YES, you can get a REFUND from BFL

[Phinnaeus Gage]

People struggling to get refunds should probably also call Sonny Vleisides' probation officer in order to let him know about the situation.  BFL changing customers' order statuses to "shipped" in order to fool the customer and/or paypal is clearly fraudulent.

His probation officer DOES read this forum. I'm sure a couple or months ago, Sonny gave him some line of bullshit, but the PO is no fool, and Sonny doesn't pay his wages. The last thing the PO wants to do is not act, for if something transpires after September 15, 2013, he'll want to make sure his ass is covered. Ain't that right, Sonny's PO?

[PuertoLibre]

The hedging allegation from BFL is a smokescreen.

FTFY.

Read this "Boohoo, I'm being molested on the interwebs" post.

He he listing the very 4 data that could just make the trolling stop, once and for all.

Listing this information would be VERY easy for them, probably MUCH less a hassle than posting pay dates.
How would it not be easier to know how many units they ship per day, rather than check the pay date for the last shiped unit of the day?

So they are clearly, actively, spending energy to keep the smoke screen up.

Correct, people are waking up to that fact.

Notice that he didn't provide any data points to increase useful information. Instead he attempted to discredit the person that was making a valid point. To increase doubts in the minds of many that the argument presented is useless.



As you can see from the image above, he is fully aware that the catch22 truth is unavoidable. An ungodly number of their customers will be on the losing end of this deal.

This is a massive signal that BFL is aware of the problem and don't give a damn. They have their customers trapped anyway.

As long as everyone believes they really are trapped, their printed toilet paper disclaimer allows them to basically get away with entrapping customers funds.

------------------------

Read my lips, BFL is no longer viable. And if it still is, it won't be for very long.

[Xian01]

imagine the sweet irony if PP decided to "fire" BFL as a customer LOL!!!!!

[PuertoLibre]

So basically from a few BFL_Josh threads from the BFL forums I have come to the understanding that the Refund policy had to change because too many people were coming to grips (including myself) that BFL were not going to deliver. Deliver in time or not at all. The hedging allegation from BFL is a smokescreen.

Perhaps refunds were awarded on a case by case basis depending on how you paid. If paid by paypal well no because there are now too many refund requests (obviously) and Paypal would shut down BFL's Paypal account due to excessive refunds.

Can anyone confirm they just recently (after No refund declaration from BFL) that they have easily gotten a refund for a BTC payment?

From PayPal's point-o'-view, isn't a good faith refund, no matter how many, better in their eyes than 100's of customers complaining via their refund/fraud department. The results are virtually the same--refunds paid.

If PP ToS states that no funds are to be used for the development of a product, and BFL clearly states that that's what the pre-order moneys are destined for, an automatic refund via PayPal should be granted without any further review.

LOL PG, I noticed this in the various rules PayPal stipulates a company must abide by.

I am glad someone else noticed it as well.

[PuertoLibre]

Someone on BFL Blogs appears to not be able to use Paypal to pay BF Labs inc. anymore?


rjthom1@msn.com - 08-07-2013 05:17 PM

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    I was trying order a miner today. I had the money transferred over to paypal last week.
    Paypal it appears is no longer accepting BFL.

    Any Comment ?

    Thanks

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_jody/267-saturday-miscellaneous-answers-page8.html

I'm not going to test the theory but interesting if it were true.

Fucking fantastic if it's true! PayPal finally listened. Shut these bastards down!

Does this mean that PayPal has revoked their account? I am quietly optimistic that they finally figured it out.

Also, does this mean that previous PayPal buyers won't be able to get their refunds through PayPal anymore if their account is suspended/terminated??

[PuertoLibre]

People struggling to get refunds should probably also call Sonny Vleisides' probation officer in order to let him know about the situation.  BFL changing customers' order statuses to "shipped" in order to fool the customer and/or paypal is clearly fraudulent.

Apparently, she already knows.

Supposedly, she has been in contact with certain parties and does read the forums.

[Viceroy]

OOOOOOoooooo   ;-)

[Stack]

Also, does this mean that previous PayPal buyers won't be able to get their refunds through PayPal anymore if their account is suspended/terminated??

I'd say your chances of a refund are higher after a suspension. Because it means PayPal see there's a problem and because if there's a balance sitting there, BFL won't be able to move it away.

[millsdmb]

I'll bet you a BFL jalapeno* they have no balance in their Paypal account =P

*ships in 2-7 years

[Phinnaeus Gage]

I'll bet you a BFL jalapeno* they have no balance in their Paypal account =P

*ships in 2-7 years

Since BF Labs Inc. quit giving refunds after July 4, 2013, because they went into Full Production, producing 300-400 units a day, there was no need to keep a positive balance in their PayPal account. Ergo, any refunds via PP since then was out of their pocket if they couldn't claw back from Sonny Vleisides checking account, of which I'm pretty sure their bank is also not a happy camper. The only happy camper I'm seeing is Sonny Vleisides after he puts in a hard day jetskiing in the Ozarks. Life sucks for that guy! Josh's rainbow poodle is probably also a happy camper. And Jody's chickens. And the staff of 35 at Camp BFL who receive a handsome weekly paycheck off the backs of monumental assholes.

Happy Camping!

[Threader]

Inaba_Josh is conspicuously absent from this thread.

Wonder why he wouldn't want to discuss BFL's righteous position on refunds?

[vcsmith]

I'll bet you a BFL jalapeno* they have no balance in their Paypal account...

It took several days for my refund to process through PayPal, which I believe meant the PayPal refund had to be funded from their bank account.  My order was a small one, so the PayPal account had to be almost completely empty.

Of course I waited until the refund cleared before starting this thread.  

[Threader]

My family thanks you very much VCsmith for your thread and sharing information 

[vcsmith]

My family thanks you very much VCsmith for your thread and sharing information 

You're welcome. Let us know if you succeed.

[millsdmb]

I'll bet you a BFL jalapeno* they have no balance in their Paypal account...

It took several days for my refund to process through PayPal, which I believe meant the PayPal refund had to be funded from their bank account.  My order was a small one, so the PayPal account had to be almost completely empty.

Of course I waited until the refund cleared before starting this thread.  

As a seller who has unfortunately worked with a buyer using stolen credit card, I can tell you that the refund is not contingent on them funding it.

They will get a bill from Paypal for each person who gets a refund from a 0 balance account.

[ryanb]

on my dispute BFL replied as my items where shipped and they did not provide tracking number.

Also it says required action on my behalf when i click on the dispute there is nothing i can do there.

On the dashboard BFL marked the item as complete and refunded and on the claim they said they shipped it with no tracking number provided.

Any ideas what should i do at this point?

[vcsmith]

on my dispute BFL replied as my items where shipped and they did not provide tracking number.

Also it says required action on my behalf when i click on the dispute there is nothing i can do there.

On the dashboard BFL marked the item as complete and refunded and on the claim they said they shipped it with no tracking number provided.

Any ideas what should i do at this point?

Call PayPal. I've had better luck with phone calls than e-mails.

[LostDutchman]

on my dispute BFL replied as my items where shipped and they did not provide tracking number.

Also it says required action on my behalf when i click on the dispute there is nothing i can do there.

On the dashboard BFL marked the item as complete and refunded and on the claim they said they shipped it with no tracking number provided.

Any ideas what should i do at this point?

You mean that you have both been refunded AND had your order shipped?

[YipYip]

on my dispute BFL replied as my items where shipped and they did not provide tracking number.

Also it says required action on my behalf when i click on the dispute there is nothing i can do there.

On the dashboard BFL marked the item as complete and refunded and on the claim they said they shipped it with no tracking number provided.

Any ideas what should i do at this point?

Plain and simple in the world of paypal if there is no tracking number it does not exist
You mean that you have both been refunded AND had your order shipped?

[ryanb]

on my dispute BFL replied as my items where shipped and they did not provide tracking number.

Also it says required action on my behalf when i click on the dispute there is nothing i can do there.

On the dashboard BFL marked the item as complete and refunded and on the claim they said they shipped it with no tracking number provided.

Any ideas what should i do at this point?

You mean that you have both been refunded AND had your order shipped?

They did not give me refund and on the dispute they said it is shipped but they canceled my order.

They do that trick some customers think well they shipped it let me close the dispute and once you close it you cannot reopen it