Somebody is trying to steal batch 1 Avalon shippments from DHL!

[sgravina]

I just talked with DHL.  Somebody called them and changed the address of my shipment to:

1826 W Pearce Blvd STE 104
Wentzvill, MO 63385

Because I caught this in time the package will be delivered to me.

The reason I figured this out is that when I looked at the tracking web site the last two entries were:

11 Recipient moved BOSTON, MA - USA  07:52  
10 Arrived at Delivery Facility in BOSTON - USA BOSTON, MA - USA  05:54  

[1715416888]

1715416888

[1715416888]

1715416888

[1715416888]

1715416888

[1715416888]

1715416888

[farproc]

So, the track number is part of your privacy. Never post it publicly.

[sgravina]

So, the track number is part of your privacy. Never post it publicly.

I didn't post my tracking number.  But I did post that I have a tracking number and sgravina is my real name.

I wouldn't have even been talking about my shipment on this forum if Yufi would have answered any of my questions.  He still hasn't acknowledge that my unit has been built or shipped.

[Dargo]

Wow - you might consider arranging to pick up the package at your local distribution center if possible. I once accidentally shipped something to my old address. I ended up waiting in front of my old address and signing for it out front on the sidewalk - UPS guy didn't even ask for ID. I could easily have been some random person intercepting the shipment.

[pikeadz]

I just talked with DHL.  Somebody called them and changed the address of my shipment to:

1826 West Pearce Boulevard
Wentzvill MO 63385

Because I caught this in time the package will be delivered to me.

The reason I figured this out is that when I looked at the tracking web site the last two entries were:

11 Recipient moved BOSTON, MA - USA  07:52   
10 Arrived at Delivery Facility in BOSTON - USA BOSTON, MA - USA  05:54 

Someone in Missouri should go to that address with a big box of dog shit and leave it at the doorstep.

[Lethos]

Once your shipment arrives, I would consider getting this attempted theft reported and investigated.
Someone brazen enough to do this once will try it again.

[Aseras]

You should call your local police and the FBI. This is federal felony, across state lines mail fraud. DHL can see who changed the address. they keep records.

[Rampion]

I just talked with DHL.  Somebody called them and changed the address of my shipment to:

1826 West Pearce Boulevard
Wentzvill MO 63385

Because I caught this in time the package will be delivered to me.

The reason I figured this out is that when I looked at the tracking web site the last two entries were:

11 Recipient moved BOSTON, MA - USA  07:52  
10 Arrived at Delivery Facility in BOSTON - USA BOSTON, MA - USA  05:54  

They changed the delivery address without knowing the original shipment address nor the tracking number, only knowing that your real name is "sgravina"??

[ebildude123]

Good to see its coming back to you, but people frauding dhl for avalons is... sad.
Whoever did that should go fall into a firey pit.

[bowen151]

Something else has to be at work here. how could they possibly change your delivery address without all of your information?

Has your computer been compromised, have you posted alot of personal information online, do you think they doxxed you and maybe tried this way?

Somethin sinister is afoot!

[Rampion]

Something else has to be at work here. how could they possibly change your delivery address without all of your information?

Has your computer been compromised, have you posted alot of personal information online, do you think they doxxed you and maybe tried this way?

Somethin sinister is afoot!

Well, I made a quick search and its very easy to find all Sam's information online, including address.

EDIT: I hope customers will get tracking numbers for next batches. That would help monitoring the package from the very beginning, thus avoiding this awful situation.

[Tyger]

you get a tracking number when they send your avalon?

[100%digital]

Batch 1 is still shipping? was under impression all batch 1 customers had received units -aside from your atypical delay/problems.

[cedivad]

EDIT: I hope customers will get tracking numbers for next batches. That would help monitoring the package from the very beginning, thus avoiding this awful situation.

+300

[01BTC10]

Call the police.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

I wouldn't have even been be talking about my shipment on this forum if Yufi would have answered any of my questions.  He still hasn't acknowledge that my unit has been built or shipped.

VERB (like word, but different)

[glendall]

Geez man that sucks. Glad to hear you found out about the attempted theft.

As for vengeance   I doubt there is much to be done at this point. The dude who tried to take it most likely will read this thread.

If it was me I would have not made this thread and instead got the police or a vigilante involved! That is really bullshit and whoever pulls scams like that should be punished.

[Minor Miner]

Did you call billy and ask if anyone had asked to pick up a DHL there?
http://www.billysroadsidebistro.com/

[sgravina]

Geez man that sucks. Glad to hear you found out about the attempted theft.

As for vengeance   I doubt there is much to be done at this point. The dude who tried to take it most likely will read this thread.

If it was me I would have not made this thread and instead got the police or a vigilante involved! That is really bullshit and whoever pulls scams like that should be punished.

I'm already exposed.  I posted here to warn others of this type of scam.  If I hadn't caught this fraud my computer would be on a plane to Missouri now.  This type of scam was very easy to implement but was not successful.  I gave the police all of the information.

[||bit]

So, the track number is part of your privacy. Never post it publicly.

I didn't post my tracking number.  But I did post that I have a tracking number and sgravina is my real name.

I wouldn't have even been be talking about my shipment on this forum if Yufi would have answered any of my questions.  He still hasn't acknowledge that my unit has been built or shipped.

Consider reporting this to DHL. They will investigate.

[cosurgi]

So, the track number is part of your privacy. Never post it publicly.

I didn't post my tracking number.  But I did post that I have a tracking number and sgravina is my real name.

I wouldn't have even been be talking about my shipment on this forum if Yufi would have answered any of my questions.  He still hasn't acknowledge that my unit has been built or shipped.

If he didn't inform you that your unit has been shipped, then how did you receive the tracking number???

EDIT: this is serious, if people don't get their tracking numbers then anything could happen to the packages!

[sgravina]

So, the track number is part of your privacy. Never post it publicly.

I didn't post my tracking number.  But I did post that I have a tracking number and sgravina is my real name.

I wouldn't have even been be talking about my shipment on this forum if Yufi would have answered any of my questions.  He still hasn't acknowledge that my unit has been built or shipped.

If he didn't inform you that your unit has been shipped, then how did you receive the tracking number???

EDIT: this is serious, if people don't get their tracking numbers then anything could happen to the packages!

I called DHL, gave them my name and zip code and they gave me the tracking number.  I assume the thief did the same.

Calling DHL was necessary because this is a valuable package and I needed to know when it would arrive.  I did this every day from when Yufi said 90% of batch 1 had shipped to when I finally got a tracking number (about 2 weeks).  Avalon should have given me the tracking number but they do not give out tracking numbers.

I was so excited to have a tracking number I told the forum so that others waiting might have hope.  That is probably when the thief got his diabolical idea.

[shibaji]

I called DHL, gave them my name and zip code and they gave me the tracking number.  I assume the thief did the same.

Calling DHL was necessary because this is a valuable package and I needed to know when it would arrive.  I did this every day from when Yufi said 90% of batch 1 had shipped to when I finally got a trakcing number (about 2 weeks).  Avalon should have given me the tracking number but they do not give out tracking numbers.

I was so excited to have a tracking number I told the forum so that others waiting might have hope.  That is probably when the thief got his diabolical idea.

Thanks for reporting this to the police. I hope the wanna-be-thief gets proper reward. I do not understand why Avalon would not send out tracking numbers. If someone knows BitSyncom / Yifu, please attract his attention to this incident.

[regular]

DHL should have a policy like with UPS or Fedex.  They won't redirect or change address until the first attempt is made.

[cosurgi]

omg, so it means that anybody who can find on internet your real name and address can call DHL and redirect the package.

question is - will the redirection work also across the countries? For example original owner is in Bulgaria and somebody calls DHL and changes shipping address to Argentina?

If no - then people in smaller countries might feel safer...

Yifu, you have to fix that!!

[Aseras]

DHL should have a policy like with UPS or Fedex.  They won't redirect or change address until the first attempt is made.

which makes it even more interesting how the redirect was done.

Sam you should contact your state attorney general, that may get more things done for you than a police report.

/ wasn't ThiagoCMC drama with rudrigorc2 one of the addresses in missouri?

[BitSyncom]

omg, so it means that anybody who can find on internet your real name and address can call DHL and redirect the package.

question is - will the redirection work also across the countries? For example original owner is in Bulgaria and somebody calls DHL and changes shipping address to Argentina?

If no - then people in smaller countries might feel safer...

Yifu, you have to fix that!!

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but there isn't anything I can do because I have not gotten a response back for these packages, I can only assume they are on the way. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

[cedivad]

What you can do is to give out tracking info. Will you do that for batch 2? Or you will enjoy us going mad for this investment?

[Aseras]

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but there isn't anything I can do because I have not gotten a response back for these packages, I can only assume they are on the way. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Of course if you gave out the tracking info LIKE YOU PROMISED people wouldn't be jumping all over demanding it and things like this wouldn't happen either.

[shibaji]

omg, so it means that anybody who can find on internet your real name and address can call DHL and redirect the package.

question is - will the redirection work also across the countries? For example original owner is in Bulgaria and somebody calls DHL and changes shipping address to Argentina?

If no - then people in smaller countries might feel safer...

Yifu, you have to fix that!!

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but there isn't anything I can do because I have not gotten a response back for these packages, I can only assume they are on the way. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

What is the issue with informing customer about tracking number ? In fact, if OP did not get the tracking number and someone else did, this would happen unknowingly! Is it too much work to send a simple email with tracking number - or even update on the account (which is probably the best) ?

[sgravina]

omg, so it means that anybody who can find on internet your real name and address can call DHL and redirect the package.

question is - will the redirection work also across the countries? For example original owner is in Bulgaria and somebody calls DHL and changes shipping address to Argentina?

If no - then people in smaller countries might feel safer...

Yifu, you have to fix that!!

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but I'm also at lost of what is going on to those I have not gotten a response back for. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Yufi, you shipped me an Avalon yet have never, ever responded to my email, support ticket or personal message.  You never told me that you shipped the computer.  As far as I can tell you haven't told anyone about their shipment.  They just show up.  That is not safe.  When I receive a magic money making machine in the mail I like to be there to sign for it so I don't lose anytime turning it on.

[cosurgi]

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but there isn't anything I can do because I have not gotten a response back for these packages, I can only assume they are on the way. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

If you don't give the tracking number, then everybody MUST daily call DHL and ask if they have any package being shipped to their address, and ask them for the tracking number. If people don't do this, then somebody else will call DHL and change the shipping address.

If you send tracking numbers to people, then they do not need to call DHL each day, but simply keep monitoring the package via internet, and take action only if the destinantion address was changed by a thief.

So this is your problem. Yifu, you must give people tracking numbers, or some random units will get stolen, because not everybody has the nerve to call DHL daily.

see my point now?

[Amitabh S]

Well the good news is we now have an address to investigate.

[Aseras]

Well the good news is we now have an address to investigate.

No, now it's a big can of worms.

Now that one idiot has tried and partly succeeded, there's going to be 100 or more try and redirect the next shipment announcement. All it takes is one "bad guy" to have a friend in DHL to take a tiny bribe of like 1 weeks worth of btc and they can redirect the whole lot of avalons.

There's enough information out now that everyone knows how they are declare and who the transfer agent is. becuase bitsyncom couldnt be bothered to give people the tracking numbers so they all posted enough info online trying to help that enabled this to happen.

[cedivad]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

You see his point of view? Its our fault.
We cannot wait for the divine gift they are giving us and so we don't deserve it.

When I will not receive my units I will complain and it will be my fault.

[Aseras]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

tell ya what. you promise to make any delayed or lost or stolen avalon owners whole, cover their lost mining profits and we wont bother you anymore.

[Rampion]

No need to panic, no need to be anxious, but tracking numbers provided at shipment will make everybody safer and will reduce the noise. There should be a way of getting that.

[myrond]

Batch 1 is still shipping? was under impression all batch 1 customers had received units -aside from your atypical delay/problems.

I wish, no tracking # or delivery for me.  (batch #1 customer).  I don't think mine has even left HK.  I know I'm not the only one either.

[SebastianJu]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Not the best sentence. If he wouldnt have been impatient the avalon would simply have been stolen. And when you give the package to the post you get the tracking number in this moment. If the trackingid didnt arrive then i only can think of that an employee didnt collect it carefully to give it to you.

I saw all the complaints about machines that didnt arrive... and now i really wonder now if the same thing happened more often.

Its really strange that "someone" can change the address. I believe showing the id is needed for such service. So was it an average joe or even an employee at the post? I mean its easy to check packages coming from an address for sure. And when you have the access to their computers... man... the world is full of slimy ash... that try to scam others in every possible way.

[Fiyasko]

Seriously, Call the cops, Get this guy arrested for a federal crime, the guy is more than likely to be doing more than just this as far as illegal actions go

[CoinHoarder]

That's messed up. Hopefully there are tracking numbers in batch 2/3. I don't want to have to worry about the Avalons getting here.

[augustocroppo]

I just talked with DHL.  Somebody called them and changed the address of my shipment to:

1826 West Pearce Boulevard
Wentzvill MO 63385

Because I caught this in time the package will be delivered to me.

The reason I figured this out is that when I looked at the tracking web site the last two entries were:

11 Recipient moved BOSTON, MA - USA  07:52   
10 Arrived at Delivery Facility in BOSTON - USA BOSTON, MA - USA  05:54 

Quite strange...

So, how DHL changed the address back to you? What they required to confirm that you are the original receiver and not the person which changed the address?

[Fiyasko]

I just talked with DHL.  Somebody called them and changed the address of my shipment to:

1826 West Pearce Boulevard
Wentzvill MO 63385

Because I caught this in time the package will be delivered to me.

The reason I figured this out is that when I looked at the tracking web site the last two entries were:

11 Recipient moved BOSTON, MA - USA  07:52   
10 Arrived at Delivery Facility in BOSTON - USA BOSTON, MA - USA  05:54 

Quite strange...

So, how DHL changed the address back to you? What they required to confirm that you are the original receiver and not the person which changed the address?

This is a good point... What the hell stops the guy from changing the address Again

[Fullsurface]

.

Yifu, you have to fix that!!
[/quote]

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but there isn't anything I can do because I have not gotten a response back for these packages, I can only assume they are on the way. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Yifu a question what will be the time frame that you will say yes let me go check on the units that have not been received or that i  haven't gotten a response back on 1 Month  2 months or 6 months
( in short when wil you start a investigation on why your products are not on route because customers can't investigate without tracking numbers there 4 kinda making it your problem as seller)

[sgravina]

So, how DHL changed the address back to you? What they required to confirm that you are the original receiver and not the person which changed the address?

I showed them my drivers license which has the original shipping address on it and my picture.

[augustocroppo]

So, how DHL changed the address back to you? What they required to confirm that you are the original receiver and not the person which changed the address?

I showed them my drivers license which has the original shipping address on it and my picture.

So you just got to a DHL office and then presented your ID.

What did they said regarding the change of address? What information you precisely learned about this?

[Entropy-uc]

I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.

Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.

Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to.  Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?

[augustocroppo]

Some excerpts from a quick research to understand how it is possible to change the delivery address:

https://www.facebook.com/Fedex/posts/531831740195113

Meanwhile, I, have travelled to Lumby, B.C. (about 40 miles north of Westbank) to see my daughters & welcome the birth of my 1st Great Grandson. I am in Lumby, & planning to leave about the same time the “parcel” is going to be released from customs. I advised DHL of the change of address, to Westbank, & was told, by a DHL service rep, in the east, this would not be a problem…this took place on Tues. Feb, 26 /13.

http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/dhl-express-international-c292353.html

(...) In addition, if I had to arrange for it to be delivered to my workplace instead (since I would not be free on Tuesday night to receive the item), I had to fax a request to DHL requesting a change of delivery address. I have no fax machine and have to look for someone with one. On top of that, they could not guarantee the delivery by Tuesday with the change in address.

(...)

I called DHL Wednesday morning after I managed to get access to a fax machine (since the representative serving me yesterday said I had to fax in a request for change in delivery address). The representative I spoke to this morning now told me that I could have emailed a request for change in delivery address, something that the DHL representative whom I spoke to yesterday neglected to mention to me.

http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=225055

Hello,

Our company has been the victim of credit card fraud. We sent a delivery to a certain company delivery address to Ireland, recipient changed the delivery address to a completely different home address of which we had knowledge.

DHL refuses to accept any responsibility, however we paid them to deliver to a certain company address, in stead they delivered to a very dodgy home address. We did not authorise this change of address nor were we informed of this at any stage. After an interview with the driver, the real delivery address has come to light.

Can anybody shed some light whether DHL should have delivered to the different delivery address although we did not authorise this? (it is our fulfillment's house DHL account)

Best,

Venka

(...)

Whenever our customers have tried that, DHL have always told them that only we - as the account holder - can change the delivery address.

So looks like something rather untoward has happened in your case.

James

[||bit]

Well the good news is we now have an address to investigate.

I'm not sure of DHL delivery and hand-over policies are, but it's possible if this was an attempted theft, that the address was just one the thief figured he could pick the package up, knowing where it would be delivered and the time by tracking the shipment online.

[shibaji]

I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.

Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.

Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to.  Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?

This is not Yifu's problem, it is problem for his business. If BiySyncom did not provide shipment tracking, and something bad happens, they are 100% responsible. Go read any online business clause. Ever dealt with Ebay or Amazon or any other online retailer ?

I do not understand on the other hand, why you are unable to understand this.

[Aseras]

I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.

Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.

Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to.  Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?

This is not Yifu's problem, it is problem for his business. If BiySyncom did not provide shipment tracking, and something bad happens, they are 100% responsible. Go read any online business clause. Ever dealt with Ebay or Amazon or any other online retailer ?

I do not understand on the other hand, why you are unable to understand this.

Yes except Yifu will only replace the avalon, perhaps when they get around to it in a few weeks. Maybe. If he feels like it. If he ever acknowledges your email or support ticket. In that time you lost 1-2 avalons worth of mining value.

There's not much you can buy on ebay that could pay for itself in one day to one week.

[ProfMac]

No need to panic, no need to be anxious, but tracking numbers provided at shipment will make everybody safer and will reduce the noise. There should be a way of getting that.

A good friend that I admire says that breakdowns are business opportunities.  There is a problem shipping.  I have students who are majoring in business and are from mainland China.  I don't know why they took Chemistry.  Anyway...Hmm.

If you are unhappy, fix the problem for everybody.  If you are not willing to fix part of the problem, shrug.

[ProfMac]

I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.

Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.

Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to.  Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?

After the shooting, I learned how detectives think.  Few people here think that way.  It is not natural to us.

[Syke]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Not the best sentence. If he wouldnt have been impatient the avalon would simply have been stolen. And when you give the package to the post you get the tracking number in this moment. If the trackingid didnt arrive then i only can think of that an employee didnt collect it carefully to give it to you.

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

[Entropy-uc]

I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.

Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.

Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to.  Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?

After the shooting, I learned how detectives think.  Few people here think that way.  It is not natural to us.

Who did you shoot? 

[ProfMac]

I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.

Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.

Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to.  Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?

After the shooting, I learned how detectives think.  Few people here think that way.  It is not natural to us.

Who did you shoot? 

I started with lawyers and bankers....

No wait.  That was a dream.

My daughter's boyfriend shot us.  The EMS team was all concerned that "he's mottled."  Which my vet. friends say is a sign that circulation has stopped.  I woke up in the ICU with the detective asking to get a statement before I died. 

But detectives basically build paperwork.  The remember everything, they give away nothing.  They don't stop crime, they document it's progress well enough to survive a courtroom battle.  I would know not to let the thief know that I knew that he existed.

[shibaji]

You really are a troll.

Ever tried to deal with Amazon when something goes wrong?  I have.  It is a complete nightmare.

Yes, many times - never had a problem. So you resort to calling names whenever cornered ? No wonder things did not go well with you and Amazon.

[A Meteorite]

You really are a troll.

Ever tried to deal with Amazon when something goes wrong?  I have.  It is a complete nightmare.

Yes, many times - never had a problem. So you resort to calling names whenever cornered ? No wonder things did not go well with you and Amazon.

This. Amazon goes to great lengths if I have a shipping problem. Sure, I do pay for Prime, but if I paid the equivalent of near $7000 for a product that used to be <$2000, I wouldn't expect any shipping problems. Getting a tracking number is practically a given at any price point anyways (and would avoid any problems to begin with).

BitSyncom, as a customer who ordered in batch 3, I hope you dearly consider giving out tracking numbers. It can help prevent things like this happening. We also will know when it's coming so we can sign for it and keep us from having to call DHL daily (which is hit and miss anyways!). This is the least we could ask of you. I get tracking numbers when I get $10 items, so I don't think this is too much to ask. This is an expensive device which, if lost, will mean that ROI becomes impossible at that point by the time it is eventually replaced - which, if I recall, being able to make a reasonable ROI was behind your pricing strategy.

[shibaji]

You really are a troll.

Ever tried to deal with Amazon when something goes wrong?  I have.  It is a complete nightmare.

Yes, many times - never had a problem. So you resort to calling names whenever cornered ? No wonder things did not go well with you and Amazon.

So you expect better service from 3 guys with the hottest product in Bitcoin than a company with armies of customer service reps.  That is what I call trolling.  Go buy from BFL and see what you get.

If you are on here shouting about having 10- boxes running in your garage netting $5k a day in Bitcoin, and leave enough of a trail that someone finds you in real life and steals them, is that Yifu's fault?  There is no difference between that and broadcasting to the whole internet that you just confirmed that DHL has your gear.

I to have Amazon prime, and have a 5 figure spend with them from last years records.  It is still impossible to get a response from them on the phone or by email when I have problems (which is blessedly rare).

That is very strange, since I too have prime, and using Amazon happily for years (so are many many of my friends). I have not claimed ever to get better service from BitSyncom in compared to Amazon (it is not possible) - why are you putting words in my mouth ? I merely expect the tracking number to be sent to the customer - how is that too much to expect ?

Are you in any way compensated by BitSyncom to blindly defend them ? Just curious, as your adamant and screwed up logic is hard to comprehend.

I have full appreciation for BitSyncom about what they have done - but if they do bad business, then as a customer I certainly have right to complain. If you do not realize the issue here, move on.  

I am done replying to you.

[Amitabh S]

Avalon, you guys are doing a great thing. Why not be more customer friendly while at it? No harm in giving a tracking number..

[greyhawk]

Avalon, you guys are doing a great thing. Why not be more customer friendly while at it?

It's a cultural thing.

Customer service is a very Western concept. In the US and strongly westernized European societies you usually even historically had a bunch of companies having a surplus of product to sell to customers. So you need something to set you apart and the customer becomes the focus.

In former communist or not-as-strongly-westernized former manufactory- or guild-based European countries historically it is the other way around. There was a lack of product, so the focus is on the seller/manufacturer and any customer can call himself blessed, that he is allowed to buy the product.

[cosurgi]

So everyone MUST daily call DHL and ask about packages, great!

Now every possible thief can search forums for people who bought avalons, find their personal information on the web, and redirect the package.

All those problems thanks to Yifu not giving out tracking numbers.
Yifu, you really have to fix that!!

[dishwara]

@BitSyncom
Better learn what is BUSINESS before doing it.
Not giving tracking number is bullshit.
But your reply for it is the worst one.

Calling a customer impatient & telling because of impatient & cant wait made dhl to CHANGE ADDRESS is the worst part.

If you cant give tracking number to YOUR OWN CUSTOMERS then why the hell you using courier with tracking numbers?

omg, so it means that anybody who can find on internet your real name and address can call DHL and redirect the package.

question is - will the redirection work also across the countries? For example original owner is in Bulgaria and somebody calls DHL and changes shipping address to Argentina?

If no - then people in smaller countries might feel safer...

Yifu, you have to fix that!!

I fail to see how this is my problem. this has everything to do with DHL. Also there are people on this forum who have yet to receive their units, this is correct. I am not blind, but there isn't anything I can do because I have not gotten a response back for these packages, I can only assume they are on the way. however instead of waiting it out like I suggested in newsletters because units have been shipped, aside from those with problem addresses, which once returned to us, will be corrected and sent out again ( you'll get a email for this, as many others have. )

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

[ngzhang]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

[caoxg]

So, would you please check SF express to Shanghai, #357 ....

Sorry to bother you ...

 

[Rampion]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

Hey Zhang, thank you for taking the time to explain the situation - it's appreciated.

Maybe you can tell to your agent that this is important hardware, and that it is crucial to have tracking numbers the same day the packages are handled to DHL? They should be able to do that, even if it is likely to be an additional cost as it requires some manual work. But the cost of potential stolen packages because of thieves exploiting this vulnerability it's likely to be much higher, please consider that.

Just an idea to try to make everybody safer.

[greyhawk]

Hey Zhang, thank you for taking the time to explain the situation - it's appreciated.

Maybe you can tell to your agent that this is important hardware, and that it is crucial to have tracking numbers the same day the packages are handled to DHL? They should be able to do that, even if it is likely to be an additional cost as it requires some manual work. But the cost of potential stolen packages because of thieves exploiting this vulnerability it's likely to be much higher, please consider that.

Just an idea to try to make everybody safer.

Please reread what zhang wrote and read between the lines this time. The Chinese mafia doesn't care if you get your money-printing machine now or never, the Chinese mafia is also not interested in customer service ratings, the Chinese mafia just provides a convenient relayment service between Bitsyncom and DHL. Bitsyncom can take it or leave it. Trying to tell the Chinese mafia how to do their job usually ends badly.

[Minor Miner]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

I really DO NOT think that you need to constantly explain what you do and why you do it.   You are MAKING THESE PEOPLE RICH!!!!!!!!!!    They should be grateful yet somehow they whine and complain because you have not handed them the riches on a silver platter and wiped their nose.   IGNORE THEM.  10% of your customers will ALWAYS complain.   IGNORE THEM (or fire them as customers).   Your life will be better.   You have done something no one else has succeeded in doing, be proud and deal with the people that appreciate your actions. 

[Rampion]

Hey Zhang, thank you for taking the time to explain the situation - it's appreciated.

Maybe you can tell to your agent that this is important hardware, and that it is crucial to have tracking numbers the same day the packages are handled to DHL? They should be able to do that, even if it is likely to be an additional cost as it requires some manual work. But the cost of potential stolen packages because of thieves exploiting this vulnerability it's likely to be much higher, please consider that.

Just an idea to try to make everybody safer.

Please reread what zhang wrote and read between the lines this time. The Chinese mafia doesn't care if you get your money-printing machine now or never, the Chinese mafia is also not interested in customer service ratings, the Chinese mafia just provides a convenient relayment service between Bitsyncom and DHL. Bitsyncom can take it or leave it. Trying to tell the Chinese mafia how to do their job usually ends badly.

Don't know if that kind of attitude will help to solve a problem we are having, both Avalon and its customers.

But anyhow its possible that Avalon's agent (name it as you wish) could provide that service for an incremental cost.

[cedivad]

I will not complain if you send me an unit without PSU and FANS but with a tracking number so that i can sleep the night.

[Rampion]

I will not complain if you send me an unit without PSU and FANS but with a tracking number so that i can sleep the night.
Also, since that you decided that you won't reply to my tickets anymore and so you won't change the shipping address to my billing address (my home vs my datacenter - how can i trust my datacenter to handle these "money making" devices? they were worth almost nothing when i ordered them). When i will not receive the devices, will i have to complain with you or with the datacenter? At least if you change the shipping address to my home i know that the datacenter didn't stole them. Ticket #507, please.

Dude;
I agree it would be NICE, if they could do that for you but they CANNOT.   This is the way it is and you need to deal with it.   If you do not trust your datacenter enough that you are concerned they may "steal" your money making machine, you should not have sent it to them.  Those were your actions, not Avalon's.  You need to sleep in the bed that you made.   These are not really even problems, and you should just deal with the small inconvenience and be happy that you are getting this thing when the difficulty is so low.  How much is that worth to you?

Avalon's may be stolen because DHL policy is loose and they will agree on changing delivery address just by providing a name + zip code (see OP). That info is very easily social engineered, thus this is an important security breach.

Having a tracking number to monitor the package from the very beginning will solve this problem.

We're just trying to find a solution in here, no need to flame in either way.

[Aseras]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

is there any reason why you couldn't generate the dhl shipping labels yourself with a HK address/account and send them with the units going out? Then agent is just delivering to DHL for pickup.

we aren't trying to make it worse, we are trying to find a way to make it easier for everyone and have everyone get their units safely and quickly.

[augustocroppo]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?

Like this?

http://www.cn.dhl.com/en/express/shipping/ship_online.html

What is DHL Web Shipping?

DHL Web Shipping is the online shipping solution that helps you manage express shipments. You can print labels, schedule courier pickups, store addresses, track your shipments and much more.

If speed and accuracy is what you need, DHL Web Shipping will streamline your shipment process and eliminate manual paperwork. This solution is ideal for small to medium-sized companies, office managers, receptionists, business travelers or anyone on the go. DHL Web Shipping is easy to use and requires no training to use.

DHL account holders can register and start shipping online. It only takes a minute to schedule a shipment, so why wait? Start saving time and money today!

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

Oh great! Now everyone knows how honest your company is! So there is an intermediary agent paid by bribery, increasing the customer's risk to not receive the product they ordered. That also proves that you do not go directly to DHL, so you can easily claim have no liability if a package is not delivered.

fuck

You are surely very good at electronic engineering, but you and your team just sucks at customer service.

[Vicus]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?

Answer in your post:

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

So ask for it.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

To my location this is from 2 up to 4 weeks.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

So, why not contacted me? I found myself in your problem list suddenly, when caught BitSyncom in random topic (after I posted ton of same questions in other threads) with straight question: "Where is my unit?" EMS have the same problem? Or you shipped via DHL regardless of what customer asked? (I have at least one proof of this, shipped to Belarus)

why we use such a screwed work flow?

Cos I have to pull out every word with pincers from you or BitSyncom. Why not just answer? I and many others are on deck to quote your answers to anyone, who asked the same info, that was answered elsewhere in forum. I do not need full explain, you can reply for ex.: "Ok, just checked, your unit is shipped, wait for week and if it will not come to you, PM me, I will request tracking # from agent... etc etc etc" or "We have problem with shipping your unit, we will ship it in n days." IS IT SO HARD? If I will have such answers, I will close this forum and will go into my favorite minecraft server and build another difficult device, to waste some time.

2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

So, EMS doesn't accept this devices too? If so, I'm will accept unit without PSU and FANs with pleasure and will not demand any money back

fuck

Can say the same. I'm tired to hunt you or BitSyncom from topic to topic.

[Amitabh S]

maybe they can write on parcel DO NOT SHIP TO AN ADDRESS DIFFERENT FROM THE ONE MENTIONED

[senseless]

2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

It's weird that you say DHL won't accept devices with a PSU when I'm using DHL to ship 1U rackmount servers all over asia. I've sent/received 1U rackmounts from sg/hk/ph/jp. Those have fans and PSUs. No problems in any of those cases. They ask me what it is, I say a computer, they print my label and off it goes (shipping as an individual sometimes and a company others, no problem in either case).

What reasoning did they give you for not accepting a device with a fan or psu? "Contraband" Seems a bit absurd. Is there some sort of local law/ordinance preventing this?

It would be nice if you could offer pick ups when our unit is ready. I can send an employee over to pick up my unit in 2 hours; and they can just bring it home with them on the plane. Then you guys can keep the shipping fees to yourselves....

[Fullsurface]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

If you wood answer the support tickets you wouldn't have to keep explaining your self on the forum  Fuck .    and we can all recall the news update .

(If you have not gotten your order, especially people in Germany or Iceland that uses special characters in their addresses. I highly suggest you open a ticket with our support indicating your order number, full address with phone numbers, so if there is a problem we can pull up new information quickly and let shipping proceed. This also applies to batch two customers, please make sure your phone number is correct, and there is no typo in the address.)

[Amitabh S]

Kind of disappointed in the way Avalon conducts itself. Is it just a rogue employee or does Bitcoin really bring out the worst in people? BFL is polite but does not deliver a "money making machine", while Avalon delivers but they are very rude. What to do? Bitcoin deserves better.

[caoxg]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

i doubt some terrible thing happen: my units shipping to Shanghai may be in somewhere Hongkong or China Custom.....

[Rampion]

People, no need to be rude. Let's just sum up the facts:

- thieves are trying to steal Avalon's from DHL, only a name + zip code is needed to change shipment address
- some say that customers are to blame for revealing too much info. Well, a lot of trusted members in this forum are known by the real names, including developers, and without a tracking number thieves could randonmly check on people to see if they have an Avalon on the way. This can become a recurrent problem because of the current value of the hardware. I'm sure everybody agrees that this is not nice and should be avoided

I will also give you another example:

CoinHoarder ordered 7 Avalons in this thread

He has done private transactions with members of this forums (me, for example), he handed over personal ID, etc. Which is pretty normal when you enter into finantial transactions with somebody.... But do you understand where I'm getting at? Dozens of users of this forums are in the same situation. Tthere is an open security breach, which can be avoided providing a tracking number at shipment or making sure that the packages are only delivered to the original address.

Other solutions may apply, let's just try to find a reasonable solution.

[shibaji]

People, no need to be rude. Let's just sum up the facts:

- thieves are trying to steal Avalon's from DHL, only a name + zip code is needed to change shipment address
- some say that customers are to blame for revealing too much info. Well, a lot of trusted members in this forum are known by the real names, including developers, and without a tracking number thieves could randonmly check on people to see if they have an Avalon on the way. This can become a recurrent problem because of the current value of the hardware. I'm sure everybody agrees that this is not nice and should be avoided

I will also give you another example:

CoinHoarder ordered 7 Avalons in this thread

He has done private transactions with members of this forums (me, for example), he handed over personal ID, etc. Which is pretty normal when you enter into finantial transactions with somebody.... But do you understand where I'm getting at? Dozens of users of this forums are in the same situation. Tthere is an open security breach, which can be avoided providing a tracking number at shipment or making sure that the packages are only delivered to the original address.

Other solutions may apply, let's just try to find a reasonable solution.

+1000

[A Meteorite]

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

I, for one, would be willing to pay more BTC if that were an issue. I already paid near $200 for shipment, what's another 1 BTC?

If it were an option, I would be the first to choose to have my Avalon shipped without fans (I already opted for no power supply) - if this meant that it would be handed off to DHL directly instead of through a proxy (so it'd be quicker) and I received a tracking number the moment it was shipped. I already have high quality Delta fans that I use in my GPU miner that I'd retire so this is a no-brainer. Can something like this be offered?

I don't know if you've looked at the self-reported loss in the other threads, but it looks like 30% of batch 1 Avalons have still not made it out to customers. This is a significant number. While not everyone who ordered an Avalon is on the forums, that is more than concerning. I'm sure a prompt tracking number would have prevented these issues and I urge you guys to look at solutions for batch 2 and 3. If what it takes is a little more BTC or losing the fans, I'd be all for it, at least for my order. There is a problem but there are solutions so take a look at what people are saying - I am confident that there is a solution that will work for everyone.

[BitSyncom]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Not the best sentence. If he wouldnt have been impatient the avalon would simply have been stolen. And when you give the package to the post you get the tracking number in this moment. If the trackingid didnt arrive then i only can think of that an employee didnt collect it carefully to give it to you.

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

[A Meteorite]

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

Does this mean orders will be shipped out quicker and with tracking numbers right away for batch 2 and 3? This is all we want to know really.

[BitSyncom]

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

Does this mean orders will be shipped out quicker and with tracking numbers right away for batch 2 and 3? This is all we want to know really.

I think it is safe to assume that by default simply because we don't have a chinese new year in between and the Customs backlog that came along with it to deal with. I think we just pulled their leg too much earlier during pre-CNY to get these units out now they are just not being too helpful.

[A Meteorite]

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

Does this mean orders will be shipped out quicker and with tracking numbers right away for batch 2 and 3? This is all we want to know really.

I think it is safe to assume that by default simply because we don't have a chinese new year in between and the custom backlog that came along with it to deal with. I think we just pulled their leg too much earlier during pre-CNY to get these units out now they are just not being too helpful.

This is good to hear - I had no idea Chinese New Year was such a big thing or would have an impact like that. I really hope as a batch 3 customer things will go smoothly for everyone in the upcoming batches and we won't see issues like we saw for some in batch 1.

[Fullsurface]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Not the best sentence. If he wouldnt have been impatient the avalon would simply have been stolen. And when you give the package to the post you get the tracking number in this moment. If the trackingid didnt arrive then i only can think of that an employee didnt collect it carefully to give it to you.

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

nice but this still doesn't take care of your first group of customers that that need  tending 2
get on the mining bandwagon so they can compete 4 the next batch . There the ones that sponsored the whole batch 2 and batch 3

[Amitabh S]

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

It all comes as part of responsibility of doing a business. I am actually thankful to you guys for doing this, but being polite is a big part of doing business. It all depends on how you want to be remembered in Bitcoin history.

[Syke]

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

Great to hear!

[SebastianJu]

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

Sounds good if you try another solution.

But these agents are another person that would know the recipients address and, if its really so easy to change the recipient, could change it via phone or email. Im not sure what i should think of these agents when you guys say that dhl cant ship it but this agent somehow gets dhl to ship them. I mean is it forbidden or not? If its forbidden then how can he do this legally?
On the other hand i dont see why it should be forbidden. Ready made PCs are sent out daily. And they have a psu included. Is it maybe something with insurance?

Then... this agent gets the tracking number in the moment he gives it to dhl. That means if he doesnt give it to avalon its simply bad service. I mean you have to call him and ask? What self employed person is this?

I chose shipping with EMS. Im not sure what this is but i hope its not a company where someone can call and change the address, without any proof that he is the real one, easily.

Im not sure but in my country dhl can come to ones house and pick up the package. Doesnt that work for you? It sounds easier and safer than giving it to an agent that ships it then. And i wonder anyway where the savings in shipping comes from. He works for this and is still cheaper than the normal shipping? Where is this agent paid from? I would like to know his business model. Really strange this all.
Plus the savings in shipping. Im not sure how much was charged for shipping of batch 1... but i assume it can easily pay any shipment.

I really really hope you guys find a solution.

What i would like to know is the legal status. I mean avalon could say that they shipped and could proof that it reached its target. If its not the same address then avalon cant change this because in theory only the receiver should be able to change that address. I think the legal problem would lie in dhl then because they let some random person change the address. But even when you would go to court you could only get back your investment if any. Thats a pain in the ass when you know you could earn way more when you got the machine.
In my opinion... if dhl is so insecure it cant be used. Or at least it could only be used if there isnt another solution for the target country.

[Rampion]

Guys, shipping those things all over the world is not so simple as some of you seems to think.

Problem acknowledged, they are workin on it: enough said

And remember this is a public forum before posting.

[kpriess]

I wouldn't report it, I would dress red/yellow and pay him/her a visit in a week or two..

[Minor Miner]

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

Sounds good if you try another solution.

But these agents are another person that would know the recipients address and, if its really so easy to change the recipient, could change it via phone or email. Im not sure what i should think of these agents when you guys say that dhl cant ship it but this agent somehow gets dhl to ship them. I mean is it forbidden or not? If its forbidden then how can he do this legally?
On the other hand i dont see why it should be forbidden. Ready made PCs are sent out daily. And they have a psu included. Is it maybe something with insurance?

Then... this agent gets the tracking number in the moment he gives it to dhl. That means if he doesnt give it to avalon its simply bad service. I mean you have to call him and ask? What self employed person is this?

I chose shipping with EMS. Im not sure what this is but i hope its not a company where someone can call and change the address, without any proof that he is the real one, easily.

Im not sure but in my country dhl can come to ones house and pick up the package. Doesnt that work for you? It sounds easier and safer than giving it to an agent that ships it then. And i wonder anyway where the savings in shipping comes from. He works for this and is still cheaper than the normal shipping? Where is this agent paid from? I would like to know his business model. Really strange this all.
Plus the savings in shipping. Im not sure how much was charged for shipping of batch 1... but i assume it can easily pay any shipment.

I really really hope you guys find a solution.

What i would like to know is the legal status. I mean avalon could say that they shipped and could proof that it reached its target. If its not the same address then avalon cant change this because in theory only the receiver should be able to change that address. I think the legal problem would lie in dhl then because they let some random person change the address. But even when you would go to court you could only get back your investment if any. Thats a pain in the ass when you know you could earn way more when you got the machine.
In my opinion... if dhl is so insecure it cant be used. Or at least it could only be used if there isnt another solution for the target country.

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

[SebastianJu]

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

Thanks. I hope they have more strict policy for changing receiving address.

[Minor Miner]

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

Thanks. I hope they have more strict policy for changing receiving address.

Yes, EMS has great security, it is like google's (impossible to contact for help).

[CoinHoarder]

I trust that the Avalon team has learned from Batch 1 that tracking numbers are needed.

No need to beat a dead horse.

[SebastianJu]

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

Thanks. I hope they have more strict policy for changing receiving address.

Yes, EMS has great security, it is like google's (impossible to contact for help).

*lol* Bad support makes it secure... great... ok... i would like to use it... except they have a problem with vanishing packages at their post stations. Some shipment provider does have such problem...

[Aseras]

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

Thanks. I hope they have more strict policy for changing receiving address.

Yes, EMS has great security, it is like google's (impossible to contact for help).

EMS is your local post office. They can look up packages in EMS system. I regularly receive EMS from India and China and many other countries. All of ours are sent registered mail, it is essentially under lock and key. You need to make friends with your post master.

[augustocroppo]

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

I suspect that you are not telling the truth here. China's DHL custom support states that they do not have any policy to determine what products can be export from China, but they follow the government regulation.

In accordance with China's customs, all you have to do is just to declare what you are exporting if you have a CR (Custom Registration) code.

That means DHL cannot directly refuse to ship the Avalon product if you declare to China's customs what you are doing.

Perhaps that explains why you need an additional agent paid by bribery to export your products. You are exporting electronic products without to declare to China's customs. Who possibly declares is your agent and that is why you are so persistent to not provide a tracking number for your customers.

http://www.dhl.com/en/express/shipping/customs_support/customs_paperwork/customs_guidelines_china.html

All importers and exporters in China are required to register with Customs authorities for an importer or exporter Customs Registration code (CR Code), or engage with an agent who has the CR Code and is authorized to act as the importer or exporter of record for their shipments. This CR code is to be indicated on customs declaration forms of all shipments, except for documents and personal effects. We encourage you to relay the urgency of these requirements (for both HS Codes and CR Codes) to your trading partners in China, as shipments being imported into/exported out of China may be placed on hold by Customs authorities until this information is available.

http://www.ec.cn/trade/declaration.shtml

Customs Export Declaration

In many countries, export shipments valued below a minimum requirement may not require a formal customs declaration. The purposes of customs export declaration are to verify and regulate outgoing cargo (including re-export goods) and to collect the statistical data (of the product, quantity, value, and destination) for export references.

(...)

The exporter normally must sign an authorization paper (the power of attorney) allowing the customs broker or the forwarder to handle the customs declaration.

In certain countries, exporters may prepare the customs declaration forms by themselves and let the customs broker handle the rest of the customs formalities.

From:   CNDGF Webenquiry (DHL CN) (CNDGF.Webenquiry@dhl.com)
Sent:   Wednesday, April 03, 2013 1:22:12 AM
To:   augustocroppo@hotmail.co.uk (augustocroppo@hotmail.co.uk)
Good day.

 

DHL have no right to determine which cargoes can be exported from China. We always follow the policy in China.

 

Best Regards

 

Zonghua Wang

Telesales

Marketing & Sales

DHL Global Forwarding(China) Co.,Ltd.

 

Orient International Finance Plaza

No.318 South Zhongshan Road

200010,Shanghai,China

[Minor Miner]

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

Thanks. I hope they have more strict policy for changing receiving address.

Yes, EMS has great security, it is like google's (impossible to contact for help).

EMS is your local post office. They can look up packages in EMS system. I regularly receive EMS from India and China and many other countries. All of ours are sent registered mail, it is essentially under lock and key. You need to make friends with your post master.

No, EMS is NOT your local post office.   It is the name used by each countries post office for their Express Mail Service.   Since these shipments originate in CHINA, it is China post UNTIL it is handed to customs in your home country, then you can track it.   If you track it before all you see is outbound from XXXX.    And, please do go and try to call China Post and say you are Joe Blow from XXXXX zip code and do you have a package coming my way.   Let me know how that works for you.

[ButchHashidy]

few people however, like OP can not wait and are impatient, then something like this happens.

Not the best sentence. If he wouldnt have been impatient the avalon would simply have been stolen. And when you give the package to the post you get the tracking number in this moment. If the trackingid didnt arrive then i only can think of that an employee didnt collect it carefully to give it to you.

Unfortuanately, Bitsyncom used a forwarding service to save money on shipping. It is this random forwarder that actually ships them with DHL. Bitsyncom chose a forwarder that won't provide him with the tracking numbers, so he can't provide them to his customers.

Bitsyncom, stop using that forwarding service!

We already switched. part of growing pains, not that I expect any body here to understand.

BitSyncom,
With utmost respect to the bitcointalk forums and to the entire Avalon team, I think it would prove to be most judicious for any foreigners outside of mainland china to watch the Ai Wei Wei documentary "Never Sorry," to get a better picture of the government we're dealing with here.  Realize the hand that BitSyn and his team have been dealt and be grateful we've come this far in a community drenched in controversy and deceit.  I dare say Avalon has put more then their pocketbooks on the line with these batches.  I think since we've entered uncharted territories it's becoming a learning experience for everyone.  I thank the OP for sharing this with the community to give us insight on what to look out for.

[exahash]

maybe they can write on parcel DO NOT SHIP TO AN ADDRESS DIFFERENT FROM THE ONE MENTIONED

You can write  "Do Not Forward" or "Postmaster: Do Not Forward"  but that might not work with a private courier.

[Aseras]

EMS is China Post.   Then they hand it off to USPS (or Canada Post) or whatever country you are in.  EMS is usually faster than other couriers out of china.   But china has a LOT of holidays where people just do not work and even the government shuts down.

Thanks. I hope they have more strict policy for changing receiving address.

Yes, EMS has great security, it is like google's (impossible to contact for help).

EMS is your local post office. They can look up packages in EMS system. I regularly receive EMS from India and China and many other countries. All of ours are sent registered mail, it is essentially under lock and key. You need to make friends with your post master.

No, EMS is NOT your local post office.   It is the name used by each countries post office for their Express Mail Service.   Since these shipments originate in CHINA, it is China post UNTIL it is handed to customs in your home country, then you can track it.   If you track it before all you see is outbound from XXXX.    And, please do go and try to call China Post and say you are Joe Blow from XXXXX zip code and do you have a package coming my way.   Let me know how that works for you.

Yes it is "the local post office" its handed around to each of them and they can look up things between each other, although there is usually some lag, a day or two.

the post office, specifically the post master ( in the US ) does have the ability to look up packages in EMS system by address. If they like you and feel like it.

[RodeoX]

As mentioned pages ago. Screwing with the mail is a VERY SERIOUS crime. Call the cops and they MUST investigate. I know that bitcoin can confuse them, but mail fraud they know very well.

[Aseras]

technically UPS Fedex and DHL are cargo, not mail. But since it's "mail fraud" across state lines it's still a federal crime.

[RodeoX]

technically UPS Fedex and DHL are cargo, not mail. But since it's "mail fraud" across state lines it's still a federal crime.

Good points to mention. But yes, cross a state line and you are in big trouble. If it was the U.S. mail... well, it's off with your head.   

[Syke]

technically UPS Fedex and DHL are cargo, not mail. But since it's "mail fraud" across state lines it's still a federal crime.

And the package is listed as $299 value. Realistically, they're not going to do anything over such a cheap package.

[shibaji]

technically UPS Fedex and DHL are cargo, not mail. But since it's "mail fraud" across state lines it's still a federal crime.

And the package is listed as $299 value. Realistically, they're not going to do anything over such a cheap package.

Not true. Just try & see.

[cedivad]

I tried to email the DHL support of my country. They replied me that they won't change the destination address without the permission from the sender. However, i've tried myself in the past, it is simply not true. You just have to be cool at the phone.

[Syke]

technically UPS Fedex and DHL are cargo, not mail. But since it's "mail fraud" across state lines it's still a federal crime.

And the package is listed as $299 value. Realistically, they're not going to do anything over such a cheap package.

Not true. Just try & see.

I've dealt with a lot of fraud over the years. Nothing ever comes of the "investigations". The new name and address where this package was redirected to isn't the actual person comitting the fraud. They're not that stupid.

[shibaji]

technically UPS Fedex and DHL are cargo, not mail. But since it's "mail fraud" across state lines it's still a federal crime.

And the package is listed as $299 value. Realistically, they're not going to do anything over such a cheap package.

Not true. Just try & see.

I've dealt with a lot of fraud over the years. Nothing ever comes of the "investigations". The new name and address where this package was redirected to isn't the actual person comitting the fraud. They're not that stupid.

That is possible. I am just saying they will not ignore the request because of $ value.

[SebastianJu]

I now had some conversations via email with DHL because i wanted to be sure that wont happen to me. They told me that:
"An address change can be made only by the freight payer, quoting the tracking-number,
or the receiver, should he not be reachable at the target address will get a notice card, it is then possible to deliver in the same area to a new address. However, a prerequisite is the personal presence or power of attorney issued to the person who is authorized to take the shipping by presentation of ID."

So only the sender can change the address. Maybe its different in china but it would be strange that a multinational corporate like DHL will have different rules. On the other hand... who knows who works at these bureaus...
Im not sure what to think about this when this actually happened.

[Joshster]

My guess would be that they shipped it to a abounded or someone unsuspecting house where they can wait outside and try haggle the package, still there must be phone records or something.

[Aseras]

I now had some conversations via email with DHL because i wanted to be sure that wont happen to me. They told me that:
"An address change can be made only by the freight payer, quoting the tracking-number,
or the receiver, should he not be reachable at the target address will get a notice card, it is then possible to deliver in the same area to a new address. However, a prerequisite is the personal presence or power of attorney issued to the person who is authorized to take the shipping by presentation of ID."

So only the sender can change the address. Maybe its different in china but it would be strange that a multinational corporate like DHL will have different rules. On the other hand... who knows who works at these bureaus...
Im not sure what to think about this when this actually happened.

You be surprised how many rules can be ignored for a handful of cash.

[SebastianJu]

You know what... now i spoke with another person there that seems to know more. And she wrote:

"No, it would not be correct to say that employees of DHL Express work in China less responsibly than Elsewhere. As you told Mrs. ***, only the freight payer or customer may cause a change of the contract awarded. The receiver in turn can cause the delivery to another address only when a delivery attempt has already been made ​​and he was asked by DHL Express to envisage a second delivery.
 
Moreover, as also mentioned in the thread, even item numbers covered by the policy. If a customer knows the shipment number, pretending to be the sender, receiver or freight payer, it can also give an address change by phone, even without being able to prove their identity. Our employees are trained, however, to recognize and detect fraud attempts of this kind.
 
If a shipment was misdirected, DHL Express provides for the immediate retrieval of the broadcast. In the rare cases where a shipment must be reported lost replacement services to our general transport conditions are done.
 
We assure you that the case you described is a rare event that is not representative of the high service standards of DHL Express."

So in fact the thread was fully correct. And its not only china. If one has the shipping number one can change the delivery. And even though they claim that the shipping number has to be treated confidential it seems to be possible to get the number by calling dhl. That opens scam every door isnt it? Even when one claims that the wrong target address could be visited... there are many way. Let it send to a small shop and collect it, wait in front of a house and claim youre mr. *** or whatever.

I cant let this lay down if its really this way. I mean thats an open security hole if all infos till now are right. So now they gave me the contact for security problems at DHL. I hope they have a better feeling about the problem and are able to change something if all is true.

[iikun]

EMS is sometimes better at final delivery but they have weak security on handover between countries. My previous company actually stopped using them due to their permanently losing several of our packages.

I personally have tried to deal with them when they lost my own package & it was ridiculous. 
Local P.O. said "It arrived on flight XYZ in London, ask the UK"
UK P.O. said "We never received it, ask origin country's PO"

It went back & forth like that...
...caused huuuuge headache for me & I spent a couple of days just sorting the whole thing out to help my client get replacement docs.

So I agree that DHL is shameful for what they did here, but I don't think any shipper is 100% safe.

[seljo]

Movie script.... except for the trolling. 

[SebastianJu]

Hm... i chose EMS as the only option... hope all goes well then.

Youre right about the security with all companies. I had a problem with a third sender too. There are documentations in TV that there are big hills of packages in their centers and its simply easy to steal something there. Not hard to do. Such problems will every shipper have.

I only think that unnecessary risks should be closed if possible. I mean when you lose a pc and get a refund its not much trouble. But losing an avalon you waited months for you lose money way more than the avalon is worth.

[coastermonger]

could any one tell me, how to give a non-exist tracking number to our customers?


first, we send the packages to HK-DHL agent.

agent transport them to HK, a few days time.

packages picked up at HK.

after about 1 week, they will give us the tracking number if we ask for.

to most country, 1 week time is enough for a delivery.

if anything goes wrong, like custom issues happened or wrong tel number or something , our agent will call us, give us the tracking number, let us contect with our customer. i think multiple people get my email when they having custom issues or DHL can not find you.

why we use such a screwed work flow?

1, save shipment cost.
2, if we go to DHL directly, they didn't accept this device, there is PSU and FANs in it, which is contraband. only these agent can send them out by doing some bribery work. if we tell them we are not satisfied, they simply ask us to deal with DHL ourself instead.

fuck

I actually found this quote by ngzahng to be pretty disturbing.  So they can't ship DHL directly because fans and PSU are considered contraband?  They have to "bribe" a local Hk-DHL facility to go around it? 

I swear to god I'm about ready to buy a plane ticket to HKG, knock on some doors, and fly home with the thing on my lap.

[cedivad]

I swear to god I'm about ready to buy a plane ticket to HKG, knock on some doors, and fly home with the thing on my lap.

And you are not alone. However, this was defined as impossible from Avalon.

[Entropy-uc]

I swear to god I'm about ready to buy a plane ticket to HKG, knock on some doors, and fly home with the thing on my lap.

And you are not alone. However, this was defined as impossible from Avalon.

Better to attend the bitcoin conference in San Jose this month and find Yifu there.  That's what I intend to do.