to do it.

Hi there,

That's so good about the selection of casinos we've got out there, I mean, it's all capitalism, right? If you do
not like BitStarz, I'm thrilled you've found another casino that fits your needs. So I wish you all the best there

Well, that might be the case, you're right, but we cannot bend the legislation that way, that has to be a question
for the legislator of the specific jurisdiction and we're simply following the regulation in place. I'm sure there's some
who don't like the verification part, but we're simply following the law here.

Even if you put terms all over the page, there'll still be people arguing that if there's no technical limitation in place,
we still "accepted the bet" and the information on the site doesn't matter. I'm sorry, but we can only do so much to
try to get the info out there. The technical implementation is coming, we actually had a developer meeting today
regarding that, so don't worry

Mike

[TwitchySeal]

Hi there,

Regarding the fiat money being withheld for not sending in documents, yes, that's something we are obligated to do
in accordance to our license issuer, it's not our rule and has to be enforced, if a casino does not that they're
in risk of losing their license. So if you have concerns about that, I'd recommend contacting the Government of Curacao's
Gambling Commission. If you want to use a card but don't want to send in a copy of it, I'd recommend not using it.

Also, for your information, the player sent the documents in and was paid in full within 24 hours, but maybe you missed
that one. The player also went on recommending BitStarz again and is still an active player in the casino.

Mike

I personally do not have any issues with your terms or fiat deposits or your casino, I lose/lost nothing. All I mean is your competition is better.

Yes, I am fully aware of that. I also know that scared off some of your players who had previous fiat deposits, cards or whatever. You have taken care of the making terms more visible part, but you still have not fairly compensated those players and have not done anything to enforce the terms from your side as RHaver suggests. Take his advice.

...but it doesn't matter how many times you do that, someone will always forget/ignore/miss the terms
and conditions.

which is why you need to do it.

Hi there,

That's so good about the selection of casinos we've got out there, I mean, it's all capitalism, right? If you do
not like BitStarz, I'm thrilled you've found another casino that fits your needs. So I wish you all the best there

Well, that might be the case, you're right, but we cannot bend the legislation that way, that has to be a question
for the legislator of the specific jurisdiction and we're simply following the regulation in place. I'm sure there's some
who don't like the verification part, but we're simply following the law here.

Even if you put terms all over the page, there'll still be people arguing that if there's no technical limitation in place,
we still "accepted the bet" and the information on the site doesn't matter. I'm sorry, but we can only do so much to
try to get the info out there. The technical implementation is coming, we actually had a developer meeting today
regarding that, so don't worry

Mike

About these rules you have to follow, are they made public anywhere?  Are there any that protect the players?

The whole point of verifying a player should be to make sure that they aren't underage, previously banned or a using fraudulent funds, right?

If that were your primary concern, you would be verifying all your players during the registration process. 

If you think maximizing deposits and minimizing cashouts is more important though, you would allow anyone deposit and redeposit as many times as they like, and only consider verification when a cashout is requested.

[ndnh]

Hi there,

Regarding the fiat money being withheld for not sending in documents, yes, that's something we are obligated to do
in accordance to our license issuer, it's not our rule and has to be enforced, if a casino does not that they're
in risk of losing their license. So if you have concerns about that, I'd recommend contacting the Government of Curacao's
Gambling Commission. If you want to use a card but don't want to send in a copy of it, I'd recommend not using it.

Also, for your information, the player sent the documents in and was paid in full within 24 hours, but maybe you missed
that one. The player also went on recommending BitStarz again and is still an active player in the casino.

Mike

I personally do not have any issues with your terms or fiat deposits or your casino, I lose/lost nothing. All I mean is your competition is better.

Yes, I am fully aware of that. I also know that scared off some of your players who had previous fiat deposits, cards or whatever. You have taken care of the making terms more visible part, but you still have not fairly compensated those players and have not done anything to enforce the terms from your side as RHaver suggests. Take his advice.

...but it doesn't matter how many times you do that, someone will always forget/ignore/miss the terms
and conditions.

which is why you need to do it.

Hi there,

That's so good about the selection of casinos we've got out there, I mean, it's all capitalism, right? If you do
not like BitStarz, I'm thrilled you've found another casino that fits your needs. So I wish you all the best there

Well, that might be the case, you're right, but we cannot bend the legislation that way, that has to be a question
for the legislator of the specific jurisdiction and we're simply following the regulation in place. I'm sure there's some
who don't like the verification part, but we're simply following the law here.

Even if you put terms all over the page, there'll still be people arguing that if there's no technical limitation in place,
we still "accepted the bet" and the information on the site doesn't matter. I'm sorry, but we can only do so much to
try to get the info out there. The technical implementation is coming, we actually had a developer meeting today
regarding that, so don't worry

Mike

Hey,
The rules are all right. What is questionable is that you did not ask for any verification when the deposit was made or on the corresponding cashout, but when he wanted to cashout a a much larger amount almost a year later.

I will look forward to the technical implementation.

Thank you

[bitstars.net]

Hey,
The rules are all right. What is questionable is that you did not ask for any verification when the deposit was made or on the corresponding cashout, but when he wanted to cashout a a much larger amount almost a year later.

I will look forward to the technical implementation.

Thank you

Hi there,

I know it sounds weird, I agree with you. But most of the cashouts are processed automatically so we don't even
notice them going out, and as your cashout was bigger than usual it got stuck in our system so we had to
manually push it through, that's when we noticed it. Again, not doing that just to be mean, I promise.

Thank you, so do I, trust me!

Mike

[vnpython]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

[TwitchySeal]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

Alright mike, why didn't you let this guy slide?

we do not keep track of how many people that are breaching that rule
and is suffering the consequences, as again, we let many slide.

What's the thought process when deciding who gets to keep their winnings a who's winnings become Bitstarz revenue.

Assuming this guy is telling the truth about having 3 bitcoin confiscated, your bonus of death rule just added 3 btc to your revenue.  We need to start keeping track here...

Like i said before, letting some slide seems like the obvious best strategy for you to confiscate as much as possible...depending on which ones you let slide.

I suppose all we can do as players is keep telling you how scummy it is.  over and over.  

[BoXXoB]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

Alright mike, why didn't you let this guy slide?

we do not keep track of how many people that are breaching that rule
and is suffering the consequences, as again, we let many slide.

What's the thought process when deciding who gets to keep their winnings a who's winnings become Bitstarz revenue.

Assuming this guy is telling the truth about having 3 bitcoin confiscated, your bonus of death rule just added 3 btc to your revenue.  We need to start keeping track here...

Like i said before, letting some slide seems like the obvious best strategy for you to confiscate as much as possible...depending on which ones you let slide.

I suppose all we can do as players is keep telling you how scummy it is.  over and over.  

Just seems like very little of this is making sense. They're handling this like complete amateurs in my opinion, failing to handle this like professionals. Just based on that I'd just leave this site be and not play at all. Of course a ton of sites have such rules but the way they are enforced at BitStarz is just nuts.

[TwitchySeal]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

Alright mike, why didn't you let this guy slide?

we do not keep track of how many people that are breaching that rule
and is suffering the consequences, as again, we let many slide.

What's the thought process when deciding who gets to keep their winnings a who's winnings become Bitstarz revenue.

Assuming this guy is telling the truth about having 3 bitcoin confiscated, your bonus of death rule just added 3 btc to your revenue.  We need to start keeping track here...

Like i said before, letting some slide seems like the obvious best strategy for you to confiscate as much as possible...depending on which ones you let slide.

I suppose all we can do as players is keep telling you how scummy it is.  over and over.  

Just seems like very little of this is making sense. They're handling this like complete amateurs in my opinion, failing to handle this like professionals. Just based on that I'd just leave this site be and not play at all. Of course a ton of sites have such rules but the way they are enforced at BitStarz is just nuts.

The sad thing is, Bitstarz probably deserves more trust than any other softswiss casino that I've come across...

[BoXXoB]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

Alright mike, why didn't you let this guy slide?

we do not keep track of how many people that are breaching that rule
and is suffering the consequences, as again, we let many slide.

What's the thought process when deciding who gets to keep their winnings a who's winnings become Bitstarz revenue.

Assuming this guy is telling the truth about having 3 bitcoin confiscated, your bonus of death rule just added 3 btc to your revenue.  We need to start keeping track here...

Like i said before, letting some slide seems like the obvious best strategy for you to confiscate as much as possible...depending on which ones you let slide.

I suppose all we can do as players is keep telling you how scummy it is.  over and over.  

Just seems like very little of this is making sense. They're handling this like complete amateurs in my opinion, failing to handle this like professionals. Just based on that I'd just leave this site be and not play at all. Of course a ton of sites have such rules but the way they are enforced at BitStarz is just nuts.

The sad thing is, Bitstarz probably deserves more trust than any other softswiss casino that I've come across...

They're that bad? Great thing I haven't played much at those sites... Quite sad indeed

[TwitchySeal]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

Alright mike, why didn't you let this guy slide?

we do not keep track of how many people that are breaching that rule
and is suffering the consequences, as again, we let many slide.

What's the thought process when deciding who gets to keep their winnings a who's winnings become Bitstarz revenue.

Assuming this guy is telling the truth about having 3 bitcoin confiscated, your bonus of death rule just added 3 btc to your revenue.  We need to start keeping track here...

Like i said before, letting some slide seems like the obvious best strategy for you to confiscate as much as possible...depending on which ones you let slide.

I suppose all we can do as players is keep telling you how scummy it is.  over and over.  

Just seems like very little of this is making sense. They're handling this like complete amateurs in my opinion, failing to handle this like professionals. Just based on that I'd just leave this site be and not play at all. Of course a ton of sites have such rules but the way they are enforced at BitStarz is just nuts.

The sad thing is, Bitstarz probably deserves more trust than any other softswiss casino that I've come across...

They're that bad? Great thing I haven't played much at those sites... Quite sad indeed

yeah.  for example:
satoshigames.io - doxed a player and trolled him hard for exploiting a bonus glitch https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1553184.msg16130930#msg16130930
fun-casino - took months to convince their site wasn't decentralized or provably fair and they still advertise it like that other forums https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1522493.new#new


and they are all slowly collecting dox from any player that has a decent sized cashout or no deposit cashout + have millions usd worth of betsofts fake progressives - disaster in the making

[BoXXoB]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

Alright mike, why didn't you let this guy slide?

we do not keep track of how many people that are breaching that rule
and is suffering the consequences, as again, we let many slide.

What's the thought process when deciding who gets to keep their winnings a who's winnings become Bitstarz revenue.

Assuming this guy is telling the truth about having 3 bitcoin confiscated, your bonus of death rule just added 3 btc to your revenue.  We need to start keeping track here...

Like i said before, letting some slide seems like the obvious best strategy for you to confiscate as much as possible...depending on which ones you let slide.

I suppose all we can do as players is keep telling you how scummy it is.  over and over.  

Just seems like very little of this is making sense. They're handling this like complete amateurs in my opinion, failing to handle this like professionals. Just based on that I'd just leave this site be and not play at all. Of course a ton of sites have such rules but the way they are enforced at BitStarz is just nuts.

The sad thing is, Bitstarz probably deserves more trust than any other softswiss casino that I've come across...

They're that bad? Great thing I haven't played much at those sites... Quite sad indeed

yeah.  for example:
satoshigames.io - doxed a player and trolled him hard for exploiting a bonus glitch https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1553184.msg16130930#msg16130930
fun-casino - took months to convince their site wasn't decentralized or provably fair and they still advertise it like that other forums https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1522493.new#new


and they are all slowly collecting dox from any player that has a decent sized cashout or no deposit cashout + have millions usd worth of betsofts fake progressives - disaster in the making

Unbelievable. Site owners doxinh players? What kind of madness is that. Makes me lose faith. Just proves how it's important to stay alert and careful. Never blindly trust anything. I've even started to read the terms when I register sites. Didn't feel the need for that in the past.

[TwitchySeal]

Did mike get tagged out?

[vnpython]

Dear all, today (27/10) i encountered bitstarz's bonus of death and although i do not like the way being handled, still have to accept it and have my 3btc taken back. None nevertheless, with my balance 1.04+btc asking for withdraw, see if i will encounter any issue with my newly registered account (23/10) without any other form of deposit except btc. I will give credit when is due... Email confirming new and never used before address already confirmed, waiting for processing... Update you guys when i have anything from bitstarz...

update as promised: request withdraw approved and after one night semi-sleepless night (dont know why my eyes dont stay shut after 3.30am), requested amount got credited into my wallet. I checked my document required by kyc (uploaded same day on my registration) and still pending... glad the withdraw when smoothly.

regards to continue playing at Bitstarz, to be honest, after so much hype on this 'bonus of death' and some other withdraw (and missing/stolen issue) read here and other sites, i hardly having any confident to play again, not knowing if i am the next victim, although i felt my play there was lucky... got introduced by askgambler and tried but ended in semi happy way.

i have nice experience with the game i played with bitstarz and until such negative feedback is resolved, i dont think i will come back. I will be watching this thread closely.

i am newbie by the way