Coinseeker
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:25:11 PM |
|
This is a true statement. Pure speculation is driving XRP prices. There is no justification for it other than greed.
And there's no justification for greed... except for human nature, so is that a design flaw? Could people be bidding XRP up because Ripple itself is difficult to understand? Anyway, I believe I understand it, and I am unmoved by the anti Ripple arguments based on ideology or pre-mining, but I think it is even harder to explain to consumers than Bitcoin. Coinseeker, can you summarize why you believe Ripple is iTunes in your analogy? IMO, iTunes was successful because it made it dead SIMPLE to purchase digital music at fair prices, not to mention it was tied to an incredibly well designed piece of hardware, and backed by a monstrous ad campaign. If you agree, how exactly does Ripple change the game like iTunes did? I'm genuinely curious as I have no dog in the fight (never mined anything), and while I believe in Bitcoin, I'm certainly no fundamentalist. What I mean when I use that analogy is that Napster started the music download revolution but in the end was killed and it was iTunes that came in and did it the right way. The foundation of Bitcoin is solid but it's full of flaws the Bitcoin community refuses to address. Add to that, the continued refusal (As if it would even be possible to avoid) to submit to regulations. This will kill bitcoin on a mass adoption scale faster than anything. Ripple, like iTunes is prepared to play nice and work within the confines of the law. Not to mention, doing all the things Bitcoin could have done, but didn't. For instance: Imagine, Bitstamp, Gox and all the exchanges as Gateways. Then add Paypal, Bank of america, Citi Bank and any bank worldwide you can think of. In time, you can use ANY of them as your gateway to move fiat and BTC. You can also choose to NOT extend trust to any of them you choose. This gives the power back to the people. I could theoretically buy BTC via paypal and send it to Gox. Then I could sell that BTC at Gox and send Euros to some bank in the UK. I can choose how and who I trust and when and where I utilize the gateways. Now this is a simplified version as Ripple is in between these transfers but the cost from ripple is .00001 or something like that. It's like nothing. This is what XRP's are for. To pay transaction fees. The average user wont need thousands of XRP. The biggest fees are going to come from the gateways, which they already charge too much, IMO.
|
|
|
|
Coinseeker
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:25:37 PM |
|
It's the third time I tell you, Coinseeker: you do not understand Bitcoin. You do not understand its deep revolutionary implications. Bitcoin is meant to set you free, while Ripple is meant for their creators to be rich.
Can you bring this sort of crap over to the bitcoin discussion forum or alternative crypto...or something? If you're going to get on a soapbox here, make it about why your speculative analysis is right... not why we should "believe in bitcoin." Maybe if you actually went after those who were talking this nonsense to begin with, I'd listen to you. But you've proven your bias against me personally so... NO! wat :facepalm: What? Ignore list.
|
|
|
|
stereotype
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1000
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:32:26 PM |
|
I have to say that after being at the conference, talking with the Ripple guys (who did a really valient job of trying to explain to everyone how it works) I still don't understand how it works. To my credit, most people at the conference said they don't understand it. Including some of the core bitcoin dev's and a number of other talented programmers in the bitcoin world. Indeed, no one I spoke to said they really understood how it works.
So, to quote one guy at the conference: "It should make you nervous that you don't understand it".
That's my position on it for now. Speculatively it looks interesting, but the fact that I don't understand it, and guys much smarter and more experienced then myself don't understand it, makes me skeptical of it's future.
Ditto. Was at a Bitcoin meetup last week talking about Ripple, and ive listened to that LetsTalkBitcoin edition of explaining Ripple. Still dont get it, and now dont want to.
|
|
|
|
TheKoziTwo
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1552
Merit: 1047
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:36:13 PM |
|
What I mean when I use that analogy is that Napster started the music download revolution but in the end was killed and it was iTunes that came in and did it the right way.
The foundation of Bitcoin is solid but it's full of flaws the Bitcoin community refuses to address. Add to that, the continued refusal (As if it would even be possible to avoid) to submit to regulations. This will kill bitcoin on a mass adoption scale faster than anything.
Ripple, like iTunes is prepared to play nice and work within the confines of the law. Not to mention, doing all the things Bitcoin could have done, but didn't.
Regulation is a problem mkay? Bitcoin was made to solve this problem. You want regulation? Just use the banks, use paypal, use the now dead e-gold. How you can talk about regulations as something necessary to bring bitcoin mainstream is beyond me. That invalidates the whole point of bitcoin in the first place and it makes me wonder what you are doing here.
|
|
|
|
Coinseeker
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:39:56 PM |
|
What I mean when I use that analogy is that Napster started the music download revolution but in the end was killed and it was iTunes that came in and did it the right way.
The foundation of Bitcoin is solid but it's full of flaws the Bitcoin community refuses to address. Add to that, the continued refusal (As if it would even be possible to avoid) to submit to regulations. This will kill bitcoin on a mass adoption scale faster than anything.
Ripple, like iTunes is prepared to play nice and work within the confines of the law. Not to mention, doing all the things Bitcoin could have done, but didn't.
Regulation is a problem mkay? Bitcoin was made to solve this problem. You want regulation? Just use the banks, use paypal, use the now dead e-gold. How you can talk about regulations as something necessary to bring bitcoin mainstream is beyond me. That invalidates the whole point of bitcoin in the first place and it makes me wonder what you are doing here. Why use Paypal when I can have incredibly low transaction fees? Makes no sense. It might invalidate YOUR view of Bitcoin but that's not what it's going to be moving forward. We'll regulate it or we'll kill it. Meaning blackball it from any mainstream existence and reduce it to a black market only currency that legitamate business wont touch with a 10 foot pole. You ideological guys better wake up out of your delusions because the crypto train is leaving and you guys don't even seem to have a ticket bought for the future. I'm done with this convo in this thread. There's plenty of Ripple threads out there and anyone looking for genuine Ripple info can visit the Ripple forums.
|
|
|
|
prof7bit
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:43:58 PM |
|
This is what TradeFortress is doing - people gave him "trusted" status, so he can virtually create money (455 BTC up to date) - because inside Ripple you just trade IOU's - the only thing is not a IOU are Ripples.
This thread from TradeFortress finally made me understand Ripple, especially the last part of the thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=206948.msg2209470#msg2209470 where web3er got his 10.15 Bitstamp-BTC exchanged for worthless TradeFortress-BTC because he basically told the Ripple-System that for him any Fortress-BTC are equally good as Bitstamp-BTC. And so the system automatically took his Bitstamp and gave him TradeFortress in exchange when the system needed some Bitstamp instead of TradeFortress on someone else's behalf. Highly educational thread! Recommended to read. This made me finally understand how Ripple works.
|
|
|
|
|
moocowpong1
Member
Offline
Activity: 79
Merit: 10
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:48:30 PM |
|
What are you talking about? You do not exchange cryptocurrency in Ripple. You exchange a) XRP's or b) other cryptocurrencies IOU's
The only thing you exchange on Mt Gox is IOUs for USD and BTC. You have to trust that Mt Gox will let you withdraw your balance at the end of day. (The law might help you if Mt Gox defaults, but a gateway can attach legal meaning to its Ripple IOUs as well.) Ripple isn't replacing Bitcoin, and you shouldn't treat gateway IOUs as any more secure than fiat or bitcoin on an exchange. However, Ripple does potentially provide a very interesting replacement for the exchange component of the Bitcoin world. As for whether XRP will compete with Bitcoin: I agree with the skeptics in this thread that the degree of control OpenCoin has is a good reason to shy away from using XRP as a currency and a store of value. Until such a point where OpenCoin's control has become negligible, XRP won't be as "free" a currency as bitcoin, and I think this is a compelling reason to not use it. This isn't really a criticism of Ripple, because using XRP as a currency isn't the point of Ripple. I have about 200 XRP total, and I'm going to sell all the ones I get in the giveaway immediately. Using or speculating in XRP is fine if you want to do it, but I don't. This doesn't make me less excited about Ripple.
|
|
|
|
Quantum_Negatum
Member
Offline
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:50:05 PM |
|
Today's volume (or lack thereof) surprising or concerning to any of you?
|
|
|
|
prof7bit
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:51:14 PM |
|
Thank you, but no further reading needed. As mentiond above the TradeFortress thread explains better than anything else I have seen so far. Especially how web3er now ended up holding 10.15 worthless TF-฿ while someone else at the other end of the world could convert 10.15 worthless TF-฿ into Bitstamp-฿.
|
|
|
|
Frozenlock
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:55:34 PM |
|
Today's volume (or lack thereof) surprising or concerning to any of you?
Surprising? No. Concerning? A little.
|
|
|
|
Jaroslaw
Member
Offline
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
supernode
|
|
May 20, 2013, 07:56:05 PM |
|
When i look at this topic today:
|
|
|
|
ChartBuddy
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2310
Merit: 1801
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:02:49 PM |
|
|
|
|
|
MickeyT2008
Sr. Member
Offline
Activity: 350
Merit: 250
This account was recently hacked
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:10:20 PM |
|
When i look at this topic today: +1 If only there was some buying and selling to speculate about....
|
|
|
|
TheKoziTwo
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1552
Merit: 1047
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:10:58 PM |
|
What I mean when I use that analogy is that Napster started the music download revolution but in the end was killed and it was iTunes that came in and did it the right way.
The foundation of Bitcoin is solid but it's full of flaws the Bitcoin community refuses to address. Add to that, the continued refusal (As if it would even be possible to avoid) to submit to regulations. This will kill bitcoin on a mass adoption scale faster than anything.
Ripple, like iTunes is prepared to play nice and work within the confines of the law. Not to mention, doing all the things Bitcoin could have done, but didn't.
Regulation is a problem mkay? Bitcoin was made to solve this problem. You want regulation? Just use the banks, use paypal, use the now dead e-gold. How you can talk about regulations as something necessary to bring bitcoin mainstream is beyond me. That invalidates the whole point of bitcoin in the first place and it makes me wonder what you are doing here. Why use Paypal when I can have incredibly low transaction fees? Makes no sense. It might invalidate YOUR view of Bitcoin but that's not what it's going to be moving forward. Because bitcoin is very unstable and you may very well lose a lot more than paypal fees when buying and selling using bitcoin. So it makes perfect sense. We'll regulate it or we'll kill it. Meaning blackball it from any mainstream existence and reduce it to a black market only currency that legitamate business wont touch with a 10 foot pole. Like we regulated e-gold? Yeah, that worked out real nice. Anyhow, that's why I love bitcoin, it can't be regulated, no matter how much you would love it, it just won't happen.
|
|
|
|
samson
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2097
Merit: 1070
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:18:10 PM |
|
Today's volume (or lack thereof) surprising or concerning to any of you?
No, not at all.
|
|
|
|
adamstgBit
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:25:52 PM |
|
wat a day for the silver market
|
|
|
|
Creenome
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 19
Merit: 0
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:28:29 PM |
|
Amen to that. The day for silver is coming
|
|
|
|
Bitsburger
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 11
Merit: 0
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:30:05 PM |
|
A friend in China mentioned today there's growing curiosity about BTC there after it was featured this weekend on CCTV. It's made it to the daily hot topic on sina weibo. Anyone want to speculate on whether/when this might be reflected in the exchanges?
|
|
|
|
samson
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2097
Merit: 1070
|
|
May 20, 2013, 08:32:15 PM |
|
A friend in China mentioned today there's growing curiosity about BTC there after it was featured this weekend on CCTV. It's made it to the daily hot topic on sina weibo. Anyone want to speculate on whether/when this might be reflected in the exchanges?
Sure : It will make no difference whatsoever.
|
|
|
|
|