mikeywith (OP)
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September 06, 2019, 02:33:13 AM Last edit: September 06, 2019, 12:43:00 PM by frodocooper Merited by suchmoon (4), hugeblack (1) |
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On their twitter account, just 10 minutes ago, Bitmain announced yet another "improved" gear with 64th and about 2880w, that is 45w per tera hash, which is almost exactly the same as the S17 pro running on Turbo mode, it seems like they added more chips and gave it a different name, but we can only be sure after they do release it, the Low power mode on this thing might be more efficient than the S17pro which is 36w per TH. source: https://twitter.com/Antminer_main/status/1169796461686427648
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philipma1957
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September 06, 2019, 04:55:01 AM |
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Good glad I waited a bit to order.
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taserz
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September 06, 2019, 06:49:33 AM |
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Good glad I waited a bit to order.
Yeah I got my m20s coming but new bitmain would do something like this.
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mochaaa
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September 06, 2019, 09:21:08 AM |
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whats price estimates? 3.5k?
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wndsnb
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September 06, 2019, 12:40:02 PM Last edit: September 06, 2019, 12:44:03 PM by frodocooper |
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Have some dead Bitmain 17 series hashboards or full miners? I'll buy them ... send me a PM with what you have and I'll make you an offer!
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philipma1957
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September 06, 2019, 02:43:46 PM |
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Well coins are edging close to 11,000. If we get a coin push to 11 or 12 over the weekend I could see them wanting close to 4000.
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mochaaa
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September 07, 2019, 03:50:27 AM |
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gunna be rough with trump tax
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Undifficulty
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September 07, 2019, 04:45:37 PM |
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I think over $3k would be too high considering the M20S are under $3k at a slightly higher hash rate.
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mikeywith (OP)
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September 07, 2019, 06:10:06 PM Last edit: September 09, 2019, 04:36:18 AM by frodocooper |
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I think over $3k would be too high considering the M20S are under $3k at a slightly higher hash rate.
This is not how you compare gear prices, besides quality and the other obvious factors,there are two major factors you need to consider when making such a comparison. 1-Price per Terahash 2-Watts per Terahash Now depending on a few factors , power consumption in many cases is the most important factor and based on that, and assuming the S17E does 64th at 2880w i see no reason why it shouldn't be selling for 3.5k or even 4k despite the fact that the M20s does sell for a lot cheaper, those 500w difference are worth a lot to many people , and to be honest 64th at 2880w is a freaking beast, I doubt any other company will get to that efficiency by year end. Another reason is that to me, bitmain in the mining industry is like Apple in the mobile phone industry, they always get away with selling over priced products just because of their brand name.
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mochaaa
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September 07, 2019, 06:24:44 PM |
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looked like efficiency was the same? im thinking 30xx watts @45j/th. It helps bitmain that they are a visible company with clear (relatively) processes for their products, quality and efficiency aside.
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Biodom
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September 07, 2019, 10:36:41 PM |
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They are trying to pre-empt M20S. Hopefully, this would mean lower prices.
I looked at the numbers and there is NO way for any of these miners to return more btc than you spent in the first 12 mo, maybe even 18 mo IF your cost is 9-11c/kwh. They have to be robust enough to work for at least 24 mo, maybe more for you to break even in btc. Of course, depending on bitcoin $$ price (if it would rise), you MIGHT get $$ profits sooner.
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philipma1957
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September 08, 2019, 12:09:14 AM Last edit: September 09, 2019, 04:36:58 AM by frodocooper |
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yeah at 68th you earn 0.001547 btc. or $16.25 usd. 68th at 45 watts a th = 3060 or 74 kwatts a day.
at 6 cent power that is 4.44 in power so 16.25-4.44= 11.81 profit after 300 days 3543 usd at 5 cent power that is 3.70 in power so 16.25-3.70= 12.55 profit after 300 days 3765 usd at 4 cent power that is 2.96 in power so 16.25-2.96= 13.29 profit after 300 days 3987 usd
never mind that these intentionally attack usa mining since they will all be at least 3500 + 966 = 4466 with trump tax.
So I am pretty much shut out of these again.
my 50 50 split deal means 34 th or 8.12 usd a day so 4466/8.12 = 550 days. very difficult for me to want them.
I am looking for small s17 pros like 40 th but killer efficiency say 36 watts a th
oh well
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xxxABJxxx
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September 08, 2019, 09:02:40 AM |
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cryptominerbros list it for $3,199.00, but price will change after relase from Bitmain. M20s is on sale on whatsminer.net, but only 40 USD under normal price . In fact Bitmain can´t lower the price than whatsminer. If tomorrow is a bullish mood, the price is higher than if bitcoin falls extremely low tomorrow. I cancel my M20s order. Wait for cheap used S17 pro 50/56 TH/s. Maybe in 2 Months you become 0,5 - 0,7 BTC for this actualy gear price.
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cbs
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September 08, 2019, 01:38:34 PM |
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Does Bitmain usually have a minimum order quantity for first batch runs?
And still no pricing? They come out tomorrow!
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Steamtyme
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September 08, 2019, 01:44:36 PM |
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Not that I'm aware. It's usually more an issue just trying to get an order in at a time like this. I think you have to set up notifications on their twitter to get the updates right away. I imagine pricing will go up a few hours before the sale is supposed to start.
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AlecMe
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September 08, 2019, 05:40:11 PM |
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Was holding off from s17pro and now it seems to be worth it with this new one coming out and being delivered one month earlier than the s17pro in December; hmmm another blow to people who have preordered...
My worry is: depending on what batch you order will they increase the price?
Or will they be fair and leave all 3 batches (3 days apart) at the same price?
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Undifficulty
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September 08, 2019, 06:24:44 PM Last edit: September 09, 2019, 04:38:44 AM by frodocooper |
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This is not how you compare gear prices, besides quality and the other obvious factors,there are two major factors you need to consider when making such a comparison.
1-Price per Terahash 2-Watts per Terahash
Now depending on a few factors , power consumption in many cases is the most important factor and based on that, and assuming the S17E does 64th at 2880w i see no reason why it shouldn't be selling for 3.5k or even 4k despite the fact that the M20s does sell for a lot cheaper, those 500w difference are worth a lot to many people , and to be honest 64th at 2880w is a freaking beast, I doubt any other company will get to that efficiency by year end.
Another reason is that to me, bitmain in the mining industry is like Apple in the mobile phone industry, they always get away with selling over priced products just because of their brand name.
I think my 1 liner resonates with point #1 in your reply. The M20S has a higher hash rate and a lower price than what we speculated the the S17E price would be. Is 4TH/s @ ~500 watts worth it? Probably not for most, but it also hasn’t been reviewed yet either. So there is a chance that gap can be closed a bit. I agree with you that it’s a beast with those stats. Bitmain was able get away with top dollar because nobody was able to get close to them in terms of #1 & #2 in your post. But I think MicroBT will be a formidable competitor and I think they have demonstrated that with the M10S & M20S. As long as they remain competitors, we all win.
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mikeywith (OP)
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September 08, 2019, 11:32:38 PM Last edit: September 09, 2019, 04:39:14 AM by frodocooper |
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Let's try another way of doing the math S17E > 45w/th M20s > 48w/th 3w per TH difference, let's take a medium scale farm with say 1000th , that is 3kwh difference, say you pay 6 cents per kwh , that is about 130$ a month or 1560$ a year ( not that big of a deal to be honest ) now let's price difference, the M20s 64th sells for 3200$ in China (from resellers) with "early September shipping" , now let's speculate on what bases would anyone want to pay more for the S17E provided it ships around the same period. M20s > 47$ per TH S17e > if 47$ per TH that means it will sell for 3011$ ( unlikely) let's assume they will sell it for 3500$ , or 54$ per TH , that is 448$ more for 64 th > ((54$-47$) * 64th) in order to save 64*3w = 192wh , or 8$ per month if you pay 6 cents per kw , so you will need 56 months to ROI the price difference ! that does not make any sense to be honest for those who pay more than just 6 cents per kw, it makes more sense to pay even more than just 3.5k , for large players 3w less per TH is a lot of money saved , if it takes 3 or 6 months to get back the price difference that should not be a problem to most people. but let's wait and see what price will they ask for.
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philipma1957
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September 09, 2019, 12:02:02 AM Last edit: September 09, 2019, 04:39:39 AM by frodocooper |
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Maybe bitmain is ready to do battle and price it low. They have done this many other times.
Maybe they sell it for 2500 and undercut all the dec preorders.
They have done this in the past they would sell a shit ton of them if they did this.
If they have a lot of them in stock I think they may surprise with a lower price.
pangolin offers the m20s 68t in ten days for 3950 they offer the m20s in Jan for 2615.
if bitmain wants to put a hurt on them and offers the s17e for 2500 in Nov it would basically shut down all of pangolin's sales
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digital$
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September 09, 2019, 01:30:11 AM |
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factor in difficulty adjustments and ROI window becomes even wider. no risk on manufacturers and all on you/us as miners. BTC halving+next gen gears soon to drive difficulty much higher...don't be suckers, prepare for the coming bloodbath!!
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