{BFL} Here's a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOK at your Monarch!

[ElGrandJefe]

Yup, I've been through multiple GPU rigs, asicminer usb sticks, 65nm BFL stuff, a bunch of Antminer S1s and S3s and I knew beforehand that I would be kind of suckling off Satan's anus or at least dead demon's teats when mining with the Monarchs. I asked for it!

But after all the initial confusion I think soon I'm done here. I'm fine with their performance, noise and the power consumption. I'll still do some testing when I have the time and wait for the units to piss on my carpet, then overheat and burn my house down. If that doesn't happen, then I'm pleasantly surprised.

If you want your house burned down, you need to buy a Black Arrow X-3.

[xstr8guy]

Yup, I've been through multiple GPU rigs, asicminer usb sticks, 65nm BFL stuff, a bunch of Antminer S1s and S3s and I knew beforehand that I would be kind of suckling off Satan's anus or at least dead demon's teats when mining with the Monarchs. I asked for it!

But after all the initial confusion I think soon I'm done here. I'm fine with their performance, noise and the power consumption. I'll still do some testing when I have the time and wait for the units to piss on my carpet, then overheat and burn my house down. If that doesn't happen, then I'm pleasantly surprised.

Don't worry about the angry mob, lol. Obviously there are Monarchs in the wild and people are actually mining with them, myself included. So please continue to share your experiences so others may learn from you or perhaps offer some help.


Countdown to shill accusations in... 3... 2... 1

[ComaWombat]

Don't worry about the angry mob, lol. Obviously there are Monarchs in the wild and people are actually mining with them, myself included. So please continue to share your experiences so others may learn from you or perhaps offer some help.

Indeed the few people who own Monarchs should feel a bit obligated to share their experiences and that's why I'm here. When I wrote "I'm soon done" I meant that I was done with the intensive troubleshooting and testing phase. There's no real need for it as I've reached a certain comfort zone. No imminent danger in sight. Maybe I should replace the coolant with holy water just to be sure.

[xstr8guy]

Don't worry about the angry mob, lol. Obviously there are Monarchs in the wild and people are actually mining with them, myself included. So please continue to share your experiences so others may learn from you or perhaps offer some help.

Indeed the few people who own Monarchs should feel a bit obligated to share their experiences and that's why I'm here. When I wrote "I'm soon done" I meant that I was done with the intensive troubleshooting and testing phase. There's no real need for it as I've reached a certain comfort zone. No imminent danger in sight. Maybe I should replace the coolant with holy water just to be sure.

Lol!

I hate to say it, in fear of jinxing myself, but my two 700GHs Monarchs have been quite reliable. That is, once I figured out for myself (no thanks to BFL) that only the custom BFGMiner 4.2 works at all... and aimed fans at the boards.

Now if I could just find someone who has Monarchs working with an rPi. It's utterly ridiculous these days to have to use a PC as a controller.

[Lassi]

Yup, I've been through multiple GPU rigs, asicminer usb sticks, 65nm BFL stuff, a bunch of Antminer S1s and S3s and I knew beforehand that I would be kind of suckling off Satan's anus or at least dead demon's teats when mining with the Monarchs. I asked for it!

But after all the initial confusion I think soon I'm done here. I'm fine with their performance, noise and the power consumption. I'll still do some testing when I have the time and wait for the units to piss on my carpet, then overheat and burn my house down. If that doesn't happen, then I'm pleasantly surprised.

Don't worry about the angry mob, lol. Obviously there are Monarchs in the wild and people are actually mining with them, myself included. So please continue to share your experiences so others may learn from you or perhaps offer some help.


Countdown to shill accusations in... 3... 2... 1

By all means let us not stop you from "praising" BFL and their products you are certainly making it very clear that these things are unsupported and fraught with disaster unless you have the requisite skills or a direct line like Lightfoot / Mr. Teal to support from Bruce and others in BFL. Mining is pretty much dead anyhow small scale so watching a few Monarchs mine after adding on hundreds of dollars in extras and hours and hours of support from the BFL defacto service team is simply an education in the lengths BFL is willing to go to support a narrative that they are some how here to help the community with their product. All one has to do is compare BFL with companies that actually ship on time and provide customer support in real time.

What have you spent in time and money so far to get one miner working to the specifications that BFL promised originally in 2013? We obviously can see that the size of the unit and configuration is not data center ready by any means compared to plug play units from the competition that do not require intensive care to run or water cooling.

[xstr8guy]

Yup, I've been through multiple GPU rigs, asicminer usb sticks, 65nm BFL stuff, a bunch of Antminer S1s and S3s and I knew beforehand that I would be kind of suckling off Satan's anus or at least dead demon's teats when mining with the Monarchs. I asked for it!

But after all the initial confusion I think soon I'm done here. I'm fine with their performance, noise and the power consumption. I'll still do some testing when I have the time and wait for the units to piss on my carpet, then overheat and burn my house down. If that doesn't happen, then I'm pleasantly surprised.

Don't worry about the angry mob, lol. Obviously there are Monarchs in the wild and people are actually mining with them, myself included. So please continue to share your experiences so others may learn from you or perhaps offer some help.


Countdown to shill accusations in... 3... 2... 1

By all means let us not stop you from praising BFL and their products. Mining is pretty much dead anyhow small scale so watching a few Monarchs mine after adding on hundreds of dollars in extras and hours and hours of support from the BFL defacto service team is simply an education in the lengths BFL is willing to go to support a narrative that they are some how here to help the community with their product. All one has to do is compare BFL with companies that actually ship on time and provide customer support in real time.

What have you spent in time and money so far to get one miner working to the specifications that BFL promised originally in 2013? We obviously can see that the size of the unit and configuration is not data center ready by any means compared to plug play units from the competition that do not require intensive care to run or water cooling.

I'm well aware of what the competition offers, lol. Of my current 10THs home setup, only 1.4THs is manufactured by BFL. I have gear from Bitfury, KNC and Bitmain as well. I haven't had to spend additional money to get my Monarchs running since I had fans and PSUs leftover from other retired rigs.

And yes, I'm also aware that home mining is dead. I've made dozens of posts on that very topic. I'm in the last days of mining with my 1w/GHs gear and will only have three S3s and two Monarchs running soon. And I know I will never have a positive ROI on the Monarchs. They are the last miners I will ever purchase. I had an early first day preorder and I simply wanted the machines. I know it's not rational, lol. I'm stubborn that way and I love mining gear so I'm not apologizing to anyone for my silly purchase. I did refund a later order though.

You're mistaken if you think I'm praising BFL and their products. Is it just because I said my Monarchs were stable? I've been very critical of BFL as my post history will most likely show. I'm overjoyed that the FTC stepped in! But I'm also "lucky" to have received my order, had compensation cloudhashing for several months and had to wait less than a month for a refund on my other order. I feel bad for those who are now stuck in limbo.

[Lassi]

We know you know the score given your posts. Others do not seem forthright.

Let us hope the FTC starts dispensing refunds.

[ComaWombat]

Now if I could just find someone who has Monarchs working with an rPi. It's utterly ridiculous these days to have to use a PC as a controller.

I would be one of them although I'm running them on Ubuntu 14.04 and Windows right now. But I do have cgminer 4.6.1 configured for running two Monarchs on rPi/raspbian OS.

There was a thread about running BFL stuff on rPi but I don't think I've read it. I like to bang my head against a wall and try things myself. Then maybe rtfm and correct the mistakes if needed.

So to put the long story short is:

a) install raspbian on an SD card, use google and RTFM if necessary
b) don't configure and install a GUI, just stay with the command line stuff
c) google howtos about installing cgminer on Linux and do the same, but make sure to get cgminer 4.6.1
d) configure cgminer with "--enable-bflsc" flag
e) compile cgminer
f) run cgminer: sudo ./cgminer
g) configure the pools
h) plug in the Mofarchers
i) profit

Make sure cgminer has write access to cgminer.conf so the changes made are really saved in the file. I'm a Linux noob so this is a very rudimentary "howto".

An extra step would be to install a web server and copy the "miner.php" file from the cgminer folder to the public server folder and then enable api/network access in the cgminer.conf. Then you could access your mining stats anywhere in the world.

[ComaWombat]

Oh, and cgminer 4.6.1 on Windows is fine, too. Just use "zadig" software to change the BFL SHA256 drivers to "winusb" and they'll work perfectly.

[sbogovac]

Now if I could just find someone who has Monarchs working with an rPi. It's utterly ridiculous these days to have to use a PC as a controller.

I would be one of them although I'm running them on Ubuntu 14.04 and Windows right now. But I do have cgminer 4.6.1 configured for running two Monarchs on rPi/raspbian OS.

There was a thread about running BFL stuff on rPi but I don't think I've read it. I like to bang my head against a wall and try things myself. Then maybe rtfm and correct the mistakes if needed.

So to put the long story short is:

a) install raspbian on an SD card, use google and RTFM if necessary
b) don't configure and install a GUI, just stay with the command line stuff
c) google howtos about installing cgminer on Linux and do the same, but make sure to get cgminer 4.6.1
d) configure cgminer with "--enable-bflsc" flag
e) compile cgminer
f) run cgminer: sudo ./cgminer
g) configure the pools
h) plug in the Mofarchers
i) profit

Make sure cgminer has write access to cgminer.conf so the changes made are really saved in the file. I'm a Linux noob so this is a very rudimentary "howto".

An extra step would be to install a web server and copy the "miner.php" file from the cgminer folder to the public server folder and then enable api/network access in the cgminer.conf. Then you could access your mining stats anywhere in the world.

I made a tutorial on running (Technobit and) BFL stuff off of rPi's, check the link in my signature... But that was on the 68nm stuff (I was early enough to allready have my Monarch "investment" refunded...)

Good luck!

[ComaWombat]

What have you spent in time and money so far to get one miner working to the specifications that BFL promised originally in 2013? We obviously can see that the size of the unit and configuration is not data center ready by any means compared to plug play units from the competition that do not require intensive care to run or water cooling.

I'll hijack this question right here and answer it myself.

So I got 1.4 TH/s with the two Monarchs right now. They cost 590 euros combined including postage. I already had PSUs for them. In comparison I could get a second hand Spondoolies SP10 1.4TH for a thousand euros right now in Finland. I already had four Antminer S3s but sold three of them for roughly a thousand euros.

Yes, I'm sure the Spoony SP10 is data center ready and more reliable. But I've heard it sounds like a jet engine. The Monarchs pack way way more power per unit compared to an Antminer S3. They are more quiet than an Antminer S3. The water cooling is a GOOD thing if it doesn't break or leak and you don't have to pay extra for it. Many PC enthusiasts would love to have water cooling for their cpus and gpus.

So for a hobbyist and a home miner a Monarch can be just fine if you can get it for a right price and it doesn't break down. For a datacenter the Molly is surely quite unreliable and wonky crap. And yes, btc mining profitability sucks for everybody right now so you really would need to get the miners for free to make any decent profit.

[lightfoot]

*nod* I'd agree, the Monarch is not going to work very well in racks in a data center. The more I watch reports of failures, and the more I think about it, the more I see that the big failure here is that it's throwing heat in 3 directions:

• There's the heat coming off the radiator on the end. A lot, but well managed; it blows out and away.
• There's the heat coming from the back of the board. Also a lot, but going sideways.
• And there's the heat coming off the tops of those FETs. Just drifting off the other side.

That's probably the killer: If you put a monarch next to another monarch, the heat from the back of one set of fets blows onto the front of the one next to it. Making those fets hotter. And then next one you put down is going to get even hotter air blown on it from the neighbors. Eventually the FETs overheat, conduct, and short out. Or they throttle a lot and run slow. But with limited heat transfer ability I could see a top fet overheating before the temp sensor on the bottom picks it up.

I think that's the #1 problem with these things (technically): If you don't have some air flow, a heat sink is nothing but a metal blanket on a part. And heat sink efficiency depends completely on the difference in temp between the part and the ambient air temps. Blow hot air on a FET with a heat sink and it's not going to work. Blow air front to back, and you will just cavitate the air on the back heat sink (essentially fighting with the fan), and totally miss the tops of the FETs (due to the water block).

Top to bottom fans would be better, but then you need to move the heat into the hot aisle with baffles or something. And the bottom of the tray will limit the air flow. But in any case, the bottom FETs are going to get hotter and conduct more than the top ones. Which will result in the bottom ones conducting too much, going into thermal runaway, and boom.

The second thing is a basic problem: Those FETs are just packed in too damn close. On the Singles you had six FETs in a small area, but then you had board space for the heat to dissipate. Here you have 18 FETs on one side, the 18 on the other between two of the hottest things on the board and the FET drivers in the middle (which generate heat because they have to switch the gates under a 24-1 voltage ratio). There's just nowhere for the heat to go but out the back, and the high density means that a lot of heat needs to be moved off the board quickly.

The back heat sink doesn't get too warm, which sounds nice except that it means the thermal transfer from the board to the sink is limited. That's why the FETs went to 100c while the heat sink on the back was cool to the touch. A front fan fixed that, but still not optimal if you have more than one Monarch.

Kind of reminds me of the singles: Putting half the FETs on the ends of the board was a good idea. But putting the other half in the center of the board, between the heat sinks for the chips, was a bad idea. That's why you could either run them like banshees with full fans in the cases, or more quietly if you took them out of the case and put a single fan blowing air in from the *side* against those center heat sinks.

Ug.

I'm getting a blown one in tomorrow, shorts power supplies and the pump was leaking, I'll post what I find as I fix it. Could just be a shorted FET, if so removing the fets on that side should get half of it going and putting on a new FET should fix it. We'll see.

Actually if this one's plumbing is bad as well I might try to splice in one of the sedion water blocks I used on a jally and put that on the back of the board while purging the water loop. Then *all* of the heat would go to the radiator and out, that might do it. Or just put a water block with it's own radiator on the back and see what happens to the FETs on the front.

Hm.

[ComaWombat]

Yeah, it baffles my mind how they were ever trying to extract 1 TH out of the card when the 700 GH is so close to crapping itself even with no heat sources close to it.

But I have a suggestion for the 1 TH Ultra Imperial Supermonarch (MSRP $4500).

A huge machined copper slab of a water block which covers the entire surface of the card including the VRMs. And the air cooled heat sink in the center should be replaced with another copper slab with heat pipes connecting it to the main water block. Then add an external water pump, a bigger radiator and a fan.

And there you have it! No heat soak and radiation all over the place. And it only costs an arm and a leg or maybe all of your limbs.

[Lassi]

I'm getting a blown one in tomorrow

BFL supplying you that one?

[wrb2010]

I'm getting a blown one in tomorrow

BFL supplying you that one?

I can answer this one. Nope.

[lightfoot]

The broken monarch came in under the "just donate the repair cost to a food bank" program :-) 500gh unit, small heat sink on the back, leaking water system, shorted out unit.

Sure enough it was leaking even on the trip over, and when I shake it I can hear the water sloshing in the radiator (which means it is not full, and ain't gonna work). Need to talk to the user about opening the loop and purging it.

However I think I see the problems: One is that it's not leaking around the pump it's leaking *inside* the pump block, specifically by the left flexible fitting. That's really odd.

And the FETs on the left side are shot. We can tell because of the 0 ohm resistance at the +12 power plugs (short) and the 0 ohm readings on the gates on one side with 50 ohm readings on the other side's gates. Simple enough, parts on the way.

Hm. I'm going to clean this up and take some pics to see if that's where the problem really is. Running with the radiator upside-down allows it to run with less than 100% water so I can see it leak.

[ComaWombat]

Good news everybody! And bad news for everybody whose Monarch has already exploded, leaked, warped or burned due to overheating. BFL started giving away instructions how to underclock those things so they have a smaller chance of self-destructing:

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/the-monarch-discussion/8787-how-do-we-overclock-monarchs-post87154.html#post87154

On hindsight it's mindnumbing to think that everybody would have been able to freely underclock and undervolt their Monarchs instead of running them super hot.

BTW, I used the commands through the usb/serial interface as I'm running cgminer instead of bfgminer. And I could have used those commands all along, right from the start, had I known them. Jeez... But better late than never.  

[noddy2000]

Good news everybody! And bad news for everybody whose Monarch has already exploded, leaked, warped or burned due to overheating. BFL started giving away instructions how to underclock those things so they have a smaller chance of self-destructing:

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/the-monarch-discussion/8787-how-do-we-overclock-monarchs-post87154.html#post87154

On hindsight it's mindnumbing to think that everybody would have been able to freely underclock and undervolt their Monarchs instead of running them super hot.

BTW, I used the commands through the usb/serial interface as I'm running cgminer instead of bfgminer. And I could have used those commands all along, right from the start, had I known them. Jeez... But better late than never.  

Just turn it off and keep it as a reminder not to be fooled again In the future by scumbag unempathetic cockroaches and put it on the shelf as the auniment it is!

Sorry but anyone ordering off bfl after the 65nm, nevermind the fpga's I have no sympathy for. Greed over doing a little research. April 2012 I called them out but got ridiculed a d banned from here because josh was paying them $1000's a month as he's in bed with the scammer theymos who owns this site. Josh even scammed on glbse with theymos lol.

Noticed its dead around here these days. Good

[ComaWombat]

Just turn it off and keep it as a reminder not to be fooled again In the future by scumbag unempathetic cockroaches and put it on the shelf as the auniment it is!

I'm one of the guys who told other people that preordering Monarchs was like russian roulette with five rounds in a six-shooter. It turned out to be russian roulette with a fully loaded semi-automatic, but I don't care as I bought them second hand at +30% Ant S3 price and they're far far better than S3s.

[noddy2000]

Just turn it off and keep it as a reminder not to be fooled again In the future by scumbag unempathetic cockroaches and put it on the shelf as the auniment it is!

I'm one of the guys who told other people that preordering Monarchs was like russian roulette with five rounds in a six-shooter. It turned out to be russian roulette with a fully loaded semi-automatic, but I don't care as I bought them second hand at +30% Ant S3 price and they're far far better than S3s.

Until it blows! Bfl are dead! No ones going order from them anymore (unless you support unempathetic pathological liars).

Its called morals. I know, most people (especially here) lack any!