[Group Buy#1] Avalon ASICs CHIPS! Using JohnK as escrow! FINISHED!

[AMuppInTime]

Google doc address under my name is no longer valid / I specified to previous person I wanted the refund sent to a diff address... It seems it didn't receive refund yet though..

[alle.sello]

I don't see my nick on refund list.
John K. please send refund to original address.

BR

[bigbeninlondon]

Refund received!  Much appreciated!

[SteveB]

Refund received. Thank you JohnK!

[thdvmgbgjn]

You should still be in the original spreadsheet. You are not. All 10000 of the chips were accounted for by people listed there.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AiYcEqkgyjc_dGU0VzhHRGpOOUxudWkxdWpDN3RmbFE&usp=sharing#gid=0

Therefore I can't see how you are entitled to a refund.

If you can sign with one of the original funding addresses that might be a different story, but that means you should control an alias in that list.

The thing is I have the transaction ID where I paid the address that we were supposed to pay. I swear I saw my name on the spreadsheet a few times too, but after I got pulled to my Business trip, I never really looked back. I got so swamped with life and work that this was just a forgotten thing. I guess I'm just trying to figure out where my 5.16 BTC went. I guess it went down the drain and I got screwed

I would normally say that you have lost your btc as you either need to a) demonstrate that you own one of the btc addresses that sent 5.16 to the group buy account by signing a message, or b) demonstrate that you own one of the bitcointalk accounts that bought 5.16 btc worth of chips. If you can't do one of those things, then the btc must have gone somewhere else, because as far as I'm aware, all of the btc that were received were accounted for.

Think about it - if you didn't have to do one of those things, then anyone could just post here and say "I sent 5.16 btc and then went on a business trip" - clearly we can't just start sending btc to anyone who says that...

Having said that, it seems there were four payments of 5.16 btc to the address but only three users that paid 5.16 btc on the spreadsheet, so you could be in luck (see transactions below).

In order to prove it though, I think you still need two things to happen in your favour:
1) The extra funds need to still be in the escrow address. If there are no extra funds in that address once all other payments are accounted for, your payment must have been refunded at some earlier stage.
2) JohnK should be allowed in to your mtgox account. This will allow him to verify that a payment was indeed sent from your mtgox account to the right address at a time that corresponds to one of the four payments below. Copy/pasted text or screenshots would not suffice here because you need to prove it is from *your* account that the payment was made, and screenshots are too easily doctored. In theory, anyone could check the blockchain (as I just did), notice there was an extra 5.16 paid that's not in the spreadsheet and claim it, so your mtgox transaction history is the only way to prove it was you who paid it, and this means someone trusted by both sides (JohnK) needs to be given your mtgox login details to verify.

Payments list: https://blockchain.info/address/1At75rKd6e8b7S7AAPzZ5V3kAzhkGYhnpU?offset=0&filter=2
Payments of 5.16:
https://blockchain.info/tx/48cfb99c9dbc1750b1319c6f2121302083359544acf42d8bb47a3852c41fcee1
https://blockchain.info/tx/6d969e3931b6bf6c78b32833767c30c3176bc67cd620b52523dba28da00c5c3a
https://blockchain.info/tx/cc6cbf7458df1fca4366bc1dbe2713d17b7aff3b3d916907491f3e879c00b37f
https://blockchain.info/tx/bc4ed5d44166100127dfacf04ffbdc4385e5c1fe19325118e3c4666ec3421156

one for 5.1 (just to show that the four 5.16's above are separate from GodFader's payment of 5.1)
https://blockchain.info/tx/bfa9d49db960463ec4ab4a981d6d3640249eb9d28e4ac313e6814beb04a1a7bb

Vycid - theoretically chip count should mean no one that is not on the list gets a refund. In practice though, if someone submitted funds, ragin didn't see them and JohnK ignored them and left them in the wallet... then they could be excluded from the chip count. In that case though, they should still have been sitting in the wallet.
It looks like there was somehow 5.16 left in the wallet after the chips were purchased that went to:
https://blockchain.info/address/16kbqtQNtLGvERubGS4QDmgLgv5fQAQcZy
This was the final payment out of the group buy wallet, and I'm not sure why it went there from the wallet.

Perhaps JohnK could clarify this - if those funds are sitting unclaimed in a wallet controlled by JohnK, then it might be worth logging into dmo580's mtgox account to verify that he did make the payment to the groupbuy address, as he may be the rightful owner.

scotjam

I understand. I knew it would be an uphill battle, and so I'm not making too big of a deal out of it and screaming my head off, but I figure it'd be nice to at least claim the 5.16 BTC and have my name on there or be refunded (if possible).

So unfortunately I'm kinda newb here, so how do I sign a message to prove that it was my bitcoin address that sent those funds? I'm not sure how to demonstrate that it was my bitcoin talk account on here who paid in, but you can see in Page 1 that I expressed interest early on and pledged 5 BTC.

Maybe Ragingazn can confirm, but here's where I messaged him right after paying him:

http://imgur.com/ElyqsCq

Here's my MtGox screenshot:

http://imgur.com/BvwDO9L

I know as you said screenshots are insufficient, so I did message JohnK (waiting for response). Perhaps we can work something out regarding MtGox access. I'm cautious when it comes to these things like access, but hopefully we can work things out.

[scotjam]

I understand. I knew it would be an uphill battle, and so I'm not making too big of a deal out of it and screaming my head off, but I figure it'd be nice to at least claim the 5.16 BTC and have my name on there or be refunded (if possible).

So unfortunately I'm kinda newb here, so how do I sign a message to prove that it was my bitcoin address that sent those funds? I'm not sure how to demonstrate that it was my bitcoin talk account on here who paid in, but you can see in Page 1 that I expressed interest early on and pledged 5 BTC.

Maybe Ragingazn can confirm, but here's where I messaged him right after paying him:

http://imgur.com/ElyqsCq

Here's my MtGox screenshot:

http://imgur.com/BvwDO9L

I know as you said screenshots are insufficient, so I did message JohnK (waiting for response). Perhaps we can work something out regarding MtGox access. I'm cautious when it comes to these things like access, but hopefully we can work things out.

Signing a message isn't possible if you sent the funds via MtGox as far as I'm aware. You need to send from a proper bitcoin client I think, because MtGox uses different sending addresses every time you send funds and doesn't give you access to old addresses.

I also don't think you'll be able to demonstrate it was your bitcointalk account that paid - if you had posted using the name dmo580 at the time that you'd sent payment, people would probably give the benefit of the doubt (if no-one else claimed it), but it's now so long after the fact that anyone could claim it was them. The fact that you pledged funds helps, but there was no confirmation that you'd sent funds from you or anyone else. Unfortunately ragin has lost the trust of many of the people involved in this group buy, so his testimony one way or the other will do little to help you I fear.

Your best bet is to let JohnK into your MtGox I think - if you're worried about security, just make sure your account is empty before you let him in. Withdraw everything, then all he can do is see your transaction history (and you can change your password afterwards). This would also protect him from accusations of stealing - if you post on the forum here that you have withdrawn everything, and then you PM JohnK your account details, he can log in and even if you claimed he stole everything afterwards, no-one would believe you. So he would be safe, and you would be safe. Only do this if he agrees to that procedure though.

Having said that, JohnK is probably the most trustworthy person on here, so personally I wouldn't worry too much about him stealing anything if I were you. The important bit is to get his attention. Once you have gotten his attention, be patient as he will probably deal with you last because there are many refunds to send, and the others are much simpler for him to process.  

Good luck!

scotjam

JohnK - if you're reading this, to my untrained eyes, the MtGox screenshot provided by dmo580 seems to corroborate his story that he paid 5.16 btc into the pot, and the transaction history of the escrow address seems to agree. Therefore I would recommend further investigation of this matter as either he is a sophisticated scammer, or he is honest and significantly out of pocket.

EDIT: JohnK - you may also be able to check that dmo580 did actually send a PM to ragin to verify he sent payment, with the transaction ID bc4ed5d44166100127dfacf04ffbdc4385e5c1fe19325118e3c4666ec3421156 - maybe that would be sufficient? I'm not sure to what extent you can access other people's PMs...

[thdvmgbgjn]

Signing a message isn't possible if you sent the funds via MtGox as far as I'm aware. You need to send from a proper bitcoin client I think, because MtGox uses different sending addresses every time you send funds and doesn't give you access to old addresses.

I also don't think you'll be able to demonstrate it was your bitcointalk account that paid - if you had posted using the name dmo580 at the time that you'd sent payment, people would probably give the benefit of the doubt (if no-one else claimed it), but it's now so long after the fact that anyone could claim it was them. The fact that you pledged funds helps, but there was no confirmation that you'd sent funds from you or anyone else. Unfortunately ragin has lost the trust of many of the people involved in this group buy, so his testimony one way or the other will do little to help you I fear.

Your best bet is to let JohnK into your MtGox I think - if you're worried about security, just make sure your account is empty before you let him in. Withdraw everything, then all he can do is see your transaction history (and you can change your password afterwards). This would also protect him from accusations of stealing - if you post on the forum here that you have withdrawn everything, and then you PM JohnK your account details, he can log in and even if you claimed he stole everything afterwards, no-one would believe you. So he would be safe, and you would be safe. Only do this if he agrees to that procedure though.

Having said that, JohnK is probably the most trustworthy person on here, so personally I wouldn't worry too much about him stealing anything if I were you. The important bit is to get his attention. Once you have gotten his attention, be patient as he will probably deal with you last because there are many refunds to send, and the others are much simpler for him to process.  

Good luck!

scotjam

JohnK - if you're reading this, to my untrained eyes, the MtGox screenshot provided by dmo580 seems to corroborate his story that he paid 5.16 btc into the pot, and the transaction history of the escrow address seems to agree. Therefore I would recommend further investigation of this matter as either he is a sophisticated scammer, or he is honest and significantly out of pocket.

EDIT: JohnK - you may also be able to check that dmo580 did actually send a PM to ragin to verify he sent payment, with the transaction ID bc4ed5d44166100127dfacf04ffbdc4385e5c1fe19325118e3c4666ec3421156 - maybe that would be sufficient? I'm not sure to what extent you can access other people's PMs...

Thanks for your help. I have found the original message where JohnK was asking who sent the bitcoins:

Who sent this:  https://blockchain.info/tx/bc4ed5d44166100127dfacf04ffbdc4385e5c1fe19325118e3c4666ec3421156 ?

Heh. I'll reach out to JohnK again to hope we can work something out.

[ragmondo]

Many thanks for sorting this out. Refund received. Glad to have got an acceptable and timely return considering all of the risks involved. Would happily do business with most of the organisers on this thread.

[redphlegm]

I am correct in saying that there should be a "round 2" for refunds, right? I haven't received mine yet.

[bassclef]

Correct, John told me he was holding off on the refunds with ownership transfers due to some conflicting information. Here's hoping we see them soon.

[flowdab]

Correct, John told me he was holding off on the refunds with ownership transfers due to some conflicting information. Here's hoping we see them soon.

FYI I had no transfers and all have not received my refund.

[nabworth]

got my refund. thanks john!

[John (John K.)]

I am holding off the chip transfer refunds atm and concentrating on those that can be found on the original sheet first. With a f-up I did yesterday, I guess I'll need to be doubly sure I didn't do any mistakes. I paid Bithav twice as I probably copied it twice from the responses sheet. Of course, I'd pay this back from my own pocket to be sure, but I would appreciate it if it gets returned. PM'ing in a moment.

dmo580:

Hmm... I think I had received an email from someone shortly after posting that there was an unclaimed 5.16 publicly. I remember sending the funds over after a couple of days when there was no other contestant to the unclaimed funds.... Well, I'll try to sort this out when I finish with this mess first.

[Noitev]

I am holding off the chip transfer refunds atm and concentrating on those that can be found on the original sheet first. With a f-up I did yesterday, I guess I'll need to be doubly sure I didn't do any mistakes. I paid Bithav twice as I probably copied it twice from the responses sheet. Of course, I'd pay this back from my own pocket to be sure, but I would appreciate it if it gets returned. PM'ing in a moment.

dmo580:

Hmm... I think I had received an email from someone shortly after posting that there was an unclaimed 5.16 publicly. I remember sending the funds over after a couple of days when there was no other contestant to the unclaimed funds.... Well, I'll try to sort this out when I finish with this mess first.

John, please. I did the spreadsheet for the avalon refund vote for you. Can you please do me a favor and refund me asap?

[zamazama]

I am holding off the chip transfer refunds atm and concentrating on those that can be found on the original sheet first. With a f-up I did yesterday, I guess I'll need to be doubly sure I didn't do any mistakes. I paid Bithav twice as I probably copied it twice from the responses sheet. Of course, I'd pay this back from my own pocket to be sure, but I would appreciate it if it gets returned. PM'ing in a moment.

dmo580:

Hmm... I think I had received an email from someone shortly after posting that there was an unclaimed 5.16 publicly. I remember sending the funds over after a couple of days when there was no other contestant to the unclaimed funds.... Well, I'll try to sort this out when I finish with this mess first.

As long as we're progressing I am happy.

[spanishfry]

I am holding off the chip transfer refunds atm and concentrating on those that can be found on the original sheet first.

Hello John, I'm one of these refunds on the original sheet with no transfers but I'm still waiting on the refund to be sent.  Thank you for anything you can do to expedite this return.

[John (John K.)]

Second batch sent out; I think I've processed most of the people without a transfer/sale (with the exception of Noitev, ryepdx and redphelgm as I managed to clear that up)

https://blockchain.info/tx/a033e13a554b5e659c0bc40208e32dd2bc56f785582fd1419626809ffac6c3e6

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AiYcEqkgyjc_dHdIRGhHMG43N21raXJVSjA4dk5nUVE#gid=0

Here's to hope I get my head around the transfers tomorrow - it's about 260 BTC more so hopefully we can throw this behind us soon.

Cheers,
John

[John (John K.)]

I am holding off the chip transfer refunds atm and concentrating on those that can be found on the original sheet first. With a f-up I did yesterday, I guess I'll need to be doubly sure I didn't do any mistakes. I paid Bithav twice as I probably copied it twice from the responses sheet. Of course, I'd pay this back from my own pocket to be sure, but I would appreciate it if it gets returned. PM'ing in a moment.
.....

Bithav sent the overpayment back promptly. Thank you so much - I've dropped you a positive rating for this!

[shep80]

Refund received -- yay for escrow!

Glad to have this GB over and behind me.

[spanishfry]

Refund received, thank you John K. and the other facilitators