DireWolf14 : Trust exaggeration

[suchmoon]

Ok suchmoon, thanks for the reply but that's not the case - please don't turn this into a me vs them situation again.. I think it's an expected kind of "lash out" (again strange choice of words but OK), just because the original member changes to neutral - a new one steps in for a negative? He would have not placed anything had Direwolf left the original negative.. That's also a part of my point..

Repeatedly? I literally took escrow funds worth MORE than the loan he was looking for. Truly was supposed to be a simple thing, I am escrow not the lender/borrower.

You're muddying the waters with this escrow thing. Your trust rating is for helping a newbie to farm trust. Now you're arguing technicalities, and yes, lashing out at marlboroza. That's not how you earn trust.

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[marcotheminer]

Ok suchmoon, thanks for the reply but that's not the case - please don't turn this into a me vs them situation again.. I think it's an expected kind of "lash out" (again strange choice of words but OK), just because the original member changes to neutral - a new one steps in for a negative? He would have not placed anything had Direwolf left the original negative.. That's also a part of my point..

Repeatedly? I literally took escrow funds worth MORE than the loan he was looking for. Truly was supposed to be a simple thing, I am escrow not the lender/borrower.

You're muddying the waters with this escrow thing. Your trust rating is for helping a newbie to farm trust. Now you're arguing technicalities, and yes, lashing out at marlboroza. That's not how you earn trust.

I was the escrow./

On the accusation of trust farming aiding and abetting: I didn't know that was his intention..? I got caught up in a $20 loan - once he mentionned he was looking for trust that's where I knew people would come after me ... - afterwards I told him I would not continue to help out. Is that not clear enough that I would not help someone farm trust?

[suchmoon]

I didn't know that was his intention..? I got caught up in a $20 loan - afterwards I told him I would not continue to help out. Is that not clear enough that I would not help someone farm trust?

Newbie admitted he's farming trust. Then you explained to him that he needs to use ETH to work around the concerns of other users in the thread. Again, you're just looking for loopholes, excuses, anything to game the system.

[marcotheminer]

I didn't know that was his intention..? I got caught up in a $20 loan - afterwards I told him I would not continue to help out. Is that not clear enough that I would not help someone farm trust?

Newbie admitted he's farming trust. Then you explained to him that he needs to use ETH to work around the concerns of other users in the thread. Again, you're just looking for loopholes, excuses, anything to game the system.

He needs to use ETH if he wants a loan, that's what I said. I do not involve myself in the thing of trust - anyway it would've been clear after that no one would add trust for the sake of adding trust to his account..

Game what system..? I'm literally trying to explain that I was not involved in anyway in with what DadyD wanted to do (or he posted saying he wanted to do)...

By the way keep in mind there is a BIG language barrier with DadyD, I've reread what he posted and by saying "get some trust" I think he meant to convey he was looking to establish himself as someone who does as agreed upon (of course the risk is always there, anyone can be a scammer, etc) in this case he had collateral. Anyway I am not justifying his actions, I replied (the "convert BTC to ETH" reply) to explain how it usually works with collateral.. Not how to fucking farm trust - anyone can figure that out without me publicly posting how to do it.. I don't give pointers on that stuff, full stop.

Regardless, seems DadyD really didn't know about the vultures here and how mentioning trust and get close by would lead to this. Oh well - things happen as they should.

[suchmoon]

He needs to use ETH if he wants a loan, that's what I said.

He wants trust feedback, the loan is just means to an end, he said it like 3 times in that thread, and you're the only one who's still playing dumb about this whole situation. Give it up.

[marcotheminer]

He needs to use ETH if he wants a loan, that's what I said.

He wants trust feedback, the loan is just means to an end, he said it like 3 times in that thread, and you're the only one who's still playing dumb about this whole situation. Give it up.

Yes he said he wanted to establish TRUST. Correct suchmoon, I was an escrow for him before that came to light / was interpreted as it is (yes I agree with you don't worry..). I don't get the benefit of any doubt here? A huge "come on....". That's the problem. Not what he's asking for/tried to do/etc. That 3 people (I'm assuming you agree with Dire, Marl) took it on me that the borrower wanted trust.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Yes he said he wanted to establish TRUST.

And you don't see any issue with someone taking a loan for the sole purpose of building trust?

I was an escrow for him before that came to light / was interpreted as it is (yes I agree with you don't worry..).

And then after he admitted it three times, you continued to try to help him to take out a loan he didn't need.

[marcotheminer]

Yes he said he wanted to establish TRUST.

And you don't see any issue with someone taking a loan for the sole purpose of building trust.

THIS IS WHY I BACKED OUT. How can no one see this? There was no resolve time here - it was straight to negative trust placement.

[o_e_l_e_o]

THIS IS WHY I BACKED OUT. How can no one see this? There was no resolve time here - it was straight to negative trust placement.

Posts quoted in chronological order.

DadyD admits it the first time:

I'm trying to get some loan to incrase my trust

DadyD admits it for the second and third time:

The only shady think is that i mention I do this think to get trust.
I have 0 trust and merit, i just want to build some

After he admits it three times, you give him additional instructions:

@DadyD best option is to buy an altcoin (I say ETH because of the potential BTC-pair to increase in the coming months..), and then use that (roughly 0.08ETH I think) to secure BTC for you to use.

And then you continue to offer to escrow for him:

Anyway, marlboroza, I can send it to you no problem at DadyD's command.

You had ample time to back out and yet continued to offer to help him secure this frivolous loan.

[suchmoon]

THIS IS WHY I BACKED OUT. How can no one see this? There was no resolve time here - it was straight to negative trust placement.

No one can see it because it didn't happen. You didn't "back out". You offered an LTC loan:

I will be able to loan you only next week, BTC or LTC as you needed earlier when we spoke.

Then newbie asked you to return the funds:

@ marcotheminer please return my funds, its a dead end here.

You obliged:

Funds returned, I am no longer able to cover any loan funds.

I can't see anything about you backing out or any concern on your part regarding newbie's trust farming.

[marlboroza]

especially with newbies who are usually lost around here

Oh, only if "they" are newbies  

He would have not placed anything had Direwolf left the original negative.. That's also a part of my point..

I was dropped as a child so you have to forgive me for being "slow".

Actually, I wouldn't have placed anything if that feedback has been left as it was because it perfectly suits your profile - "helping "newbie" " to farm trust. Don't you worry about me, you will see my moral side when I get that loan back, but just wait for it.

Yes he said he wanted to establish TRUST.

And you don't see any issue with someone taking a loan for the sole purpose of building trust.

THIS IS WHY I BACKED OUT. How can no one see this? There was no resolve time here - it was straight to negative trust placement.

You are lying. I don't know in what twisted reality do you live but after I asked first time "do we have a deal" you said:

Anyway, marlboroza, I can send it to you no problem at DadyD's command.

And after that you didn't back out, "you have been told" to send funds back:

@ marcotheminer please return my funds, its a dead end here.

But just keep that threads and negative coming, I am sure you will find supporters.

[marcotheminer]

I contacted him privately and told him I would not anymore - which is why he posted the dead end post. Please people.. Let's take a breath and step back for a minute shall we.

THIS IS WHY I BACKED OUT. How can no one see this? There was no resolve time here - it was straight to negative trust placement.

Posts quoted in chronological order.

DadyD admits it the first time:

I'm trying to get some loan to incrase my trust

DadyD admits it for the second and third time:

The only shady think is that i mention I do this think to get trust.
I have 0 trust and merit, i just want to build some

After he admits it three times, you give him additional instructions:

@DadyD best option is to buy an altcoin (I say ETH because of the potential BTC-pair to increase in the coming months..), and then use that (roughly 0.08ETH I think) to secure BTC for you to use.

And then you continue to offer to escrow for him:

Anyway, marlboroza, I can send it to you no problem at DadyD's command.

You had ample time to back out and yet continued to offer to help him secure this frivolous loan.

I'm trying to make it clear I didn't aid and abet possible trust abuse.. Suchmoon please don't accuse me of just trying to weasel out.

Sending the escrow funds to marlboroza does not mean continuing to help - it means sending it to the person that asked for it, so the loan is done between the 2 parties without me involved anymore I was tired of the constant questioning of DadyD.

Best option for COLLATERAL. Do you really think I meant "oh, listen best option to abuse trust and get some on your profile so you can loan huge amounts is to do a), b), c)"...

I apologise I should've stated immediately I AM OUT. I did not foresee that not saying that would lead to this.

especially with newbies who are usually lost around here

Oh, only if "they" are newbies 

He would have not placed anything had Direwolf left the original negative.. That's also a part of my point..

I was dropped as a child so you have to forgive me for being "slow".

Actually, I wouldn't have placed anything if that feedback has been left as it was because it perfectly suits your profile - "helping "newbie" " to farm trust. Don't you worry about me, you will see my moral side when I get that loan back, but just wait for it.

Yes he said he wanted to establish TRUST.

And you don't see any issue with someone taking a loan for the sole purpose of building trust.

THIS IS WHY I BACKED OUT. How can no one see this? There was no resolve time here - it was straight to negative trust placement.

You are lying. I don't know in what twisted reality do you live but after I asked first time "do we have a deal" you said:

Anyway, marlboroza, I can send it to you no problem at DadyD's command.

And after that you didn't back out, "you have been told" to send funds back:

@ marcotheminer please return my funds, its a dead end here.

But just keep that threads and negative coming, I am sure you will find supporters.

You asked if you could receive it - I said yes. Not that I would escrow for you. Sending you the funds from DadyD once he approved would mean I had NOTHING left (obligation, commitment, anything) in the deal.

Yes .. DadyD is not me lol if you're still on that as a point you're lost mate.

==

About the "being told to return funds" part you mentionned please see post above this one..

[suchmoon]

I apologise I should've stated immediately I AM OUT. I did not foresee that not saying that would lead to this.

The "I AM OUT" thing is your own straw man. I don't think anybody expected you to say those exact words, or say anything at all. The point is that at the time you continued to engage the trust-farming newbie in ways that could help him farm trust and you didn't express any concern about trust farming, but now you're trying to rewrite history.

Every time you get caught up in some questionable shit your only concern seems to be your own trust score and not the shady dealings that lead to it. You need to start realizing that you can't fix this without rethinking your involvement in ludicrous $12 "deals" like this.

[DadyD]

Oh boy...Oh boy..Stop climbing on the mirrors...I'll use google translate cuse i'm tired, sorry for my bad english.

First of all, did any of you take care to look for evidence about me and Marco because we are two different people or did you just take his and his past reputation as a bad example?
I think no. It's easier to point the finger and blame without proof, right?

I want to be a bit sarcastic so, sorry if your feeling get hurt

• Go on my profil and click on "Show the last topics started by this person."
• You'll see my last ( 3 ) topics.
• Two of which are almost the same. One in Italian and one in English. As you can see, especially those who think they are awake, as guarantor I asked @alexrossi. He, for some reason, disappeared for a few days without giving explanations and I decided to abandon his service as a guarantor.
• As recommended by @alexrossi I did the second post, in the international section to attract more people. and, as marco, he also advised me to use altcoin as a guarantee but, obviously, he is not with negative feedback (for obvious reasons, I am sarcastic.) And please, don't call him too, has been out of the games for a while.
• Here is some proff ( In italian ofc ): http://prntscr.com/pg5z1g , http://prntscr.com/pg5zga .
  

Oki, all this is to prove that I'm not marco.
If you need more proof, don't hesitate to contact me, I also asked @babo and @hostfat to be my guarantor, who for various reasons refused. AND PLEASE, don't mention them and leave them out !!

And now let's move on to the most important part.
I will mention a post that I think has the best summary of the situation, to explain how things are, from my point of view.

Ok DadyD was tagged, I'm not telling him to trust farm, let alone how to do it..

Neither am I helping them get a loan

That's exactly what you are doing.
True. I think marco went into a panic. He is trying, like every person, to get out of this situation in the best possible way ... not succeeding.
The thread is archived here: https://archive.is/p9Lmu

Post 1 - DadyD asks for a loan, and already includes you as the escrow, meaning you have already agreed to help him get a loan.
True, he agreed to be my guarantor. He did it at the expense of my intentions.

Post 2 - You confirm your willingness to help him get a loan.
I don't think this is a fault ... Many act as guarantors in the forum and yet have good feedback. The only difference is that some of you hate marco and have insisted on making it pay. TRUE, he did bad and shady things in the past, but this is not a valid reason to punish him now (at least in this situation, AND ESPECIALLY WITHOUT EVIDENCE, or almost without carrying ... you have made many archives ...)Guys, the people can change ... remember it.

Post 7 - You confirm you are holding BTC collateral from DadyD, whilst DadyD is asking for a BTC loan.
True, and from my point of view it is right with regards to my investment. If it is wrong for you it is your problem. The question here is just one, I asked for a loan, I brought a guarantee, whatever it is, you can accept it or not. Questions aside, you have your butt covered and a profit in the event of a successful loan. You're just trying to bring marco's reputation down because you can't accept the loan issue and that, in this case, marco and I are two different people.

Post 12 - DadyD states "I'm trying to get some loan to incrase my trust"
VERY TRUE! And I confirmed it 3 times! Because this is the truth and unlike others I do not hide.
AND ESPECIALLY, as advised by your dear and esteemed user, I HAD TO CHANGE MY APPROACH AND LIE about my intentions. Nice one! NICE ONE! I'd rather be a user with -30 feedback than a liar, keep that in mind. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5190446.msg52673109#msg52673109 proof of

Just going to chime in here. Could we not have left this new user a neutral. Then explained to them how this is not the appropriate way to build up a trusted reputation?

The OP was given an explanation by TryNinja why his behavior is untrustworthy, and he had the opportunity to retract his statement, and acknowledge that this is frowned upon.  Instead, he doubled down and proceeded as he had started.  I wouldn't have left him a review at all if he had adjusted his approach.

Also, I have a strong suspicion this "newbie" isn't really a newbie at all.

- Just in case.

Post 14 - DadyD states a second time "I do this think to get trust" (Presumably "think" means "thing") and a third time "I have 0 trust and merit, i just want to build some"
Yes, excuse my school English ... We don't all have the privilege to study it.
Post 16 - After stating three times he is only taking this loan out to farm trust, you then advise him to sell some BTC to buy ETH and use the ETH as collateral to obtain a BTC loan. That sounds an awful lot like instructions to me.
Yes, lots of instructions for taking a loan. He, at the expense of my intentions, continued to provide me with his guarantor support, without looking at why I was asking for the loan. THIS IS THE FAULT YOU ALLOCATE TO HIM! Since his morality is not the same as yours and the little bell "Hey, this man is building trust" has not sprung into his head. He continued to do what I asked, that is, SUPPORT ME IN THE TRANSACTION! This, as far as I'm concerned, is the only thing you are blaming!

You are both helping him to get a loan by offering to escrow on his behalf, and you are also telling him how to farm trust (which he admitted he is trying to do) by trading the coin he wants for one he doesn't want just to use it as collateral to get a loan in the coin he just sold.

The whole situation is extremely shady.

I answered in red.

I could go on all night quoting each post in part, but tomorrow I wake up at 4:40 am and honestly I'm tired of seeing sheep following sheep without trying to see the real point of the situation.

I hope that the feedback given to him is recalculated, as he has only worked with the purpose of helping me in my small intent, right or wrong.

You are unleashing a case without thinking about the consequences. You're just trying to be on the righteous side, when you're just ruining his business without caring at all.

If you have anything to say about his actions, adopt them to me as it is I who asked for his services. But obviously, you hate him, not me, right?

[o_e_l_e_o]

My comments on Posts 1, 2, and 7 having nothing to do with the ethics or logistics of having an escrow (or a guarantor, as you put it). My comments are to highlight that when marco said "Neither am I helping them get a loan", he is lying. He had agreed to hold bitcoin for you and escrow for you, therefore assisting you in getting a loan.

In terms of Post 12 and 16, you don't seem to have accepted that taking a loan that you don't need for the sole purpose of building trust is a shady thing to do. Do you disagree with this?

He continued to do what I asked, that is, SUPPORT ME IN THE TRANSACTION!

I am glad we are in agreement. He supported you in the shady activity of taking out a loan you didn't need for the sole purpose of building trust.

[DadyD]

My comments on Posts 1, 2, and 7 having nothing to do with the ethics or logistics of having an escrow (or a guarantor, as you put it). My comments are to highlight that when marco said "Neither am I helping them get a loan", he is lying. He had agreed to hold bitcoin for you and escrow for you, therefore assisting you in getting a loan.

"True. I think marco went into a panic. He is trying, like every person, to get out of this situation in the best possible way ... not succeeding." maybe u didnt noticed that

In terms of Post 12 and 16, you don't seem to have accepted that taking a loan that you don't need for the sole purpose of building trust is a shady thing to do. Do you disagree with this?
Ma boy...Bring me the evidence that I don't need that loan. I don't want logical speeches, I want tangible evidence, with numbers and calculations where you can confirm to me that that coin exchange is useless. Then, if I hold it right, I'll give you mine (though I doubt it). If you don't understand why I asked for the loan, it doesn't mean it's wrong, you're just ignorant about it. As shady as it is, it doesn't make me any effect.

He continued to do what I asked, that is, SUPPORT ME IN THE TRANSACTION!

I am glad we are in agreement. He supported you in the shady activity of taking out a loan you didn't need for the sole purpose of building trust.

Stop saying I didn't need it, because you don't know the details.

And it's nice to see people doing selective readings and not face reality

[marlboroza]

@DadyD I don't trust trust farmers so I won't read single word you posted. I consider them lies.

@marcotheminer can you lock this thread as it is resolved, DW removed negative feedback.

[DadyD]

@DadyD I don't trust trust farmers so I won't read single word you posted. I consider them lies.

@marcotheminer can you lock this thread as it is resolved, DW removed negative feedback.

Buddy, your one of this "trust farmar" that you hate so much...

Proof: http://prntscr.com/pg6u3a

You have only given negative feedback, WITHOUT ALSO INTERVENTING PERSONALLY IN THE THREAD. Without even giving your opinion, you have only followed the others. You expressed negative feedback and, consequently, people trust you even IF YOU DID NOTHING. I call this trust farming.

Shame. That's all.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Bring me the evidence that I don't need that loan.

You mean outside of the fact that you admitted three times you were only taking out the loan to build trust?

Marco was holding 0.0017 BTC of yours, which you were offering to send to another person as collateral for a 0.0015 BTC loan. If you actually needed 0.0015 BTC to spend, you could just have had marco instantly return the 0.0017 BTC to you instead. That way, you would have ended up with 0.0017 - 0.0015 = 0.0002 BTC more, AND not have to take a loan, AND not have to waste time looking for a lender, AND not have to pay extra transaction fees, AND not have to pay repayment fees.

We are now going over the same ground repeatedly. You have admitted you only wanted a loan to build trust, and you have agreed that marco was attempting to help you do that. There is nothing more to discuss.

@marcotheminer can you lock this thread as it is resolved

[marlboroza]

Without even giving your opinion

OK, I have read this and to be honest, I don't really need to comment anything before sending trust feedback. I can still read and make my own conclusions based on reading without commenting, thank you very much for your opinion.