My bank account's got robbed by European Commission. Over 700k is lost.

[Behemot]

ou do realize that you can't use all of the money in your bank account right? A lot of it does not exist, hence transaction limits. If you put all of your money in cash you are essentially throwing a lot of it away. This is why Gates, Slim, Ortega, etc all invest. And also, why would getting the money from your insurance company take longer than actually paying it?

So you claim taxes are a "theft', but I bet all the money in the world that you use the utilities provided for by taxes. How is that fair, and why should I feel sympathy for someone that avoids taxes? True, OP did choose the more "competitive" business option, but that does not make it any less immoral. And obviously, his business did not end up on top as he lost all of the money.

I am not feeding the troll.

[J603]

ou do realize that you can't use all of the money in your bank account right? A lot of it does not exist, hence transaction limits. If you put all of your money in cash you are essentially throwing a lot of it away. This is why Gates, Slim, Ortega, etc all invest. And also, why would getting the money from your insurance company take longer than actually paying it?

So you claim taxes are a "theft', but I bet all the money in the world that you use the utilities provided for by taxes. How is that fair, and why should I feel sympathy for someone that avoids taxes? True, OP did choose the more "competitive" business option, but that does not make it any less immoral. And obviously, his business did not end up on top as he lost all of the money.

I am not feeding the troll.

I'm the troll? Sorry, but go around in public claiming that "the regime" makes you pay "thefts". The average person is going to think that you're crazy. Also explain why the richest people in the world all invest instead of having tons of liquid cash.

You should also answer my question: Do you use utilities paid for by taxes and if so why is it fair that someone else (like me) should pay for you?

[infested999]

ou do realize that you can't use all of the money in your bank account right? A lot of it does not exist, hence transaction limits. If you put all of your money in cash you are essentially throwing a lot of it away. This is why Gates, Slim, Ortega, etc all invest. And also, why would getting the money from your insurance company take longer than actually paying it?

So you claim taxes are a "theft', but I bet all the money in the world that you use the utilities provided for by taxes. How is that fair, and why should I feel sympathy for someone that avoids taxes? True, OP did choose the more "competitive" business option, but that does not make it any less immoral. And obviously, his business did not end up on top as he lost all of the money.

I am not feeding the troll.

I'm the troll? Sorry, but go around in public claiming that "the regime" makes you pay "thefts". The average person is going to think that you're crazy. Also explain why the richest people in the world all invest instead of having tons of liquid cash.

You should also answer my question: Do you use utilities paid for by taxes and if so why is it fair that someone else (like me) should pay for you?

Bitcoin does attract a lot of nutjobs, so you might not fit in here. But your pathetic attempt at justifying theft was not appreciated. We do use electricity provided by our government, but we did not ask for them to setup an electric company that costs $0.40/kWh and we could create our own electric company that is much better, but the government does not allow this.

Sucks for OP, but why would you put 700,000+ into one account? Amounts that high should be in assets. Like many people have said, as soon as you put that money in there it is gone forever. You should never exceed the amount that is going to be insured.

Tax evasion has its flaws.

Like you would have handled it any better...

While I don't have 700,000 dollars to lose, I haven't lost money due to a bank closing down yet.

And what do you expect me to say? Should I feel sympathy for someone far richer than me who lost money because they tried to evade taxes that I pay willingly with no problems?

You are just saying "Well you should have taken all the money out of your bank and bought BTC, idiot" yet you did not forsee this thread coming months in advance did you? You basically just said "BTC just dropped from $100 to $80, you should have sold, idiot". I can't imagine what zeroday had to go through after his money was gone, I've never in my life had almost everything I own taken away from me, nobody else taken in seriously, and then everyone else thinks nothing is wrong and calls you the idiot.

The people making excuses here really prove a social pattern I have observed. How extremely clear-cut does a situation have to be for people to stop taking sides. In the Zimmerman case people still took sides, even though there were little arguments for the "bad" side. Then you can come up with something almost universally agreed upon such as this video, people still blame the guy because he "shouldn't have asked for that pack of cigarettes". Then in this thread the Cyrus officials reach into zeroday's pockets, grab his money, and run away with it. Now that is a very clear-cut situation and you can figure out who is the robber and who is being robber, yet there are still people taking different sides here?

[molecular]

The people making excuses here really prove a social pattern I have observed. How extremely clear-cut does a situation have to be for people to stop taking sides. In the Zimmerman case people still took sides, even though there were little arguments for the "bad" side. Then you can come up with something almost universally agreed upon such as this video, people still blame the guy because he "shouldn't have asked for that pack of cigarettes". Then in this thread the Cyrus officials reach into zeroday's pockets, grab his money, and run away with it. Now that is a very clear-cut situation and you can figure out who is the robber and who is being robber, yet there are still people taking different sides here?

Now hold on a second...

I'm all with you on most of what you say because I'm one of the nut-jobs here that advocate the state should stay out of the economy and be separated from money.

Also I don't say OP acted wrongly or carelessly by putting his money into a bank account. I can only imagine the pain of losing such amount and I'm not saying it's his own fault or anything like that.

But please consider what actually happened here: He invested his money in the bank (under false pretense that it would be safely "stored" there, which is not the case as we know now, in hindsight). The bank fucked up (gambled with the money and lost it).

Now what can be done is 2 options: bail-in (OP pays for the loss) or bail-out (tax-payer of Europe pay for the loss).

Actually it's hard for me to take sides here. Honestly, I'd probably have to say I'm with Max Keiser: hang the banksters! However after we chop their heads off: what then? The situation is fucking unbearable. Noone has a solution to offer. There's lots of hindsight, of course and everyone is pointing fingers and stating how things should've been done in the first place. Well guess what: it's too late now and it doesn't matter who's at fault.

All (fiat) money will vanish because everyone will default in a huge chain reaction. The great credit contraction.

[infested999]

Noone has a solution to offer.

Isn't BTC supposed to be the solution?

[molecular]

Noone has a solution to offer.

Isn't BTC supposed to be the solution?

It's a solution for the problem of having good money that can be transacted directly through the internet. Brilliant shit that exists now.

But still we need to sneak out the bad money somehow without hurting the patient. In medicine a drug is "snuk out" by slowly reducing the dose being administered.

We need a solution for the transition.

[infested999]

Nothing is illegal, however, I'm not eager to disclose my location on public resources in internet.

If you seek place to live and have full freedom of running international business without taxes and regulations, I may suggest BELIZE and PANAMA.
If you desire to give up your current enslaving citizenship and become a tax-free men traveling around the world, I recommend DOMINICA.

I checked out Dominica and their citizenship costs $100k which is a bit rich. If I ever secure enough funds to stop working altogether I only need a way to avoid wealth tax (capital gains/dividend tax in most jurisdictions, net worth tax in my jurisdiction) for which I need to officially reside outside of the Netherlands (which isn't defined exact, but you need a new foreign address). I won't need a passport that allows easy travel since I have no intention of renounce Dutch citizenship. Any recommendations? 

Anyway, this is far from a reality but it's nice to be prepared

100 to just buy citizenship? You don't have to do anything else? Or is that just the cost of a house there?

[infested999]

Nothing is illegal, however, I'm not eager to disclose my location on public resources in internet.

If you seek place to live and have full freedom of running international business without taxes and regulations, I may suggest BELIZE and PANAMA.
If you desire to give up your current enslaving citizenship and become a tax-free men traveling around the world, I recommend DOMINICA.

I checked out Dominica and their citizenship costs $100k which is a bit rich. If I ever secure enough funds to stop working altogether I only need a way to avoid wealth tax (capital gains/dividend tax in most jurisdictions, net worth tax in my jurisdiction) for which I need to officially reside outside of the Netherlands (which isn't defined exact, but you need a new foreign address). I won't need a passport that allows easy travel since I have no intention of renounce Dutch citizenship. Any recommendations? 

Anyway, this is far from a reality but it's nice to be prepared

100 to just buy citizenship? You don't have to do anything else? Or is that just the cost of a house there?

Donation to the government: http://www.isla-offshore.com/second-passport/dominica-best-choice-for-economic-citizenship/

How much is that compared to the US?

[Inedible]

Sucks for OP, but why would you put 700,000+ into one account? Amounts that high should be in assets. Like many people have said, as soon as you put that money in there it is gone forever. You should never exceed the amount that is going to be insured.

Tax evasion has its flaws.

Of course you're a troll, otherwise you wouldn't have posted this.

On the very unlikely chance you're not a troll and just didn't bother to read the thread, the person concerned employs Cypriots.

You might not run a business but when you do, you need to have a bank account. It needs to exist somewhere so why not Cyprus?

Why wouldn't he have it all in one account? Why would he have it in multiple accounts? When you pay your electric bill, do you pay into one account or do you pay into several different accounts for different invoices at different times?

If you had all your assets seized by the government, can I find a homeless person that's less well off than you to scoff at you?

"He had it coming. Why did he use the banking system? How did he not see the government would change the law overnight? Being a criminal has it's flaws."

[infested999]

1. Own a buisiness
2. Give people payment invoices where they have to pay in a mixture of cash, check, money order, Paypal, and Home Depot gift cards (in Europe)
3. They can never take all of your funds because each of those things are safe for small amounts.

That's clearly what he should have done.

[zeroday]

1. Own a buisiness
2. Give people payment invoices where they have to pay in a mixture of cash, check, money order, Paypal, and Home Depot gift cards (in Europe)
3. They can never take all of your funds because each of those things are safe for small amounts.

That's clearly what he should have done.

Unfortunately, i couldn't pay with cash, money order, paypal or gift cards $150K to my contractor. The only option is bank transfer.

[infested999]

1. Own a buisiness
2. Give people payment invoices where they have to pay in a mixture of cash, check, money order, Paypal, and Home Depot gift cards (in Europe)
3. They can never take all of your funds because each of those things are safe for small amounts.

That's clearly what he should have done.

Unfortunately, i couldn't pay with cash, money order, paypal or gift cards $150K to my contractor. The only option is bank transfer.

Send him a bank transfer from money that you immediately bought for Bitcoin, his bank account will immediately get frozen.

[Behemot]

Actually it's hard for me to take sides here. Honestly, I'd probably have to say I'm with Max Keiser: hang the banksters! However after we chop their heads off: what then? The situation is fucking unbearable. Noone has a solution to offer. There's lots of hindsight, of course and everyone is pointing fingers and stating how things should've been done in the first place. Well guess what: it's too late now and it doesn't matter who's at fault.

What do after you hang the banksters? Oh come on. You just take all their (huge) property and pay some of the debt. You sell the bank and all it's property and pay some of the debt. The rest is just dead asset. But you don't touch client's money.

As for states, you sell all the regime's property to pay regimes debt. It should usually be enough to also pay pensions (and other obligations) for some time in advance. Than, the *state* just ends

[Svennisen]

Well, this sucks. But in the long run positive for bitcoin. Got to see the good in everything.. right?

[Behemot]

Got to see the good in everything.. right?

My words bro, my words

[Inedible]

1. Own a buisiness
2. Give people payment invoices where they have to pay in a mixture of cash, check, money order, Paypal, and Home Depot gift cards (in Europe)
3. They can never take all of your funds because each of those things are safe for small amounts.

That's clearly what he should have done.

Even with hindsight, why is that clearly what he should have done?

Do you currently own a home that's worth more than $100K? Are you going to move to a smaller one in case the government decides to put a 50% tax on your house to pay for the budget deficit next month?

[solex]

1. Own a buisiness
2. Give people payment invoices where they have to pay in a mixture of cash, check, money order, Paypal, and Home Depot gift cards (in Europe)
3. They can never take all of your funds because each of those things are safe for small amounts.

That's clearly what he should have done.

Even with hindsight, why is that clearly what he should have done?

Do you currently own a home that's worth more than $100K? Are you going to move to a smaller one in case the government decides to put a 50% tax on your house to pay for the budget deficit next month?

Correct. In fact this can only be another mission executed....

Thank you Captain Hindsight!!

[Inedible]

1. Own a buisiness
2. Give people payment invoices where they have to pay in a mixture of cash, check, money order, Paypal, and Home Depot gift cards (in Europe)
3. They can never take all of your funds because each of those things are safe for small amounts.

That's clearly what he should have done.

Even with hindsight, why is that clearly what he should have done?

Do you currently own a home that's worth more than $100K? Are you going to move to a smaller one in case the government decides to put a 50% tax on your house to pay for the budget deficit next month?

Correct. In fact this can only be another mission executed....

Thank you Captain Hindsight!!

Were you just waiting for someone to post the word 'hindsight' so you could use that pic?

Otherwise I can't see any sense in your post 

[zeroday]

Nothing is illegal, however, I'm not eager to disclose my location on public resources in internet.

If you seek place to live and have full freedom of running international business without taxes and regulations, I may suggest BELIZE and PANAMA.
If you desire to give up your current enslaving citizenship and become a tax-free men traveling around the world, I recommend DOMINICA.

I checked out Dominica and their citizenship costs $100k which is a bit rich. If I ever secure enough funds to stop working altogether I only need a way to avoid wealth tax (capital gains/dividend tax in most jurisdictions, net worth tax in my jurisdiction) for which I need to officially reside outside of the Netherlands (which isn't defined exact, but you need a new foreign address). I won't need a passport that allows easy travel since I have no intention of renounce Dutch citizenship. Any recommendations?  

Anyway, this is far from a reality but it's nice to be prepared

BELIZE and PANAMA don't tax foreign income. If you run international or online business living there or just trade stocks or bitcoin, you may just forget about taxation because you don't even have to fill annual tax report.
When you migrate to one of these countries and live there for over 6 months, you become tax-free man, even with dutch passport.
To legally fuck EU revenue service, before you leave EU you may invest all your not-yet-taxed assets into your new offshore corporation. Then, a year after you move to caribbean and stop being resident for tax purposes in EU, you just sell this corporation and gett tax free income. BTW, as a variant, you may also invest not-yet-taxed money in bitcoin and play the same trick.

[solex]

Were you just waiting for someone to post the word 'hindsight' so you could use that pic?

Otherwise I can't see any sense in your post 

I was referring to the 3-point plan which you also dismissed. Yes, could have been clearer...