[ActiveMining] Official Shareholder Discussion Thread [Moderated]

[drawingthesun]

Look, if you're Ken why would you keep this company going?  He should pay off the refunds, follow the MSD instructions, and then liquidate the rest of the company.  Shareholders will get nothing because they are only supposed to get profit shares.  There are no profits.  Ken will take what he gets from the mining farm and liquidation money and retire on that.  

There is no reason to bother with trying to make a 28nm chip.  For what?  The market is saturated with miners and mining chips that are already for sale and most of those chips don't even move.  Asicminer has 60 ph worth of chips.  KNC, Black Arrow, BFL, Cointerra, Spondoolie, it goes on and on...  Hash Fast is one of soon-to-be-many casualties because there aren't enough miners to support that many chips.  

If Ken was really going to have a mining chip in Q3, he wouldn't be given out refunds.  He'd be telling customers, "You can wait until September and get your miner."  

If Ken is smart, he'll deal with the legal stuff and then close up shop.  He can exit this thing with some money in his pocket and none of his personal wealth being taken from him.  It's all win for him.  Minus the reputation from a few disgruntled anonymous people on a website forum.

Oh for sure. It's highly likely Ken has at least a million from this venture. And he paid himself and other family members a nice wage too. Good guy.

[theMiracle]

Look, if you're Ken why would you keep this company going?  He should pay off the refunds, follow the MSD instructions, and then liquidate the rest of the company.  Shareholders will get nothing because they are only supposed to get profit shares.  There are no profits.  Ken will take what he gets from the mining farm and liquidation money and retire on that...

Ken was instructed by MSD to refund his shareholders.  It's irrelevant what the (illegally issued) shares represent.
Not sure if some sort of civil case (exposing Ken's personal assets) could be built on top of the MSD ruling, and doubt that Ken is foolish enough to have serious assets on paper, but worth a thought.

[tempestb]

Look, if you're Ken why would you keep this company going?  He should pay off the refunds, follow the MSD instructions, and then liquidate the rest of the company.  Shareholders will get nothing because they are only supposed to get profit shares.  There are no profits.  Ken will take what he gets from the mining farm and liquidation money and retire on that...

Ken was instructed by MSD to refund his shareholders.  It's irrelevant what the (illegally issued) shares represent.
Not sure if some sort of civil case (exposing Ken's personal assets) could be built on top of the MSD ruling, and doubt that Ken is foolish enough to have serious assets on paper, but worth a thought.

Right exactly, pay off the people who want refunds for their share purchases.  The others who don't want to get a refund will end up with nothing after Ken liquidates the company.  Their shares don't entitle them to anything but profits and there are none.  So it's either refund or get nothing.  I don't see why Ken would bother trying to do anything else.  The market is too crazy right now to even attempt to make a chip and sell it.  He's got himself a nice little mining farm that he can run or sell off and probably has a lot of people who gave up on ever getting a refund and won't likely see that form on the website.  So he'll get to keep their money as well. 

Again, it's all win for Ken to just liquidate and move on.

[NotLambchop]

@tempestb:  Sorry, I misunderstood.  We pretty much agree.

[knybe]

...
There is no reason to bother with trying to make a 28nm chip.  For what?  The market is saturated with miners and mining chips that are already for sale and most of those chips don't even move.  Asicminer has 60 ph worth of chips.  KNC, Black Arrow, BFL, Cointerra, Spondoolie, it goes on and on...  Hash Fast is one of soon-to-be-many casualties because there aren't enough miners to support that many chips. 
...

this is why NOBODY should put absurd faith in this company anymore. This train has sailed.

if ACTM was ever going to be successful, it should have happened at the end of last summer. Once that was missed by a long shot, so was any hope for anything relevant coming from a Ken Slaughter venture.

All things considered, I guess he did pretty well… for himself.

[knybe]

...
Mining at 100th.
...

Such pro.
Very mining.

exactly, this is a farce.

[RoadStress]

@Bargraphics ...

[kroy101]

Is there any legal way those that got shares not directly from the company at IPO but from trading at btct or bitfunder could get a (partial) bitcoin refund?

I never intended to pay this baboon's retirement when I sailed good 9 BTC to his venture. I guess Im still in denial, haven't yet contacted the law firms, should I? non-IPO share holder, non USA citizen... what are my chances I get a single penny out of this shitstorm?

[JoTheKhan]

Is there any legal way those that got shares not directly from the company at IPO but from trading at btct or bitfunder could get a (partial) bitcoin refund?

I never intended to pay this baboon's retirement when I sailed good 9 BTC to his venture. I guess Im still in denial, haven't yet contacted the law firms, should I? non-IPO share holder, non USA citizen... what are my chances I get a single penny out of this shitstorm?

You are as entitled to a refund as the IPO investors. Don't let any one who is not a lawyer (except for Ken's lawyer, I would ignore him if he appears too) and is not a part of the MSD investigation to tell you otherwise.

[thehun]

So... what's the process now to request refunds for our shares? Is it necessary to contact the lawyer the US?

[zumzero]

Is there any legal way those that got shares not directly from the company at IPO but from trading at btct or bitfunder could get a (partial) bitcoin refund?

I never intended to pay this baboon's retirement when I sailed good 9 BTC to his venture. I guess Im still in denial, haven't yet contacted the law firms, should I? non-IPO share holder, non USA citizen... what are my chances I get a single penny out of this shitstorm?

You are as entitled to a refund as the IPO investors. Don't let any one who is not a lawyer (except for Ken's lawyer, I would ignore him if he appears too) and is not a part of the MSD investigation to tell you otherwise.

If you bought 9 btc worth of IPO shares at 0.0025 that's 3600 shares you own.
If you bought 9 btc worth of IPO shares at 0.0005 that's 18,000 shares you own.

Some people are throwing around the figure of $0.05 per share as the refund but I dont know where they got this from.  Actually Ken increased the price from 0.0005 to 0.0008 during the initial IPO.

Anyway,  going by the above figures, you could expect to make between $180 and $900.  When you consider this relatively low sum, ones wonders if there's a chance that more money could be made from holding out for dividends as they are paid in bitcoin.

[wasubii]

^^Pahahaha

Dividends!

Pull the other one mate!

Dividends from what? Selling rack mounting rails?

[zumzero]

How about you stop ridiculing and grow up.  There is more than one opinion in here and it serves everyone to be able to read those ideas and thoughts which are not in keeping with the majority.  Minorities have been right in the past.  The truth is we don't know what plans Ken may or may not have for future business.  Your assumption that there is no future is your opinion and not a proven fact.

[Bargraphics]

Is there any legal way those that got shares not directly from the company at IPO but from trading at btct or bitfunder could get a (partial) bitcoin refund?

I never intended to pay this baboon's retirement when I sailed good 9 BTC to his venture. I guess Im still in denial, haven't yet contacted the law firms, should I? non-IPO share holder, non USA citizen... what are my chances I get a single penny out of this shitstorm?

The impression that the MSD gave me was that it shouldn't matter when you purchased your shares. They will try to get restitution for everyone that was deceived by Ken.

Restitution is still being figured out but I highly recommend contacting the MSD and getting all relevant information to them that way you are all set once everything is decided and if you choose to stay with Ken at that point you simply wouldn't take the offer.

Here's some information for you:

_______________________________________________________________________

MSD Info:

Shawn Hagerty
Investigator
Missouri Secretary of State, Securities Division
600 W. Main St., Box 1276
Jefferson City, MO  65102
573-526-3901
573-526-3124 (fax)
shawn.hagerty@sos.mo.gov

Scott Johnson
Investigator
Missouri Secretary of State, Securities Division
600 W. Main St., Box 1276
Jefferson City, MO  65102
573-751-4704
scott.johnson@sos.mo.gov

Missouri Securities Contact Information Page

Wood Law Info:

http://www.woodlaw.com/cases/virtual-mining-corporation-and-active-mining-corporation
888-237-0999
1100 Main Street, Suite 1800, Kansas City, Missouri 64105
1736 E. Sunshine Street, Suite 209, Springfield, Missouri 65804

[bitdog101]

Is there any legal way those that got shares not directly from the company at IPO but from trading at btct or bitfunder could get a (partial) bitcoin refund?

I never intended to pay this baboon's retirement when I sailed good 9 BTC to his venture. I guess Im still in denial, haven't yet contacted the law firms, should I? non-IPO share holder, non USA citizen... what are my chances I get a single penny out of this shitstorm?

You are as entitled to a refund as the IPO investors. Don't let any one who is not a lawyer (except for Ken's lawyer, I would ignore him if he appears too) and is not a part of the MSD investigation to tell you otherwise.

If you bought 9 btc worth of IPO shares at 0.0025 that's 3600 shares you own.
If you bought 9 btc worth of IPO shares at 0.0005 that's 18,000 shares you own.

Some people are throwing around the figure of $0.05 per share as the refund but I dont know where they got this from.  Actually Ken increased the price from 0.0005 to 0.0008 during the initial IPO.

Anyway,  going by the above figures, you could expect to make between $180 and $900.  When you consider this relatively low sum, ones wonders if there's a chance that more money could be made from holding out for dividends as they are paid in bitcoin.

@zumzero... Ken himself said it...

For someone trying to convince everyone to hang on, I would of assumed you knew all the facts... or at least have read the previous posts by Ken himself...

Ken,

At this time, I would be willing to sell the shares I bought from you for .0005 bitcoin each.
I bought just 1000 additional shares on Crypto-Trade recently, but let's just talk about the shares I bought in the original IPO.
Please explain how we shall do this.

The easiest way would be for you to just let me transfer the shares and then you multiply that amount by .0005 and send the bitcoin to an address I will provide.

How long do you think this process will take?

Lorenzo Money

He needs about 20Mill usd to reimburse everyone. In 45 days that could be higher. Maybe he's making it up as he goes along again? This seemed to come from a phone call interview and he didn't even know about this secretary of state ruling so he was put on the spot and under pressure so maybe he got it wrong?

Not if he reimburses in fiat and not bitcoin.   

Hash Fast tried that but it was ruled illegal?

Just worked it out just incase. He will need 3.1 Million USD to reimburse 10 Mill shares at 0.0025 with BTC price at $125 which it was when most people bought in? But again people who bought in at 0.005 when btc was $600 would push the total up to 6Mill USD?

Ken raised about $1,000,000 from the sale of all shares. 

No he raised X BTC, nobody here wants the useless USD.

10 Million shares where not sold at .0025 BTC, the tenders shares will be valued at their original purchase price of .0005 BTC @ ~$100 USD.  The shareholder will have to prove that they purchased the shares from Active Mining not from someone else.

All sharesholders wanting a refund will need to provide their ID information to the Missouri Securities Division.  The shareholders will have to transfer the shares back to Active Mining.

A long time, 15 days for our offer to get approved, if it is ok on the first revision, then 45 days for the offer, then 120 days for the payment.  I have not seen the final order yet, this is based on what I have last seen.

You will be getting ~$.05 X number of shares purchased plus 8% interest from the time of your purchase on the original IPO.

[zumzero]

I had already read that post.  In fact I read almost every post.  There has been some discussion and debate about the figure put forward by Ken and I couldn't recall where it originated or who came up with the figure at the time of writing.  As you can see it was StuartUK who first offered a price per share for reimbursement.  This made Ken chime in with his interpretation.  Anyway, that doesn't matter as the actual figure will be released in due course.  

Also, you are mistaken if you think I'm trying to convince anyone to hold on.  I have nothing to gain from people holding on.  In fact, if I hold on then perhaps I would benefit from most people returning their shares to Ken.

No.  What I'm doing is offering up the other side of the bitcoin.  As much as Blahgraphics, the self appointed MSD spokesman, wants you all to jump in bed with the US Gov before deciding to stick with Ken or not, I am pointing out that once you're in bed with the US Gov there IS no jumping out and would ask people to consider whether or not they think waiting for an official renumeration package announcement THEN making a decision to jump in bed with the US Gov or not is preferable.

Everyone has different priorities.  There are many in the Bitcoin community who would value privacy and anonymity over whatever money might be reclaimed from a bad investment.  I'm not here to tell you what to do.  Blahgraphics does that.  I'm here to voice my minority opinion and represent those who feel the same way.

The impression that the MSD gave me was that it shouldn't matter when you purchased your shares. They will try to get restitution for everyone that was deceived by Ken.

Restitution is still being figured out but I highly recommend contacting the MSD and getting all relevant information to them that way you are all set once everything is decided and if you choose to stay with Ken at that point you simply wouldn't take the offer.

This is simply wishy-washy language based on supposition.  There is zero evidence to support what is being said here and this conjecture is at odds with the same Bargraphics who insists that some posters make baseless claims without any supporting facts or figures.  Pure propaganda.  But why?

[Bargraphics]

I'm here to voice my minority opinion and represent those who feel the same way.

Yes the self appointed "minority spokesman".

There are many in the Bitcoin community who would value privacy and anonymity over whatever money might be reclaimed from a bad investment.

There are also those out there that have chosen their path to stay with Ken and will say anything to stop others from hurting this company. Unfortunately your threats are empty and the US Gov doesn't give a shit about your pillow money that you blew on a bad investment and didn't report to the IRS.

As I said before Zum, anyone that is scared of the US Gov won't contact the MSD so your posts are pointless. Anyone that simply doesn't have the information will benefit from other shareholders providing the contact information to them.

Guys like me will go down with the ship

Edit:

OK .. so here's what this Ken Slaughter con artist did to me: ordered 10 of Fast-Hash One Gold Rush boards when they advertised 30 to be available in stock.

Three weeks later today, there's the usual no response. E-mails, messages on the order trail, their voicemails, you name it. Zilch. All demanding a refund or the equipment.

The bastards are just a bunch of con artists, and I have to admit I've been conned.  Still .. I've been around the world and in business long enough to not let anyone get away with even a single ounce of my gold, let alone $8,722.00 in cash.

So here's what I'm doing: contacted the Missouri Attorney General's office, who advised that this is a C 7 felony in Missouri, which carries a maximum prison sentence of 7 years.

I've also contacted a law firm in Missouri to bring criminal proceedings against these crooks; I don't care if it ends up costing $100K - I will see these bastards behind bars or get my money, damages and interest in full.

If anyone's interested in joining and has credible evidence (I know I do), then PM me.

Another "bump in the road".....

Oh and the mine is down to ~72TH at the time of this posting - http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/userstats.php/1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa

[wasubii]

How about you stop ridiculing and grow up.  There is more than one opinion in here and it serves everyone to be able to read those ideas and thoughts which are not in keeping with the majority.  Minorities have been right in the past.  The truth is we don't know what plans Ken may or may not have for future business.  Your assumption that there is no future is your opinion and not a proven fact.

Although i do mock (its hard not to, because you are just sooooo cutie wutie) but my post does contain a serious question. Perhaps you, in your infinite wisdom would like to answer it:

Dividends from what? Selling rack mounting rails?

[CoinHoarder]

Ordered 2 Hash Fast Ones on 8/6/2013, no hardware ever arrived, and I've been waiting over 3 months for a refund.

Something is seriously wrong here. I suggest everyone that invested in this venture to get out while they still can.

Unfortunately, I can't wait any longer as this hardware was ordered as part of a group buy and I need to look out for the people that invested in the hardware with me. I also contacted Wood Law with my information.

I gave VMC a warning via their support system that I would go to a lawyer if my refund wasn't processed (as that worked for me before with HashFast.. they magically sent a unit a couple days later.) I never got any response from that message, and I also received no response to my original refund request either, only an email after both support requests saying "your message has been received."

[BlackFlag]

@CoinHoarder try this one...

Virtual Mining Corporation

Bitcoin Pre-Order Refund Agreement


I hereby agree for my pre-order equipment ordered from Virtual Mining Corporation paid is USD or bitcoins to be refunded to the bitcoin address below converted at the current coinbase.com buy price at the time the refund is issued.  I agree that this will be a full repayment of Virtual Minings obgation to you.  Refund will be processed within 7 business days.

Name:
Address:
City:
State:
Country:

Order ID:
Order Date:
Total amount of order in USD:
Bitcoin Refund Address:

I hereby agree the above terms:

_________________________________
Signed

_________________________________
Print Name

_________________________________
Date


Sign and scan the above agreement and email to btcrefunds@virtualminingcorp.com