WEX.nz

[Colorblind]

I'd say there's a decent chance that withdrawing BTC/tokens from WEX for the fork is totally worth it.

It's insanely worth it. If you're leaving your coins there, you'll be kissing your potential 2x coins goodbye for no reason. On top of that, I strongly believe that WEX will end up liquidating these coins elsewhere, which is something basically every user of that exchange should at all times avoid. At the end of the day, the money that comes out of these 2x coins will greatly improve the exchange's (i.e. the operator's) financial position. If people want to start withdrawing their coins from there, it would be worthwhile to do it way before the actual forking date.

I would withdraw my coins from WEX anyways, no matter the case. They just came back from a serious downtime involving getting shut down by the US government for potential money laundering accusations, and their users (including myself) lots millions. Why on Earth anyone would trust them to store any coins is beyond me. I would not keep coins on WEX longer than a few days, tops.

I would argue, that apart from MtGox, BitStamp and Bitfinex, BTC-E's downtime was not consequence of their incompetence but rather consequence of legal pressure and their return really showed everyone dedication and skills of their team. Also "WEX code" is rare feature, allowing you to transfer assets to other exchange users without fees - that's alot.

[erk]

so is it possible wex will release a statement about US verification in the future? or is it set in stone that if you had coins before the shutdown that now you will no longer have access permenently? if so, is it best to try to sell account to non us citizen?  waiting for a solution from wex seems unlikely at this point

Banning US citizens is clearly in the Terms of use on WEX.nz for all to see. I would call that set in stone.

Speaking of banning US citizens, it seems that Bitfinex is terminating trading, deposits, and withdrawal functionality for U.S. individual customers by November 9, 2017.

I wonder how many other crypto exchanges will take that hard line?

[Puff Pastry Hangman]

I was also impressed with WEX/BTC-E returning to try again instead of just keeping whatever BTC balances they had. However it is not so encouraging when you see your BTC balance disappear and support don't respond to your tickets to explain what is going on, most people in this situation are probably quite keen to withdraw everything they have from WEX and move on. If it turns out to be a temporary issue that gets fixed I will change my stance, but for now...

[dexx100]

All scammers. Coins are gone and no email answers.

[erk]

All scammers. Coins are gone and no email answers.

Good, now you can stop posting here.

[marky89]

Banning US citizens is clearly in the Terms of use on WEX.nz for all to see. I would call that set in stone.

Speaking of banning US citizens, it seems that Bitfinex is terminating trading, deposits, and withdrawal functionality for U.S. individual customers by November 9, 2017.

I wonder how many other crypto exchanges will take that hard line?

Remember, though: BTC-e was indicted for operating an unlicensed money service business and fined $110 million for it. Bitfinex has been doing exactly that---with no MSB licenses in any of the 50 states---for something like 5 years. They are pulling out of the market now that law enforcement moved against BTC-e and regulators (like the CFTC and SEC) are ruling on ICO tokens. But we'll have to see if it's too little too late. I suspect that the various US agencies are months or even years into investigating Bitfinex. Pulling out of the market now doesn't erase past violations.

This isn't the wild west anymore. It's possible that exchanges might get away with flouting the law in the early years. To do so now is suicide for any company that wants to remain in existence five years from now. The message to exchanges operating in the US is clear: get proper licensing, or get out.

[erk]

Banning US citizens is clearly in the Terms of use on WEX.nz for all to see. I would call that set in stone.

Speaking of banning US citizens, it seems that Bitfinex is terminating trading, deposits, and withdrawal functionality for U.S. individual customers by November 9, 2017.

I wonder how many other crypto exchanges will take that hard line?

Remember, though: BTC-e was indicted for operating an unlicensed money service business and fined $110 million for it. Bitfinex has been doing exactly that---with no MSB licenses in any of the 50 states---for something like 5 years. They are pulling out of the market now that law enforcement moved against BTC-e and regulators (like the CFTC and SEC) are ruling on ICO tokens. But we'll have to see if it's too little too late. I suspect that the various US agencies are months or even years into investigating Bitfinex. Pulling out of the market now doesn't erase past violations.

This isn't the wild west anymore. It's possible that exchanges might get away with flouting the law in the early years. To do so now is suicide for any company that wants to remain in existence five years from now. The message to exchanges operating in the US is clear: get proper licensing, or get out.

I think BTC-e got targeted before Bitfinex because they were run by Russians. The Admin on BTC-e said it was political, probably referring to the Russiaphobia that's been dominating the US media since Trump got in. The DoJ press release started off with "Russian National" as the first two words in the headline before mentioning the actual topic. https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndca/pr/russian-national-and-bitcoin-exchange-charged-21-count-indictment-operating-alleged

Bitfinex might be getting out of the US just in time, though I doubt they are being targeted because they are not "Russian Nationals".

[dman4u2hold]

I was also impressed with WEX/BTC-E returning to try again instead of just keeping whatever BTC balances they had. However it is not so encouraging when you see your BTC balance disappear and support don't respond to your tickets to explain what is going on, most people in this situation are probably quite keen to withdraw everything they have from WEX and move on. If it turns out to be a temporary issue that gets fixed I will change my stance, but for now...

I am from the usa and have no problem with them banning us. But taking all of our coins and not giving any of them back is a definite no no. That's straight up stealing and justice will be served one way or another.

[exstasie]

I am from the usa and have no problem with them banning us. But taking all of our coins and not giving any of them back is a definite no no. That's straight up stealing and justice will be served one way or another.

This is why it would have been advisable to leave with the 55% back when they were still BTC-e. I felt when watching everything unfold in September, that they were hinting that it was not safe for US users to move forward. It was only logical to assume that WEX would prohibit US customers, although I wish they had been more forthright about it before the launch of the new site.

I think BTC-e got targeted before Bitfinex because they were run by Russians. The Admin on BTC-e said it was political, probably referring to the Russiaphobia that's been dominating the US media since Trump got in. The DoJ press release started off with "Russian National" as the first two words in the headline before mentioning the actual topic. https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndca/pr/russian-national-and-bitcoin-exchange-charged-21-count-indictment-operating-alleged

That's an interesting take, and I'm tempted to agree. But it's also important to note that the indictment was brought in January 2017, and was merely unsealed when they arrested Vinnik in Greece. That means they probably investigated the exchange for months prior to proceeding with the indictment, back to 2016 or even earlier. So while the press release and media have sensationalized the Russian angle, it seems that the feds were looking into BTC-e under Obama, long before all this Russiaphobia began to come to a head around the Trump election.

Bitfinex might be getting out of the US just in time, though I doubt they are being targeted because they are not "Russian Nationals".

Bitfinex is definitely an interesting test case. They've pushed the envelope with Tether and their BFX tokens (both arguably derivatives or securities), and the whole Wells Fargo / banking fiasco gives me the shivers. I'm hoping for the best, but I would stay away from there myself.

[Puff Pastry Hangman]

Got a response from support today, they added the BTC that I quoted as having gone missing to my account!

Hope this gives hope to all others who are waiting for missing BTC to reappear after verification.

I still don't have the BTCET that should have accompanied my BTC but will be asking for that too.

[cooltobe]

Got a response from support today, they added the BTC that I quoted as having gone missing to my account!

Hope this gives hope to all others who are waiting for missing BTC to reappear after verification.

I still don't have the BTCET that should have accompanied my BTC but will be asking for that too.

can you please share how you were able to convince them to refund the missing quote .

[Puff Pastry Hangman]

Just being persistent with emails to support. When they replied with something that didn't make sense I just said so politely and re-stated my concern. My BTC sum was small, maybe that has something to do with why I was successful, but hopefully they will get around to sorting this out for everyone who was affected.

[royerd]

There is actually topic to sue them for this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2307553 .

[JoenN]

what will happened if we don't verify at wex.nz? they force us to verify later ? or just in security problem we need to verify??

[BitHodler]

what will happened if we don't verify at wex.nz? they force us to verify later ? or just in security problem we need to verify??

As long as you don't deposit/withdraw fiat, there is basically no need to verify yourself, unless they suddenly change their terms and force even those who don't deal with fiat deposits/withdrawals to verify themselves.

WEX does however force you to verify yourself when you request an email change, shut off 2FA, removing white listed IP's, and of course the afore mentioned fiat deposits/withdrawals ~ easy to understand, right?

[JoenN]

yes, it's easy to understand ! but when you don't see your country in verification list , it's scary  

[neotes]

So apparently, to verify with Wex, you cannot reside or be a U.S. citizen.  That means anyone who is in the U.S. will not be able to verify, and thus locked out of their accounts?   =/

I am in the same situation since I am a US citizen. Wex has blocked my account which, originally was with BTCe. I requested Wex to return the funds in my account since I cannot maintain an account in the future under their new requirements for US citizens.

Wex made arrangements to take over the former BTCe client accounts.
Each client asset account has a corresponding custodial liability that they assumed along with the assets. From a legal standpoint, Wex is acting as a custodian for their clients’ funds. As such,  they have a legal liability to return funds to the client upon request. If Wex refuses to return client’s funds, I would deem it to be an act of fraud and theft. Wex is not the legal owner of said funds, and therefore, has no legal right to keep those funds for their own account.

They are using the excuse that the account is blocked if the client is a US citizen. If the account is blocked, then the client cannot access the account and process a withdrawal or any other type of transaction.
The reality is that it is not necessary for the client to actually process the withdrawal. All the client should need to do is make a request for withdrawal to the Wex exchange.  The Wex administrators have the ability to access all accounts and process any clients withdrawal request, regardless if they are a US citizen or not. If necessary, Wex can get pre-approval  from the appropriate regulators.

I believe there should be coordinated effort to submit complaints to a governmental/regulatory agency.
Does anyone have suggestions what agencies to submit complaints to?

[Colorblind]

So apparently, to verify with Wex, you cannot reside or be a U.S. citizen.  That means anyone who is in the U.S. will not be able to verify, and thus locked out of their accounts?   =/

I am in the same situation since I am a US citizen. Wex has blocked my account which, originally was with BTCe. I requested Wex to return the funds in my account since I cannot maintain an account in the future under their new requirements for US citizens.

Wex made arrangements to take over the former BTCe client accounts.
Each client asset account has a corresponding custodial liability that they assumed along with the assets. From a legal standpoint, Wex is acting as a custodian for their clients’ funds. As such,  they have a legal liability to return funds to the client upon request. If Wex refuses to return client’s funds, I would deem it to be an act of fraud and theft. Wex is not the legal owner of said funds, and therefore, has no legal right to keep those funds for their own account.

They are using the excuse that the account is blocked if the client is a US citizen. If the account is blocked, then the client cannot access the account and process a withdrawal or any other type of transaction.
The reality is that it is not necessary for the client to actually process the withdrawal. All the client should need to do is make a request for withdrawal to the Wex exchange.  The Wex administrators have the ability to access all accounts and process any clients withdrawal request, regardless if they are a US citizen or not. If necessary, Wex can get pre-approval  from the appropriate regulators.

I believe there should be coordinated effort to submit complaints to a governmental/regulatory agency.
Does anyone have suggestions what agencies to submit complaints to?

I'm in no way endorsing WEX, and really sorry for what you are coming through, but you have to take some things into consideration.

From legal standpoint WEX is not BTC-e and even though they obtained BTC-e's digital assets (database and cold wallet) they did not took liabilities of BTC-e. Restoring btc associated with previous BTC-e accounts was done out of their good will (i.e. WEX wanted to continue being exchange, so they figured they will pay back to some of their users instead of just leaving with tons of BTC that will be really painful to cash). Basically this means that you are in a limbo - all obligations to store your property (afaik BTCs are considered a property, not funds in US) was taken by BTC-e and FBI siezed their assets (so legally speaking your property now is in FBI posession even though it is in form of encrypted and probably long time emptied cold wallet key). Meanwhile WEX denies (and probably will continue to deny) any responsibility even though they took over after BTC-e's demise.

[erk]

WEX token

31.10.17 23:05 from admin
Dear WEX users!

Input data: WEX has bought out the BTC-e user base and their digital profiles.

WEX issued tokens that compensate for the lost fiat balances of users of the BTC-E exchange.

Starting from November 2 2017 00:00 a.m. (Moscow) we will publish data on the percentage (%) of the bought out tokens, under the chat, the information will be updated in real time. Conditions for keeping, selling and buying tokens will be described in the Terms of Use.

Our company is working under the laws of Singapore which considers digital currencies and tokens as a "digital asset". It means that we have the right to issue tokens, a “digital asset” with conditions and price specified at the start and available for trading.

The WEX token is a contract between us and users, according to which we are obliged to buy out the WEX tokens during a certain interval of time (2 years). In this case from the legal point of view it is the creditor’s right (right of the user) to get a compensation / payment for tokens and also to trade it.

In the first stage, tokens are redeemed from the market at regular intervals (daily, weekly, monthly). This stage has already been launched and changes can be seen online by the percentage of redeemed tokens.
At the second stage, tokens will be bought out 1 to 1 from user balances. The time of the launch of this stage has not yet been determined.

Previous news about tokens -- https://wex.nz/news/2

Yours sincerely,
WEX

https://wex.nz/news/4

I am not sure what they mean by percentage redeemed, does that mean taken out of circulation by WEX buying them back at market not 1:1 ?

[1Referee]

I am not sure what they mean by percentage redeemed, does that mean taken out of circulation by WEX buying them back at market not 1:1 ?

They used the significantly lower rates of the debt tokens to buy them back on the market, and thus lower their active debt without paying the full 1:1 price. In other words, people who put their coins in the market, will never get 1:1 as WEX will buy these debt tokens at current rates. You will only get paid the full 1:1 ratio (if ever) if you patiently keep them in your account. It was to be expected, and honestly, you can't blame them for buying back their debt at far lower rates. All tokens move below the 0.6 level, and some even below 0.5 currently.