Evolution is a hoax

[styca]

Why there are still monkeys around if they were part of our evolutionary beginnings ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cz0gFarCfBE

That is why it is called “Theory” of Evolution.

No. I answered this on the 'did we land on the moon thread': We didn't descend form modern monkeys. Modern monkeys and modern humans descended from a common ancestor. Here's an analaogy to answer the quesion:
My father’s father died many years ago, but he left quite a few living descendants, including me, my sister, and my paternal cousins. To ask the question ‘If humans evolved from monkeys, how come there are still monkeys?’ is a bit like asking me ‘If you are descended from your grandfather, how come your cousins are still alive?’ The question doesn’t make any sense: why shouldn’t my cousins still be alive?.

I also do not believe with this theory about humans are evolved form of monkeys. However, evolution itself is real in terms of survivability. Living things were evolving to adapt to their environment.

Why are monkeys always brought up in these arguments? Evolution doesn't just mean that humans are descended from monkey-like creatures. If you go (a lot) further back we are descended from fish, too. If you go far enough back, all life on earth is descended from single-celled organisms.
Also if you agree that 'Living things were evolving to adapt to their environment', then you agree with the theory of evolution. That's all it is, evolving to be a better fit to current environment. The problem people have is timescales. We didn't descend from monkeys overnight, it happened over millions of years.

I’m not an expert but there explanations about this.

Yes, see above.

[franky1]

yes
as styca explains
but to go into more detail

a goose has not been a goose all its ancestry.
at one point a swan and a duck made sweet love and produced an ugly offspring.. that offspring was named a goose

the whole chicken and egg thing
ofcourse the egg came first
before the egg was some small raptor like dinosaur bird that made sweet love to another bird like creature and produced the egg that became the chicken

as for human evolution.
well you just have to look at incestual hillbillies. if members of the same immediate family 'get it on' the offspring is gonna appear dang ugly ad mutated in view of what is the norm of visuals of what the parents would look like. but that offspring could then become the next evolution

also when a gorilla rapes a dolphin you might end up with this guy


basically. unless your an identical clone of your parent. you are an evolved version of them because your different then them. and thats how evolution works

[franky1]

yes that's a trick that exists in this century but still believed by some people, if monkeys ovulate to be human why until now I have never heard of monkeys being human.

a monkey didnt just ovulate a human
a monkey was raped by anothr animal and a mutation was born which through a process of cross breeding multiple times became a Neanderthal
(do you not know how many varients of 'monkey' there are?)
the neanderphal had higher thyroid function(gland inside the throat which some people distinguish as the 'adams' apple)
this increased the metabolism and the ability to think more than the predecessors thus they got smarter and learned to hunt better than monkeys.
so while monkys stayed in tree's and now became aware of the risk of other animal rape/cross breeding. they stayed out of the way.. while the homosapiens took to the ground and walked and fought off any attackers
with the homosapiens more cross breading and variants occured, some lived, some died. thats the whole natural strongest and fittest survive and thrive stuff

millions of years later people started to wonder about evolution. so people started talking around camp fires about how things began. and insights about the difference between monkey thyroid and human thyroid became a story about an apple that was given to a human. and he shared it with another human of similar mutation/evolution level(dna) which became a story about ribs being exchanged. just because language at the time didnt have words for explaining how two people had similar dna and such.

these camp fire stories then spread from clan/colony to colony and each tweaked the story a little more trying to in one way understand the science and in other ways create a emotional, provocative story to entertain. whilst both still not have the language to be the 'sciency' version

those clans that used the story as a moral guide of whats right/wrong. and a story of warning to not be nosey and walk off down dark paths, let them not fall into dangerous situations of harm. thus they survived because of these stories. the stories then expanded to tell other moral rules people should follow.
like no same sex love and no sodemy as it made them sick (yes aids existed back then(though they didnt have a name for it), but due to these stories of warning, it became near non existant and not talked about once the stories scared people off from doing same sex stuff)

and thus eventually it became a religion but where the stories were a wishy washy mess of twists to previous versions of it and misunderstandings. because back then they couldnt write. so their stories were just word of mouth and vague memory of a story they hear as a kid, who heard it from someone who heard it as a kid
but people used it as their rule of law and morals

[styca]

if monkeys ovulate to be human why until now I have never heard of monkeys being human.

Monkeys don't give birth to humans. That would be completely crazy, and that is not evolution.
Monkeys give birth to monkeys. What happens is that over millions of years, the monkeys slowly change due to natural selection. There is no sudden switch from monkey to human. The differences accrue extremely gradually. One generation is almost indistinguishable from the next. Maybe over a hundred generations you can see a slight difference. Over millions of years the difference is crystal clear.

'Monkey' is not an end state. 'Human' is not an end state. There is no end state. Evolution is simply what happens over many generations as a species adapts to its environment.

[styca]

a monkey didnt just ovulate a human
a monkey was raped by anothr animal and a mutation was born which through a process of cross breeding multiple times became a Neanderthal

No. Broadly speaking, different species can't interbreed. I can't breed with a zebra and create a weird zebra-man.
Monkeys bred with monkeys. Natural selection over billions of years created those monkeys from single celled organisms. Monkey isn't an end state. It just seems to be a fixed state from a human timescale. Human is not a fixed state. Everything is evolving right now, just very very very slowly from generation to generation.

(do you not know how many varients of 'monkey' there are?)

Yes, different fits to different circumstances. Monkeys, apes as well. All still evolving. On a more measureable timescale, the human jaw is a good example. It has been shrinking since we started to cook food. Because natural selection no longer favours a hugely strong jaw.
https://www.thoughtco.com/human-jaw-evolution-and-food-processing-4000409

[franky1]

a monkey didnt just ovulate a human
a monkey was raped by anothr animal and a mutation was born which through a process of cross breeding multiple times became a Neanderthal

No. Broadly speaking, different species can't interbreed. I can't breed with a zebra and create a weird zebra-man.
Monkeys bred with monkeys. Natural selection over billions of years created those monkeys from single celled organisms. Monkey isn't an end state. It just seems to be a fixed state from a human timescale. Human is not a fixed state. Everything is evolving right now, just very very very slowly from generation to generation.

(do you not know how many varients of 'monkey' there are?)

Yes, different fits to different circumstances. Monkeys, apes as well. All still evolving. On a more measureable timescale, the human jaw is a good example. It has been shrinking since we started to cook food. Because natural selection no longer favours a hugely strong jaw.
https://www.thoughtco.com/human-jaw-evolution-and-food-processing-4000409

i never said human and zebra. i said monkey and animal.
take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)
..
it wasnt just ape+ape single species generational evolution, there was also some mix breeding and survival of the fittest.
because if it was just ape+ape evolution without cross breeding then that other posters saying why are there still apes would have a valid question.
in short
it was cross breeding that bilaterally forked the species chain and created 2 altcoins

[af_newbie]

a monkey didnt just ovulate a human
a monkey was raped by anothr animal and a mutation was born which through a process of cross breeding multiple times became a Neanderthal

No. Broadly speaking, different species can't interbreed. I can't breed with a zebra and create a weird zebra-man.
Monkeys bred with monkeys. Natural selection over billions of years created those monkeys from single celled organisms. Monkey isn't an end state. It just seems to be a fixed state from a human timescale. Human is not a fixed state. Everything is evolving right now, just very very very slowly from generation to generation.

(do you not know how many varients of 'monkey' there are?)

Yes, different fits to different circumstances. Monkeys, apes as well. All still evolving. On a more measureable timescale, the human jaw is a good example. It has been shrinking since we started to cook food. Because natural selection no longer favours a hugely strong jaw.
https://www.thoughtco.com/human-jaw-evolution-and-food-processing-4000409

i never said human and zebra. i said monkey and animal.
take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)
..
it wasnt just ape+ape single species generational evolution, there was also some mix breeding and survival of the fittest.
because if it was just ape+ape evolution without cross breeding then that other posters saying why are there still apes would have a valid question.
in short
it was cross breeding that bilaterally forked the species chain and created 2 altcoins

Animals from different species cannot interbreed, by definition.

Only animals with very slight genetic differences can interbreed and produce a viable offspring.

That is why you cannot breed chimpanzees with humans and expect a viable offspring, despite the fact that we share 99% of the DNA.

Even between humans if the genetics of the parents are not quite right, children will be born with deformities, retardation, unable to pass their genes to the next generation.  Never mind breeding between animals with much greater genetic differences.

Learn how the speciation works.  It is not as simple as wham bam thank you, ma'am.

[franky1]

a monkey didnt just ovulate a human
a monkey was raped by anothr animal and a mutation was born which through a process of cross breeding multiple times became a Neanderthal

No. Broadly speaking, different species can't interbreed. I can't breed with a zebra and create a weird zebra-man.
Monkeys bred with monkeys. Natural selection over billions of years created those monkeys from single celled organisms. Monkey isn't an end state. It just seems to be a fixed state from a human timescale. Human is not a fixed state. Everything is evolving right now, just very very very slowly from generation to generation.

(do you not know how many varients of 'monkey' there are?)

Yes, different fits to different circumstances. Monkeys, apes as well. All still evolving. On a more measureable timescale, the human jaw is a good example. It has been shrinking since we started to cook food. Because natural selection no longer favours a hugely strong jaw.
https://www.thoughtco.com/human-jaw-evolution-and-food-processing-4000409

i never said human and zebra. i said monkey and animal.
take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)
..
it wasnt just ape+ape single species generational evolution, there was also some mix breeding and survival of the fittest.
because if it was just ape+ape evolution without cross breeding then that other posters saying why are there still apes would have a valid question.
in short
it was cross breeding that bilaterally forked the species chain and created 2 altcoins

Animals from different species cannot interbreed, by definition.

Only animals with very slight genetic differences can interbreed and produce a viable offspring.

That is why you cannot breed chimpanzees with humans and expect a viable offspring, despite the fact that we share 99% of the DNA.

Even between humans if the genetics of the parents are not quite right, children will be born with deformities, retardation, unable to pass their genes to the next generation.  Never mind breeding between animals with much greater genetic differences.

Learn how the speciation works.  It is not as simple as wham bam thank you, ma'am.

dang both you and styca both didnt read a dang thing
lets repeat it just for you to save another post

take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

heck lets repeat it again
take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

now you read it 3 times you should have understood
where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant  but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

let me emphasise a good comparison
just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds
again like i said..
wait let me make it bold for both of you
close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
i never said gorrilla and zebra or human and chimp..
..
what some of you have to understand is millions of years ago there were less varients available as the millions of years ago preceeded todays mega variant of nature. so whatever 'gorilla' and 'smaller ape' of the time millions of years ago would have had a closers species divide than the varients we have in modern times


hope that clears the matter up

[styca]

dang both you and styca both didnt read a dang thing

-snip-

i never said gorrilla and zebra or human and chimp.

I did read your post, I just disagree. I know you didn't mean zebra and human, I was just using an extreme example. Sorry about that, got carried away.

Evolution isn't like some chemical reaction of [animal A] + [close genetic relative animal B] = [new slightly different species animal C].
It all happens within a single species. Chimp + chimp = baby chimp, just like its parents.
It's not a question of animals mutating from their parents. It's just animals inheriting their parents genes. The thing that causes the change is which animals in the population survive to breed.

I'll oversimplify and condense the timeline, but basically it's this:
Some gazelles are faster than other gazelles. Say a slow gazelle is 30mph, fast is 40mph, average is 35mph. Now introduce some predators. The gazelles run away. The slower 30mph gazelles get eaten. The average 35mph and fast 40mph gazelles survive and have children, the children are like the parents. The 'slow' gazelles in the next generation are 35mph gazelles, children of their 35mph parents. The fast 40mph gazelles have fast 40mph children. The new population has fast=40mph, slow=35mph, average say 37.5mph. Bingo! Natural selection (slowest get eaten) has created evolution. Gazelles are now faster than they used to be.

[BADecker]

dang both you and styca both didnt read a dang thing
lets repeat it just for you to save another post

take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

heck lets repeat it again
take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

now you read it 3 times you should have understood
where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant  but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

let me emphasise a good comparison
just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds
again like i said..
wait let me make it bold for both of you
close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
i never said gorrilla and zebra or human and chimp..
..
what some of you have to understand is millions of years ago there were less varients available as the millions of years ago preceeded todays mega variant of nature. so whatever 'gorilla' and 'smaller ape' of the time millions of years ago would have had a closers species divide than the varients we have in modern times


hope that clears the matter up

Standard breeding is what you are talking about, here. Beyond standard breeding, the offspring doesn't reproduce... not in nature at least. Or do you have proof?

[iluvbitcoins]

dang both you and styca both didnt read a dang thing
lets repeat it just for you to save another post

take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

heck lets repeat it again
take for instance a gorilla and a smaller ape. where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant mutant offspring but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

now you read it 3 times you should have understood
where the species divide was wide enough to cause a noticable variant  but close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
and i said over many cross breedings.. (just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds)

let me emphasise a good comparison
just like how dogs got mix bred into new breeds
again like i said..
wait let me make it bold for both of you
close enough species divide to have a viable pregnancy
i never said gorrilla and zebra or human and chimp..
..
what some of you have to understand is millions of years ago there were less varients available as the millions of years ago preceeded todays mega variant of nature. so whatever 'gorilla' and 'smaller ape' of the time millions of years ago would have had a closers species divide than the varients we have in modern times


hope that clears the matter up

Standard breeding is what you are talking about, here. Beyond standard breeding, the offspring doesn't reproduce... not in nature at least. Or do you have proof?

There's evidence of the same species of animals staying on an island and the same species on the mainland.
The island animal becomes different than the mainland animal given enough time because of different paths their evolution took.

What do you say about the current evolution of humans?
Some humans have developed white color and the ability to drink milk, while some have a yellowish color and are a lot shorter and posses high IQs (they can't drink milk). There are already some illnesses that can affect only certain races.

Don't you think this is the beginning of a new evolution of different subspecies?

[franky1]

Standard breeding is what you are talking about, here. Beyond standard breeding, the offspring doesn't reproduce... not in nature at least. Or do you have proof?

dog breding.
muts and mongrals
different breeds mixing it up

millions of years ago the sapien genepool was closer than it is now where by some dwarf sapiians and some giant sapians could procreate

these days a homo sapien(human) vs a chimp probably couldnt
but certain varients of monkeys still can cross breed

if you belive that only a colly sheep dog can only breed with a colly sheep dog and a labrador can only breed with a labrador.. then i guess you never seen a colly cross labrador.. but millions of them exist

[franky1]

I'll oversimplify and condense the timeline, but basically it's this:
Some gazelles are faster than other gazelles. Say a slow gazelle is 30mph, fast is 40mph, average is 35mph. Now introduce some predators. The gazelles run away. The slower 30mph gazelles get eaten.

yes perfectly true thats called survival of the fittest. thats just one part of evolution. surviving to procreate.
but to speed up evolution some animals get attracted to certain things of other animals.
(emphasis i do not mean humans and zbra's when i say animals and other animals.. dont go starting that tangeant again)
(again for emphasis i mean prehistoric animals that are variant enough differing characteristics but close enough for viable pregnancy)
(again for emphasis pre historic animals had a much closer genepools that cross breding was a little more possible back then)
like a prehistoric duck getting randy with a swan because the big swan can fight and scare off predators with bigger wing span compared to a duck. so swan and duck do the mumbo jumbo and a goose pops out

thus evolution sped up in 1 generation rather than thousands of years

[BADecker]

I'll oversimplify and condense the timeline, but basically it's this:
Some gazelles are faster than other gazelles. Say a slow gazelle is 30mph, fast is 40mph, average is 35mph. Now introduce some predators. The gazelles run away. The slower 30mph gazelles get eaten.

yes perfectly true thats called survival of the fittest. thats just one part of evolution. surviving to procreate.
but to speed up evolution some animals get attracted to certain things of other animals.
(emphasis i do not mean humans and zbra's when i say animals and other animals.. dont go starting that tangeant again)
(again for emphasis i mean prehistoric animals that are variant enough differing characteristics but close enough for viable pregnancy)
(again for emphasis pre historic animals had a much closer genepools that cross breding was a little more possible back then)
like a prehistoric duck getting randy with a swan because the big swan can fight and scare off predators with bigger wing span compared to a duck. so swan and duck do the mumbo jumbo and a goose pops out

thus evolution sped up in 1 generation rather than thousands of years

Nice science fiction story, but no proof that this^^ is really what happened.

[styca]

Standard breeding is what you are talking about, here. Beyond standard breeding, the offspring doesn't reproduce... not in nature at least. Or do you have proof?

Yes, it's standard breeding between animals within a single species. Nature is tough and dangerous. Some animals survive to reproduce, some don't. This is 'survival of the fittest' - survival of those that are a best fit to existing circumstances:

I'll oversimplify and condense the timeline, but basically it's this:
Some gazelles are faster than other gazelles. Say a slow gazelle is 30mph, fast is 40mph, average is 35mph. Now introduce some predators. The gazelles run away. The slower 30mph gazelles get eaten. The average 35mph and fast 40mph gazelles survive and have children, the children are like the parents. The 'slow' gazelles in the next generation are 35mph gazelles, children of their 35mph parents. The fast 40mph gazelles have fast 40mph children. The new population has fast=40mph, slow=35mph, average say 37.5mph. Bingo! Natural selection (slowest get eaten) has created evolution. Gazelles are now faster than they used to be.

On top of this we have random mutations within a species that occur from time to time. Most mutations are harmful, and so don't survive. Unfortunately you see this with humans born with congenital 'defects'. That what mutations are, defects from the norm. But very occasionally you can get a mutation that has positive benefits. And this survives through the mechanism illustrated in my quote above. Natural selection plus the occasional beneficial mutation equals evolution.

[senne]

Why there are still monkeys around if they were part of our evolutionary beginnings ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cz0gFarCfBE

Evolution is completely believable as there are fossils that suggest that we did have monkey ancestors. It is just that certain group of monkeys were unfortunate enough to not move out of their comfort zone, stay in trees while other set of monkeys decided to move on grasslands in search for food and mate and on the way during the eons evolved in order to survive and thrive.

[BADecker]

On top of this we have random mutations within a species that occur from time to time. Most mutations are harmful, and so don't survive. Unfortunately you see this with humans born with congenital 'defects'. That what mutations are, defects from the norm. But very occasionally you can get a mutation that has positive benefits. And this survives through the mechanism illustrated in my quote above. Natural selection plus the occasional beneficial mutation equals evolution.

So we see that devolution is what is really happening today.

[BADecker]

Why there are still monkeys around if they were part of our evolutionary beginnings ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cz0gFarCfBE

Evolution is completely believable as there are fossils that suggest that we did have monkey ancestors. It is just that certain group of monkeys were unfortunate enough to not move out of their comfort zone, stay in trees while other set of monkeys decided to move on grasslands in search for food and mate and on the way during the eons evolved in order to survive and thrive.

Exactly. Evolution is believable since it hasn't come close to having been proven. If it had been proven, it would be knowable. Since it is only believable, it falls into the category of religion.

[franky1]

Exactly. Evolution is believable since it hasn't come close to having been proven. If it had been proven, it would be knowable. Since it is only believable, it falls into the category of religion.

evolution has proof
DNA

[BADecker]

Exactly. Evolution is believable since it hasn't come close to having been proven. If it had been proven, it would be knowable. Since it is only believable, it falls into the category of religion.

evolution has proof
DNA

But all you show is talk.