[ANN] Bisq - Exchange, Decentralized.

[citb0in]

maybe because he simply has the better reputation than you and therefore enjoys certain privileges ? i am just guessing


I want to add and emphasize that hopefully with your last sentence / warning you meant the troll 16xypjnxlrew, and not me :-) 

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

[1714117558]

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[n0nce]

Hello everybody. I am 'kinda' new here and looking for a way to purchase BTC on a decentralized way. I do NOT want to register on any known centralized exchange and process KYC procedure for the reasons mentioned on that link. I was referred to this great piece of P2P software called Bisq unfortunately I still struggle at the first hurdle --> How do buy the suggested first 0.002 BTC (two millibitcoins) to start? The FAQ link is not really a help for me. I live in Germany and there is no bitcoin/ATM nearby where I could purchase a small amount by cash without KYC. I already posted in the particular subforum marketplace where I am looking for someone to buy a small amount via Paypal Friends/Family but without luck yet. In case I get to my first 0.002 BTC I would really like to download, install and use Bisq. Looking forward to any assistance, please reply either via PM or on my marketplace forum post. Thanks!

I would probably recommend getting your first Bitcoin (for Bisq security deposits) through Lightning on Robosats.
I've done a short, unsponsored review about it here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5405549.0

Unfortunately, also Robosats requires a security deposit, but obviously much lower (as you're buying less BTC) and pretty quick & cheap through the use of Lightning. I just checked and you would need around 1£ in collateral (or less) to buy roughly 20£ of BTC. I'm sure you can find someone who gifts you that amount (worst case message me) or lends a few thousand sats without collateral.

Otherwise, if you have another crypto as collateral, you can also find people who give you a Bitcoin loan in the lending section.


Another way to get KYC-free sats is to buy hashpower on a hashpower marketplace like NiceHash. Last I checked, you could just rent a miner for a few hours, pay for it with fiat and get mining rewards on an address you like.

[1miau]

Man, that really sucks! BTW: The reason I changed my email address here on forum was because initially I didn't know if this forum is good or bad and if I would stay here so I used a one-time disposal email address. After I registered and realized that this forum is very frequently visited with lot of content and good replies from many pros I changed it to my correct email address.

Just as a probably helpful information:

Bitcointalk has been hacked several times, where various data was obtained by hackers, such like also E-Mail Addresses, which are normally hidden from public (for a good reason). Because in case a hacker obtains your mail address and your real name or can tie your Bitcointalk account (via Mail) to your real-life identity, you might be in danger because such data is sold on the Darknet frequently (see also Ledger's big hack).
Unfortunately, hackers are acting very aggressively.

So, I can recommend using a different, pseudonymous mail address for your Bitcointalk Account and for Crypto in general.
It's just a recommendation but I assume many people will agree here.  

[citb0in]

Already did that  the email address I'm using here on the forum is not related to my person itself so even if it get published somewhere, I don't really care about Thanks for pointing out

[the_real_w000000t]

Hello people
this is w000000t from the Bisq support team, I was notified there was some trolling going on in this thread so I decided I finally needed to get an account on THE forum, and here I am. I reckon the trolling has been cleaned already, but I suppose, since I'm here... AMA if you want.
I know more than the average, being a support agent and all, but not everything. There is actually a lot to learn about Bisq, and I'm not done so myself.

[n0nce]

Hello people
this is w000000t from the Bisq support team, I was notified there was some trolling going on in this thread so I decided I finally needed to get an account on THE forum, and here I am. I reckon the trolling has been cleaned already, but I suppose, since I'm here... AMA if you want.
I know more than the average, being a support agent and all, but not everything. There is actually a lot to learn about Bisq, and I'm not done so myself.

Could you verify that it's you by e.g. sending a screenshot of your post from w000000t's profile in https://bisq.chat/ and writing that that's you? Maybe simply in Random/Off-Topic channel.

[the_real_w000000t]

Hello people
this is w000000t from the Bisq support team, I was notified there was some trolling going on in this thread so I decided I finally needed to get an account on THE forum, and here I am. I reckon the trolling has been cleaned already, but I suppose, since I'm here... AMA if you want.
I know more than the average, being a support agent and all, but not everything. There is actually a lot to learn about Bisq, and I'm not done so myself.

Could you verify that it's you by e.g. sending a screenshot of your post from w000000t's profile in https://bisq.chat/ and writing that that's you? Maybe simply in Random/Off-Topic channel.

Just posted a link to my previous post in offtopic at bisq.chat

[n0nce]

Hello people
this is w000000t from the Bisq support team, I was notified there was some trolling going on in this thread so I decided I finally needed to get an account on THE forum, and here I am. I reckon the trolling has been cleaned already, but I suppose, since I'm here... AMA if you want.
I know more than the average, being a support agent and all, but not everything. There is actually a lot to learn about Bisq, and I'm not done so myself.

Could you verify that it's you by e.g. sending a screenshot of your post from w000000t's profile in https://bisq.chat/ and writing that that's you? Maybe simply in Random/Off-Topic channel.

Just posted a link to this post in offtopic at bisq.chat

Awesome! I'm pasting the source here so it can be found easily for anyone to verify.

View Source
Room ID: !ceotTUcgziBHsLNmxR:matrix.org
Event ID: $3Kw3UV7adbxcqDY6rEJXlHqHNB-gTnphjbcTbTo9dVc
Original event source

Code:

{
  "content": {
    "body": "this is a verification that \"the_real_w000000t\" on bitcointalk.org is actually me, as per post https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5230289.msg60739151#msg60739151",
    "msgtype": "m.text",
    "org.matrix.msc1767.text": "this is a verification that \"the_real_w000000t\" on bitcointalk.org is actually me, as per post https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5230289.msg60739151#msg60739151"
  },
  "origin_server_ts": 1660342314833,
  "room_id": "!ceotTUcgziBHsLNmxR:matrix.org",
  "sender": "@w000000t:matrix.org",
  "type": "m.room.message",
  "unsigned": {
    "age": 198
  },
  "event_id": "$3Kw3UV7adbxcqDY6rEJXlHqHNB-gTnphjbcTbTo9dVc",
  "user_id": "@w000000t:matrix.org",
  "age": 198
}

[DireWolfM14]

Full disclosure:

Howdy LoyceV,  I'd like to vouch for a new member; the_real_w000000t

I met w000000t on Bisq's IRC channel, https://bisq.chat.

[Bitcoin_Arena]

The recent tornado cash issue triggered me to think about the worst. Things like the US government sanctioning Bisq.network, having profiles of developers in GitHub deleted and probably arresting some of the developers who may not be anonymous (we all know how crazy those Government Motherf*ckers can be)

Does Bisq have a plan to make sure that their operation remains smooth even after being sanctioned (In case it happens)?
Perhaps opting for decentralized alternatives to github?

[the_real_w000000t]

Honestly we haven't talked extensively about this, yet, still we feel the pressure, no doubt.
Brief references to the possibility of choosing an alternative to github have been made, and if you notice how, under DAO > Governance, all proposals links do not point straight to github, but rather to a translation url that redirects to the correct issues on github thereafter, this was a possibility that had been put in code since the start.

More extensive discussion was entertained regarding the specifics of the FinCEN legislation, where Bisq, as a platform which doesn't get involved in the trades directly, not like TornadoCash (I reckon), it cannot really be considered a middleman acting as financial entity. The security deposit, and the rest of the trade protocol, is only "led" by the application, yet all the funds move exclusively between the trading peers, no middle step involved where Bisq manages the funds in any way.

[DaveF]

Honestly we haven't talked extensively about this, yet, still we feel the pressure, no doubt.
Brief references to the possibility of choosing an alternative to github have been made, and if you notice how, under DAO > Governance, all proposals links do not point straight to github, but rather to a translation url that redirects to the correct issues on github thereafter, this was a possibility that had been put in code since the start.

More extensive discussion was entertained regarding the specifics of the FinCEN legislation, where Bisq, as a platform which doesn't get involved in the trades directly, not like TornadoCash (I reckon), it cannot really be considered a middleman acting as financial entity. The security deposit, and the rest of the trade protocol, is only "led" by the application, yet all the funds move exclusively between the trading peers, no middle step involved where Bisq manages the funds in any way.

Have you spoken to a real lawyer about the implications? And probably more then one because one that is well versed in EU law probably has no clue about US law.
Going with the theory that if you cover the EU + US you can probably be covered for most places. I don't know squat about implications of doing what you do, but I can see some overzealous enforcement person trying to make a name for themselves trying to cause trouble. Sad, but true.

-Dave

[the_real_w000000t]

That is something we will consider, yes, Bisq should definitely move forward

[DireWolfM14]

we all know how desperate those Government Motherf*ckers have become

FIFY. 

I don't understand how the US government could justify sanctioning Bisq, but that doesn't mean they're not plotting to do so.  Bisq itself is nothing more than "ebay" for digital assets.  I don't see Bisq as an obfuscation tool, at least not anymore than Coinbase Pro, or any other centralized exchange.  The only difference is the lack of KYC and traceability, but there's no US law that has codified traceability requirements of digital assets, or cash for that matter.  Because that would be unconstitutional... (as if that matters.)

Bisq has implemented rules that I believe make it less prone to government sanctions; i.e. there are limits on fiat to BTC trades that allow no more than 0.25BTC to be traded in one transaction.  The rules aren't so much for AML reasons, but rather for the safety of traders.  However, those ruled would make it more difficult (and less obscure) if one were to use Bisq to wash large sums of fiat.  But the fact remains that with some effort Bisq can be used by bad actors.

Nevertheless, I would love to see Bisq move it's source code to a decentralized or self-hosted gitlab type of hosting site.  The governments of the world (and specifically the US) are starting to panic as their corruption is getting exposed.  They know that their only hope of maintaining their grip on power is by ensuring they control their subjects' currency.  Anything Bisq can do to mitigate a governments ability to shut the system down will ensure that the bitcoin revolution lives on.

[DireWolfM14]

Sorry for the muli-post, but I just wanted to give everyone a headsup; Bisq version 1.9.5 is currently in the testing phase, and the pre-release may be as early as tomorrow.  There are a few improvements to the UI, and some bug fixes as well.

Here's a list of the planned improvements:

Improvements
P2P network status indicator
Prevent UI trading actions when there are no P2P connections
Prepare Bisq for bitcoin-core v23 compatiblity
Possibility to copy addresses / transaction ids
Send funds - don't use all available funds by default
Show Peer Info window only when left-clicking on avatar
Allow mediated payout signature message to be re-sent
Clear sensitive data from trade ProcessModel
GetBlocksResponse lower chunk size (was 6000 now 4000)

And, more info here:
https://github.com/bisq-network/bisq/tree/release/v1.9.5

[citb0in]

Thanks for sharing this information ! will update as soon as possible

[DireWolfM14]

For those of you who are using bisq, I'm sure you've already seen the update notice informing you of version 1.9.5 having been released about a week ago.  The new P2P connectivity GUI indicator is a pretty cool feature.  At least now when you're browsing through offers, and one times out you'll know if it's your connection or the other party.  I haven't had one time out since the new version, and since I have a couple of instances running from time to time, I've notice that if one instance is having connection issues, the offers from that instance will not be visible to others.  So, I figure the issue with timing out once taking an offer shouldn't be as big of an issue anymore.

Still no Taproot address compatibility, I guess it was wishful thinking to interpret "Prepare Bisq for bitcoin-core v23 compatibility" meant taproot implementation.

[the_real_w000000t]

For those of you who are using bisq, I'm sure you've already seen the update notice informing you of version 1.9.5 having been released about a week ago.  The new P2P connectivity GUI indicator is a pretty cool feature.  At least now when you're browsing through offers, and one times out you'll know if it's your connection or the other party.  I haven't had one time out since the new version, and since I have a couple of instances running from time to time, I've notice that if one instance is having connection issues, the offers from that instance will not be visible to others.  So, I figure the issue with timing out once taking an offer shouldn't be as big of an issue anymore.

Still no Taproot address compatibility, I guess it was wishful thinking to interpret "Prepare Bisq for bitcoin-core v23 compatibility" meant taproot implementation.

I guess bitcoinj has no compatibility with taproot (yet?), and since that's the library Bisq uses for all bitcoin functions, that's a limitation we need to cope with

[DireWolfM14]

I guess bitcoinj has no compatibility with taproot (yet?), and since that's the library Bisq uses for all bitcoin functions, that's a limitation we need to cope with

I recall learning that bisq uses the bitcoinj library not long ago.  You're correct; as of the most recent major release of bitcoinj they've implemented sending to segwit v1 addresses, but have yet to implement creation of taproot addresses.

Here's an excerpt from the bitcoinj V0.16.0 release notes:

Implement BIP350 – Bech32m format for v1+ witness addresses.
Implement Taproot BIP341 – send to P2TR addresses. Receiving to and spending from P2TR addresses and chains will be implemented in a future release.

However, it's still not possible to send to a taproot address from the Bisq wallet.  Here's what I get when I try:

[16xypjnxlrew]

However, it's still not possible to send to a taproot address from the Bisq wallet.  Here's what I get when I try:

https://i.postimg.cc/9fcKzSth/image.png

Why did you update the app then? Use the old one, look for the old application build in the folder Downloads