[OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading

[Ron~Popeil]

I am not a trader and have no skills at all as it relates to that so please excuse what might the a dumb question. Is the interest rate on liquidity swaps accrued hourly but credited daily or is it accrued for each 24 hour period? I am lending in BTC if that helps.

[1714761184]

1714761184

[1714761184]

1714761184

[1714761184]

1714761184

[1714761184]

1714761184

[DoubleSwapper]

Very Nice feature, BFXDATA!!! Been waiting for this a long time!
Is it possible though that there is a bug or that the data stream stopped? The graph halts at 16:44 for me? Can anybody else confirm? If not this might be a personal incompatability with my browser.

I am not a trader and have no skills at all as it relates to that so please excuse what might the a dumb question. Is the interest rate on liquidity swaps accrued hourly but credited daily or is it accrued for each 24 hour period? I am lending in BTC if that helps.

The former.  

EDIT: Oh, and a feature request from my side for BFX. It would be very nice of you to implement some kind of counter that shows outstanding swap payments for the day. I try to calculate my expected swap payment for every day and almost everyday it's either up to 14 % lower or 15 % higher than expected. No idea what I'm doing wrong and not many sources I see for possible mistakes. I have of course included the 15 % fee you take. I'm not sure whether there is possible intra-hour churn but that should almost never matter for me and is definitely not the reason.

[bjornw]

Very Nice feature, BFXDATA!!! Been waiting for this a long time!
Is it possible though that there is a bug or that the data stream stopped? The graph halts at 16:44 for me? Can anybody else confirm? If not this might be a personal incompatability with my browser.

I am not a trader and have no skills at all as it relates to that so please excuse what might the a dumb question. Is the interest rate on liquidity swaps accrued hourly but credited daily or is it accrued for each 24 hour period? I am lending in BTC if that helps.

The former.  

yep you're correct... I did a feature request to the bitfinex team and they already implemented it, I missed it and have to do some recoding... working on it

EDIT 20:06 UTC Should be synched again.

[Ron~Popeil]

Very Nice feature, BFXDATA!!! Been waiting for this a long time!
Is it possible though that there is a bug or that the data stream stopped? The graph halts at 16:44 for me? Can anybody else confirm? If not this might be a personal incompatability with my browser.

I am not a trader and have no skills at all as it relates to that so please excuse what might the a dumb question. Is the interest rate on liquidity swaps accrued hourly but credited daily or is it accrued for each 24 hour period? I am lending in BTC if that helps.

The former. 

Thanks! That makes a big difference. I like safe investments over trying to win big by trading. I get too emotional about such things.

[capoeira]

Could you please disable your JS-based Incapsula DoS-protection on https://www.bitfinex.com/pages/stats ? I don't want to run selenium just to download one fucking HTML.

[ironic mode]nice tone of voice to do a feature request... [/ironic mode] if I were the bitfinex team i'm not sure If I were to consider your request...

obviously he made a big loss in a trade (or his wive cheated him) 

[komar]

obviously he made a big loss in a trade (or his wive cheated him) 

No, just got a hundred emails from cron.

[noggin-scratcher]

I try to calculate my expected swap payment for every day and almost everyday it's either up to 14 % lower or 15 % higher than expected.

I do the same in a moderately automated way (copy/paste swap details into a spreadsheet, it takes care of the rest), and while it does vary a bit around the actual figure each day, I get closer than 14-15%.

All I'm doing is amount*duration*rate*0.85 for each swap though, so... not sure where errors would be creeping in for you.

How do you handle accumulating errors between days? For mine, I keep a running total of how much I've been wrong by, and add the error for each day onto that total so that I can adjust for it and, in effect, start each day from zero. Some days it's a little over, some days it's a little under, but the overall total error has mostly corrected back towards zero over long enough spans of time.

[komar]

Hey guys, why bitfinex chart on bitcoincharts.com stopped working just exactly the same moment when you enabled your DoS-protection?

[capoeira]

Hey guys, why bitfinex chart on bitcoincharts.com stopped working just exactly the same moment when you enabled your DoS-protection?

you should ask bitcoincharts

[komar]

you should ask bitcoincharts

Already asked. But I'm sure the cause is not on their side. The only problem I ever got with bitcoincharts when they started to check HTTP Referer (so I couldn't just hotlink the chart).

[nick32768]

I cannot cancel my orders!

When I click on cancel, the error message is "The order could not be canceled". One of the order ID is: 62432676

Nick.

[m5j0r]

^ "cancel all" still works.

We need a statement of the BFX team very soon!!

This caused a tiny panic in our tradingroom already and it doesn't feel very trustworthy if your exchange behaves weird all of a sudden...

[nick32768]

^ "cancel all" still works.

We need a statement of the BFX team very soon!!

This caused a tiny panic in our tradingroom already and it doesn't feel very trustworthy if your exchange behaves weird all of a sudden...

Thanks!!!

[komar]

Oh jeez.
Some time ago I decided to collect exchange statistics by my own, but now I'm thinking about starting yet another exchange.

[unclescrooge]

Hey guys,

The orders can now be cancelled, they couldn't for a few moments because of a broken link with the trading engine.

Thank you
Raphael
Bitfinex team

[m5j0r]

@unclescrooge:

Good to hear that this has been resolved.
Have there been problems with the API today too?
Third party sites didn't receive any Bitfinex data for some time..

The orderbook on bitfinex.com doesn't update nearly half as fast as http://bitcointicker.co/ and the others. A live, fast orderbook would be great. The site mentioned removed the feature to expand the orderbook depth so I only use bitcoinwisdom right now, but I think it was really useful when it worked.
->a bigger, really fast live orderbook
->fast tickchart
->beep on trade (just hearing when activity increases instead of setting artificial price alarms is quite nice)

Could that have been due to DDoS attacks again? It happened at the same time as todays dump...

[DoubleSwapper]

I try to calculate my expected swap payment for every day and almost everyday it's either up to 14 % lower or 15 % higher than expected.

I do the same in a moderately automated way (copy/paste swap details into a spreadsheet, it takes care of the rest), and while it does vary a bit around the actual figure each day, I get closer than 14-15%.

All I'm doing is amount*duration*rate*0.85 for each swap though, so... not sure where errors would be creeping in for you.

How do you handle accumulating errors between days? For mine, I keep a running total of how much I've been wrong by, and add the error for each day onto that total so that I can adjust for it and, in effect, start each day from zero. Some days it's a little over, some days it's a little under, but the overall total error has mostly corrected back towards zero over long enough spans of time.

First I start with an upper ceiling ball park estimate which even then sometimes reveals mistakes.
(Highest Swap Rate)*(0.85)*(lend out funds). This works for me when the swap rates are sufficiently similar and you have nearly all your funds lend out. For example even this upper ceiling estimate showed that yesterday's swap rate was about 8% higher than it could have possibly been. If there is nearly to no difference like there sometimes is, I stop right here.
If the difference is large enough I go for more detailed calculations similar to yours which often reveal and even larger difference (11 % in this case).

I'm doing this long enough that when I see the swap payment rate I immidiately have an estimate in my head (yep, fits, pretty good! or nah, this can't be) which almost always turns out to be correct.

First, it's nice to see that you can confirm that there is variation and it's not exactly the amount it should be, so I'm not making this up. In defense of BFXs good intentions and what you stated I'm assuming that most likely some parts of the daily swap payment are not included this day for whatever reason and are then included in the next day so this difference might balance itself out.

The P2P lending is surely a complex feature and we have hear about numerous problems in the past (the time of the swap payment was always fluctuating, now it's almost always at 2:40, the incident where some hours were not credited, the one time where we got a paymen 2 days later because the original one was too low, etc. etc. I'm still wondering about the very interesting intricacies BitcoinIdioitDude has laid out (the possibility (that now seems to be fixed) to churn aways loans by cycling them through would directly implicate that loans were taken out without the lender receiving a swap payment for this etc.)

That being said I still consider this feature an amazing feat of BFX and just hope it's in their best intent to not screw us over because they would probably have far more effective means to do so. For reasons of transparency I would be happy for some kind of counter (like the unrealized swap cost one in the margin trading tab) that shows the accrued amount of due swap payment and is then resetted with the daily pay out.

[noggin-scratcher]

First, it's nice to see that you can confirm that there is variation and it's not exactly the amount it should be, so I'm not making this up. In defense of BFXs good intentions and what you stated I'm assuming that most likely some parts of the daily swap payment are not included this day for whatever reason and are then included in the next day so this difference might balance itself out.

I see some small variations, but typically less than a 1% difference from my predicted value. I'm chalking it up to rounding errors that average out over a few days (i.e. if they're only calculating fees owed every 10 minutes, or 1 hour or w/e the time period is, then I'd have to model that to get the same figure exactly, which I'm not).

I did have a period of maybe a week where I was consistently getting paid more than I expected each day, by a slightly larger margin than the normal +/-1%, and my accumulated error is still showing a small surplus because of that. I really doubt there's anything deliberately untoward going on.

[DoubleSwapper]

Seems like the manipulators have found a new way to rig the interest rate. Sudden spike to 0.69 %!

[komar]

Seems like the manipulators have found a new way to rig the interest rate. Sudden spike to 0.69 %!

Not so sudden: