Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[Bitcoiner_cph]

About 10,000 coins were sold on Bitfinex alone to only bring us down $10, but the bid side remains the same. Take that info how you see fit. I know what that means to me.

Let me translate: Bull-market is ON. Bear-market is off. This 10$ move was an last failed attempt to reverse the trend. I see the we are going up.

What is your basis?

This experienced trader makes a valid point for something otherwise:

https://www.tradingview.com/v/iWXmzaeG/

No one know the future, except me, and I will tell you, just make a small donation (minimum 0,0001 BTC) to 1LtehFJgSTRPLCvfTkXqL38EuP5tH2hrgc

[JorgeStolfi]

Do you have a scenario in your mind where bitcoin does succeed in some measure?

To be clear on my position, I've actually become more sceptical of bitcoins' success over time, despite the excellent news, but the revolution that's been set in motion will continue even if somehow bitcoin does not. What form that revolution will take will only become apparent as it happens - perhaps not the techno libertarian paradise that some believe, but then perhaps it will shake the very core of our centralised power structures.

I see bitcoin like the Wright Brothers' Flyer One model:  a notable experiment, but which still needs many improvements and bug fixes (some of them with no solution in sight) before it can become a viable commercial service.

Unfortunately that experiment has been appropriated by several groups for purposes that it was not intended for, and was not ready for; the latest one being as an investment/speculation instrument.   It is as if some entrepreneurs in 1908 had tried to set up airlines with fleets of Flyer Ones, or sell Flyer Ones to the general public by claiming that one day they would be in high demand and therefore extremely valuable.

[JorgeStolfi]

So basically you are telling us that people are not investing to lose their money? That in fact one should only invest in things that you believe will be big one day? What a brilliant strategy indeed!

I don't quite understand your remark.  I don't see "Wall Street" rushing to buy bitcoins.  I see a lot of venture capital going into companies that plan to make a profit from others using and trading bitcoin.

E.g.,  the bitcoin exchanges make money whether the bitcoin price is rising or falling. Ditto for bitcoin payment processors, managers of bitcoin funds,  bitcoin storage companies, makers of hardware wallets, etc..  Those ventures are "safe bets" because they may well return the invested capital, with profit, even if the BTC price were to crash and they had to close. 

[Bitcoiner_cph]

Do you have a scenario in your mind where bitcoin does succeed in some measure?

To be clear on my position, I've actually become more sceptical of bitcoins' success over time, despite the excellent news, but the revolution that's been set in motion will continue even if somehow bitcoin does not. What form that revolution will take will only become apparent as it happens - perhaps not the techno libertarian paradise that some believe, but then perhaps it will shake the very core of our centralised power structures.

I see bitcoin like the Wright Brothers' Flyer One model:  a notable experiment, but which still needs many improvements and bug fixes (some of them with no solution in sight) before it can become a viable commercial service.

Unfortunately that experiment has been appropriated by several groups for purposes that it was not intended for, and was not ready for; the latest one being as an investment/speculation instrument.   It is as if some entrepreneurs in 1908 had tried to set up airlines with fleets of Flyer Ones, or sell Flyer Ones to the general public by claiming that one day they would be in high demand and therefore extremely valuable.

What is the problems with bitcoin?? I am sure that millions of people don't think like you do.

[gentlemand]

What is the problems with bitcoin?? I am sure that millions of people don't think like you do.

Save yourself some life force and hit ignore.

[Bitcoiner_cph]

What is the problems with bitcoin?? I am sure that millions of people don't think like you do.

Save yourself some life force and hit ignore.

??

[dreamspark]

About 10,000 coins were sold on Bitfinex alone to only bring us down $10, but the bid side remains the same. Take that info how you see fit. I know what that means to me.

Let me translate: Bull-market is ON. Bear-market is off. This 10$ move was an last failed attempt to reverse the trend. I see the we are going up.

What is your basis?

This experienced trader makes a valid point for something otherwise:

https://www.tradingview.com/v/iWXmzaeG/

Dont waste your time, no one left in here is a serious trader, if you actually want to hear the views of people who can trade both ways join whaleclub on teamspeak or trading view chat.

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[Heater]

...

Those ventures are "safe bets" because they may well return the invested capital, with profit, even if the BTC price were to crash and they had to close. 

I don't know about that. I prefer my safe bets to be open for business.

[dreamspark]

Evolution dark net market admins have just run off with the users money. 43k btc. Still feeling super bullish everyone?

[inca]

Evolution dark net market admins have just run off with the users money. 43k btc. Still feeling super bullish everyone?

Did you predict that with your TA?

[Cconvert2G36]

Evolution dark net market admins have just run off with the users money. 43k btc. Still feeling super bullish everyone?

Sheep 2.0

[inca]

Evolution dark net market admins have just run off with the users money. 43k btc. Still feeling super bullish everyone?

Sheep 2.0

Almost makes one want to set up a dark net marketplace

[dreamspark]

Evolution dark net market admins have just run off with the users money. 43k btc. Still feeling super bullish everyone?

Did you predict that with your TA?

 

[YourMother]

ROFL

$1.5M for a forum that won't bring any major feature improvements. Right from your daddy theymos with love hahahaha. Who will be responsible with the design ? "Slickage = unknown startup which doesn't even have a website on its own. 4 developers, $375k per year per developer."




God, i hope that Facebook will implement that payment system faster ( remember: over 1 billion users ) so we can get over with this piece of shit beta currency that facilitated hundreds and hundreds of these atrocious scams.

[gentlemand]

Evolution dark net market admins have just run off with the users money. 43k btc. Still feeling super bullish everyone?

Sheep 2.0

Almost makes one want to set up a dark net marketplace

It's a sweet deal. The users will all be too fucked out of their skulls to ever exercise due diligence. The tools are now there to neuter this type of scenario before it even becomes a possibility. My sympathy is limited/ non existent.

[JorgeStolfi]

What are the problems with bitcoin??

Some problems:

* Centralization of mining seems inevitable.

* There is no mechanism to stabilize the value.

* Limited supply leads to expectations of high value which leads to hoarding instead of use.

* Block reward leads to a hyperdeveloped mining industry supported by investors rather than by users.

* For most people, irreversibility is a serious defect, not a feature.

* Risk of theft is too high for people who are not computer experts.

And maybe more.

I am sure that millions of people don't think like you do.

Perhaps a million people have a reasonable understanding of bitcoin and believe in its eventual succeess.  Probably millions of people also have a reasonable understanding of bitcoin but do not believe in its eventual success.  The other 7000 million either haven't heard of it, or have heard of it but don't care to know more, or know just enough to dismiss it.

[galdur]

I wonder if that slow and steady and persistent grind down so familiar from last year is returning. Way too early to tell, sure hope not. But bear market rallies tend to be rather deceptive.

[inca]

I wonder if that slow and steady and persistent grind down so familiar from last year is returning. Way too early to tell, sure hope not. But bear market rallies tend to be rather deceptive.

Way to early to tell. I agree. A pullback into the 260's or 270's is healthy. We were unlikely to have yet another green weekly candle

[solex]

What are the problems with bitcoin??

Some problems:

* Centralization of mining seems inevitable.

As mining matures it is becoming decentralized. organofcorti stats shows this clearly.

* There is no mechanism to stabilize the value.

Yes there is: more widespread adoption, the plateau of market penetration at the top of the S-curve. It's value will be very stable then, more so than the DXY which has screamed from 80 to 100 in a short time and that measures multi-trillion$ of value.

* Limited supply leads to expectations of high value which leads to hoarding instead of use.

Hearding is good, investing is good, saving is good. Only inflationistas dream otherwise.

* Block reward leads to a hyperdeveloped mining industry supported by investors rather than by users.

As before, investors are good. How many people mine their own raw materials for products they use?

* For most people, irreversibility is a serious defect, not a feature.

Cash and gold is irreversible. This is a good feature of sound money.

* Risk of theft is too high for people who are not computer experts.

Early days in a new technology. Wallet software has improved massively, still a way to go, but in 10 years, very safe to own bitcoins.

I am sure that millions of people don't think like you do.

Or you. You are doing your students a disservice by not teaching them about Bitcoin in the way MIT, Princeton and Nicosia do.

Perhaps a million people have a reasonable understanding of bitcoin and believe in its eventual succeess.  Probably millions of people also have a reasonable understanding of bitcoin but do not believe in its eventual success.  The other 7000 million either haven't heard of it, or have heard of it but don't care to know more, or know just enough to dismiss it.

Handwaving. Only a few people understand the software in detail. The rest have to just see that it works: like smartphones, like quantum mechanics, like stem-cell treatment, like meteorology, etc etc etc. In case you haven't noticed a major feature of modern civilization is extreme specialization. No one person can understand more than a fraction of everything.