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Author Topic: {BFL} Here's a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOK at your Monarch!  (Read 46127 times)
Bicknellski
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May 07, 2014, 04:53:30 AM
Last edit: May 07, 2014, 06:33:32 AM by Bicknellski
 #161

Where did they get 1.5W/GH for KnCMiner from? Or 1.1 for AntMiner?

My October Jupiter is 1.2W/GH measured at the wall.
My AntMiner S2 is 1.0W/GH measured at the wall.

These are measurements I have made myself from equipment that I own and run.

Is BFL comparing estimated Monarch ASIC chip-level power draw in a low power mode (0.35W/GH), versus an exaggerated total-system draw at the wall for competitors?

Looks impressive on paper, but then I remember my Jalapeño was meant to run solely from a USB port, ie 2.5W, whereas the end product draws 35W (I own one and I measured it myself).

Perhaps we should save the power comparisons until some customers have their units and report back with real world at-the-wall power measurements.



And AntMiner uses the 55nm process node, not 28nm. BFL uses the 2 generation ahead process to win, it must be honorable.

Psst. AntMiner wins as it actually exists and ships tomorrow. (MAY 8th Shipping)

When comparing 28nm Rockerbox SP30s vs. 28nm BFL chips who wins then?

Who is shipping that 28nm first if you order today?  Spondoolies Tech.
Who will achieve their power numbers? Spondoolies Tech.
Who makes a cheaper $/gh unit? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has better on time delivery record? Spondoolies Tech.
Who is a more responsive company to question via email? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has a better in house design team? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has fewer lawsuits? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has a higher density unit? Spondoolies Tech.


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May 07, 2014, 05:22:03 AM
 #162

Man so glad I'm one of the people who have been refunded by BFL due to Sonny's recent
troubles and such....

But still the scam continues..here it the latest spam email like from BFL News
I got in my email..I should unsubscripe  now that I'm free with my (all to soon to end for others I'm afraid)
Full Refund from BFL (1 year and 20 days to get such) ...ahem ...er ..may i say...."whewwwwww"

here is the link to their latest scam attempt

http://us6.campaign-archive2.com/?u=5015fc3486176144c53751877&id=4cba49d604&e=7bb6242f2b

the mind boggles absolutely boggles

and imho...they will string this along as far as possible and one day it will just pull a 'gox' and declare bankruptcy

google the US regulators current method of dealing with fraud after the bank crisis...it is not to punish but to "FINE THE CORP"

Sad to say ..I think they are gonna 'walk' with a settlement and all their personal assets and  eclipse and all

by sacrificing BFL the equipment arm to the wolves....settle for $$$ the new white collar way to do the crime

hope I am incorrect....but they gotta have an exit strategy

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May 07, 2014, 05:27:13 PM
 #163

It would end quickly if people would stop acting as creditors for manufacturers.
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May 22, 2014, 12:00:08 AM
 #164


Update from josh

 Originally Posted by BFL_Josh View Post


[top]Monarch Update - 20 May 2014

[top]Rate this Entry

0 Comments 
 by BFL_Josh
 , 05-20-2014 at 11:02 PM (0 Views)

 I wish I could start this update by saying we are shipping... but we aren't quite yet. Believe me, it's just as painful for me as it is for everyone else. There's not a lot of update I can give at the moment, things are moving very fast and any information I post right now would be out of date inside of 24 hours.

 But a quick summary and bottom line will have to do:

 We have gone through several board revisions, moving towards a final revision. I had expected a final rev delivered to KC today, but some last minute resistor adjustments has delayed that until (hopefully) tomorrow (although they may be on the way to KC already). I wish I could convey the level of effort that is required to bring a board and a chip to life, but words just can't do the job justice I'm afraid. There are hundreds if not thousands of little things that need to be attended to that make a board and a chip viable and useful. They are all small things for the most part, but they all add up to a significant investment in time to get right.

 So the bottom line is we are very close... I don't know how close. I can put a time frame on it and risk being wrong or I can just say that we are working as fast as we possibly can to make this happen. We absolutely do not want to end up with boards or devices that arrive dead or half functioning or over heating or consuming more power than they should or parts falling off of them (these are all things that could easily happen if we ship bad hardware). I believe we will start shipping any day now ... as soon as we get a board that works to the level we believe is up to our standards of operation, we will have a large quantity of them roll off the line within 24 hours and we'll start the packing and shipping process after that.

 I will post a further update tomorrow once I've had a chance to go over in more detail with the engineering team on where we stand as far as the final rev and hopefully I'll have the latest (and last) board in the shop to test."

And today he post this pic on twitter


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May 22, 2014, 01:14:41 AM
 #165


Update from josh

 Originally Posted by BFL_Josh View Post


[top]Monarch Update - 20 May 2014

[top]Rate this Entry

0 Comments  
 by BFL_Josh
 , 05-20-2014 at 11:02 PM (0 Views)

 I wish I could start this update by saying we are shipping... but we aren't quite yet. Believe me, it's just as painful for me as it is for everyone else.

Yeah, everyone else would be in deep pain with 1000 bitcoins for a new house. Poor Joshie. You really are delusional.



Quote Bicknellski
   
   
Re: BFL Monarch - Delivery Dates
May 21, 2014, 08:13:38 AM
   
Reply with quote  #133
Nice that Josh could afford a 1000 BTC home right?

http://www.kmbc.com/news/Kansas-man-buys-Johnson-County-home-with-Bitcoins/26083128

You are welcome Monarch customers.
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May 22, 2014, 01:17:51 AM
 #166


Update from josh

 Originally Posted by BFL_Josh View Post


[top]Monarch Update - 20 May 2014

[top]Rate this Entry

0 Comments 
 by BFL_Josh
 , 05-20-2014 at 11:02 PM (0 Views)

 I wish I could start this update by saying we are shipping... but we aren't quite yet. Believe me, it's just as painful for me as it is for everyone else. There's not a lot of update I can give at the moment, things are moving very fast and any information I post right now would be out of date inside of 24 hours.

 But a quick summary and bottom line will have to do:

 We have gone through several board revisions, moving towards a final revision. I had expected a final rev delivered to KC today, but some last minute resistor adjustments has delayed that until (hopefully) tomorrow (although they may be on the way to KC already). I wish I could convey the level of effort that is required to bring a board and a chip to life, but words just can't do the job justice I'm afraid. There are hundreds if not thousands of little things that need to be attended to that make a board and a chip viable and useful. They are all small things for the most part, but they all add up to a significant investment in time to get right.

 So the bottom line is we are very close... I don't know how close. I can put a time frame on it and risk being wrong or I can just say that we are working as fast as we possibly can to make this happen. We absolutely do not want to end up with boards or devices that arrive dead or half functioning or over heating or consuming more power than they should or parts falling off of them (these are all things that could easily happen if we ship bad hardware). I believe we will start shipping any day now ... as soon as we get a board that works to the level we believe is up to our standards of operation, we will have a large quantity of them roll off the line within 24 hours and we'll start the packing and shipping process after that.

 I will post a further update tomorrow once I've had a chance to go over in more detail with the engineering team on where we stand as far as the final rev and hopefully I'll have the latest (and last) board in the shop to test."

And today he post this pic on twitter




Well we should not be surprised..here is a 'supposedly" 'tongue in cheek" video...Hitler rant on butterfly labs
from last august 2013...man if you read the subtitles he absolutely "nail them dead to rights" I mean it is now
May 21st 2014 and Josh has just said they have not a clue on how to get the card working"

anyway an oldie but a goodie ...but pay attention to the subtitles...boy...the guy must have a time machine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jYNMKdv36w

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May 22, 2014, 01:50:01 AM
 #167

http://www.kctv5.com/story/25568078/bitcoin-used-to-buy-500000-olathe-home look what your preorders bought...
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May 22, 2014, 03:22:58 AM
 #168


That is what Josh bought after failing to pay up on a 1000BTC bet he lost.
If Josh owed me $500K, I would promise half to whoever collected it.
Then I would eat popcorn and watch the fireworks  Grin

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May 22, 2014, 03:45:16 AM
Last edit: May 22, 2014, 03:58:35 AM by Bicknellski
 #169

You know that people have mentioned that the basic PCI style design they are going for may not be the right form factor to shove that much heat and power into. Remember it takes a lot to design an efficient cooling system for a GPU and that is what in essence they are designing. BFL is not Nvidia or AMD that is for sure. They may not find a solution to their problems and given they are 16 months into this now do you really expect them to keep going if they can't solve it? At some point they might have to throw in the towel and give up. The fact people are buying housing when a product like this is on the verge of failure is a telling sign not of confidence but of desperation and fear.

Radeon HD 7990 Further Delayed

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May 22, 2014, 03:57:30 AM
 #170

Posted by BFL_Josh
Monarch Update - 20 May 2014

So the bottom line is we are very close... I don't know how close.
Here's the best way to express how close:
Two WeeksTM

Or the new favourite:
RSNTM
(aka Real Soon NowTM)

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May 22, 2014, 04:03:09 AM
 #171

Posted by BFL_Josh
Monarch Update - 20 May 2014

So the bottom line is we are very close... I don't know how close.
Here's the best way to express how close:
Two WeeksTM

Or the new favourite:
RSNTM
(aka Real Soon NowTM)

Or first suggested delivery:
Shipping in November December 2013 TM
(aka The lie we tell everyone at the pre-order phase TM)


Added What You Accidently Omitted (AWYAO)

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May 22, 2014, 05:18:20 AM
 #172

I believe I know what is wrong with the Monarch.

It is so unbelievably fast, that it caused an error in reality. Therefore, the bug in reality has cause a looping error of "Two Weeks".

Currently the error in reality is being debugged by experts in the field of "deb-U-ggery". Please stay tuned to your local quantum flux forecasts.

[Email me if they start commenting out the statement "Two Weeks". You know, to prevent a very visible error at the very least.]

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May 22, 2014, 05:38:31 AM
 #173

Posted by BFL_Josh
Monarch Update - 20 May 2014

So the bottom line is we are very close... I don't know how close.
Here's the best way to express how close:
Two WeeksTM

Or the new favourite:
RSNTM
(aka Real Soon NowTM)

Or first suggested delivery:
Shipping in November December 2013 TM
(aka The lie we tell everyone at the pre-order phase TM)


Added What You Accidently Omitted (AWYAO)

So damn true it hurts.  

In August 2013 I nearly pulled the trigger on converting my heavily delayed 65nm order (3x 60 GH/s miners) into a Monarch order.  I literally had it up on the screen in front of me.  600 GH/s delivered in November/December 2013 was tempting... "we've got experience now, second ASIC, largely free of risk, we know all the pitfalls now" (see http://i.imgur.com/48BeJaG.png)... convincing sales talk...

...until I slapped myself back into reality and realised that this is BFL we're talking about... they NEVER hit their deadlines.  Never.  Ever.  In the History of the Planet.  Have they ever.  Hit.  A.  Deadline*.

* When it comes to delivering bitcoin mining hardware to customers (not just "review" units to a selected few).  I know for sure my order was severely delayed anyway... maybe I was the only one? Smiley

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May 22, 2014, 07:06:07 AM
 #174

You know that people have mentioned that the basic PCI style design they are going for may not be the right form factor to shove that much heat and power into. Remember it takes a lot to design an efficient cooling system for a GPU and that is what in essence they are designing. BFL is not Nvidia or AMD that is for sure. They may not find a solution to their problems and given they are 16 months into this now do you really expect them to keep going if they can't solve it? At some point they might have to throw in the towel and give up. The fact people are buying housing when a product like this is on the verge of failure is a telling sign not of confidence but of desperation and fear.

Radeon HD 7990 Further Delayed

this is back to my pessimistic post of the past..if they plan'd this scam right they have an end game...if they actually 'paid' for equip for personal use..eclipse paid for equip with legit paper trail..they did not hide any btc from the IRS all liability will fall on BFL the corporation....ie.....for a settlement with class action and or feds which is the norm now...they could say don't hold us liable for the corp problems  pay off them....and say ...see we show we bought the stuff for personal use and or as proper for the mining pool we run....
but get a 'pass' like the bankers in the economic crisis...keep personal assets to settle ...bankrupt the BFL corporation

feds get $$$ class action gets $$$ they get out of it with whatever personal equip miners they got developed/for them selves in the process wages/ perks whatever free and clear

even working in the above manner (ie legal) you always had equp ready to plug in you eclipse pool or personal miner as fast as you could make capacity to do so ..a slow vampire bleed of equip (paid legit) to all the investors/employees (nice to make a cover wth employees) personal pools run private...etc

they could have done all the above LEGIT ....and they would have still made more money then god

likely they had too much eqo..and the above is just my nightmare...but if they did do the above like i state as an 'end game" then well....they will be laughing their ass off at us here in 1/2 year when bfl corp goes bankrupt and they walk

but then again if they were that bright they would have STOPPED at the 65mm stuff...got out what they could say oct/nov....told everyone mining was too hard ...never had the monarch project..and wrap'd up the bfl corp bankruptcy then...refunds towards the end...much sorrow expresse etc etc....but they got to greedy and tried the same scam with the monarch imho they over reached...thus likely my nightmare scenario is just that a 'nigtmare'

so likely my idea that they will get away with it by using methods (above) the long scam...well hopefully it is just my paranoia

but man......as a scam I'm sure they had/have and end game plan...wtf is it .....could they have been so long term into this scam they have covered their tracks?

anyway the above is what gives me the shudders..they will walk with a settlement and get away with it all..personal assets completely safe including eclipse mining pool

again above is my worst case scenario don't ya know

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May 28, 2014, 01:35:21 AM
 #175

How Late is the Monarch?

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May 29, 2014, 01:16:31 AM
 #176

HOW LATE IS THE WASP?!?

I do not suffer fools gladly... "Captain!  We're surrounded!"
I embrace my inner Kool-Aid.
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May 29, 2014, 01:26:23 AM
 #177

Love the idea behind them but BFL now is a no go and by the time you get them or they say shipping. OH SORRY MORE DELAYS 2 MORE WEEKS. If they had the equipment they would be shipping out just like the rest of the legit company's out their. BFL are far from legit. Just because they shipped a handful of units out don't make them 100% legit and having hundreds of thousands of orders in pre orders still. Good luck BFL in your future.  I don't see it lasting much longer.

=
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May 29, 2014, 01:36:58 AM
 #178

When comparing 28nm Rockerbox SP30s vs. 28nm BFL chips who wins then?

Who is shipping that 28nm first if you order today?  Spondoolies Tech.
Who will achieve their power numbers? Spondoolies Tech.
Who makes a cheaper $/gh unit? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has better on time delivery record? Spondoolies Tech.
Who is a more responsive company to question via email? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has a better in house design team? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has fewer lawsuits? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has a higher density unit? Spondoolies Tech.

It's not really fair to say it's a good idea to preorder from spondoolies regardless of their track record so far.

There is a good chance spondoolies next gen is delayed and the fact they can sell tested/competed hardware without delays doesn't demonstrate their ability to go from new chips/hardware to working product without delays.

Just say no to preorders.
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May 29, 2014, 01:47:47 AM
 #179

It's not really fair to say it's a good idea to preorder from spondoolies regardless of their track record so far.

You're right, the comparison isn't fair. BFL, who is always late, vs. Spondoolies, who has never been late.

Buy & Hold
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May 29, 2014, 02:06:42 AM
 #180

When comparing 28nm Rockerbox SP30s vs. 28nm BFL chips who wins then?

Who is shipping that 28nm first if you order today?  Spondoolies Tech.
Who will achieve their power numbers? Spondoolies Tech.
Who makes a cheaper $/gh unit? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has better on time delivery record? Spondoolies Tech.
Who is a more responsive company to question via email? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has a better in house design team? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has fewer lawsuits? Spondoolies Tech.
Who has a higher density unit? Spondoolies Tech.

It's not really fair to say it's a good idea to preorder from spondoolies regardless of their track record so far.

There is a good chance spondoolies next gen is delayed and the fact they can sell tested/competed hardware without delays doesn't demonstrate their ability to go from new chips/hardware to working product without delays.

Just say no to preorders.

Agreed. NO PREORDERS EVER.

However I personally broke that rule. I could get horribly disfigured taking the risk. But if you were to make a choice vs BFL vaporware and ST version the SP30 I am putting my $ where I think it might reasonably pay off. Cheaper, more likely at this time to ship to you. That is the point. We all agree BFL is non starter and by comparison ST might be worth it. Also you can always buy their SP10 IN STOCK if you don't want to the wait for the biggest hash rate lowest power numbered SP30. Either way BFL is a joke.

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