[OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading

[Ente]

Really liking using Bitfinex, great job.

I've got a question about exchange buy orders.

Example :-
1 - Deposit 1 btc into my account and move it to the exchange wallet.
2 - Sell all at market and end up with, for example, USD 900.
3 - Wait for 1 day, then buy all at market when the btc price has gone down to USD 850.

Why can't I spend the entire USD 900 amount that's in my exchange wallet?
Because it gave a warning at step 3 and said not enough margin.
Can I only spend (USD900 - 10% = USD 810)?

Note I'm not doing a margin trade here, just an straight buy at market exchange order.

Sorry if this has been answered before, just a bit confused by this.

I believe you put your funds into the wrong wallet type, and then went on to do margin trading, where you meant to do plain exchange.
There a "trading", "deposit" and "exchange" wallet, with those three types of business separated from each other. You can move funds from one wallet to another via "manage wallets".

Ente

[1715492080]

1715492080

[1715492080]

1715492080

[Ente]

It seems to me that only the top 40 or so lend offers are shown on the grid.  So if my auto-renew loan is set for 365 days @ .90%, and there are 40 other 2-day loans at less than .90%, then my offer won't even show up on the grid and thus will not be taken.  Can someone confirm that this is how it works?

Offers at the same interest rate are summed up to one offer. Amount is the total amount, lending time is the longest of all individual offers.
If it was 40 offers with different interest rates, then yes, your (worse interest rate) 365 days offer is not visible on the list, as you say.

Ente

[accord01]

How come the swap isn't being charged when the system is searching for a loan on a margin position?  It took the system almost 1 hour to find a loan for a position, and during that time no interest was charged in the swap.

The other day, out of no where when i had no positions open the last few days, I get charged $14.  Was that for some interest from several days ago?  If so, why is it not being charged immediately.

[Ente]

How come the swap isn't being charged when the system is searching for a loan on a margin position?  It took the system almost 1 hour to find a loan for a position, and during that time no interest was charged in the swap.

The other day, out of no where when i had no positions open the last few days, I get charged $14.  Was that for some interest from several days ago?  If so, why is it not being charged immediately.

It sometimes takes a little while to update the numbers, from my experience.

Another question: Is there any way to see the current interest rate on a position? On the old interface it was visible.

Ente

[btcperth]

I believe you put your funds into the wrong wallet type, and then went on to do margin trading, where you meant to do plain exchange. There a "trading", "deposit" and "exchange" wallet, with those three types of business separated from each other. You can move funds from one wallet to another via "manage wallets".

Ente

I think that's what I did, thanks

[superbit]

Over 7 million lent out and rates at 0.6% a day?  What happened......lol

[vokain]

Over 7 million lent out and rates at 0.6% a day?  What happened......lol

0.6% per day sounds less than 219% per year? Or is it just risk taking considering Bitcoin doubles around every 3-4 months?

[arbitrage001]

Over 7 million lent out and rates at 0.6% a day?  What happened......lol

0.6% per day sounds less than 219% per year? Or is it just risk taking considering Bitcoin doubles around every 3-4 months?

Sound like a classical bubble. How long will the party last is anyone guess.

[superbit]

Over 7 million lent out and rates at 0.6% a day?  What happened......lol

0.6% per day sounds less than 219% per year? Or is it just risk taking considering Bitcoin doubles around every 3-4 months?

Sound like a classical bubble. How long will the party last is anyone guess.

These rates are fairly low for leverage trading something that is MUCH more volatile than 1% a day.

[Indamuck]

Over 7 million lent out and rates at 0.6% a day?  What happened......lol

0.6% per day sounds less than 219% per year? Or is it just risk taking considering Bitcoin doubles around every 3-4 months?

Sound like a classical bubble. How long will the party last is anyone guess.

These rates are fairly low for leverage trading something that is MUCH more volatile than 1% a day.

Have any lenders here had to eat a loss of principal while lending through Bitfinex, and can relate the circumstances/experience here?

[Ente]

Another question: Is there any way to see the current interest rate on a position? On the old interface it was visible.

http://bfxwiki.everdot.org/HOWTO_see_the_current_interest_rate_on_a_position_and_change_loans

Thanks for trying ;-)
Yes, I can easily see the interest of every single loan. I'd like to see the average, effective interest of the whole position, like I could in the last interface. I'd rather not export the list of all loans to openoffice and let it calculate the effective interest by weight-adding all individual interests ;-)
Heck, I can even still see that summed-up effective interest rate percentage when I log into the classic version.
And, by the way, I got used to the new interface faster than I thought.
Now let's get used to the new interest rate denomination..

Ente

[superbit]

Another question: Is there any way to see the current interest rate on a position? On the old interface it was visible.

http://bfxwiki.everdot.org/HOWTO_see_the_current_interest_rate_on_a_position_and_change_loans

Thanks for trying ;-)
Yes, I can easily see the interest of every single loan. I'd like to see the average, effective interest of the whole position, like I could in the last interface. I'd rather not export the list of all loans to openoffice and let it calculate the effective interest by weight-adding all individual interests ;-)
Heck, I can even still see that summed-up effective interest rate percentage when I log into the classic version.
And, by the way, I got used to the new interface faster than I thought.
Now let's get used to the new interest rate denomination..

Ente

Exact same as me, I got used to the new interface way quicker then expected, now I just want to get used to seeing interest rates at over 0.5%

[Wassupia]

I know that this would have happened during the crash in April. MtGox went out and the market moved so fast that Forced Executed positions where FE'd so low that it would have made lenders loose part of the principal.

What actually happened in April was that BFX investor money stepped in and covered those losses.

.....

The market is more mature now than what it was in April and BFX has a lot more internal volume now compared to what they had back then (they are basically doubling every month now) so I think the chances of loosing principle has gone down a lot. But you should beware that it is possible.

What would happen if bitfinex itself went down before/during a crash?

Bitfinex and its API is down atm, does that mean the trade engine is down as well, if not, could that ever happen?

[Ente]

BitFinex is back online for me.

Ente

[accord01]

Over 7 million lent out and rates at 0.6% a day?  What happened......lol

How did you know there was over 7 million lent out?  From what time period?  Thanks

[MegaKill]

I just saw a lending offer for 36500days! thats 100years lol   just for fun

[Ichthyo]

I know that this would have happened during the crash in April. MtGox went out and the market moved so fast that Forced Executed positions where FE'd so low that it would have made lenders loose part of the principal.

What actually happened in April was that BFX investor money stepped in and covered those losses.

What would happen if bitfinex itself went down before/during a crash?

Bitfinex and its API is down atm, does that mean the trade engine is down as well, if not, could that ever happen?

Let's dissect that question from a theoretical viewpoint.
For the platform to work and actually offer the specific financial instrument it does, three components are involved. Each one of them can of course fail temporarily. Every system is fallible

• the front-end. That is what we, the users see when we deal with Bitfinex. Both the web application and the API count as front-end. This front-end allows us to monitor and control and change our positions, orders, loans. When the front-end goes down during a critical market situation, we loose our ability to react, but the positions and orders as such will be executed according to the rules. Consequences reach from lost opportunities to loosing all of one's account value. Stop orders will protect you against the worst losses for this kind of failure
• the trading engine. This is what watches the market situation, the current position value, and triggers orders. The trading engine going down while the market moves away significantly is kind of the worst-case scenario of technical failure. Since then the platform isn't able to behave according to the rules, any continued operation after such an event could be challenged legally (and those customers getting off worse through such an event might be inclined to try the legal approach).
• Operating a Contract-for-Difference requires a real trading account at some market place. This trading account has the size of all Bitfinex user's positions netted / aggregated. When this backing exchange (or the API link to that exchange) goes down, Bitfinex looses the ability to run its financial construction. But when the actual Bitfinex engine itself continues to work, the platform is able to continue its calculation in theory according to the rules. Thus, this situation creates a gap between the nominal state of affairs, and the actual monetary situation for Bitfinex itself -- and without any doubt the company has to absorb this difference, up to the limits where it goes bankrupt. But such a decoupling of nominal an real position could also create an unexpected revenue for Bitfinex, just depending on the real market movement. It's an interesting question how to deal correct with such a situation (in both legal and moral sense)

[nrd525]

It is possible that bitfinex could use its internal pricing.  According to the stats, 50% of the BTC trades are being done locally (at least in the past 24 hours).

[rioshoosh]

• Operating a Contract-for-Difference requires a real trading account at some market place. This trading account has the size of all Bitfinex user's positions netted / aggregated. When this backing exchange (or the API link to that exchange) goes down, Bitfinex looses the ability to run its financial construction. But when the actual Bitfinex engine itself continues to work, the platform is able to continue its calculation in theory according to the rules. Thus, this situation creates a gap between the nominal state of affairs, and the actual monetary situation for Bitfinex itself -- and without any doubt the company has to absorb this difference, up to the limits where it goes bankrupt. But such a decoupling of nominal an real position could also create an unexpected revenue for Bitfinex, just depending on the real market movement. It's an interesting question how to deal correct with such a situation (in both legal and moral sense)

At this point, this is a non issue. Bitfinex has enough internal volume to maintain pricing reasonably close to other exchanges without needing a direct link to them.

[Ente]

Again a new lending bug:

I don't know what is happening, but your autolending feature is trying to loan with a fucked up rate.

I have autolend @ 0.88% / 30 days.

BUT it opens new loans at 0.274% for 12 months. That is inacceptable.... (I thought 365 days loans are not even possible?)

I don't understand what you are arguing. You do have your asked 0.88%/30days, in fact the loan you have is better in both ways: you pay a third interest only, and you may have it running longer than those 30 days. Of course you are free to close a loan at any time you like. So, close it in 30 days if you wish?

Ente