Posting in forums with moderators who give no smerit? Solutions?

[bones261]

<…> If someone presses on the +merit, but has no smerit to give, then it gives the user the option to "report to merit sources." <…>

I don’t think it would work. What is there to stop every active user on the forum to report load of posts, getting into the nearly impossible situation where the queue would have a size similar to all the posts being created? (I’ve exaggerated it a notch, but that is what would happen I figure, unless lots of restrictions are set in place to somehow avoid abuse and troll report of candidate posts in large numbers).

Besides, for it to work similar to the regular reports, it would require for the Merit Sources to have a similar uniform criteria: if one proposed post is marked bad (i.e. does not deserve merit), then none of the other Merit Sources could merit it.

Well, it would naturally need some restrictions. If it were to be implemented, it would have to restrict the functionality to Jr members and above to mitigate sybils. Also, I think rather than a merit source having the option to mark something as "bad," it would give the merit source the option to "report to moderator." That way, if someone is trying to pass off insubstantial, off-topic, plagiarized posts etc. of their alt accounts, those posts will get reported to the moderators instead for proper action. If a merit source simply doesn't think a post deserves merit, they can simply mark it as unhandled and move on. Perhaps after x number of merit sources mark the post as unhandled, it will get removed from the queue entirely. Also, perhaps limit an account's ability to use this function to once every 24 hours.
As I stated in my previous post, this probably won't get implemented. It's just a suggested solution. I'm very curious where all these unicorns are hanging out that make really good posts, yet go neglected.

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[cryptohunter]

Of course there is a legitimate excuse reason why a merit history can look like that. I have no doubt you will be able to explain it all in a way that sounds reasonable and convincing (to you anyway).

Such shiny goalposts. Are these new by any chance?

Of course there are reasons. Like using the post history page and/or tabs and/or bookmarks and/or any other methods merit sources use to do their job. I guess it's a good sign that this is all you can come up with in your crusade.

It is apparent that you're unwilling/unable to face the fact you make ludicrous statements so it is easier for you to deny you made them even though they are there in black and white. That's fine. Ignore my questions/posts directed to you and just jump to other posts you feel more comfortable engaging.

Nothing wrong with opening up your pals post history  and shovelling merits into it every few seconds. Never said there was. That sounds as you say far more fun than naturally reading the forum and meriting good posts that you happen to come across from a wide spectrum of good posters.

No crusade simply assisting you make sense of the merit system.

I don't mind spending time discussing things with you at all but try to remain calm, and be open to changing your opinions if observable events dictate it is required. Also if you say something you later realise is ludicrous do not deny you said it or ignore any later reference to it just say okay I realise that was a crazy thing to say actually and that is no longer my opinion.

[suchmoon]

No crusade simply assisting you make sense of the merit system.

I have 50 sMerits I need to send. Since I can't make sense of the merit system can you tell me which posts I should merit?

[cryptohunter]

No crusade simply assisting you make sense of the merit system.

I have 50 sMerits I need to send. Since I can't make sense of the merit system can you tell me which posts I should merit?

That would be like asking your math tutor for the answer to the test you have been set.

I will observe closely to see if you are doing well or there is still room for improvement.

Read over this thread a few times and I almost feel confident you will be able to handle it alone in the mid to long term.

Also just worth a small mention... you know how that guy likes to just fire up bitcointalk and open up his buddies list to shoot off a few early morning merits within a few seconds. Well, don't be like that. Don't fire up bitcointalk look for my latest posts and just decide to shoot off a few aggressive comments or some ludicrous fantasies in my direction. Give others a chance to enjoy talking to you. I don't feel you should focus all your positive energy towards me. I mean it will be nice to hear from you now and then of course. This is not a rejection.

[suchmoon]

No crusade simply assisting you make sense of the merit system.

I have 50 sMerits I need to send. Since I can't make sense of the merit system can you tell me which posts I should merit?

That would be like asking your math tutor for the answer to the test you have been set.

Not really, I'm just trying to coerce you into giving up those unicorn unmerited-better-than-0.13% posts that you've been harping on for a few pages.

I'm starting to think that no such thing exists. Looks like I'll have to send those sMerits the old-fashioned way - to the 800 friends.

[bones261]

No crusade simply assisting you make sense of the merit system.

I have 50 sMerits I need to send. Since I can't make sense of the merit system can you tell me which posts I should merit?

That would be like asking your math tutor for the answer to the test you have been set.

Not really, I'm just trying to coerce you into giving up those unicorn unmerited-better-than-0.13% posts that you've been harping on for a few pages.

I'm starting to think that no such thing exists. Looks like I'll have to send those sMerits the old-fashioned way - to the 800 friends.

Well, the next time you see a rainbow, you could try running really fast or get in your car to go even faster. When you reach the end of the rainbow, I'm sure you will find them there. 

[suchmoon]

No crusade simply assisting you make sense of the merit system.

I have 50 sMerits I need to send. Since I can't make sense of the merit system can you tell me which posts I should merit?

That would be like asking your math tutor for the answer to the test you have been set.

Not really, I'm just trying to coerce you into giving up those unicorn unmerited-better-than-0.13% posts that you've been harping on for a few pages.

I'm starting to think that no such thing exists. Looks like I'll have to send those sMerits the old-fashioned way - to the 800 friends.

Well, the next time you see a rainbow, you could try running really fast or get in your car to go even faster. When you reach the end of the rainbow, I'm sure you will find them there. 

Yeah but that's gonna take more than 28 seconds

[Foxpup]

However when I notice a merit history like this

Today at 13:50:34: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: account blocked today over a year old and 1500+ posts
Today at 13:50:00: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: What's happening with Bitcoin losing more than 10 per cent of its value?
Today at 13:49:32: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: What is this forum for?
Today at 13:49:00: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: Trust abuse! Injustice! Fake trust by winter! Much butthurt I am!
Today at 13:48:33: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: Is the new ERA of merit dying again?
Today at 13:47:59: 3 to The Pharmacist for Re: DT1 list alternation: add me on it
Today at 13:47:16: 3 to The Pharmacist for Re: I need merit badly

.

Imagine 28 seconds between naturally browsing the board (not searching for your fav merit buddies at all just per chance your machine accidentally flys from you buddies post to his next one deserving more merit) reading the post (in full context of the thread)digesting it deciding on a sensible merit score and then just leaving that thread (cos it got boring after reading merit buddies post) and browsing the board naturally again (not searching for merit buddies)and finding another great post (just pure chance it is same buddy posting again) to read in the middle of a thread reading it and deciding on another senisble merit score. This just happening over and over.

Then they tell me --- if i happen to cross a good post I merit it simple as that. It's not like I just go searching for my merit buddies posts and taking 28 second or 30 seconds average to just plaster more merits to them.

edit  there is a 27 second one too... those 28 second ones are simply inefficient discovery/evaluation/rewarding incidents.

Foxes do not perceive time in the same way that humans do. I do not expect you to understand the madness to my method, but the fact is that I (or someone who looks very much like me) really did find these posts naturally while browsing the forum, and there is a perfectly rational explanation involving time travel that is probably beyond your comprehension.

The vast bulk of his merits are given out to a few people.

Code:

3835 Merit sent by Foxpup (#55384) to 220 unique users in 1496 transactions

I know that's not as many as 800, but what can I say? I'm just not a very outgoing person, that's all. Most time travellers aren't.

Why are you bothering suchmoon with my merit history anyway? If you've got a problem with it, you can take it up with me.

[suchmoon]

Why are you bothering suchmoon with my merit history anyway? If you've got a problem with it, you can take it up with me.

Can you imagine the shitstorm if cryptohunter found out that The Pharmacist is a member of the Vulpine Order of Merit. Oops, sorry.

[cryptohunter]

Why are you bothering suchmoon with my merit history anyway? If you've got a problem with it, you can take it up with me.

Can you imagine the shitstorm if cryptohunter found out that The Pharmacist is a member of the Vulpine Order of Merit. Oops, sorry.

This did not escape me.

Foxpup offered up what I consider a reasonable (by meta club standards) explanation regarding time travel.  I accept that here at meta club one needs to adapt to these alternative realities where good posters from a group of 99.87% of the board are akin to unicorns where as within the the 0.13% they are impossible to avoid. Obviously my jealousy over the box of foxpup deadly ass fog must have been clouding my judgement. Nothing to see here.

As ever Foxpup is attentive to the thread and gives it the usual 2 second glance over (which I appreciate could be many eons in his time) and does not notice I have no interest in even talking to suchmoon - he seems to unable to hold a conversation since he forgets he has said things only moments earlier. You're not dragging him around in your time machine are you. Poor guy seems very confused.

Bones can't read either so it becomes difficult to get a sensible conversation going.

loyce just makes random statements then will not provide any evidence or even explanation of what he means.

PT well he just agrees with anything suchmoon incorrectly states.

fox pup well we know he is very generous to his merit club buddies and gives out great prizes (to them) but as yet we have not tested his debating skill. Of course with time travel at his disposal this is going to be very interesting. I am worried about getting on his bad side though he may send suchmoon back in time to when I was more vulnerable. I only ask you put him in those special clothes that don't get burned off in the transition.



So far we have

"most" pre merit legends are spammers

good posters from 99.87% of the board are unicorns.

Take what up with you fox pup? there is nothing to take up. You enjoy giving merit to your friends. You enjoy giving out great prizes. Carry on I don't have an issue with it. If you are enjoying yourselves what is that to do with me?

The issue is claiming merit is some objectively applied reward based on some set of criteria where all posts get equal chance of review. It simply is not that. Nothing more to say.

Fun though discovering new friends along the way.

[suchmoon]

good posters from 99.87% of the board are unicorns.

unicorn unmerited-better-than-0.13% posts

Very subtle difference there but such an expert as yourself should be able to spot it.

The issue is claiming merit is some objectively applied reward based on some set of criteria where all posts get equal chance of review.

No, the issue is still your extensive use of fallacies to justify your bullshit.

Nobody claims to review all posts nor is that needed. There is no need to review bounty reports and other garbage. There is no need to micromanage the merit system at the level of each individual post. What matters is that in the long run good posters will tend to accumulate more merits than shitposters and that part seems to be working.

Feel free to let us know about those unmerited good posts any time.

[Foxpup]

As ever Foxpup is attentive to the thread and gives it the usual 2 second glance over (which I appreciate could be many eons in his time) and does not notice I have no interest in even talking to suchmoon - he seems to not unable to hold a conversation since he forgets he has said things only moments earlier. You're not dragging him around in your time machine are you. Poor guy seems very confused.

Since you have no interest in talking to suchmoon, I'd advise you to stop doing it. Repeatedly doing things that you have no interest in can be very psychologically stressful. The only one who seems confused here is you.

fox pup well we know he is very generous to his merit club buddies and gives out great prizes (to them) but as yet we have not tested his debating skill.

If we're going to make this a debate, perhaps you would care to present some evidence that those in my "merit club" are in fact my "buddies". I hardly know any of them at all, and there are a few whom I suspect I would greatly dislike if I did get to know them (though I'll refrain from mentioning names to avoid hurting anyone's feelings). I certainly would not call a single one of them my friend.

Take what up with you fox pup? there is nothing to take up. You enjoy giving merit to your friends. You enjoy giving out great prizes. Carry on I don't have an issue with it. If you are enjoying yourselves what is that to do with me?

Good question. If it's nothing to do with you, why do you persist in posting about it?

EDIT: Typo

[cryptohunter]

good posters from 99.87% of the board are unicorns.

unicorn unmerited-better-than-0.13% posts

Very subtle difference there but such an expert as yourself should be able to spot it.

The issue is claiming merit is some objectively applied reward based on some set of criteria where all posts get equal chance of review.

No, the issue is still your extensive use of fallacies to justify your bullshit.

Nobody claims to review all posts nor is that needed. There is no need to review bounty reports and other garbage. There is no need to micromanage the merit system at the level of each individual post. What matters is that in the long run good posters will tend to accumulate more merits than shitposters and that part seems to be working.

Feel free to let us know about those unmerited good posts any time.

The subtle difference is there but that is not what I asked you specifically and not what you replied to. Re- read it again. Here is my question. There is no point trying to change things now.

"Yes or no out  of the remaining 99.87% of the board can some of them make as good or better posts than those in the 0.13%? I mean is it likely or not?"

that was what you replied to

Even so to say there is not unmerrited individuals making posts as good or better than a lot of the redundant shit the top 0.13% get merits for is ludicrous.  However that was not what you were replying to. So stop trying to back step.

Next you'll say "most" pre merit legends just means a few.

@fox

Suchmoon keeps seeking me out. I feel bad ignoring him just because I am not interested .. he puts such effort in it just does not seem charitable. It could be more interesting if he could hold a sensible conversation and not forget things he says every few mins or out right deny them. Then getting angry and annoyed.

You show me evidence of your time machine and I will indulge some of your requests.
The onus is on you really. I mean if i were reading this and viewing the evidence ......would i believe you use a time machine to view the board naturally and treat merit as suggested or would I believe you just open your merit buddies post history and just hammer on the merit button for his posts with hardly having time to find and read them before pressing.
People can draw their own conclusions.

[suchmoon]

Even so to say there is not unmerrited individuals making posts as good or better than a lot of the redundant shit the top 0.13% get merits for is ludicrous.

Not as ludicrous as you punching your poor straw man for two days non-stop.

Let me try for the 4th or 5th time: show me the good unmerited posts, I'll merit them if they're worthy, and we can both be proud for being part of the solution to this problem. Unless there is no problem or you're not interested in a solution, in which case please disregard this and continue trolling.

[cryptohunter]

Even so to say there is not unmerrited individuals making posts as good or better than a lot of the redundant shit the top 0.13% get merits for is ludicrous.

Not as ludicrous as you punching your poor straw man for two days non-stop.

Let me try for the 4th or 5th time: show me the good unmerited posts, I'll merit them if they're worthy, and we can both be proud for being part of the solution to this problem. Unless there is no problem or you're not interested in a solution, in which case please disregard this and continue trolling.

See what I mean the guy just can't stop himself.... he can't stay away from me.



Okay okay

First before I indulge your requests. Let's clear 2 things up.

1. do you believe " most " pre merit legends are spammers?
2. do you still say that I was incorrect to assume that some of the 99.87% of the board are capable of making posts as good if not better than some made by the 0.13%?

Are you keeping to your original views that most pre merit legends are spammers and  that none of the 99.87% are capable of making posts as good or better than some of the 0.13%

Let me try that for the 6th or 20th time with you first.

Answer those and I will get you some posts worthy of merit (compared to some of the run of the mill low value posts the 0.13% give merit to each other for)that have yet not received any.

[Foxpup]

You show me evidence of your time machine and I will indulge some of your requests.
The onus is on you really. I mean if i were reading this and viewing the evidence ......would i believe you use a time machine to view the board naturally and treat merit as suggested or would I believe you just open your merit buddies post history and just hammer on the merit button for his posts with hardly having time to find and read them before pressing.
People can draw their own conclusions.

I never said I used a time machine. You just assumed I used a time machine instead of some other means of time travel. I should point out that user's post histories are in chronological order and the posts I merited aren't. Draw whatever conclusions you like.

[Findingnemo]

Even so to say there is not unmerrited individuals making posts as good or better than a lot of the redundant shit the top 0.13% get merits for is ludicrous.

Not as ludicrous as you punching your poor straw man for two days non-stop.

Let me try for the 4th or 5th time: show me the good unmerited posts, I'll merit them if they're worthy, and we can both be proud for being part of the solution to this problem. Unless there is no problem or you're not interested in a solution, in which case please disregard this and continue trolling.

See what I mean the guy just can't stop himself.... he can't stay away from me.



Okay okay

First before I indulge your requests. Let's clear 2 things up.

1. do you believe " most " pre merit legends are spammers?
2. do you still say that I was incorrect to assume that some of the 99.87% of the board are capable of making posts as good if not better than some made by the 0.13%?

Are you keeping to your original views that most pre merit legends are spammers and  that none of the 99.87% are capable of making posts as good or better than some of the 0.13%

Let me try that for the 6th or 20th time with you first.

Answer those and I will get you some posts worthy of merit (compared to some of the run of the mill low value posts the 0.13% give merit to each other for)that have yet not received any.

When someone is recognized already then they are not in any difficult situation to get merits but there are other few people out there making lot of worthy to read post but still not getting enough merits just because they are still not recognized (Means posting outside the meta).

I think this is a flaw in this system but we have no other tool to stop ranking up the spammers.If you have any better idea to control spam then it will be appreciated but don't blame the current working system.

[marlboroza]

Today at 13:50:34: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: account blocked today over a year old and 1500+ posts
Today at 13:50:00: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: What's happening with Bitcoin losing more than 10 per cent of its value?
Today at 13:49:32: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: What is this forum for?
Today at 13:49:00: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: Trust abuse! Injustice! Fake trust by winter! Much butthurt I am!
Today at 13:48:33: 2 to The Pharmacist for Re: Is the new ERA of merit dying again?
Today at 13:47:59: 3 to The Pharmacist for Re: DT1 list alternation: add me on it
Today at 13:47:16: 3 to The Pharmacist for Re: I need merit badly

I am really surprised to see this. It just doesn't feel right.

Imagine 28 seconds between naturally browsing the board (not searching for your fav merit buddies at all just per chance your machine accidentally flys from you buddies post to his next one deserving more merit) reading the post (in full context of the thread)digesting it deciding on a sensible merit score and then just leaving that thread (cos it got boring after reading merit buddies post) and browsing the board naturally again (not searching for merit buddies)and finding another great post (just pure chance it is same buddy posting again) to read in the middle of a thread reading it and deciding on another senisble merit score. This just happening over and over.

Then they tell me --- if i happen to cross a good post I merit it simple as that. It's not like I just go searching for my merit buddies posts and taking 28 second or 30 seconds average to just plaster more merits to them.

I did some digging on both The Pharmacist and Foxpup accounts. It took me several hours and I can't step over it. Anyway, thread is in reputation read it if you want.

[otrkid1970]

I received my first 2 merits today on my god awful new account.  I was a Legendary and got hacked. Anyways...I got my first 2 merits posting in my favorite section Politics & Society. I just posted how i felt about the topic and with no real thought about Merit. Boom 2 Merits. My advice is Enjoy the forum and make some Enjoyable comments with your own thoughts and not about thinking "Merits.

Stop overthinking the merit system

[The Sceptical Chymist]

<snip>

I am really surprised to see this. It just doesn't feel right.

I was actually surprised as well.  I'm not sure why he gave me that many merits for all those posts--I guess he just likes what I post, but you'd have to ask him for the reason.  I swear to Baphomet that I'm not an alt of Foxpup if that's the implication.  Perhaps he knows I'm looking for Newbie-to-Sr. Member accounts (and some Hero members, too) to give merits to, and he knows I'll distribute the sMerits I get.  Who knows?

You got me with that Rickroll.  I thought that shit went ghost in 2012 or so, and it's not something I'd love to have revived. (lol)

See what I mean the guy just can't stop himself.... he can't stay away from me.

Oh ffs, he's not stalking you.  You're going all over the place giving opinions that are very contrarian and playing devil's advocate in ban appeal threads.  He probably just disagrees with you about some things (and I can completely understand that) and wants to challenge you on what you're writing.  That's part of what a discussion forum is.

However, I will be happy to merit some neglected posters who are putting out fabulous posts and not getting the recognition that they deserve.

Same here.  I just found one post worthy of merit in an Economics thread buried in a shitpost sandwich, but looking for such things gets very tiring very quickly.