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Author Topic: Bitmain launches the Z9 Equihash miner  (Read 36799 times)
Dr_Thrax
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May 04, 2018, 11:36:39 PM
 #201

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

In order to be more fast and power efficient, ASIC chips untill I now can only make one task following an only way. That is why I prefer GPUs with tech like CUDA and OpenCL, these tech allows you to make any task, any way, slower and more power to do the process, but you have versatility.
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May 04, 2018, 11:39:52 PM
 #202

^ he gets it. ASIC is a better option. Bitmain is the problem. Not the computer. Just need more companies. Which more and more are showing up these days. Bitmain wont be able to do this much longer.

Personally I prefer GPUs, the multi algo versatility, allows you to mine a wide variety of coins, hold it, and make so much higher profits that mining only 1 algo.
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May 04, 2018, 11:44:53 PM
 #203

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

They have money, motivation, smart people. That is it. They are not going to kill gpu mining. That idiot over at Ethereum Vitalik Buterin is going to kill gpu mining with PoS on ETH. Once those gpus shift... oh boy.

That is so wrong, Vitalik will kill ETH switching to PoS, and GPU mining will stay for a very long time, remember that GPU can mine a lot of algos, and can be created new ones to mine. That is not the same reality to ASIC devices.
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May 04, 2018, 11:45:05 PM
 #204

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

They have money, motivation, smart people. That is it. They are not going to kill gpu mining. That idiot over at Ethereum Vitalik Buterin is going to kill gpu mining with PoS on ETH. Once those gpus shift... oh boy.
Unless bitmain doesnt have new generation or faster ethereum asic(and they probably already have it or working on it)i mean they were selling first batch for 800$ so it must be cheap for them to make it no way gpu rigs can fight that.Once again entire world depends on how fast raven can fly Grin
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May 05, 2018, 12:18:20 AM
 #205

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

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May 05, 2018, 12:35:59 AM
 #206

The other thing that I think could happen is that companies will shift to FPGA's like Baikal uses and then when a fork happens to counter ASIC's they can analyze the fork and then push updates to the miners.  The mining manufacturer can still make money by charging for algo releases for the miners.  Would have to keep pushing new miners, you just push firmware updates. 

So while the shots have been fired across the bow at Bitmain with the moves to fork, I think it is likely the manufacturers are going to adapt and return fire with more adaptable hardware/software.  The war is going to escalate for sure. 
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May 05, 2018, 12:44:18 AM
 #207

That is so wrong, Vitalik will kill ETH switching to PoS, and GPU mining will stay for a very long time, remember that GPU can mine a lot of algos, and can be created new ones to mine. That is not the same reality to ASIC devices.

I know that GPUs can mine a lot of algos, I have over 100 of them. However, if you look at the hashing power on ETH as it disperses to other coins... the diff will be so high on those they won't be profitable. Vitalik will kill gpu mining. @Metroid will finally be correct.
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May 05, 2018, 01:04:25 AM
 #208

What PSU you are planning to run with this miner? I have an extra APW3++ for it, but it has such low power consumption that cheapish ATX PSUs should work out fine too. By cheap I don't mean bad quality one, but PSUs in 600-700W range are probably cheaper than APW3++ with shipping, taxes etc. Lower power ones don't necessarily have enough PCIe connectors.
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May 05, 2018, 01:35:49 AM
 #209

What PSU you are planning to run with this miner? I have an extra APW3++ for it, but it has such low power consumption that cheapish ATX PSUs should work out fine too. By cheap I don't mean bad quality one, but PSUs in 600-700W range are probably cheaper than APW3++ with shipping, taxes etc. Lower power ones don't necessarily have enough PCIe connectors.

I wasn't willing to spend BTC on a PSU, especially if I only need a low end psu as long as it has 4 PCI-e connectors. I have a left over 750w gold PSU from building GPU rigs that I am going to use.
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May 05, 2018, 01:44:34 AM
 #210

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => Centralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.
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May 05, 2018, 01:48:56 AM
 #211

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => decentralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

thats what i keep telling them, they seem afordable .. now just wait till everthing is asic only and watch the
high prices they start quoting you
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May 05, 2018, 01:51:47 AM
 #212

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => decentralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

we wont allow it though, I dump my ether as i mine it , Id do the same with zcash and invest and mine
monero and raven , as long as we stay true to the spirit crypto with our investments , support and hash
they cannot push us out
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May 05, 2018, 01:52:44 AM
 #213

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => decentralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

Things arent as decentralized as you think they are. The flaw in this argument is that people with money still own GPU warehouses, also causing this issue. All of the GPU coins have the same type of facilities as ASIC coin operations. There is literally no difference between the two. Peole with money, and the GPU mining pools own the hash. Pools literally tell people to stop mining on their pools to spread hashrate. The only issue here is a monopoly. Or just being a "cool kid" and not really understanding the issue. Do you not realize that GPU mining pools are causing the same problem? 3/4 of suprnova are GPU coins and they dominate networks. So how is suprnova different then bitmain as far as hashrate superiority?

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Marvell2
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May 05, 2018, 01:56:13 AM
 #214

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => decentralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

Things arent as decentralized as you think they are. The flaw in this argument is that people with money still own GPU warehouses, also causing this issue. All of the GPU coins have the same type of facilities as ASIC coin operations. There is literally no difference between the two. Peole with money, and the GPU mining pools own the hash. The only issue here is a monopoly. Or just being a "cool kid" and not really understanding the issue.

Again dumbass u are missing the point... anyone can run a gpu rig or two

80 percent of people cannot run asics due to the high startup cost, noise heat
and pre order nature.  Not to talk of the fact you cant go to your closest computer store to buy components
they all come from 1 region.

Are you this thick or are u paid by bitmain?
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May 05, 2018, 02:02:46 AM
 #215

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => decentralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch


ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

Things arent as decentralized as you think they are. The flaw in this argument is that people with money still own GPU warehouses, also causing this issue. All of the GPU coins have the same type of facilities as ASIC coin operations. There is literally no difference between the two. Peole with money, and the GPU mining pools own the hash. The only issue here is a monopoly. Or just being a "cool kid" and not really understanding the issue.

Again dumbass u are missing the point... anyone can run a gpu rig or two

80 percent of people cannot run asics due to the high startup cost, noise heat
and pre order nature.  Not to talk of the fact you cant go to your closest computer store to buy components
they all come from 1 region.

Are you this thick or are u paid by bitmain?
Watchew talkin' bout willis?  80 percent of people who spend 2K to build a mining rig cant spend 2K on an Asic?

Idk guy.   Bitmain isn't the only Asic producer.

Let's not be so douchey.  Cool   We're all in this together, Makaveli.
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May 05, 2018, 02:03:53 AM
 #216

Guy just wants to be an ahole. Dont bother. Anyone who says anything positive is a shill. Hes ridiculous to talk to. Baikal is worse. They ruined 6 algos in one machine. Hes just a cool kid that hates bitmain and only bitmain.

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May 05, 2018, 02:07:56 AM
 #217

I think we need to expand our vision and definition of decentralization.   It can change.   Things must improve/become more efficient/more secure.

Why isn't bitcoin such a failure since it went away from GPU mining?   It seems more stable than ever now.

Everyone has this concept that GPU = decentralized and Asic = centralized and I don't necessarily think that is the case anymore.
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May 05, 2018, 02:08:23 AM
 #218

Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => Centralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

Bitmain works with Texas Instruments. They make quality products and is a well established tech company.

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May 05, 2018, 02:08:51 AM
 #219

I think we need to expand our vision and definition of decentralization.   It can change.   Things must improve/become more efficient/more secure.

Why isn't bitcoin such a failure since it went away from GPU mining?   It seems more stable than ever now.

Everyone has this concept that GPU = decentralized and Asic = centralized and I don't necessarily think that is the case anymore.

Its not.

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May 05, 2018, 02:09:23 AM
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Cant stop evolution. ASIC are made for mining. More companies just need to get involved to make the products affordable. GPUs are crap to use for mining. Im constantly RMA'ing cards in large amounts. 7 this week alone. They ALWAYS break. Sucks if you have a big operation. What are people going to do. Fork every time a new ASIC comes out? This fight against them is unrealistic and petty. Companies need to embrace the tech, and solidify networks with better machines. The most vocal are the smaller miners. Sorry....People with money will run the industry. Dont hate a computer because a monopolizing company. You just look stupid hating an inanimate object thats just a calculator. When you can buy asics for the price/availability of GPUs, EVERYONE will use them. Anyone who is serious about mining will switch. Anyone who says they wont, are full of crap. GPUs need to be replaced. Texas Instruments are pioneers in this industry. Its funny, people talk crap about how bitcoin tech is old and useless, while GPUs are getting the same way. People are using power sucking AMD 2 series cards for mining FFS.  ASIC will be the future. All algos will have chips. Its natural computer evolution. It happens to EVERY computer. If anyone denies this fact, they are clearly not as smart as they are making themselves out to be. GPUs were a nice bandaid. Not a resolution.

what makes you think the ASIC you buy from Bitmain is any better in component quality?
You're missing one of the core feature of a crypto currency => decentralization.
ASIC might be affordable now but in few years the only ASICs manufactured will cost USD 20k => decentralization, hands down and soon you'll have only big corps controlling your crypto.

Anyone have some idea how the hell is bitmain made first ethereum asic and now for equihash,did they make some new chip that can be reprogramed?Yeah i get it that they made a lot of money last year and that can spend it on devs but i am more interested if there is new chip because it can probably be used on most algos and kill gpu mining Undecided Also good luck to those who got in on the first batch

ASICs are not reprogrammable only FPGAs are.

Things arent as decentralized as you think they are. The flaw in this argument is that people with money still own GPU warehouses, also causing this issue. All of the GPU coins have the same type of facilities as ASIC coin operations. There is literally no difference between the two. Peole with money, and the GPU mining pools own the hash. Pools literally tell people to stop mining on their pools to spread hashrate. The only issue here is a monopoly. Or just being a "cool kid" and not really understanding the issue. Do you not realize that GPU mining pools are causing the same problem? 3/4 of suprnova are GPU coins and they dominate networks. So how is suprnova different then bitmain as far as hashrate superiority?

A GPU is limited in hashing capability.  Also, there is a limit to which how many GPUs one can run in a warehouse.  storage space, cooling requirements, power, maintenance costs all add up.  
Even if a big corp owns multiple data centers they can't outrun millions of GPUs mining from a desktop/small rig
Regarding pools; they dominate networks because of the users of the pool.  But that dominance can be changed by users compared to big corps controlling stuff.



Watchew talkin' bout willis?  80 percent of people who spend 2K to build a mining rig cant spend 2K on an Asic?

Idk guy.   Bitmain isn't the only Asic producer.

Let's not be so douchey.  Cool   We're all in this together, Makaveli.


Check on pricing of the cryptonight ASIC miner.  12k was the markup price.  Now it's 2k.  If the coins didn't fork do you think they would've reduced the price?
Sure you get 220kH/s for 12k but this could also be 220kH/s for 60k?  Now how many would be able to shell out 60k if that was the only option available as an ASIC?
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