[TAT.VIRTUALMINE]

[joele]

There is no bitcoin investment with no risk.
or you may keep your btc in cold wallet for 10 years, they said if bitcoin still available that time it may value $10k+/btc, but it has risk as well because it can be $0

http://techcrunch.com/2013/06/02/calculating-the-long-term-value-of-a-bitcoin/

[miTgiB]

what controls how many will get put onto the market?, is there a limited amount of them, also when difficulty increases in 2 weeks or a month, wouldnt the price of these drop? because dividends are dropping,

so buying them would be betting on the difficulty not going up so fast? or betting on that i would be able to atleast sell them for same price i bought them for,

right?
seems a bit risky for my taste i guess

Since you are a speculator, please stop saying investing.  Nobody invests with a 2-4 week horizon, they speculate.  If you think there will be less mining, this will increase in value, if the mining activity increases, these will decrease in value, it is simple math.

[drdanishkhan]

When can we expect TAT.VIRTUALMINE shares on BTCT.CO

[ThickAsThieves]

When can we expect TAT.VIRTUALMINE shares on BTCT.CO

When BTCTC fixes its application system.

[joele]

TAT, difficulty will be 15M 1-2 hours before the dividend.
What will be the dividend difficulty computed then, the 12M or 15M? or 90% 12M and 10% 15M? 

[ThickAsThieves]

TAT, difficulty will be 15M 1-2 hours before the dividend.
What will be the dividend difficulty computed then, the 12M or 15M? or 90% 12M and 10% 15M? 

This is in the contract, the dividend used the difficulty from 12PM EST the day before.

[ThickAsThieves]

TAT.VM dividends have been paid, ฿0.00004138 per share.

[Kyune]

what controls how many will get put onto the market?, is there a limited amount of them,

As far as I can tell, TAT is free under the contract on Bitfunder to release more shares at any time, without advance notice, and to set any "fair market price" when doing so.  In fact it looks like he has done so once already -- there were originally 100k shares released, but now it looks like there are 115k total shares released.  I don't know if the additional 15k shares released at a later time were also sold at .007 or not, but TAT was probably not contractually obligated to set the price precisely at that level even if he happened to do so.

It is also my understanding that TAT is currently looking into the process of launching the same investment on at least one if not two other exchanges (btct and Havelock).   If successful, this would obviously result in the creation of more shares as well, albeit in a sister market.

So scarcity of shares, in the sense of a stable and known number of shares where the share issuer does not arbitrarily create more, does not appear to be a feature of this asset.

[ThickAsThieves]

what controls how many will get put onto the market?, is there a limited amount of them,

As far as I can tell, TAT is free under the contract on Bitfunder to release more shares at any time, without advance notice, and to set any "fair market price" when doing so.  In fact it looks like he has done so once already -- there were originally 100k shares released, but now it looks like there are 115k total shares released.  I don't know if the additional 15k shares released at a later time were also sold at .007 or not, but TAT was probably not contractually obligated to set the price precisely at that level even if he happened to do so.

It is also my understanding that TAT is currently looking into the process of launching the same investment on at least one if not two other exchanges (btct and Havelock).   If successful, this would obviously result in the creation of more shares as well, albeit in a sister market.

So scarcity of shares, in the sense of a stable and known number of shares where the share issuer does not arbitrarily create more, does not appear to be a feature of this asset.

The asset will not be released on Havelock, this I can confirm. It's release on BTCTC is in question, but uncertain at the moment.

Some new "units" (I have to be careful with these terms...) were sold within the first 36 hours of the IPO release at roughly .0075 and higher. I have not participated in the market since then.

Oddly, other speculators seem to be holding down the price for now.

Regardless, the intent of this asset is to be denominated as 1MH/s. While I can affect the market value by releasing more, I cannot totally control the market from speculators or increased demand over time. I want to see a healthy price, just as much as the other unit holders. Generally, this asset is still undervalued when compared to other mining assets, or, you can say the others are overvalued...

I plan to take some time to see if I can think of a regulated way to issue new shares in the future, but I cannot promise a magical solution. At the moment, I have sold as much as I'd like to, and will probably not reassess until this weekend.

I can tell you that if the asset does get approved for release on BTCTC, I won't be releasing as many shares there (in the short term at least), and it will make it much less likely that I will release new shares on Bitfunder (in the short term).

[KSV]

why is anyone buying this? difficulty is going to increase. . .ASICs are coming on the market, it doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure that much out.

[SOSLOVE868]

what controls how many will get put onto the market?, is there a limited amount of them,

As far as I can tell, TAT is free under the contract on Bitfunder to release more shares at any time, without advance notice, and to set any "fair market price" when doing so.  In fact it looks like he has done so once already -- there were originally 100k shares released, but now it looks like there are 115k total shares released.  I don't know if the additional 15k shares released at a later time were also sold at .007 or not, but TAT was probably not contractually obligated to set the price precisely at that level even if he happened to do so.

It is also my understanding that TAT is currently looking into the process of launching the same investment on at least one if not two other exchanges (btct and Havelock).   If successful, this would obviously result in the creation of more shares as well, albeit in a sister market.

So scarcity of shares, in the sense of a stable and known number of shares where the share issuer does not arbitrarily create more, does not appear to be a feature of this asset.

The asset will not be released on Havelock, this I can confirm. It's release on BTCTC is in question, but uncertain at the moment.

Some new "units" (I have to be careful with these terms...) were sold within the first 36 hours of the IPO release at roughly .0075 and higher. I have not participated in the market since then.

Oddly, other speculators seem to be holding down the price for now.

Regardless, the intent of this asset is to be denominated as 1MH/s. While I can affect the market value by releasing more, I cannot totally control the market from speculators or increased demand over time. I want to see a healthy price, just as much as the other unit holders. Generally, this asset is still undervalued when compared to other mining assets, or, you can say the others are overvalued...

I plan to take some time to see if I can think of a regulated way to issue new shares in the future, but I cannot promise a magical solution. At the moment, I have sold as much as I'd like to, and will probably not reassess until this weekend.

I can tell you that if the asset does get approved for release on BTCTC, I won't be releasing as many shares there (in the short term at least), and it will make it much less likely that I will release new shares on Bitfunder (in the short term).

I want to know ,when will you stop this IPO process??? if you always issuing new contracts...it make very difficult for us to selling our contract without loss....seems we are obligate to fee the 0.8% trading administration fee.... I do think if you would slightly issue less new contract it will be a good news for those earlier adopter...what you think here??

[ThickAsThieves]

Some new "units" (I have to be careful with these terms...) were sold within the first 36 hours of the IPO release at roughly .0075 and higher. I have not participated in the market since then.

Oddly, other speculators seem to be holding down the price for now.

Regardless, the intent of this asset is to be denominated as 1MH/s. While I can affect the market value by releasing more, I cannot totally control the market from speculators or increased demand over time. I want to see a healthy price, just as much as the other unit holders. Generally, this asset is still undervalued when compared to other mining assets, or, you can say the others are overvalued...

I plan to take some time to see if I can think of a regulated way to issue new shares in the future, but I cannot promise a magical solution. At the moment, I have sold as much as I'd like to, and will probably not reassess until this weekend.

I can tell you that if the asset does get approved for release on BTCTC, I won't be releasing as many shares there (in the short term at least), and it will make it much less likely that I will release new shares on Bitfunder (in the short term).

I want to know ,when will you stop this IPO process??? if you always issuing new contracts...it make very difficult for us to selling our contract without loss....seems we are obligate to fee the 0.8% trading administration fee.... I do think if you would slightly issue less new contract it will be a good news for those earlier adopter...what you think here??

It seems you did not read the comment you quoted.

[EskimoBob]

IPO is done so you can probably publish a simple reports, showing us how much TAT has as "shareholders equity" and how much you have as "investments" under assets in BTC. (ASICMINER and something else?) and all the other usual stuff (expences etc)

[Kyune]

I want to know ,when will you stop this IPO process??? if you always issuing new contracts...it make very difficult for us to selling our contract without loss....seems we are obligate to fee the 0.8% trading administration fee.... I do think if you would slightly issue less new contract it will be a good news for those earlier adopter...what you think here??

Conceptually, don't misunderstand the asset by thinking of the asset as a share in a business that will have some kind of protection against "dilution" farther down the road.  That is probably one reason TAT is trying to hew to the word "unit" and rejected my casual use of the word "share" to describe the asset.  It's much more like a bond.  Well...it IS a bond.

I can even see how calling its initial release an "IPO", although true in the technical sense, has a little potential to confuse people about what this is all about.  This is not an IPO that lets "early adopters" fund a risk-taking venture and expect greater reward for doing so.  It's just a bond with a structured payout.  The reward for early adopters compared to later adopters, if there is one at all, is collecting dividends while difficulty is still (relatively) lower.  I see little basis for the hope that unit prices will rise significantly in the open market, however, even if TAT chooses to limit further issurance of units from this point forward.

[ThickAsThieves]

IPO is done so you can probably publish a simple reports, showing us how much TAT has as "shareholders equity" and how much you have as "investments" under assets in BTC. (ASICMINER and something else?) and all the other usual stuff (expences etc)

While I have not promised any sort of reports, and as a bond holder, one can't expect "shareholder equity" reports, I do appreciate that tracking my backing between my two assets could be time-consuming or complex for people, so I will consider including updates in my next transparency report that confirm my AM holdings readily.

The fact is that my holding addresses, and portfolios are already public and auditable weekly.

[EskimoBob]

IPO is done so you can probably publish a simple reports, showing us how much TAT has as "shareholders equity" and how much you have as "investments" under assets in BTC. (ASICMINER and something else?) and all the other usual stuff (expences etc)

While I have not promised any sort of reports, and as a bond holder, one can't expect "shareholder equity" reports, I do appreciate that tracking my backing between my two assets could be time-consuming or complex for people, so I will consider including updates in my next transparency report that confirm my AM holdings readily.

The fact is that my holding addresses, and portfolios are already public and auditable weekly.

+1

I used the "shareholder equity" here kinda loosely (because you keep talking about dividends . Yes, TAT supposed to  be a bond (debt) so it sits on the other side of your balance sheet. Proceeds from sale of this bond are used to acquire equity, that will earn income to cover your (expenses) liabilities like coupon payments (that 1 Mh/s thingy)

Fuck, now I really like to see that balance sheet of yours

[KizunaAikawa]

Damn was hoping this will get on Havelock.. 

[freedomno1]

Damn was hoping this will get on Havelock.. 

Well at least we have normal ASIC div's first

[ThickAsThieves]

Daily Payout: 115,000 shares were paid ฿0.00003223 each for TAT.VIRTUALMINER.

[Necrocide666]

Why did the dividend amount drop? Is this share price related or difficulty change related?