[AMC]-The Official Active Mining Cooperative Discussion

[kslaughter]

Ken - I believe this operation will be a success and I've bought a lot of 2-3 month call options to AMC shares. I'd appreciate it if you take guys like me into consideration when setting the expiration date for the AMC to VMC share swap deadline.

We need to make sure there is a way to make Surprise (and any others in this position) whole.

The first Google hit I found for what happens to an option following a stock split, is here:

http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/03/092103.asp

The answer might help us figure out a solution.

This is really not a stock split, it is a swap, 1 share of AMC for 1 share of VMC when approved for trading.  The option owner are placing there bets and it up to them to guess right on the timing.  As an option trader myself I understand their concerns.

I made the options trades before any of the merger announcements on the basis of the existing AMC description on both exchanges and previous statements from Ken on this forum. I'm concerned in 2-3 months there won't be anyone to buy my AMC shares or any way to exchange them for VMC shares. I hope I'm not going to get punished for taking Ken at his word.

I don't think that is going to happen, AMC will continue to exist for a long time to come.  Even if the 10M shares where all swapped for VMC shares, AMC still has more to offer and will continue to grow.  The only difference will be that some of the revenue from AMC will flow into VMC.  I think it is a win for AMC and a win for VMC. 

[Surprise]

I read the proposed offer for VMC and I believe it says VMC may buy AMC shares on the open market. I take it this will happen after the merger period if VMC views AMC as undervalued at a current market price?

[kslaughter]

I read the proposed offer for VMC and I believe it says VMC may buy AMC shares on the open market. I take it this will happen after the merger period if VMC views AMC as undervalued at a current market price?

Yes, that option is available to VMC, however I don't see VMC purchasing a large number of shares, as most of VMC's effort will be going into selling machines.  While most of AMC's effort will be going into building its mining farm.  The main reason for the swap is so that enough shares of AMC will be sold to allow VMC to pay the NRE.  Of course AMC will get the NRE paid back. 

[Surprise]

Thanks for clearing things up Ken. I think this merger will work out fine for me and my options. I also appreciate the ability to invest in AMC or VMC depending on my opinions of the value of hardware selling or snowballing mining power.

[kslaughter]

Should AMC provide VMC with the NRE  then AMC will receive at manufacturers
cost the first 100 Fast-Hash-One fully loaded machines.  The availablity date has
been moved up to the end of October, due to the fact that using eASIC's Low Volume
Production these chips can be available in about 12 weeks.

These machines are rated at 24.576 TH/s maximum, so this would be a total of
2,457.6 TH/s.  Now to get all of these machines AMC would need considerable
resources to pay for these.  However, this is the maximum number and
AMC could purchase less than the maximum depending on their available
funds.  

AMC will also receive 70% of the profit from bulk chips sales.


eASIC Fast Turn Around ASIC: http://www.easic.com/high-speed-transceivers-low-cost-power-fpga-nre-asic-45nm-easic-nextreme-2/easic-nextreme-2-fast-turnaround-asics-manufacturing/

[JimmyJazz]

Yep, thanks for the explaination, this is most certainly the reason.

btct : 2013-07-04 00:47    ฿ 2.78000000    511867    0.00000543    COMPLETE

Only the 511867 sold shares got their divs.

Yep, he must have thought it would be ฿2.78/2,000,000 = 0.00000139, but it turned out to be ฿2.78/511,867 = 0.00000543. Maybe Ken can issue a special ฿0.00000404 dividend on BF to cover this? Thoughts?

Yes, Ken should definitely cover us for this. This was one of the issues that were addressed. So the past 5 dividend payouts from BitFunder has been wrong.

No, the BF dividends are right.

So I am to receive less just because I hold my shares on Bitfunder?

[kslaughter]

Yep, thanks for the explaination, this is most certainly the reason.

btct : 2013-07-04 00:47    ฿ 2.78000000    511867    0.00000543    COMPLETE

Only the 511867 sold shares got their divs.

Yep, he must have thought it would be ฿2.78/2,000,000 = 0.00000139, but it turned out to be ฿2.78/511,867 = 0.00000543. Maybe Ken can issue a special ฿0.00000404 dividend on BF to cover this? Thoughts?

Yes, Ken should definitely cover us for this. This was one of the issues that were addressed. So the past 5 dividend payouts from BitFunder has been wrong.

No, the BF dividends are right.

So I am to receive less just because I hold my shares on Bitfunder?

No, It was a mistake, and BTC-TC shares got overpaid.  This will be corrected in the future, however we are not taking back the dividends that where overpaid to
BTC-TC shareholders.

[lolstate]

Thanks for clearing things up Ken. I think this merger will work out fine for me and my options. I also appreciate the ability to invest in AMC or VMC depending on my opinions of the value of hardware selling or snowballing mining power.

Ah, ok, now I have thought it through, you should be fine. AMC shares will still be listed come your Expiry Date and the AMC stock price should trend as you originally expected (or better  ) because AMC continues to earn from mining despite the new plan to launch a public VMC. If you exercise your options, you likely then choose to swap AMC for VMC, because we obviously expect VMC shares will be more valuable.

[JimmyJazz]

Thank you for clearing up the dividend issue.

Would just like to say that I am an investor in AMC and have been a long time lurker on the board. I am happy that the slander being posted over the weekend has gone and we can now look forward to helping grow the project.

All the best.

[EskimoBob]

Yep, thanks for the explaination, this is most certainly the reason.

btct : 2013-07-04 00:47    ฿ 2.78000000    511867    0.00000543    COMPLETE

Only the 511867 sold shares got their divs.

Yep, he must have thought it would be ฿2.78/2,000,000 = 0.00000139, but it turned out to be ฿2.78/511,867 = 0.00000543. Maybe Ken can issue a special ฿0.00000404 dividend on BF to cover this? Thoughts?

Yes, Ken should definitely cover us for this. This was one of the issues that were addressed. So the past 5 dividend payouts from BitFunder has been wrong.

No, the BF dividends are right.

So I am to receive less just because I hold my shares on Bitfunder?

No, It was a mistake, and BTC-TC shares got overpaid.  This will be corrected in the future, however we are not taking back the dividends that where overpaid to
BTC-TC shareholders.

How many shares have you sold via IPO?

[kslaughter]

Thank you for clearing up the dividend issue.

Would just like to say that I am an investor in AMC and have been a long time lurker on the board. I am happy that the slander being posted over the weekend has gone and we can now look forward to helping grow the project.

All the best.

I have been a lurker from 2009 until March 2013, registered in 2010 and did 2 post, so I know where you are coming from.  Well, things are starting to come around, we are doing exactly what we said we would and we will continue to do that.  After a while it gets harder and harder for the slanders to come up with anything.

[Stuartuk]

Thanks for clearing things up Ken. I think this merger will work out fine for me and my options. I also appreciate the ability to invest in AMC or VMC depending on my opinions of the value of hardware selling or snowballing mining power.

Ah, ok, now I have thought it through, you should be fine. AMC shares will still be listed come your Expiry Date and the AMC stock price should trend as you originally expected (or better  ) because AMC continues to earn from mining despite the new plan to launch a public VMC. If you exercise your options, you likely then choose to swap AMC for VMC, because we obviously expect VMC shares will be more valuable.

Excuse me lolstate but I don't understand this. 5days ago AMC were going to the moon. Accepted. Now you are saying not only are AMC shares are still going to the moon but now VMC are issuing millions of shares and they are also going to the moon. So have you just DOUBLED the performance of Kens overall enterprise?

Also, according to a few posters Ken is doing better out of this and now so are the AMC-to-VMC shareholders - so on top of Kens overall btc buisness doing twice as well as last week we are all doing twice as well from extra share value? If I have this right, can you say where all this extra added value is going to come from?

[Stuartuk]

Hi Ken, could you please clear up these two things up from your community consultation document-

VMC will provide a method for shareholders to vote.

then a few lines later-

VMC shares offer no voting rights. Shares of VMC on the exchange do not represent real world shares of the
company.  The shares are solely a distribution mechanism for rights to profits.

And-

VMC will be run by a 7 member board of directors, the board of directors will be elected within three months
of the initial IPO of VMC.  

Does this mean you are going to offer a selection of candidates (say 10) and shareholders will vote and select 7 of these 10 to become board members?

Thanks, Stuart

[ArcticWolf]

Thanks for clearing things up Ken. I think this merger will work out fine for me and my options. I also appreciate the ability to invest in AMC or VMC depending on my opinions of the value of hardware selling or snowballing mining power.

Ah, ok, now I have thought it through, you should be fine. AMC shares will still be listed come your Expiry Date and the AMC stock price should trend as you originally expected (or better  ) because AMC continues to earn from mining despite the new plan to launch a public VMC. If you exercise your options, you likely then choose to swap AMC for VMC, because we obviously expect VMC shares will be more valuable.

Excuse me lolstate but I don't understand this. 5days ago AMC were going to the moon. Accepted. Now you are saying not only are AMC shares are still going to the moon but now VMC are issuing millions of shares and they are also going to the moon. So have you just DOUBLED the performance of Kens overall enterprise?

Also, according to a few posters Ken is doing better out of this and now so are the AMC-to-VMC shareholders - so on top of Kens overall btc buisness doing twice as well as last week we are all doing twice as well from extra share value? If I have this right, can you say where all this extra added value is going to come from?

I think a lot of people are waiting for the merger to actually happen before making a move. I think that after the merger, AMC will lose a bit of share value while VMC will gain, because AMC will have comparatively lower dividends.

[kslaughter]

Hi Ken, could you please clear up these two things up from your community consultation document-

VMC will provide a method for shareholders to vote.

then a few lines later-

VMC shares offer no voting rights. Shares of VMC on the exchange do not represent real world shares of the
company.  The shares are solely a distribution mechanism for rights to profits.

And-

VMC will be run by a 7 member board of directors, the board of directors will be elected within three months
of the initial IPO of VMC.  

Does this mean you are going to offer a selection of candidates (say 10) and shareholders will vote and select 7 of these 10 to become board members?

Thanks, Stuart

There will nomination's.

[bigdude]

I don't think that is going to happen, AMC will continue to exist for a long time to come.  Even if the 10M shares where all swapped for VMC shares, AMC still has more to offer and will continue to grow.  The only difference will be that some of the revenue from AMC will flow into VMC.  I think it is a win for AMC and a win for VMC.  

Ken, from the bolded points above, it is clear that you have mixed up what was supposed to happen ... what everyone was asking for.

AMC and VMC was supposed to be merged ... so that there is only ONE entity.

Now, you are completely changing this around so that both will still exist, and AMC will grow ??

This is completely wrong! and will bring us right back to all the issues and dramas of the last 130 pages of this thread.

You need to merge AMC into VMC, with the express intention of COMPLETELY dropping AMC from existence.

Sure, it will take sometime for all AMC shares to be swapped over, but no one is going to hold on to AMC shares on purpose when they know AMC is being closed/merged into VMC.

If you don't do this, and FIX what you have been saying for the past few pages, then we are right back where we started. Two companies, and a lot of crap in between.

Please fix it, and stop confusing/mixing sh!t up.

[metalh47k]

I don't think that is going to happen, AMC will continue to exist for a long time to come.  Even if the 10M shares where all swapped for VMC shares, AMC still has more to offer and will continue to grow.  The only difference will be that some of the revenue from AMC will flow into VMC.  I think it is a win for AMC and a win for VMC.  

Ken, from the bolded points above, it is clear that you have mixed up what was supposed to happen ... what everyone was asking for.

AMC and VMC was supposed to be merged ... so that there is only ONE entity.

Now, you are completely changing this around so that both will still exist, and AMC will grow ??

This is completely wrong! and will bring us right back to all the issues and dramas of the last 130 pages of this thread.

You need to merge AMC into VMC, with the express intention of COMPLETELY dropping AMC from existence.

Sure, it will take sometime for all AMC shares to be swapped over, but no one is going to hold on to AMC shares on purpose when they know AMC is being closed/merged into VMC.

If you don't do this, and FIX what you have been saying for the past few pages, then we are right back where we started. Two companies, and a lot of crap in between.

Please fix it, and stop confusing/mixing sh!t up.

Ideally a single company with shares ie. VMC. At worst; two companies, One with shares, the other without.

[WildFire.ca]

I am in 100% agreement with the last 2 posts. If this gets sorted out properly I have more BTC to invest and I will start telling friends to put some of there net worth in to this venture.

[oaxaca]

I am in 100% agreement with the last 2 posts. If this gets sorted out properly I have more BTC to invest and I will start telling friends to put some of there net worth in to this venture.

+1

[auto2nr1]

I agree with the 4 posts above.