Fortunejack refusing to pay 5 BTC *STAY FAR AWAY*

[suchmoon]

Yes, you can always ignore logic and facts for whatever reason you see fit.

I totally agree with this, especially when the individual is being paid to ignore things such as Sign campaigns. 😎

Putting up IP's that are linking accounts together is not convincing? Even after the fact that the user in question says "Uhm yeah me and some buddies at work all registered on the same day, whaddya know"..

If most IPs are same then it is shady, but if few are same over a period, I'm not surprised.

VERY SURPRISING THAT PPL AT WORK REGISTERED ON THE SAME DAY, HOW DARE THEY DO THAT... LET ME CONFISCATE THEIR 5BTC.

Again, you seem to be one of the people that want these companies to do what YOU think is right and just. If you register from the same IP and sometimes login from the same IP then the abuse is obvious, it doesn't matter what you think or how you feel about it. Companies and especially gambling sites are not in the marketplace of feelings.

EDIT; If you tell me that my opinion can be overlooked due to me wearing a sig then the same thing might as well be said for you since you have for years now followed FJ and tried to discredit them, right?

This was left by you in 2018:


"Will remove once solved", press the Reference link and the title says "[SOLVED]" and the thread is locked.

In what way does this post make trading with allahabadi high-risk, as per the red trust reference? Even assuming OP's claim is frivolous - he/she isn't being red-trusted but someone discussing the claim in the thread is. That paints a sad picture of FJ signature campaign.

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[Hhampuz]

In what way does this post make trading with allahabadi high-risk, as per the red trust reference? Even assuming OP's claim is frivolous - he/she isn't being red-trusted but someone discussing the claim in the thread is. That paints a sad picture of FJ signature campaign.

Are you asking me or someone else? I've not left any red trust for allahabadi and just said that if he thinks my opinion can be overlooked due to the sig I wear than his opinion an be overlooked since he jumps at every chance to shit on FJ.

[suchmoon]

In what way does this post make trading with allahabadi high-risk, as per the red trust reference? Even assuming OP's claim is frivolous - he/she isn't being red-trusted but someone discussing the claim in the thread is. That paints a sad picture of FJ signature campaign.

Are you asking me or someone else? I've not left any red trust for allahabadi and just said that if he thinks my opinion can be overlooked due to the sig I wear than his opinion an be overlooked since he jumps at every chance to shit on FJ.

I'm asking you and Lauda (who red-trusted allahabadi using your post as reference). allahabadi may have a bias against FJ just like you and Lauda may have a bias favorable to FJ. Do we need red trust for that or just a "~" and move on?

[Hhampuz]

In what way does this post make trading with allahabadi high-risk, as per the red trust reference? Even assuming OP's claim is frivolous - he/she isn't being red-trusted but someone discussing the claim in the thread is. That paints a sad picture of FJ signature campaign.

Are you asking me or someone else? I've not left any red trust for allahabadi and just said that if he thinks my opinion can be overlooked due to the sig I wear than his opinion an be overlooked since he jumps at every chance to shit on FJ.

I'm asking you and Lauda. allahabadi may have a bias against FJ just like you and Lauda may have a bias favorable to FJ. Do we need red trust for that or just a "~" and move on?

I wouldn't even red trust the OP so that's where my opinion is. I accept all opinions but will challenge them accordingly.

[Thekool1s]

I guess this should serve as a lesson to all gamblers out there that do not gamble with Bookmakers/Casinos who have poor TOS. I'm kinda disappointed TBH how the crypto gambling industry is handling the multi-account situation there are far better ways to detect multi-accounts than merely IPs ^{( which I have explained here )}. UIDs are far better at detecting multi-accounts and have a very low rate of false-positive scenarios. If a solo developer like me could implement a UID verification system and would outright block the registration of a new account if the user's UID matched someone else, preventing the loss of time and money for both me and them, I expect these casinos to go above and beyond.

I do understand this is one of the ways these casinos make money and one could argue all day about reading TOS before you put your money in these casinos but TBH I believe they don't need to rely on these practices. Like if the OP had lost the bets etc the casino would have gladly swallowed the losses but when its time to pay up, they go through all this verification and stuff, TBH its shady behaviour in my opinion and this isn't just limited to FJ, I have seen a couple of other casinos which have similar TOS. What you as a gambler can do is stop gambling at these casinos and demand better TOS. Otherwise, why not just burn your private keys/seed?

Also if this is the industry standard, It looks like the most profitable business to me. Basically, in theory, one could run a casino with similar TOS and when the times come to pay up large sums and your bankroll is kinda running low, You create a fake IP log of sorts and bail yourself out by not paying the amount due and by returning the original deposited amount. No one would be able to argue against you since you will already have established your brand and one-off cases would be dismissed as trolls and shit. I will look around and see how many bookmakers and dice websites have these kinds of TOS and are going unnoticed. Looks like a quite lucrative business to me... hmm.

[Hhampuz]

~

If your system is superior you really should go out there and sell it to big brand casinos (not only crypto ones) and you'd make a killing considering they'd save a lot on administrative fees.

As for the TOS this is how any larger legitimate casino operates. You can just go through all the big ones that you can find out there in the world and you will see.. It's nothing about "Avoid these poor TOS sites" - if anything you'd run a greater risk of losing money if you find the opposite (as they'll most likely be small-time nonamers).

[AlexSimion]

Well to be honest I expected more from you reputable members , and DT or whatever .

Op is being accused of multi accounts ,  but in case FJ actually released yesterday a withdrawal for the other account their accusing him of being linked . Then this is extremelly fishy to say the least .    It's true that email might be fake as you say Lauda  , but as long as FJ haven't commented on this yet , Op's claim still stands , but you guys are literally on a witchhunt against the OP while ignoring some facts from an objective point of view .
Honestly I expected more from experienced members such as yourselves .

PS: I'm a regular player at FortuneJack , depositing regularly , withdrawing etc . Haid my fair share of issues with them regarding some higher amount withdrawals but it all got solved in a few days.

[Thekool1s]

If your system is superior you really should go out there and sell it to big brand casinos (not only crypto ones) and you'd make a killing considering they'd save a lot on administrative fees.

It isn't my system, this has existed for a very long time and I don't need to sell anything, It's literally a few lines of codes and you get a UID, you can then couple this with IPs if you want and you will have the ability to build a stronger case against multi-account users. But the way I'm starting to see it, they are shying away from this for the very reason I stated above. A way to bail themselves out.

As for the TOS this is how any larger legitimate casino operates. You can just go through all the big ones that you can find out there in the world and you will see.. It's nothing about "Avoid these poor TOS sites" if anything you'd run a greater risk of losing money if you find the opposite (as they'll most likely be small-time nonamers).

How many have you gone through? Can you list a few? If it is the case I find it a very lucrative business... Also, everybody is a nonamer at some point but that shouldn't stop someone fixing the industry-standard...

[Hhampuz]

How many have you gone through? Can you list a few? If it is the case I find it a very lucrative business... Also, everybody is a nonamer at some point but that shouldn't stop someone fixing the industry-standard...

It would be easier if you named the top 50 casinos and I could tell you on two hands tops (more like one) which ones I haven't played at.

[Thekool1s]

How many have you gone through? Can you list a few? If it is the case I find it a very lucrative business... Also, everybody is a nonamer at some point but that shouldn't stop someone fixing the industry-standard...

It would be easier if you named the top 50 casinos and I could tell you on two hands tops (more like one) which ones I haven't played at.

I was asking about the TOS regarding multi-accounts. Anyway, I haven't gambled much in my life so 50 is kinda stretch... I can google it them for you if you want... But I have come across William hills and Bet365 and after doing a quick google search I found they have a similar rule of 1 account per person but I don't know yet how they enforce this. Gonna read more into this...

[amelik2]

Since you all think I'm a photoshop expert. Here's a screen grab that 'patdugan' sent me of the withdrawal. If we are going to play the photoshop card who's to say that FJ didn't photoshop what they posted with the IPs?

https://i.ibb.co/7ksRyQp/screen.png

FJ has not responded to any of my emails. They have no problem posting private info of their users on a public forum but can't even have a private discussion? Nice way to operate an online gambling site...

They are also completely ignoring the fact that they paid out my coworker winnings yesterday. Please explain that?

Why don't they post the IP's of the users on the weekends or after 5PM EST? Have both users been logged in at the same time from different IP's in different areas? I bet they have...I'm sure they won't share that though because it will help justify my side even more. They already posted us logging in 18 minutes apart in different cities. If they really cared about doing what is right they would respond to my emails and do a more thorough investigation. I've offered to complete a KYC and send in doc's. They won't even respond to my offering. 

Just because we are coworkers who signed up on the same day because another person told us positive things about the site means they can refuse to pay? I'm sure many people on this forum have a friend or coworker who uses the same gaming site. They're refusing payment because we happened to connect to the same office wifi network a couple times?

How do they expect to grow their business by word of mouth if they don't allow friends or co-workers of users to get paid?

FYI myself and many of my coworkers are on a few established well known books (5D, Bookmaker, Heri) Not once have they ever given us a problem about logging in from the same IP. They have the same 'Terms and Conditions'. We are all verified users with 0 issues!

I've offered to show FJ that my deposit came from my verified account on Heritage but they aren't interested. Nice shady operation they have going on...

[allahabadi]

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OP withdraw your claim and read the ToS again.

Which section of the ToS shud the OP refer to?

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I am advising FJ that no further time needs to be wasted on this. If you break the ToS, then you can go home.

Didn't knew that you work for FJ in the capacity of an advisor; again wnich section of the ToS are you referring to?

P.S. Shouldn't advisors be negged too for shady shit their companies do?

Posting this here again so that other defenders of FJ (read sign soul sellers) can maybe point it out to me.

According to our Terms and Conditions, we reserve the right to terminate all the accounts onto the same IP. The rules apply to the accounts, coming from the same family, household, relative or a connected person that might be somehow linked with the acc.

Maybe others can see what I can't can someone point me to the section where it says SAME IP and not some frivolous shit like multiple registered accounts?

[allahabadi]

Reposting it here for all who have seen this thread to be able to see FJ's much better response by clicking their link.

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With this, we apologize to be linking this information public. Still, as the community has been involved in the case so actively and the Player has been so vocal, we believe that full transparency of the case is crucial. So all the information is decided to be public, to avoid any misjudgments over the matter.

Having gone thru the entire thread I have come to the conclusion that there is indeed strong connection between the two accounts and hence FJ is very much within the margin of error in this case.

Too many coincidences IMO to be ignored, but it wud hv been better had u clarified it in such a manner prior.

[bearybarney]

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OP withdraw your claim and read the ToS again.

Which section of the ToS shud the OP refer to?

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I am advising FJ that no further time needs to be wasted on this. If you break the ToS, then you can go home.

Didn't knew that you work for FJ in the capacity of an advisor; again wnich section of the ToS are you referring to?

P.S. Shouldn't advisors be negged too for shady shit their companies do?

Posting this here again so that other defenders of FJ (read sign soul sellers) can maybe point it out to me.

According to our Terms and Conditions, we reserve the right to terminate all the accounts onto the same IP. The rules apply to the accounts, coming from the same family, household, relative or a connected person that might be somehow linked with the acc.

https://i.ibb.co/72m6qsK/image.png

Maybe others can see what I can't can someone point me to the section where it says SAME IP and not some frivolous shit like multiple registered accounts?

I also find it odd that FJ only removed the winnings from the OP's balance and left the amount he deposited and did not 'confiscate all monetary funds available' on the account as per the ToS... If they are so sure the OP was multi-accounting they would surely take all funds as per the ToS. As they havent it would lead to me to believe there is at least a case for the OP.

[AlexSimion]

Posting the proof provided by FortuneJack in case some people don't see it on the other thread

Hi Dear Community,

I believe, even the data and ToC was clearly enough to consider this case closed for further development, there still are some questions to be addressed. I am here to make a quick recap of the situation and vocalize the official position of FortuneJack.

1. Accounts amelik2 and PatDugan were created on March 25, 2019.  Nothing special here, accounts get created every day. Still, as from operating this business for ages, we are aware of patterns of behaviors various types of players develop. I will make one of the public - players who love to win large or bet large, sometimes create two accounts. For obvious reasons: to avoid casino restrictions, to get more bonuses, cash backs, to rest one account if they fill it has gone unlucky, etc. It's impossible to detect if the accounts are created with this pattern on the day of creation (hundreds of accounts are created every day). Still, during the play, it gets obvious.





2. PatDugan occurred to be a great player. Even he took good advantage of us, still having a good player on you casino, is a pleasure of every business owner. PatDugan's playing pattern was a little bit abusive to the casino, but still on edge, not crossing the line. A player would make a bet on sports, get this bet approved by the casino. As it happened, he would throw lots and lots of other games in the bet slip, thereby going bigger and bigger. Yet, the practice is abusive, and the Player somehow managed to be in the rules. But if the play with casino gets out of hands, the casino reserves the right to restrict some aspects of the game with the Player. To be perfectly clear here: Adding option is a willing offer from casino to players, keeping the game going, like a cashback or other promotion. Every casino ever receives the right to restrict players' gaming practice, if the playing pattern seems to be abusive to its promotions. Hereby, here is an example of betslip PatDugan used to win some big bucks, the + sign indicates, that game was added in the bet slip using the promotion.






3. PatDugan was restricted this option on February 11. Surprisingly, account created the exact same day, on March 25, 2019, that has not logged in since June 28, 2019 logs on FortuneJack. Here you see Amelik2's log-in history.




4. But this is fine as well, people log in and log out, sometimes years later. Weird thing here is that, those two accounts get linked on two similar IP's.





5. Even more suspicious is that after logging in, first time after June 28, 2019, on the same day, when PatDugan was restricted options letting Player abuse the promotion, Amelik2 (hasn't been on the website for eight months) starts to play with the precisely same pattern. Making the first easy bet, to get it approve by casino and throwing in lots and lots of other games. Notion again: + signs are identifying the games that were added into bet slip using this very promotion option, PatDugan used.





6. So, as far as casino is concerned, two accounts registered the same day, getting linked with two similar IP's, using absolutely identical patterns of playing, abusing similar promotion are two accounts owned by one person and on FortuneJack (as on most of other casinos) multi-accounting is a strict violation of rules and will not be tolerated.



7. Bottom line of this is that, the ToC clearly identifies that YOU ARE ONLY ALLOWED TO REGISTER ONE ACCOUNT. And is clear about family, coworker, friend or friend of friends situations as well.


In addition to all this, PatDugan is indeed approved Player on FortuneJack and already has complete the KYC procedure. The Player has all the right to continue playing on the website, and none of his/her withdrawals will be withheld. In the case of MultiAccounting, and it is a common practice, Player Is always allowed the keep one, verified account.  But no player can or will abuse casino promotions, especially with multi-accounting, which is so obvious and easy to detect by experienced casino staff.


With this, we apologize to be linking this information public. Still, as the community has been involved in the case so actively and the Player has been so vocal, we believe that full transparency of the case is crucial. So all the information is decided to be public, to avoid any misjudgments over the matter.

Should be pretty clear by now

[BlackRed]

How he did damages to the site? They had enough evidence to block him earlier

[PrimeNumber7]

First of all, we would love to once again clarify what the actual meaning of the term ‘last IP’ is, which was included into the screenshot above. It’s the IP address that the certain user used for the last time of logging in into the FJ account.

On another hand, the IP address (107.77.204.49/)

I reviewed the "shared" IP address and discovered this IP belongs to my my work office wifi.

I looked up the whois for the IP address in question, and it appears to belong to AT&T wireless.

I cannot rule out this IP address being a hotspot for AT&T wireless customers, but I think this is pretty unlikely. If this IP address belonged to your office WiFi, I think it would probably be more likely to belong to AT&T Uverse, or whatever their trade name is for serving business customers.

If I am understanding correctly, FJ told the OP they didn't want him gambling at their casino anymore, and the OP subsequently used another account to gamble at FJ's casino, and won 5 btc. If this is true, FJ should allow the OP to withdraw his deposit if they haven't already, but they do not owe him his winnings.

[andulolika]

I never imagined FJ has such stupid rules or that it such a site, I negative rated their account since I don't believe a crypto casino that promotes fairness and freedom could have such rules as holding users funds or prohibiting double accounts.

If you take this to court you will probably win btw.

 since they atleast repaid the initial deposit i changed my rating to a negative neutral one.

[Thekool1s]

I never imagined FJ has such stupid rules

Well, believe it or not, this is the industry-standard... So there is no point in singling out FJ. Most of these casinos/bookmakers try to protect themselves against abuse of bonus offers / Promotions which they run. I was pretty shocked how these casinos/bookmakers have got away with it so far TBH... There are no regulatory bodies which protect the recreational punters... Given this is a multi-billion dollar industry I'm baffled why the governments haven't regulated them so far... I guess it has something to do with lobbying but I'm merely speculating at this point... Anyway, I started a discussion recently and unfortunately what I have learned so far is that there is a massive gap in the market and people usually don't give a shit about their privacy as they aren't informed enough about why their privacy matters...

[dragonvslinux]

As you posted on the prior screenshot with the two IP's logging in 18 minutes apart one was in VA and one was in Baltimore. Everyone knows it is impossible to travel from VA to Baltimore in under 75 minutes. Clearly we are two separate people.

For the benefit of non-US users such as myself:



As a correction, it's possible to fly in 51 minutes:



For reference sake, just in case! FUTURISTIC PLANS FOR BALTIMORE 'Teleport' proposal
(Note, if you're based in the present, this link may not work)

I have offered to send a copy of the phone bill. I've offered to send additional documentation as well. Since you have all the IP's you will see the IP with only 1 user accessing it is my house in the town near where I live. I have no problem sending a mortgage statement and additional documentation showing that I live near that town.

They don't want to accept documentation, instead attempt to control the narrative of discussion by refusing to post in this thread, instead only posting in their own ANN?
Yikes.