[VMC] Official Virtual Mining Corporation Discussion

[Kasnec]

Why has the pre-order date for the fast hash one silver changed from Dec 31 to March 2014? Will this affect pre-existing orders?

Can we cancel pre-orders and receive a refund?

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[bloodninja]

yea, i was also gearing up to get one of those set for Dec 31, then all of the sudden i see it get pushed by 3 months! 
i wonder if they still have nothing to show for or if there was a batch of ASIC's delivered on the set date n then updated the date for the next batch..
i also cant help but wonder that if this isnt a scam then how is it possible to under-estimate availability by 3 months? 

[RoadStress]

Why has the pre-order date for the fast hash one silver changed from Dec 31 to March 2014? Will this affect pre-existing orders?

Can we cancel pre-orders and receive a refund?

These messages make me laugh so hard. Kasnec tried contacting VMC for those answers?

[eXme]

Why has the pre-order date for the fast hash one silver changed from Dec 31 to March 2014? Will this affect pre-existing orders?

Can we cancel pre-orders and receive a refund?

These messages make me laugh so hard. Kasnec tried contacting VMC for those answers?

This company is similar to bfl..

[Kasnec]

I have contacted them, and am still waiting on a reply - but I figured someone else may have got there first and received a response to the same question.

[RoadStress]

I have contacted them, and am still waiting on a reply - but I figured someone else may have got there first and received a response to the same question.

And i think you will wait for a reply a long time. Let us know what they tell you.

[BitCsByBit]

Why has the pre-order date for the fast hash one silver changed from Dec 31 to March 2014? Will this affect pre-existing orders?

Can we cancel pre-orders and receive a refund?

These messages make me laugh so hard. Kasnec tried contacting VMC for those answers?

This company is similar to bfl..

More like an illegitimate child of BFL and Labcoin.

[xnu]

My friend just tol me he received his cheque refund for 1 Ths Platinum from VMC. Anyway, one month for waiting for cheque to arrive and another for waiting to clear it by banks. Frozen money for few months.

[RoadStress]

My friend just tol me he received his cheque refund for 1 Ths Platinum from VMC. Anyway, one month for waiting for cheque to arrive and another for waiting to clear it by banks. Frozen money for few months.

Why did he buy from VMC? Just discovered the website on internet? Didn't read these forums where it's obvious that this is a scam?

[wonker]

My friend just tol me he received his cheque refund for 1 Ths Platinum from VMC. Anyway, one month for waiting for cheque to arrive and another for waiting to clear it by banks. Frozen money for few months.

Why did he buy from VMC? Just discovered the website on internet? Didn't read these forums where it's obvious that this is a scam?

A scam with refunds? 

[PurpleTentacle]

My friend just tol me he received his cheque refund for 1 Ths Platinum from VMC. Anyway, one month for waiting for cheque to arrive and another for waiting to clear it by banks. Frozen money for few months.

Why did he buy from VMC? Just discovered the website on internet? Didn't read these forums where it's obvious that this is a scam?

How in the world can it possibly be a scam with $1,000,000 paid to eASIC with an official press release and people getting the refunds they ask for?

[xnu]

A scam with refunds? 

Yeah, that would be very strange indeed

[RoadStress]

My friend just tol me he received his cheque refund for 1 Ths Platinum from VMC. Anyway, one month for waiting for cheque to arrive and another for waiting to clear it by banks. Frozen money for few months.

Why did he buy from VMC? Just discovered the website on internet? Didn't read these forums where it's obvious that this is a scam?

A scam with refunds? 

Ok maybe "scam" isn't the right word, but i still think this is a scam. Let me explain you. First he took pre-order money for a shipping date that was never real. The website still claims November shipping right now. With the money he took from pre-order he can build his own miners and just refund everyone. Of course it's not a scam because he didn't ran away with the money, but he kept your money locked for a period of time when he used as he pleased (i'm talking about kslaughter). If i take 1000BTC for asic miners and i multiply them to 10000BTC and then refund everyone then it wouldn't be a scam right? But i made money with your money while you made nothing.

And 1-2-5 refunds means nothing. Let's see if he can refund all his customers. Besides a press release from eASIC i never saw anything from this company. The money paid to eASIC means nothing. They can have the chips available in 2 years or 10 years. Paying 1 mil $ doesn't mean anything without any other proof.

[Bargraphics]

My friend just tol me he received his cheque refund for 1 Ths Platinum from VMC. Anyway, one month for waiting for cheque to arrive and another for waiting to clear it by banks. Frozen money for few months.

Why did he buy from VMC? Just discovered the website on internet? Didn't read these forums where it's obvious that this is a scam?

A scam with refunds?  

Ok maybe "scam" isn't the right word, but i still think this is a scam. Let me explain you. First he took pre-order money for a shipping date that was never real. The website still claims November shipping right now. With the money he took from pre-order he can build his own miners and just refund everyone. Of course it's not a scam because he didn't ran away with the money, but he kept your money locked for a period of time when he used as he pleased (i'm talking about kslaughter). If i take 1000BTC for asic miners and i multiply them to 10000BTC and then refund everyone then it wouldn't be a scam right? But i made money with your money while you made nothing.

And 1-2-5 refunds means nothing. Let's see if he can refund all his customers. Besides a press release from eASIC i never saw anything from this company. The money paid to eASIC means nothing. They can have the chips available in 2 years or 10 years. Paying 1 mil $ doesn't mean anything without any other proof.

I always kind of knew you were a little crazy but man this takes the cake.

The website still claims November shipping right now.

While I'm sure it does, it is a mistake and if you sent an email to them letting them know where they missed these, they would likely get changed. When you try to place an order it tells you that it is April delivery before it lets you purchase.

With the money he took from pre-order he can build his own miners and just refund everyone.

This is the whole point, he is building his own miners, there is a security that people own shares of this company and they will get dividends on those miners that he builds. Unless you have proof that he is mining for himself and forgoing paying dividends to his shareholders what you are saying is pure jaded speculation.

Ok maybe "scam" isn't the right word, but i still think this is a scam.

then you got on to say

Of course it's not a scam because he didn't ran away with the money

Then you proceed to tell a scenario that never existed but instead it is something you cooked up in that funny mind of yours about multiplying BTC out of thin air.

Let's see if he can refund all his customers.

All of his customers did not ask for a refund so again why would you bring a scenario like this up? Everyone that has asked for a refund received one. Straw-man arguments left and right.

The money paid to eASIC means nothing.

This is where I know you must know nothing about this whole process. You obviously have a vast misunderstanding of how eASIC and fabless semiconductor companies work.

They can have the chips available in 2 years or 10 years. Paying 1 mil $ doesn't mean anything without any other proof.

The whole business model of eASIC is time to market and quick turnaround once you have a working chip. While it may take a little longer to get the initial first chips, the process for ordering more should be very quick. eASIC wouldn't be in business right now if it took them "2 years or 10 years" to create a chip.

We're all waiting for the chips, Ken is no where near as late as BFL. They are not nearly as late as HashFast, and BlackArrow has a 3 week delay. You must be crazy to go out of your way to want to see this company be a scam, ever since one of the shareholders argued with you on one of these threads you have tirelessly forgone any reason and kept spewing childish remarks about "How can anyone order from this company" "This company is a scam" "Blah blah blah".

Roadstress, go focus your efforts at scam busting on another thread where you won't look so bad.

[xnu]

Ok maybe "scam" isn't the right word, but i still think this is a scam.

Maybe it's true, what do you suggest? Not buying? That will not solve the problem of stealing time from customers. If there are real facts, then ok, we'll write FTC, they'll take care on this case.

[RoadStress]

I always kind of knew you were a little crazy but man this takes the cake.

While I'm sure it does, it is a mistake and if you sent an email to them letting them know where they missed these, they would likely get changed. When you try to place an order it tells you that it is April delivery before it lets you purchase.

So a company that took millions in pre-orders can't keep their website up to date? It needs reports from customers to fix that?

This is the whole point, he is building his own miners, there is a security that people own shares of this company and they will get dividends on those miners that he builds. Unless you have proof that he is mining for himself and forgoing paying dividends to his shareholders what you are saying is pure jaded speculation.

I thought AMC and VMC are 2 separate things. Are you telling me that someone who bought a Fast-Hash-One unit actually bought shares to the company and that will get dividends instead of the real hardware?

Ok maybe "scam" isn't the right word, but i still think this is a scam.
then you got on to say

Of course it's not a scam because he didn't ran away with the money

Then you proceed to tell a scenario that never existed but instead it is something you cooked up in that funny mind of yours about multiplying BTC out of thin air.

I'm not english native and i don't know if there is a word for what i described. Maybe "con trick"? He conned you to give him money to make whatever he wants with them.

We're all waiting for the chips, Ken is no where near as late as BFL. They are not nearly as late as HashFast, and BlackArrow has a 3 week delay. You must be crazy to go out of your way to want to see this company be a scam, ever since one of the shareholders argued with you on one of these threads you have tirelessly forgone any reason and kept spewing childish remarks about "How can anyone order from this company" "This company is a scam" "Blah blah blah".

Roadstress, go focus your efforts at scam busting on another thread where you won't look so bad.

Ok then i have one question: when will the chips be available? Do you know that? All i know is that they were supposed to be available this autumn/winter, but it seems that they got delayed. I'm not up to date with the latest news, but i don't see a specific date for the chips/miners.

@xnu Ok since FTC punished so bad BFL i bet ken is really afraid of them.

[Bargraphics]

So a company that took millions in pre-orders can't keep their website up to date? It needs reports from customers to fix that?

Yes actually, there are many website where information gets missed that should be changed, doesn't change the fact that the current delivery date is plastered in front of your face when you try to make an order before payment. This is where it counts, arguing about it being missed anywhere else is just you trying to pick a fight with no point.

I thought AMC and VMC are 2 separate things. Are you telling me that someone who bought a Fast-Hash-One unit actually bought shares to the company and that will get dividends instead of the real hardware?

No I'm not, they are two separate entities. But you still have a straw-man argument, you are assuming that he will mine with the equipment instead of shipping it but have no proof. This is the definition of FUD as you are literally expressing your own jaded views of past mining companies on this one and calling them facts.

I'm not english native and i don't know if there is a word for what i described. Maybe "con trick"? He conned you to give him money to make whatever he wants with them.

Pirate did that and now he is in jail, do you honestly think anyone would be stupid enough to do that again? Especially when we have all the real information about Ken? Again a straw-man argument backed by no facts and based on your jaded views of past mining companies.

Ok then i have one question: when will the chips be available? Do you know that? All i know is that they were supposed to be available this autumn/winter, but it seems that they got delayed. I'm not up to date with the latest news, but i don't see a specific date for the chips/miners.

They were supposed to be available late november/early december. This has always been the case. It is now nearing the end of december and speculation leads us to believe there will be chips by mid to late january. There isn't much information out there to tell which is why I said speculation. This is the last post from Ken two days ago.

Weekly Update 12/25/13

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

Here is a picture of our manufacturing line for assembling miners.


Assembly Line


We are working on assembling everything, so when our boards and chips arrive, we can ship the miners fast.

Even if this company is late, they are one of the only companies offering refunds. If you ordered a unit and think you will not receive it, get a refund. Otherwise sit tight because chips are incoming.

[RoadStress]

No I'm not, they are two separate entities. But you still have a straw-man argument, you are assuming that he will mine with the equipment instead of shipping it but have no proof. This is the definition of FUD as you are literally expressing your own jaded views of past mining companies on this one and calling them facts.

I wasn't stating anything. I just said that it could be done and i wouldn't call it my own jaded view because i just state the facts that i see. They were supposed to ship now and they aren't. Facts are simple and i don't have any interest to spread FUD.

Pirate did that and now he is in jail, do you honestly think anyone would be stupid enough to do that again? Especially when we have all the real information about Ken? Again a straw-man argument backed by no facts and based on your jaded views of past mining companies.

Ok Pirate is in jail (for how many years?) while BFL customers had to wait for 1 year in order to get their miners and they are happy to get 50% back from their investment.

Ok then i have one question: when will the chips be available? Do you know that? All i know is that they were supposed to be available this autumn/winter, but it seems that they got delayed. I'm not up to date with the latest news, but i don't see a specific date for the chips/miners.

They were supposed to be available late november/early december. This has always been the case. It is now nearing the end of december and speculation leads us to believe there will be chips by mid to late january. There isn't much information out there to tell which is why I said speculation. This is the last post from Ken two days ago.

Even if this company is late, they are one of the only companies offering refunds. If you ordered a unit and think you will not receive it, get a refund. Otherwise sit tight because chips are incoming.

Ok so you or anyone else that invested in this don't know anything for sure. Only pure speculation. The chips may or may not be available in late January. By that logic they may also be available in January 2015. Nobody knows! Also the fact that there isn't much information seems really strange for me and they aren't the only company that offer refunds. BFL offered refunds too on Paypal (yes a bit forced, but still they were offering refunds). Also please tell me what proof do you have besides a press release from eASIC? Is there anything else to show the progress that they made or at least a specific date for the chips? Because i never saw a statement from eASIC saying that chips will be available on a specific date.

[Bargraphics]

Ok so you or anyone else that invested in this don't know anything for sure. Only pure speculation.
I have stated it was speculation and I'm glad that you have stated your views are pure speculation even though you come on here blatantly saying it's a scam without any proof to back it up. To each their own I guess.

The chips may or may not be available in late January. By that logic they may also be available in January 2015. Nobody knows!

Actually anyone familiar with the IC process and the timelines that are industry standards understands that your logic is incredibly flawed. Small (1-4 week delays) are standard in this industry. Month/Year long delays are not.

Also the fact that there isn't much information seems really strange for me and they aren't the only company that offer refunds. BFL offered refunds too on Paypal (yes a bit forced, but still they were offering refunds).

How do you come up with this stuff in your head? A forced refund IS NOT a normal refund. AMC is offering actual refunds to it's customers. You can try and twist that any way you want but again you are making yourself look bad by even comparing calling up PayPal as a last resort and demanding a refund versus calling the company and them giving it to you without a hassle.

Also please tell me what proof do you have besides a press release from eASIC? Is there anything else to show the progress that they made or at least a specific date for the chips? Because i never saw a statement from eASIC saying that chips will be available on a specific date.

Are you asking for pictures of the inside of a Fab while they are making the mask? Are you asking for the files of the specific chip they sent to the Fab to make that mask? Are you asking for pictures of the chips while they are being made at the Fab? Jesus Christ, just like any other ASIC company out there you will NOT get a picture of the chips til they are in the hands of the manufacturer of the ASIC. No one is going to get access to a fab to get these pictures or release their IP to the public.

As far as a specific date for the chips, we had an initial timeline long ago. That timeline was never updated but based on information we gather from updates such as these:

Weekly Update 12/18/13


Crypto-Trade:

I have all of the legal issues worked out, and I am programming them into the verification site.

VMC:

We are working with eASIC and our engineers to get our chip and boards in full production.

We have stock piled all the hardware to build the miners and we are per-assembling the miners.

The new timeline that is speculated is this:

I've brought this timeline over from the other thread as I think it may be useful to keep a copy here.

The dates in bold are confirmed by announcements, while the others are projected from estimated timelines in the prospectus.

• 26th July [source] - Ken estimates two weeks for NRE to be paid (during visit to eASIC)
• 3rd August [source] - Ken returns from his trip to eASIC and the Engineering firm
• 4th August [source] - Ken posts to say he is busy working on eASIC deal
• (sometime before August 28th) [used for guesstimates below] - NRE Funds paid
• 28th August [source] - Ken confirms NRE funds were converted 'some time ago'
• 4th September [source] - eASIC issue press release
• 12th September [source] - Avalon refund confirmed as having been received
• 1st November [original guesstimate] - Chip samples delivered in 9 weeks;
• 30th October [source] - Ken announces gradual hashrate increase including 'other resources' [source]
• 25th November [original guesstimate] - Low-volume chip production starting in 12 weeks, using an e-beam process;
• 30th November [source] - Ken announces delays due to further R&D and unveils Intellihash(tm) technology
• 12th December [source] - Weekly announcement states "we are continuing to bring in all the parts for mass production of our miners"
• 18th December [source] - Weekly announcement states "working with eASIC and our engineers to get our chip and boards in full production"
• 24th December - 9th January [original guesstimate] - Normal volume chip production starting in 16-18 weeks.

* Note: As of 30th November, probable delays have been introduced into the timeline.

(I will be trying to keep this updated as more facts are revealed. In an effort to keep this thread tidy, please PM me with any suggestions.)

We're all waiting to see chips, I never hid that fact, but coming on here uninformed such as you are and plastering bullshit responses such as 2015, BFL gave refunds, etc.. is simply unacceptable.

[RoadStress]

Actually anyone familiar with the IC process and the timelines that are industry standards understands that your logic is incredibly flawed. Small (1-4 week delays) are standard in this industry. Month/Year long delays are not.

Ok i can understand that, but there should be something specific. For example first they were supposed to get chips last week of November, then they got a delay until last week of December. But i don't see specific dates. And considering that you said chips were supposed to be available late november/early december i think we are past 1-4 week delay if they will be available in late January.

Ok forget about refunds. Maybe i went too far or i'm not easily pleased with stuff.

Are you asking for pictures of the inside of a Fab while they are making the mask? Are you asking for the files of the specific chip they sent to the Fab to make that mask? Are you asking for pictures of the chips while they are being made at the Fab? Jesus Christ, just like any other ASIC company out there you will NOT get a picture of the chips til they are in the hands of the manufacturer of the ASIC. No one is going to get access to a fab to get these pictures or release their IP to the public.

As far as a specific date for the chips, we had an initial timeline long ago. That timeline was never updated but based on information we gather from updates such as these:

We're all waiting to see chips, I never hid that fact, but coming on here uninformed such as you are and plastering bullshit responses such as 2015, BFL gave refunds, etc.. is simply unacceptable.

I don't want pictures from the Fab, but shouldn't sample chips be available with a few weeks before mass production? At least we don't have "clock buffers", like BFL had. Let's talk again in late January to see how this goes. Don't need to get irritated like that.