[UNO] Unobtanium Info & Discussion - Merge Mine w/BTC! - Update NOW to qt 0.11.5

[Benefactor]

UNO's at 2.78 right now!  

I could make a DVC offer at rock-bottom prices, but I don't want to offend anyone.  Maybe wait until the workweek, when hopefully silver continues it's nascient 20-30 year bull market advance.

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[Benefactor]

Last post before bedtime:  Consider buying on Coins-e.  This week I decided I would adopt them, and I left 30 coins between 0.0099 and 0.0101 that anyone can grab and work arbitration on.  Easy 5% for ya!  Remember:  sell slooowly in small pieces over time. 

'Night!

[FallingKnife]

To those of you who are/were pursuing the idea of convincing other coins to merge mine against Uno, I was wondering if any of you have found interest yet? Were you guys able to succeed where I had failed in finding other communities to join in to mm against Uno?

Bryce emailed last night and said he is still very interested in this idea of auth/pow with Btc.  I explained how the community had stepped forward to innovate new ideas such as the miner's premium and building an AuthPow/Uno ecosystem, but just wondering if there's been any movement on the latter.

[BitcoinNational]

re:convincing other coins to merge

zeta ... too pride-full, "you can fork but we wont", hard to judge if this is a vocal minority or the majority (but they know about it)

maza .... shoes on the other foot now, they have very impressive hash rates

dem .... don't know, but they also have nice hash rates

digi, myriad, digital ... don't know

Acoin ... would like to talk with them as they will be a low hash coin in the near future, but have ok hash these days.

xjo, open, battle, firefly, tak, tiger, ben, byte, bancor, unb, unic, goat, asic, ctm
I'd have no complaint if they merged into uno.

BUT
auth/pow with Btc I would say is OFF, my opinion is strong NO

<sub>*Because we can hold our own right now and the indication is that we will continue to be a 'good enough' network for 12-18 months


**I'd rather help some small coin (or snap shot UNO) merge into BTC ... then we know we can do it if we need to do it.

***building an AuthPow/Uno/altSHA ecosystem this may work, let the devs discuss, all it takes is 3-4 top players (say maza, uno, zeta plus launching a few smart multi algos) ... badda bing we are competing with SHA10min.  Say the stakes become more 'accepted' well then we offer launches out of this SHA ecosystem.</sub>  

------------------------------------
@Mark

Can't eat for dinner what you can't short (will bitfinex offer shorting UN?) ... if someday you can short uno I don't give a damn

UN is thus arrived to the big show and even with 50tons it be tough to make the market.  PLUS, the 1000oz is an open but limited supply offer.  It repeats once the books are re-balanced.

-------------------------------------
@traders

24hr volume
Unobtanium  7.63 BTC

Nice, VeryNice

[Blazin604]

re:convincing other coins to merge

zeta ... too pride-full, "you can fork but we wont", hard to judge if this is a vocal minority or the majority (but they know about it)

maza .... shoes on the other foot now, they have very impressive hash rates

dem .... don't know, but they also have nice hash rates

digi, myriad, digital ... don't know

Acoin ... would like to talk with them as they will be a low hash coin in the near future, but have ok hash these days.

xjo, open, battle, firefly, tak, tiger, ben, byte, bancor, unb, unic, goat, asic, ctm
I'd have no complaint if they merged into uno.

BUT
auth/pow with Btc I would say is OFF, my opinion is strong NO

<sub>*Because we can hold our own right now and the indication is that we will continue to be a 'good enough' network for 12-18 months


**I'd rather help some small coin (or snap shot UNO) merge into BTC ... then we know we can do it if we need to do it.

***building an AuthPow/Uno/altSHA ecosystem this may work, let the devs discuss, all it takes is 3-4 top players (say maza, uno, zeta plus launching a few smart multi algos) ... badda bing we are competing with SHA10min.  Say the stakes become more 'accepted' well then we offer launches out of this SHA ecosystem.</sub>  

------------------------------------
@Mark

Can't eat for dinner what you can't short (will bitfinex offer shorting UN?) ... if someday you can short uno I don't give a damn

UN is thus arrived to the big show and even with 50tons it be tough to make the market.  PLUS, the 1000oz is an open but limited supply offer.  It repeats once the books are re-balanced.

-------------------------------------
@traders

24hr volume
Unobtanium  7.63 BTC

Nice, VeryNice

What are you guys talking about exactly? I may be able to get things going with Digibyte

[SgtMoth]

"auth/pow with Btc I would say is OFF, my opinion is strong NO

*Because we can hold our own right now and the indication is that we will continue to be a 'good enough' network for 12-18 months"

I agree, network should strengthen if we continue on this path but should keep after zetacoin as the price continues to fall.
What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

[Blazin604]

"auth/pow with Btc I would say is OFF, my opinion is strong NO

*Because we can hold our own right now and the indication is that we will continue to be a 'good enough' network for 12-18 months"

I agree, network should strengthen if we continue on this path but should keep after zetacoin as the price continues to fall.
What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

What will UNO be used for ?

[popolite11]

"auth/pow with Btc I would say is OFF, my opinion is strong NO

*Because we can hold our own right now and the indication is that we will continue to be a 'good enough' network for 12-18 months"

I agree, network should strengthen if we continue on this path but should keep after zetacoin as the price continues to fall.
What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

What will UNO be used for ?

Used to hold and make some profit.

[BitcoinCharlie]

What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

What will UNO be used for ?

I thought TRC was essentially dead?

UNO has been an excellent store of value

EDIT: Also, IMHO pegs end / will end badly CHF, HKD

[balu2]

What will UNO be used for ?

store of value, commodity  


Lots of new people on the thread. Welcome all newcomers  


...........

volatile Litecoin is bleeding out on me again for 2$,  Incredible  

[FallingKnife]

What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

What will UNO be used for ?

I thought TRC was essentially dead?

UNO has been an excellent store of value

I see some new names here. Welcome, guys.

Uno has been the best store-of-value crypto. I can't think of another with a proven record as long as Uno.

While there are tons of little coins out there that could be merged mined against Uno, many of them are negligibly important and wouldn't bring much hash to the game if we lumped all together. That was my original thinking though; build up a merge mining eco-system of alt coins to improve miner profitability as much a possible. The problem is that other coins don't want to do it.

Why is this important for the community to think about? Well, one of the great things that attracts people to Uno is that it has largely passed through its inflationary period. That means you can hold Uno and not have to worry that miners are dumping tons of coins on the market and eroding the price (a problem that bitcoin has today). But that advantage has flip side: if miners make less money, then the hashrate falls as they move on to mine profitable coins. Uno is usually not profitable to mine, and very infrequently is it the most profitable coin to mine.  The current reward is .03125 Uno per block (a block is produced every 3 minutes on average). That means that only 15 Un are produced each day, so investors only need to absorb about $60 worth of Uno each day, which is nothing. In May 2015 that 15 Uno will drop to 7.5 Uno. And it halves again in December 2015, when we'll be looking at less than  4 Uno mined each day as Uno continues to reduce rewards on schedule.
Here's a good post that lays out the schedule.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=527500.msg9954618#msg9954618

The thing that concerns many of us is what will happen to Uno's mining hash and network security as this block reward halving continues.
Proposals from the community have included:
1. Make mining more profitable by encouraging other coins to merge mine against Uno.  Efforts to recruit other coins haven't worked yet.
2. Community subsidizes miners by buying their mined coins at a premium. Seems to hold promise.
 #2.5 Raise the price of Uno. A form of community subsidy, we can value Uno and keep the price high enough for mining to be profitable.
3. Altruistic hash: buy cloud hash on genesis-mining.com and point it at Uno, or operate your own mining equipment. Hash is getting cheaper.
4. Merge mine against  Bitcoin.  We already have a commitment from one large Bitcoin pool to add Uno to merged mining if we implement it.
5. Ignore it and hope it works out.

I've been thinking about this for a year. I started working on option #1, trying to get other coins to mm against Uno without success. I even offered a 100 Uno bounty to the first coin that wold do it.

I support option #2 and #2.5 It's a very innovative community approach.  
I also support #3.  I am an altruistic hasher myself, contributing about  .8 to 1 TB to Uno at all times.
I've tried option #5 at various times in my life, and I have to say... once in awhile, ignoring problems does work out, but in my personal experience it sucks badly when it doesn't.

My thought process has brought me to option 4. I see that not as any sort of capitulation to Bitcoin, but simply as a practical solution. The hash is there. It doesn't "belong" to Bitcoin -- it belongs to the miners. It is there for the taking. Miners will happily mine Uno with Btc with I0C with Nmc or any other coin. Miners want to run their equipment profitability. Some of them do that by skipping from coin to coin as profitability shifts.

Uno's hash varies between about 12 and 30 THS, which is very good for an altcoin, but it's not even a drop in the bucket of Bitcoin's hash.

I think if we do option #4 (merge mine against Btc), we're solving a long term problem for Uno, and setting it up for some cool things. With hash measured in Phs instead of Ths, it will become even more suitable as a store of wealth.  My feeling is that it's better to do this before there is a problem, rather than just wait and see what happens.  Auth/Pos with bitcoin would allow Uno to claim the largest hashing network in the world as its own.  

Not everybody agrees with me, that's fine. I just wanted to lay it out again, where we've been and what our options are.

As for the Devs, I still haven't heard from Blazr2. He must be on a spiritual journey someplace cool. Bryce likes the idea, and has brought it up in the past. The community has mixed feelings.

that's sort of where we're at.

[BitcoinNational]

I will entertain option #4
under these terms

1. the 'F**k' does not happen until at least December 2015
2. We look to create an AuxPow so UN stays at 3min
3. We can get some 'demo' first (I suggest a snap shot of UN ... UN-EX can create some use out of it).
---------
I watch IX to see the advantage of lots of Hash ... so far the market does NOT seem to care ... at all.  We have the same market cap and higher inflation.  (there's only a question of fair in regards to ix) ... plus 10 min speed sucks

[Blazin604]

What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

What will UNO be used for ?

I thought TRC was essentially dead?

UNO has been an excellent store of value

I see some new names here. Welcome, guys.

Uno has been the best store-of-value crypto. I can't think of another with a proven record as long as Uno.

While there are tons of little coins out there that could be merged mined against Uno, many of them are negligibly important and wouldn't bring much hash to the game if we lumped all together. That was my original thinking though; build up a merge mining eco-system of alt coins to improve miner profitability as much a possible. The problem is that other coins don't want to do it.

Why is this important for the community to think about? Well, one of the great things that attracts people to Uno is that it has largely passed through its inflationary period. That means you can hold Uno and not have to worry that miners are dumping tons of coins on the market and eroding the price (a problem that bitcoin has today). But that advantage has flip side: if miners make less money, then the hashrate falls as they move on to mine profitable coins. Uno is usually not profitable to mine, and very infrequently is it the most profitable coin to mine.  The current reward is .03125 Uno per block (a block is produced every 3 minutes on average). That means that only 15 Un are produced each day, so investors only need to absorb about $60 worth of Uno each day, which is nothing. In May 2015 that 15 Uno will drop to 7.5 Uno. And it halves again in December 2015, when we'll be looking at less than  4 Uno mined each day as Uno continues to reduce rewards on schedule.
Here's a good post that lays out the schedule.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=527500.msg9954618#msg9954618

The thing that concerns many of us is what will happen to Uno's mining hash and network security as this block reward halving continues.
Proposals from the community have included:
1. Make mining more profitable by encouraging other coins to merge mine against Uno.  Efforts to recruit other coins haven't worked yet.
2. Community subsidizes miners by buying their mined coins at a premium. Seems to hold promise.
3. Altruistic hash: buy cloud hash on genesis-mining.com and point it at Uno, or operate your own mining equipment. Hash is getting cheaper.
4. Merge mine against  Bitcoin.  We already have a commitment from one large Bitcoin pool to add Uno to merged mining if we implement it.
5. Ignore it and hope it works out.

I've been thinking about this for a year. I started working on option #1, trying to get other coins to mm against Uno without success. I even offered a 100 Uno bounty to the first coin that wold do it.

I support option #2. It's a very innovative approach.  
I also support #3.  I am an altruistic hasher myself, contributing about  .8 to 1 TB to Uno at all times.
I've tried option #5 at various times in my life, and I have to say... once in awhile, ignoring problems does work out, but in my personal experience it sucks badly when it doesn't.

My thought process has brought me to option 4. I see that not as any sort of capitulation to Bitcoin, but simply as a practical solution. The hash is there. It doesn't "belong" to Bitcoin -- it belongs to the miners. It is there for the taking. Miners will happily mine Uno with Btc with I0C with Nmc or any other coin. Miners want to run their equipment profitability. Some of them do that by skipping from coin to coin as profitability shifts.

Uno's hash varies between about 12 and 30 THS, which is very good for an altcoin, but it's not even a drop in the bucket of Bitcoin's hash.

I think if we do option #4 (merge mine against Btc), we're solving a long term problem for Uno, and setting it up for some cool things. With hash measured in Phs instead of Ths, it will become even more suitable as a store of wealth.  My feeling is that it's better to do this before there is a problem, rather than just wait and see what happens.  Auth/Pos with bitcoin would allow Uno to claim the largest hashing network in the world as its own.  

Not everybody agrees with me, that's fine. I just wanted to lay it out again, where we've been and what our options are.

As for the Devs, I still haven't heard from Blazr2. He must be on a spiritual journey someplace cool. Bryce likes the idea, and has brought it up in the past. The community has mixed feelings.

that's sort of where we're at.

Thanks for all of that info....I don't quite understand what "merge mine" means still but I think Digibyte may be open...they have a great dev team with Droid wallets and IOS wallets already up..if you could make a post here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=408268.15920 that would be great and we can get things rolling....explain to them how it can benefit Digibyte and they may hop on board. I really like the idea of UNO and I think others will too if you can explain it proper. I am sure youll do that better than I will be able to.

[sirsmokesalot]

I agree, that was a very nice summary of things thus far. Uno is a digital precious metal, at least, that is how my mind sees it. I think given the nature of how the two behave it is easy to want to draw that parallel between them. Uno is not out to solve the worlds problems. It exists as a vehicle to facilitate the transference of wealth from one individual to another. Uno is what you make it.

The strength to the network would be an amazing addition. I do feel like coins lose a little bit of their identity though when they merge, so be it. I think it is a natural evolution of markets. Perhaps we shouldn't be so concerned about things right yet. If the other competitors of the sha game were to die off, which coin would those miners turn their machinery to? It could be a case of too little too late for a lot of them. The nicest part of Uno are the numbers though. Given enough time, and a dedicated enough community, it is damn hard to sink Uno.

Merge mining means you get X coin when you mine Y coin. I dunno if you get Y coin for mining X coin though. I think it is usually a Master/slave type situation.

[Benefactor]

To those of you who are/were pursuing the idea of convincing other coins to merge mine against Uno, I was wondering if any of you have found interest yet? Were you guys able to succeed where I had failed in finding other communities to join in to mm against Uno?

Bryce emailed last night and said he is still very interested in this idea of auth/pow with Btc.  I explained how the community had stepped forward to innovate new ideas such as the miner's premium and building an AuthPow/Uno ecosystem, but just wondering if there's been any movement on the latter.

I thought the best solution was to just raise the price?

*scratches head
*extinguishes match
*shoulders fall, sulking downward

[IMZ]

Welcome all newcomers.

Strugglin' a little with research on the MM thing. Will read more this morning.

m

[Benefactor]

Used to hold and make some profit.

Hmm, ...reminds me of the empty end game of the Underpants Gnomes of Southpark.

Unobtanium is what we put into it.  Where can you find a community like this one in the Cryptoworld?  On the Internet?  This is quality, here, and notice how there's excellent buy support after a price rise?  Unobtanium doesn't "pump".  (At least if we have any say in it!)

If you sell any, please only a little at a time, and leave some buy support on the bid stack for a while as a courtesy to the community.

There are many ongoing projects and new merchants as time progresses, but, yes, technically, this truly is best utilized by cryptocurrency royalty as a 'store of value' coin.  It really is a 'hold and make some profit' coin, if you like.  Many of us are dedicated long-term, and have other assets to support it with.  Unobtanium attracts the best investors, as it should.  We just want to enjoy living our lives and have something to show for our efforts at the end of the day,....

In speaking of Unobtanium, we have to be careful, though, as the evil powers that be are constantly undermining the advancement of cryptocurrencies or otherwise usurping their control from the good, decent people that love them.  We don't want too much attention.  Be wise, and if you buy coin on Cryptsy, (or other exchanges,) please take them off and store them offline.

Still, I just have to say it:  No other coin has consistently risen month after month after month as Unobtanium has!  We practice what we preach.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts

[FallingKnife]

What about terracoin?  I dont remember if it was brought up.

What will UNO be used for ?

I thought TRC was essentially dead?

UNO has been an excellent store of value

I see some new names here. Welcome, guys.

Uno has been the best store-of-value crypto. I can't think of another with a proven record as long as Uno.

While there are tons of little coins out there that could be merged mined against Uno, many of them are negligibly important and wouldn't bring much hash to the game if we lumped all together. That was my original thinking though; build up a merge mining eco-system of alt coins to improve miner profitability as much a possible. The problem is that other coins don't want to do it.

Why is this important for the community to think about? Well, one of the great things that attracts people to Uno is that it has largely passed through its inflationary period. That means you can hold Uno and not have to worry that miners are dumping tons of coins on the market and eroding the price (a problem that bitcoin has today). But that advantage has flip side: if miners make less money, then the hashrate falls as they move on to mine profitable coins. Uno is usually not profitable to mine, and very infrequently is it the most profitable coin to mine.  The current reward is .03125 Uno per block (a block is produced every 3 minutes on average). That means that only 15 Un are produced each day, so investors only need to absorb about $60 worth of Uno each day, which is nothing. In May 2015 that 15 Uno will drop to 7.5 Uno. And it halves again in December 2015, when we'll be looking at less than  4 Uno mined each day as Uno continues to reduce rewards on schedule.
Here's a good post that lays out the schedule.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=527500.msg9954618#msg9954618

The thing that concerns many of us is what will happen to Uno's mining hash and network security as this block reward halving continues.
Proposals from the community have included:
1. Make mining more profitable by encouraging other coins to merge mine against Uno.  Efforts to recruit other coins haven't worked yet.
2. Community subsidizes miners by buying their mined coins at a premium. Seems to hold promise.
3. Altruistic hash: buy cloud hash on genesis-mining.com and point it at Uno, or operate your own mining equipment. Hash is getting cheaper.
4. Merge mine against  Bitcoin.  We already have a commitment from one large Bitcoin pool to add Uno to merged mining if we implement it.
5. Ignore it and hope it works out.

I've been thinking about this for a year. I started working on option #1, trying to get other coins to mm against Uno without success. I even offered a 100 Uno bounty to the first coin that wold do it.

I support option #2. It's a very innovative approach.  
I also support #3.  I am an altruistic hasher myself, contributing about  .8 to 1 TB to Uno at all times.
I've tried option #5 at various times in my life, and I have to say... once in awhile, ignoring problems does work out, but in my personal experience it sucks badly when it doesn't.

My thought process has brought me to option 4. I see that not as any sort of capitulation to Bitcoin, but simply as a practical solution. The hash is there. It doesn't "belong" to Bitcoin -- it belongs to the miners. It is there for the taking. Miners will happily mine Uno with Btc with I0C with Nmc or any other coin. Miners want to run their equipment profitability. Some of them do that by skipping from coin to coin as profitability shifts.

Uno's hash varies between about 12 and 30 THS, which is very good for an altcoin, but it's not even a drop in the bucket of Bitcoin's hash.

I think if we do option #4 (merge mine against Btc), we're solving a long term problem for Uno, and setting it up for some cool things. With hash measured in Phs instead of Ths, it will become even more suitable as a store of wealth.  My feeling is that it's better to do this before there is a problem, rather than just wait and see what happens.  Auth/Pos with bitcoin would allow Uno to claim the largest hashing network in the world as its own.  

Not everybody agrees with me, that's fine. I just wanted to lay it out again, where we've been and what our options are.

As for the Devs, I still haven't heard from Blazr2. He must be on a spiritual journey someplace cool. Bryce likes the idea, and has brought it up in the past. The community has mixed feelings.

that's sort of where we're at.

Thanks for all of that info....I don't quite understand what "merge mine" means still but I think Digibyte may be open..

Hi Blazin604,
In merge mining,  miners are able to solve blocks for several blockchains (coins) at the same time. Sort of like buying a lottery ticket that works in multiple lotteries instead of just one. It means that miners who are trying to solve bitcoin blocks might, in the process, generate a hash difficult enough to secure the Uno blockchain (or the namecoin blockchain, or I0C, or IXC, or any of the others). It also creates a more profitable experience for miners. Basically some code is added to Uno's client that allows the network to accept the work done by miners on the Bitcoin blockchain as proof of work for Uno blocks.

A couple of things we don't need to worry about if Uno implement's authPow with Bitcoin (merge mining with Bitcoin that is):

Uno's 3 minute timing does not change. It's still 3 minute blocks.
Uno's blockchain does not "merge" with Bitcoin. It still retains it's own separate blockchain.
Uno can still be mined directly, but the difficulty will skyrocket.

I don't want to change anything that we love about Uno; I would just make the argument that more hash is better than less hash, and there's no reason for us to need to worry about network hash if AuthPow is implemented. The problem of low hash goes away, and nothing changes with Uno except that you have to upgrade your wallet.

[BitcoinCharlie]

Used to hold and make some profit.

Hmm, ...reminds me of the empty end game of the Underpants Gnomes of Southpark.

Unobtanium is what we put into it.  Where can you find a community like this one in the Cryptoworld?  On the Internet?  This is quality, here, and notice how there's excellent buy support after a price rise?  Unobtanium doesn't "pump".  (At least if we have any say in it!)

If you sell any, please only a little at a time, and leave some buy support on the bid stack for a while as a courtesy to the community.

There are many ongoing projects and new merchants as time progresses, but, yes, technically, this truly is best utilized by cryptocurrency royalty as a 'store of value' coin.  It really is a 'hold and make some profit' coin, if you like.  Many of us are dedicated long-term, and have other assets to support it with.  Unobtanium attracts the best investors, as it should.  We just want to enjoy living our lives and have something to show for our efforts at the end of the day,....

In speaking of Unobtanium, we have to be careful, though, as the evil powers that be are constantly undermining the advancement of cryptocurrencies or otherwise usurping their control from the good, decent people that love them.  We don't want too much attention.  Be wise, and if you buy coin on Cryptsy, (or other exchanges,) please take them off and store them offline.

Still, I just have to say it:  No other coin has consistently risen month after month after month as Unobtanium has!  We practice what we preach.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts

I am in agreement with Benefactor.  The strength of our community is our core competency.

UNO is royalty. It can slowly become the "reserve currency" of crypto. The settlement currency, if you will.  I imagine our slow growth is similar to the takeover of the pound sterling by the then gold-backed US dollar as world reserve currency, ie perhaps we will overtake BTC.

The growth needs to be as it is now, slow and steady! Don't forget the turtle!

[FallingKnife]

To those of you who are/were pursuing the idea of convincing other coins to merge mine against Uno, I was wondering if any of you have found interest yet? Were you guys able to succeed where I had failed in finding other communities to join in to mm against Uno?

Bryce emailed last night and said he is still very interested in this idea of auth/pow with Btc.  I explained how the community had stepped forward to innovate new ideas such as the miner's premium and building an AuthPow/Uno ecosystem, but just wondering if there's been any movement on the latter.

I thought the best solution was to just raise the price?

*scratches head
*extinguishes match
*shoulders fall, sulking downward

You are absolutely right! I edited my post and added option #2.5 to recognize this strategy: raise the price.  If Uno was at .003 right now, our hash would probably only be from a few altruistic hashers. Our current price is supporting our present hashrate, which is enviable in altcoin circles.
There are guys out there (probably even our own ProminerOne) who could put up 30 ths in an instant. It's a good amount, but it's really not a lot by today's standards. If Uno's blocks were built on Peta hashes (thousands of Ths) an attacker would find it extremely difficult to go back and rewrite the blockchain.