Lauda, MinerJones, Blazed | Missing escrow funds

[Bothebu]

People think the 1400 BTC in Escrow are not high enough and that lauda stole from the altcoin funds,
But they simply dont wanna do math thats all so i help a bit.

At first i wanna write that these numbers arent 100% accurate becaus i doesnt exactly know how many altcoins really got converted at start its just an estimate with this in mind.
This calculation shows how much Altcoins lost in value compared back than with the value now Left the value in btc when we invested right side the value now.

in BTC

LTC: 131.806919857 now 70.544134084
XRP: 143.421843806 now 59.4388254915
ETH: 792.971309565 now 298.760281758
MAID:149.88903042 now 29.1265901
DASH:136.835085363 now 44.8986655922
WAVES:52.1873061717 now 10.1257557693
DOGE: 25.6991926573 now 8.7235791589
ETC: 31.3899723712 now 8.2679004029

Total: 1464.20066 now 529.885732357

btw. 529btc + 1590(direct BTC Invest) =2119 btc
around 600 btc to tonbi so we are at 1519 btc
75 btc to nemgun we are at 1445 btc
minus the fees for the escrow around 1400 btc
looks completly normal to me..


I repeat the numbers are not 100% precise becaus i dont know the exact number ton got or nemgun or how much fees its just an estimate to show everyone that 1400btc isnt far of.

All the alt coins were converted to BTC last year after the ICO...total investment was 3055 BTC per a post from Lauda.

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[1714153546]

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[The Sceptical Chymist]

Please excuse my severe, untreated attention deficit--I did not read the details of this thing, but I want to ask if it was ever made clear what the fate of the bitcoin cash was going to be.  I'm not taking any sides on this one because I don't have enough info yet (though I'm reading these arguments from both sides), but my understanding is that it's controversial at best whether the forked coins stay with the sender or the receiver of the actual bitcoin, unless this was made clear at the beginning.

There was some controversy about this before, IIRC, and I remember aTriz had kept all the bitcoin cash in a campaign that he was running at the time the fork happened, again, if I recall correctly.  I think I remember that happening and that someone made a stink about it, but I believe that either aTriz or the project developer kept the bch and either way that the campaign participants did not receive the bch. 

You could argue that if the terms state that you get XBTC for your participation, that shouldn't include the forked coin.  I get that.  I'm curious as to what the consensus is about this; what Lauda thinks; what other members think; and if it was mentioned in the terms of this thing.  I don't think it's way off-topic.

[DotNetApp]

All the alt coins were converted to BTC last year after the ICO...total investment was 3055 BTC per a post from Lauda.

Nope not true , they did not got converted last year.
The Post from Lauda back than was only the conversion rates so everybody could calculate how much nvst he will get it never states that they directly convert the alts to btc
and they didnt convert them.

[Bothebu]

All the alt coins were converted to BTC last year after the ICO...total investment was 3055 BTC per a post from Lauda.

Nope not true , they did not got converted last year.
The Post from Lauda back than was only the conversion rates so everybody could calculate how much nvst he will get it never states that they directly convert the alts to btc
and they didnt convert them.

I think Lauda is the person to answer that question.  It should be fairly simple question to answer as well as how much is in all of the accounts.  Awaiting that answer.
 

[suchmoon]

You could argue that if the terms state that you get XBTC for your participation, that shouldn't include the forked coin.  I get that.  I'm curious as to what the consensus is about this; what Lauda thinks; what other members think; and if it was mentioned in the terms of this thing.  I don't think it's way off-topic.

It wouldn't have made sense to claim the BCH at the time of the fork as it would have been a potential security risk to manipulate the private keys holding 1000+ BTC.

It wouldn't make sense for the escrow to keep (or ignore) the BCH after the refunds are issued and the escrow wallet is no longer used. The risk is no longer there and there is a substantial value in BCH and it certainly doesn't belong to the escrow. The escrow could charge a substantial fee for the trouble (and to avoid having to deal with dust forks) but the coins should be distributed.

[Lauda]

But they simply dont wanna do math thats all so i help a bit.
-snip-

Thanks. You did indeed help.

People think the 1400 BTC in Escrow are not high enough and that lauda stole from the altcoin funds,

Which is nonsensical because I never had access to the other altcoins (exc. used to have for DOGE; now locked on bittrex).

All the alt coins were converted to BTC last year after the ICO...total investment was 3055 BTC per a post from Lauda.

Which is nonsense that I have never said. Unfortunately, they were not all liquidated instantly (had they been, there would be more money to repay).

The Post from Lauda back than was only the conversion rates so everybody could calculate how much nvst he will get it never states that they directly convert the alts to btc
and they didnt convert them.

Here comes the merit party.

It wouldn't make sense for the escrow to keep (or ignore) the BCH after the refunds are issued and the escrow wallet is no longer used.

Disagreed, as I always have on the fork debate (especially in cases where ToS/policies covers this beforehand). Although discussing the principles of forking would be swaying away from this accusation. The real problem (documentation-wise) is the exchange account. This thread is just a joke, i.e. a distraction by some of the involved parties (in order to delay exchange access, vote, refund).
Even though the funds that are on it aren't significant in comparison (mostly part of what was last released to nemgun), they should be pooled back and having access restored would enable us to build a proper chain of events (with little to no vagueness). That said, nemgun keeps delaying this with various excuses. Today is the final day.

[Bothebu]

Lauda,

Please answer:
How much was distributed?
How much is available to refund?   

Thank you.

[Bothebu]

As far as the conversion of ALT coins to BTC, I see that the post NEVER stated that they were converted.

So, Lauda, Blazed and Miner Jones.  As the escrow agent of ALL coins, and in the interest of TRANSPARENCY, please answer the following:

How many of each coin are still in escrow?
Were any converted to another coin?, If so, when and how much was converted and the exchange rate.
How much was distributed and to whom (amounts, dates, and coin type)?
What kind of docummnetation did the founders provide to prove that each milestone was achieved that triggered a distribution?
Please provide addresses to verify this information.

As escrow agent you hold a fiduciary responsibility to the investors.  If you continue to not answer these questions that is considered a breach of your fiduciary responsibility.

Thank you.

[allahabadi]

Please excuse my severe, untreated attention deficit--I did not read the details of this thing

I think u shud Please read the post Fuck-ur-sis-racist; before jumping in like a paw-licker...

but I want to ask if it was ever made clear what the fate of the bitcoin cash was going to be.

Even if it wasn't; no excuse for the escrows to claim it... I'm not saying they did...

There was some controversy about this before, IIRC, and I remember aTriz had kept all the bitcoin cash in a campaign

So now Lauda will be going the aTriz way; well I wouldn't be shocked... Way to go Lauda (Not saying s/he will)... But if aTriz did keep so much money; why the fuck ain't he paying snakey any soon and crying about it...

You could argue that if the terms state that you get XBTC for your participation, that shouldn't include the forked coin.  I get that.  I'm curious as to what the consensus is about this; what Lauda thinks; what other members think; and if it was mentioned in the terms of this thing.  I don't think it's way off-topic.

Finally talking sense... But looks like everyone conveniently ignored u...

[suchmoon]

It wouldn't make sense for the escrow to keep (or ignore) the BCH after the refunds are issued and the escrow wallet is no longer used.

Disagreed, as I always have on the fork debate (especially in cases where ToS/policies covers this beforehand).

If you mean ideological (de)merits of bcash etc - that doesn't really matter. There is a significant value in those coins that was not foreseen (I'm assuming) at the time when the escrow took control of the funds and the client(s) want (I'm assuming) to get those coins.

If my assumptions are correct then the client(s) did not have a choice - e.g. to choose an escrow with a more favorable view towards forks - and there was no way to have a ToS reflecting that so the escrow should make a reasonable effort to accommodate the client(s). What would be the reason not to?

Although discussing the principles of forking would be swaying away from this accusation.

It's among the many accusations in the OP and one that seems to have some basis in fact. Other stuff would have to wait for:

Even though the funds that are on it aren't significant in comparison (mostly part of what was last released to nemgun), they should be pooled back and having access restored would enable us to build a proper chain of events (with little to no vagueness). That said, nemgun keeps delaying this with various excuses. Today is the final day.

[hulla]

If an audit was done 300-900 btc wouldn't be missing

Nothing is missing.

If nothing is missing why cant you publicly prove that?

I understand how you feel cause it hurt deep like knife when ones invest in a project which is somehow died and yet to collect back the fund invested but you still need to calm either because the forum is watching and interfering into the situations. However, Madam Lauda said they are working on it.

[endlasuresh]

Lauda,

Please answer:
How much was distributed?
How much is available to refund?  

Thank you.

I will answer
How much was distributed?  All the funds that is 3000 BTC
How much is available to refund?    0

It really shocks me that Lauda is major scammer where he lied all that on aTriz accusations, and I believe we should file a case to the Crotian Police.

[vlom]

What is the multisig address that the escrow funds were being held in?  It should be public, and each withdrawal should be able to be accounted for and described by Lauda as well as the 2nd signer for the multisig wallet.  These are pretty basic requirements for an escrow and the blockchain exists as a public record to check/balance what these individuals are claiming.  There should be no room for questioning, especially when this amount of funds are involved.

i would like to know this too. but until now Lauda refused to post this.

this is "endless" and i don't have the time to check all the transactions.....

Why exactly would you care where the money is going to or coming from as long as the amount (as per milestones) is there? You would waste your own time trying to trace it all, especially since altcoin addresses aren't public.

the wallet (354jirex7gkFxMiNmN45SxyMxSUsdGcrsf) in OP is empty.
3,091 btc

There was never 3091 BTC. This is why random individuals shouldn't try to do audits..

OK. not 3091 BTC. But BTC: 1590.919664 + Altcoins => Total BTC raised (at these exchange rates): 3055.120324

The time-stamp for the conversion rates is: 19:00 UTC - 28/06/2017.
The total funds raised per currency:
BTC: 1590.919664
LTC: 7807.588
XRP: 1325280.390
ETH: 6477.095
MAID: 765482
DASH: 1916.643
WAVES: 31145.630
DOGE: 23577240.970
ETC: 4126.090
Conversion rates per currency into BTC*:
BTC: 1
LTC: 0.01688190
XRP: 0.00010822
ETH: 0.12242700
MAID: 0.00019581
DASH: 0.07139310
WAVES: 0.00167559
DOGE: 0.00000109
ETC: 0.00760768
Total BTC raised (at these exchange rates): 3055.120324
Total USD raised at the BTC-USD price (Bitstamp): 7790556.826
This means that any price changes for you, as an investor, no longer matter. You can use these numbers to estimate the number of tokens that you will receive.

[OgNasty]

Lauda,

Please answer:
How much was distributed?
How much is available to refund?  

Thank you.

I will answer
How much was distributed?  All the funds that is 3000 BTC
How much is available to refund?    0

Given the available information and claims, I think that is the only reasonable assumption at this time until proven otherwise.  I don't understand why the funds haven't been moved to a multisig address and a message signed proving their existence.  At this point, the lack of transparency appears to be willfully disobedient by the escrow agents claiming to be in control of these funds, and worthy of forfeiture of their escrow fees.

What is the multisig address that the escrow funds were being held in?

How did the funds end up on Bittrex?

I'm still waiting on answers for the first two questions in this thread.  This appears to be the old 'incompetent or scammer' situation.

[vlom]

I just want to know how much was distributed by you.  Surely this is an easy question for you to answer since you control the BTC funds.

That's an entirely different question from 'seeing the accounting'. Follow the first address or wait for me to wake up again; whichever is easier for you.

Also, I assume the forks of Bitcoin Cash will be distributed back to members.

No. Everything will be sent in BTC.

If you could kindly post the amount when you have a moment I would apprecite it.  Thank you.
So the Bitcoin Cash was converted to BTC?  When was that done?

regarding the forks i "know" this:

[allahabadi]

Even I don't keep track of alts I've sold... (Not saying someone did; just me )  

[endlasuresh]

What is the multisig address that the escrow funds were being held in?  It should be public, and each withdrawal should be able to be accounted for and described by Lauda as well as the 2nd signer for the multisig wallet.  These are pretty basic requirements for an escrow and the blockchain exists as a public record to check/balance what these individuals are claiming.  There should be no room for questioning, especially when this amount of funds are involved.

i would like to know this too. but until now Lauda refused to post this.
u will receive.

He will never answer correctly, in the past Lauda told that he don't belong to ALU services, now he seriously tell I don't own Escrow Services.

I havent seen Theymos  who never take care of these forums.

[Deena]

He will never answer correctly, in the past Lauda told that he don't belong to ALU services, now he seriously tell I don't own Escrow Services.

I havent seen Theymos  who never take care of these forums.

Enough proofs have been provided in the past that Lauda scams or at least practises thing for which all normal users are tagged with negative trust. Unfortunately there are a bunch of high placed members who seem to profit from Lauda's scams and they keep backing him (making themselved fellow scammers).

I have asked Theymos for attention regarding this situation but got ignored. The only thing I read him post is that he was irritated about how DT trust was centralized. However he does not interfere. I also pointed out how this forum is not being ruled by clear principles but by patchwork here and there. I guess it'll be a money thing or otherwise a lack of philosophical insight. But the normal and honest users are being victimized on this forum by this principleless government with its olichargic bunch of scammers, led by Lauda.

I tell you; even when rock hard proof is provided in this thread that Lauda was scamming, other DT members will still refuse to stop supporting him. It happened before. That's why Theymos actually should interfere.

[Anduck]

I tell you; even when rock hard proof is provided in this thread that Lauda was scamming, other DT members will still refuse to stop supporting him. It happened before.

It happened here and happened before? Rock hard proof? Could you please gather and link sources for this? Thanks.

[Deena]

It happened here and happened before? Rock hard proof? Could you please gather and link sources for this? Thanks.

Sure buddy. Here's an example I posted myself: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2829282.