Wearing Double signature (Shan85)

[Xal0lex]

Is there any chance you could translate his last post for us? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=232519.msg62258450#msg62258450

This is a translation of the above post. It may not be perfect English, but have to consider the peculiarities of Urdu and the difficulty of translating from this style of writing.

Reply to illegally allegations
Assalamualaikum, my dear respected brothers,

I am aware that everyone wants to talk about me, but the truth is no one knows the reality. You are all my seniors, and I trust that you will keep the respect in your hearts for me throughout my life. Whether someone speaks ill of me or praises me, I am not affected because in one person, there are 100 good qualities and 1 bad quality. People tend to focus on the negative. I don't care about what others think of me; I only remember the kindness and compassion of all my brothers.

It doesn't matter to me if someone speaks badly about me, as I won't lose anything. If a person is 99% good and 1% bad, people only focus on the bad. I am going through difficult times, and instead of motivating me, everyone is demotivating me. I am worried about this, as it has caused a significant loss for me.

I am not saying that someone should motivate me, but they should also not investigate. Because I know my current situation and my Lord knows it too. I am very hurt by the fact that if someone had seen me struggling, why didn't they guide me? The first campaign I did was without knowledge of this matter. If I had any greed in my heart, I wouldn't have shared this, but the close ones knew about it. I shared it with Gladitorcomeback and Zain Bhai. I also talked to a senior about it, that I didn't receive the payment for 2 weeks. I had done the work properly, as you can see in my posts, but I didn't receive the payment. So, I applied on Duelbits and got accepted. Then someone reported it and created threads about it. Now, I will address the truth there as well.

But I am saddened that my own community is not standing with me. I removed the request text from the Pakistan local board immediately to protect my community. My community is dearer to me than my own life, but no one motivated me on this matter. Every person makes mistakes, and no one is perfect. But no one here is an angel. May Allah bring justice to my case.

ThemePen brother, you are saying that I managed the merit myself. I worked hard and created posts with accurate information, but no one supported me. What else could I have done? And ThemePen brother, if you knew about changing the signature, why didn't you guide me? The matter of reputation is dearer to me than anything else. Please remember, if one person's reputation is tarnished, it affects the entire community. You all are damaging your own reputations. Instead of blaming me, ask for the truth.

Thank you.

Xal0lex, I see you are a moderator, don't you have some educational topics on the Pakistan board about some basics and norms of behaviour here on the forum? Considering two very bad cases of breaking the rules in the last period.

You're so fast I became a moderator of this section only ten days ago

[SatoPrincess]

I guess yes because I've active in this forum for a year and never saw this cheat before.

It's not a new occurrence actually, just that this case managed to fall between the cracks since the payout days for both campaigns are different so the cheater could switch between Duelbits (Tuesday) and BCR (Thursday)

With so many members to handle, campaign managers might find it difficult if a member makes the switch before the tally.

I don’t think this happened as a result of the number of campaign participants, I think this case flew under the radar for so long because of his posting habit, the account mostly made posts in gambling board and Pakistani local board making it difficult for the community to notice the frequent changes in avatar and signature code.

[Eh Moo Nah]

This should be considered as an "observed Opportunity" for Campaign Managers.

It is not a valid Reason that Managers are busy and are just checking the Post of Participants by the End of week campaign? and don't they have assistants to do this?

(If you are looking for an Assistant - count me IN , I'm an Analyst in a Different Industry. )

also.

 Is there a way that a Manager will be notified as soon as a Participant of the campaign removes the signature even just for a second?

[Josefjix]

It was also difficult for any forum members to notice because he was not a reputable member and posted more frequently in his local board, and it appears that he was only making the switch once a week, Bettercaulraul is his main sig and avatar and was only switching to Duebits a few minutes later before post counts and switching it back immediately because Duebits participants are simply too numerous in numbers.

Your opinion raise an interesting question here, since Shan85 is active in his local board, how can the other users who are active in his local board doesn't realized if Shan85 is participating BetterCallRaul campaign? I think when we're active posting in a same thread, we will be more familiar with other users.

Although all active users in Pakistan board shouldn't be blamed, but I think it's quite suspicious.

He was very clever with his sig heist; Duelbits payments were on Tuesdays, so most of the time he finished his post early on Mondays, changed his sig and avatar to Duebits before the cut-off time, logged off until payment was made, and then logged back in late Tuesday with BettercaulRaul sig and avatar. Who knows, but we can't blame an entire community for the actions of one bad apple.

I'm sure his not the only one doing it, there may be others doing the same sig heist as well.

He applied for Coinomize few weeks ago the $80 he was earning from Duebits and Raul was not enough so he wanted another $42 from Coinomize

Bitcointalk Username: Shan85
SegWit BTC Address: bc1qjx8ryt0jxa44k68dn3uhgpt2yhzs6rtw2cw2st
EARNED merit in the last 120 days: 106

[rby]

Reply to illegally allegations
 And ThemePen brother, if you knew about changing the signature, why didn't you guide me? The matter of reputation is dearer to me than anything else. Please remember, if one person's reputation is tarnished, it affects the entire community. You all are damaging your own reputations. Instead of blaming me, ask for the truth.

Thank you.

What kind of guidance is this user talking about.
You grew from brand new to full member and Has promoted a couple of campaigns and yet you haven't read campaign rules. Infact, all the campaigns in this forum has the rule of not adding anything to signature and not removing signature and avatar during campaign period.

Even without rules, morality has it that you are a cheat. There is no part of the world where your act could be justified. Your type is not needed in this forum, but bad enough is that you will create a new account and start building it up. But, I think you have learnt your lesson.

[coolcoinz]

Reply to illegally allegations
Assalamualaikum, my dear respected brothers,

I am aware that everyone wants to talk about me, but the truth is no one knows the reality. You are all my seniors, and I trust that you will keep the respect in your hearts for me throughout my life. Whether someone speaks ill of me or praises me, I am not affected because in one person, there are 100 good qualities and 1 bad quality. People tend to focus on the negative. I don't care about what others think of me; I only remember the kindness and compassion of all my brothers.

It doesn't matter to me if someone speaks badly about me, as I won't lose anything. If a person is 99% good and 1% bad, people only focus on the bad. I am going through difficult times, and instead of motivating me, everyone is demotivating me. I am worried about this, as it has caused a significant loss for me.

I am not saying that someone should motivate me, but they should also not investigate. Because I know my current situation and my Lord knows it too. I am very hurt by the fact that if someone had seen me struggling, why didn't they guide me? The first campaign I did was without knowledge of this matter. If I had any greed in my heart, I wouldn't have shared this, but the close ones knew about it. I shared it with Gladitorcomeback and Zain Bhai. I also talked to a senior about it, that I didn't receive the payment for 2 weeks. I had done the work properly, as you can see in my posts, but I didn't receive the payment. So, I applied on Duelbits and got accepted. Then someone reported it and created threads about it. Now, I will address the truth there as well.

But I am saddened that my own community is not standing with me. I removed the request text from the Pakistan local board immediately to protect my community. My community is dearer to me than my own life, but no one motivated me on this matter. Every person makes mistakes, and no one is perfect. But no one here is an angel. May Allah bring justice to my case.

ThemePen brother, you are saying that I managed the merit myself. I worked hard and created posts with accurate information, but no one supported me. What else could I have done? And ThemePen brother, if you knew about changing the signature, why didn't you guide me? The matter of reputation is dearer to me than anything else. Please remember, if one person's reputation is tarnished, it affects the entire community. You all are damaging your own reputations. Instead of blaming me, ask for the truth.

Thank you.

Thanks for translating it.

It looks like he's looking for support in his local board, hoping that you guys will defend him. He's playing dumb, acting like it wasn't a deliberate action, but at the same time shows defiance, like it's the world's fault that he did it. It's the fault of his peers, the fact that he wasn't paid in another campaign, that other's don't know him well.
He also merited his other accounts because nobody was willing to merit them, so what was he supposed to do?

He's not going to talk to the people who don't understand him, but he may talk to his brothers in faith, as they're above the rest. He doesn't care about those here who criticize him, only about his brothers.

And remember, he wasn't making accounts and joining campaigns out of greed, but because he was going through difficult times.

What's there to learn from this case?
Merit posters! When you merit, you show support.
Every supported post is one more person saved from becoming a campaign abuser and account farmer!

[Saisher]

I'm just surprised that there's no animosity toward the bad deeds that he has done, he prefers blaming his community and his seniors for not guiding him properly.

I find this unethical and distasteful you are supposed to know the rules and you know that it's cheating to accept payment on two campaigns, you don't drag your community to your misdeeds

If one person's reputation is tarnished, it affects the entire community

If you made a mistake you should man enough to accept and not blame your community for not supporting your misdeeds and guiding you.

I'm sure your community will not tolerate your action, you should be out of this forum.

[examplens]

This is a translation of the above post. It may not be perfect English, but have to consider the peculiarities of Urdu and the difficulty of translating from this style of writing.

Reply to illegally allegations
Assalamualaikum, my dear respected brothers,

I am aware that everyone wants to talk about me, but the truth is no one knows the reality. You are all my seniors, and I trust that you will keep the respect in your hearts for me throughout my life. Whether someone speaks ill of me or praises me, I am not affected because in one person, there are 100 good qualities and 1 bad quality. People tend to focus on the negative. I don't care about what others think of me; I only remember the kindness and compassion of all my brothers.

It doesn't matter to me if someone speaks badly about me, as I won't lose anything. If a person is 99% good and 1% bad, people only focus on the bad. I am going through difficult times, and instead of motivating me, everyone is demotivating me. I am worried about this, as it has caused a significant loss for me.

I am not saying that someone should motivate me, but they should also not investigate. Because I know my current situation and my Lord knows it too. I am very hurt by the fact that if someone had seen me struggling, why didn't they guide me? The first campaign I did was without knowledge of this matter. If I had any greed in my heart, I wouldn't have shared this, but the close ones knew about it. I shared it with Gladitorcomeback and Zain Bhai. I also talked to a senior about it, that I didn't receive the payment for 2 weeks. I had done the work properly, as you can see in my posts, but I didn't receive the payment. So, I applied on Duelbits and got accepted. Then someone reported it and created threads about it. Now, I will address the truth there as well.

But I am saddened that my own community is not standing with me. I removed the request text from the Pakistan local board immediately to protect my community. My community is dearer to me than my own life, but no one motivated me on this matter. Every person makes mistakes, and no one is perfect. But no one here is an angel. May Allah bring justice to my case.

ThemePen brother, you are saying that I managed the merit myself. I worked hard and created posts with accurate information, but no one supported me. What else could I have done? And ThemePen brother, if you knew about changing the signature, why didn't you guide me? The matter of reputation is dearer to me than anything else. Please remember, if one person's reputation is tarnished, it affects the entire community. You all are damaging your own reputations. Instead of blaming me, ask for the truth.

Thank you.

Thanks for this translation. It seems that all of you from the Pakistan board are guilty because he cheated in two campaigns. I don't know how he can plead ignorance, and he received payments for multiple Sunday campaigns. Obviously not an incident.

I'm just surprised that there's no animosity toward the bad deeds that he has done, he prefers blaming his community and his seniors for not guiding him properly.

Obviously, he did not expect this kind of outcome and he completely lost the ground under his feet. For a moment he is proud and tries to present it as if it means nothing to him until he realizes that he has run out of opportunities for income from the campaign.

It doesn't matter to me if someone speaks badly about me, as I won't lose anything. If a person is 99% good and 1% bad, people only focus on the bad. I am going through difficult times, and instead of motivating me, everyone is demotivating me. I am worried about this, as it has caused a significant loss for me.

[AB de Royse777]

~snip~ @Royse777 must compensate the company for the past weeks

First I thought it's a weird request but then I emptied my mind and considered the proposal. Logically my client lost money on the guy and it's because of me. I can make many reasons why it missed my radar but all will sound excuses and I don't like excuses.

FYI, I compensated my client with the BTC that was lost on Shan85. It's my own interpretation of this specific case and as we all know it's not something common we experienced before. As managers we all have our freedom of conducting own businesses. Just because I did something does not need to be followed by others and not to be considered as a common practice too.

Cheers,
 

[nutildah]

What's there to learn from this case?
Merit posters! When you merit, you show support.
Every supported post is one more person saved from becoming a campaign abuser and account farmer!

LOL. Given the rest of your post I have to assume you're being sarcastic here...

Based on the merit histories of the known alts, I'd say this person likely still has a few un-busted accounts that are still in signature campaigns. But because they have done a careful job of avoiding any blockchain links, I won't bother mentioning who I suspect they are for now.

Despite this person's heartfelt plea to their countrymen, they are a pathological liar, I don't buy whatever story they may have for one second. Oddly enough I did get a PM from one of them in March asking for a second chance. I said no. Looks like I made the right decision.

[shasan]

I think I disagree with you on this;
Does s/he need to catch all the cheaters in this forum before he could be trusted, if catching one cheater is not enough.
--------
There was a user who wanted to pay for evil fee or copper membership, but theymos mistakenly sent him some btc, as new as s/he was and having joined the forum with a concealed ip, s/he chosed to return the btc. He recieved enough positive feedbacks without waiting for him to reach 5 years in the forum

When there is a financial transaction there is no necessary for time. When I send you 500$ means anyone can trust me for 500$. For example, you send me 500$ btc and then I send you 500$ eth or something else. This means you should trust me for this 500$. Even others can do the same. So, the main factor is not the time in this case.

Lets us discuss another scenario:
You have no financial transactions but you are working a lot of time on the forum and you have found out few scams (it might be one too) you have reached sr member/hero member then anyone can trust you. Because you will not scam a few hundred dollars. Though it can be different if you have no earned merit and all of your merit is from airdrop.

[Shan85]

What happened:: The user (Shan85) wearing both signatures of Duelbits signature as well as signature of BetterCallRaul (each before receiving the payment.

I did not know this happened mistakenly Sorry. I accept my mistake and I’m ready to refund last week payment to both of you Roysee and Hhampuz. SORRY

[examplens]

What happened:: The user (Shan85) wearing both signatures of Duelbits signature as well as signature of BetterCallRaul (each before receiving the payment.

I did not know this happened mistakenly Sorry. I accept my mistake and I’m ready to refund last week payment to both of you Roysee and Hhampuz. SORRY

And you need to return that money, for that contact Royse777 and Hhampuz. Royse777 already paid out of his own pocket for your mess.

Please don't pretend you didn't know it was a foul, you did it for more than a week. It is also clearly indicated in the rules of both campaigns that any changes to signatures are not allowed.

▶️ You are not allowed to change anything on the signature code. If you edit the signature code, I will disqualify you immediately

Do not wear any other Signature or Avatar during your stay in this campaign or you will be removed without notice or payment.

[hugeblack]

There's no obligation for both of them to compensate the company for the past weeks, they're not have any intention to scam the company and Shan85 isn't their alt accounts. I also don't think they need to pay a developer to create a script or adds on to monitor their campaign participants.

There is a difference between a person joining same campaign using more than one account and a person not wearing the signature and being paid.

When the advertising company wants to ads here, they ask the campaign manager to search for the best ways, and therefore he selects best high quality posting account to wear signature. If this does not happen, it means that the company paid money for nothing, and therefore the campaign manager is responsible for that + the amount is less than $300.

The matter is different if scam is using more than one account and/or spam, as the user has advertised for the company, and therefore the campaign manager will not refund the money to them.

It's exactly like this story ---> I've been hacked (Electrum 4.3.2)

But this forum have a lot members, I believe with so many eyes, this case would have very low chance to happen again.

It would be a real bonus, a campaign manager who has this bot and analyzes users' posts, merits, etc. Instead of selecting members and counting the number of posts

[shasan]

I did not know this happened mistakenly Sorry. I accept my mistake and I’m ready to refund last week payment to both of you Roysee and Hhampuz. SORRY

I did not understand why you have not returned the money. If you were a legit user then you could return the fund of both campaign managers then you could say sorry hear. And also message both campaign managers. But before doing anything you should return the fund.

[tbterryboy]

I did not understand why you have not returned the money. If you were a legit user then you could return the fund of both campaign managers then you could say sorry hear. And also message both campaign managers. But before doing anything you should return the fund.

Shan85 used different addresses on both of these campaigns and I checked on duelbit campaign sheet where I Shan85's addy got zero balance right now. So, he has to cover with some other balances and I am sorry to say (but as per typical scammers' behaviors) that may happen unlikely. I mean when scammers talk, they are ready to give all the promises and then easily do forget.

And also message both campaign managers. But before doing anything you should return the fund.

I guess, there will not be any problem for these managers to post BTC addresses here to get refunds from Shan85 (as Shan85 is active here). Also, managers may follow what icopress practices:

I would recommend that either of them employ the method of icopress by giving the week's pay to the scam buster.

[shasan]

Shan85 used different addresses on both of these campaigns and I checked on duelbit campaign sheet where I Shan85's addy got zero balance right now.

Oh, really!! But I am sorry I could see few transactions on the wallet of the accused user. You can see the balance on https://www.blockchain.com/explorer/addresses/btc/bc1q5d3fa52ewajkzd532ejc8wzxleeml2ta9khc08 Hopefully think you will not say that the wallet bc1q5d3fa52ewajkzd532ejc8wzxleeml2ta9khc08 is not the wallet of Shan85. Payment proof as well as wallet address proof  round 134 , round 135, round 136

I guess, there will not be any problem for these managers to post BTC addresses here to get refunds from Shan85 (as Shan85 is active here).

Shan85 knew about it long ago and was posted on the local board for support but failed and that's why posted it here. Payment can be refunded to the wallet where the fund came from see the wallet address of the campaign manager or may ask for the campaign manager. I don't think the campaign managers are afraid of such a small amount. They can bear more loss than this. Now the responsibility is of Shan85.

[rby]

but I've always understood that if you're in a campaign and change your signature even briefly, it's noted by the campaign manager....somehow.  I never understood the somehow, but is that not the case?  And if it were as easy as switching sigs and trying to fool managers, we'd be seeing way more of these shenanigans.

Consider Duelbits that has about 112 participants, it will be very tedious to check if the 122 participants are wearing signature, then check for the post quality, then count the number of posts, update spreadsheet. This is a whole lot of work for a CM that is managing upto 5 different campaigns.

Why I don't blame the managers is because, no normal human being will ever think of switching signature between companies and receiving payments. It's weird to reason such and that is not actually something that I can conceive throughout my stay in this forum and likewise many other genuine users.

~snip~ @Royse777 must compensate the company for the past weeks

First I thought it's a weird request but then I emptied my mind and considered the proposal. Logically my client lost money on the guy and it's because of me. I can make many reasons why it missed my radar but all will sound excuses and I don't like excuses.

FYI, I compensated my client with the BTC that was lost on Shan85. It's my own interpretation of this specific case and as we all know it's not something common we experienced before.

That's your own interpretation. But as I stated earlier, it isn't necessary to refund the companies involved because Shan85 actually promoted the companies but in an inconsistent and dubious manner. There was no such time he was without a signature. Just that at one time, he is wearing BetterCallRaul signature and the other time he will wear Duelbits.  So, there was actually a promotion, although it might be inconsistent.

[Awaklara]

I did not know this happened mistakenly Sorry. I accept my mistake and I’m ready to refund last week payment to both of you Roysee and Hhampuz. SORRY

whether you really don't know or are you looking to profit on purpose. but what is clear, you are violating the clearly written campaign rules. I hope you don't beat yourself up for skipping reading the campaign rules.

In order to refund your payment, you must communicate with the manager. it gives responsible morals. but it won't clear your error. maybe the negative tag will still be in your account.

I will support the flag.

[noormcs5]

In order to refund your payment, you must communicate with the manager. it gives responsible morals. but it won't clear your error. maybe the negative tag will still be in your account.

I will support the flag.

I am sure that he will never refund the amount to the managers whom he tried to scam by changing the signatures and getting double payments in the signature campaigns.

For a person to refund the money, he needs to be morally very sound but a scammer and a thief have no moral values and therefore there is no chance he will refund anything. Good thing is that he is caught and his dirty act has come to the conclusion.