Potential Match Fixing involving Finnish teams FC Futura and Ilves-Kissat

[FairlaySupport]

We need a little bit more time to collect more evidence and will post an update in 24 hours.

[newfish1]

We need a little bit more time to collect more evidence and will post an update in 24 hours.

Please, lets decide on the arbitration panel and then you can present more evidence.

For now, the two people you contacted yourself have agreed, they are

efialtis (Gosubetting.com)
holydarkness

Lets make it 3 in total. As you proposed two of them, I think it will be fair if i have a chance to propose at least one also. Actually I am not an active user of this forum, so I don't know the local community. So I can not propose anybody from my own knowledge. But I have no objection on the person, that was already mentioned here on multiple occasions and appears to be a well respected member of BitcoinTalk family.

So the third member should be cryptofrka or buwaytress (both Legendary users recommended in this thread by others).

Lets make a decision on the third panel member and then you can present more evidence. I feel like there is no need to discuss it further, until the arbitration panel is set and ready to go.

Thank you.

[cryptofrka]

Hey fellas,

thanks for considering me but I'm not really interested in being an arbitrary.

First off, I surely lack experience for such a role - currently time as well. Secondly, considering my position on the forum (promoter, campaign/competition manager) I'm more interested in a potential long-term cooperation with Fairlay than opposing them here - which I'd morally have to do.

That being said, I want to help you because you're clearly in the right. Even if you were a scammer whose brother is a player on the team you bet against, you're right until they prove it - and I haven't seen any proof yet. We should not tolerate withholding winnings based on hunches or '99% certainties', and the betting pattern you use is used by my friend who professionally gambles so I'm familiar with it and I don't think it's that uncommon. Professional gamblers don't bet on the Champions League, they bet on Japanese 2nd league handicaps and table tennis where it's easier to find an edge.

I've seen Fairlay's markets - for example, yesterday there was a 130mBTC pool for women's 2nd tier Brazilian football -7,5 handicap. Such markets are clearly allowed, so a player taking bets on them should never be punished.

In any case, I believe arbitration isn't the best approach anyway. Instead, I’d prefer to demonstrate to Fairlay why I feel they are in the wrong here and why I feel it's important for their long-term reputation on Bitcointalk to resolve this quickly and amicably.

I think that, if this isn't settled soon and in the right way, Fairlay risks a flag being raised against them. In the current state of events I'd have to support it and it's something I'd rather avoid.

[Haunebu]

I have no idea why Fairlay is dragging this issue out for so long. I thought they would have chosen an arbitration panel by now and sorted things out, but are still talking about collecting more evidence.

At this point, the pendulum is clearly swinging in @newfish1's favor. Whatever happened to SBR? Personally, I would vote for experienced punters like @efialtis to be a part of the panel.

[solsolsols]

Whatever happened to SBR?

AFAIK they decided to stop working with SBR after that incident where Fairlay tried to steal cryptocurrency, due to them accusing the player of money laundering. Not sure if they offered to donate those ‘dirty’ btc to charity at the time.  
https://www.sportsbookreview.com/forum/sportsbooks-industry/3557348-fairlay-currently-stealing-my-btc-6-figures.html

All Fairlay's excuses are a joke. A few days ago Pinnacle/Bet365 and other bookies were taking bets on team they suspect in match fixing. To me it's a good sign that the team is ok and Fairlay is trying to steal the players money again.

[FairlaySupport]

We were trying to convince qualified people close to AskGamblers and SPR to decide on that matter but in the end it failed. We have further contacts  to start an official investigation into the matter. However this could take months or even a year to be completed - not what we were hoping for. So we refrain from it for now.  

We will do some further digging and share our findings. Please bear with us.


Just one arbitrator should be enough. So far, we would go for holydarkness, who was recommended to us first and signaled his willingness to participate.  Anyway, we are still investigating the matter and need a little bit more time...

[johanJ]

There seems to be a market for selling fixed matches and Ilves Kissat is mentioned there quite often.   For example, on instagram, 4th and 5th picture at https://www.instagram.com/jay_chinea/

a market for selling fixed matches, where you could literally make hundreds of thousands of dollars via highly criminal activity - advertising itself in the open on instagram ?? you are joking right ?

are you new to the betting scene? on many tipping platforms, in telegram tipping groups, everywhere where betting is involved - every third tipster claims to have fixed games )))))

[notblox1]

If you dont want people betting on highly risky markets like Finnish lower league than you should not allow betting on them.
Proof needs to be presented for fixed matches and that should be reporting to UEFA and Finish federation first, if true this can be much more serious.
Suspicion about something is not enough to confiscate all coins from users.

[un_rank]

There seems to be a market for selling fixed matches and Ilves Kissat is mentioned there quite often.   For example, on instagram, 4th and 5th picture at https://www.instagram.com/jay_chinea/

This is not the evidence you think it is. Would it make sense to suspend the results of all clubs that mentioned in what seems to be a market for fixed matches? Do a random search on any random small club on instagram and come back with the results you see.

I have been silently reading the entire conversation and have my own perception of the issue which is in line with what the majority of people here have voiced out. Fairlay is in the wrong here and have no solid ground to seize the balance of this user and suspend them and you will be building a very bad reputation for yourself if you continue at it.

Just one arbitrator should be enough. So far, we would go for holydarkness, who was recommended to us first and signaled his willingness to participate.

No, you will need at least 2, 3 will be perfect cause then you have a tie breaker, but 1 is no arbitration at all.

- Jay -

[Hamphser]

If you dont want people betting on highly risky markets like Finnish lower league than you should not allow betting on them.
Proof needs to be presented for fixed matches and that should be reporting to UEFA and Finish federation first, if true this can be much more serious.
Suspicion about something is not enough to confiscate all coins from users.

When there's some accusation then it should really be needing up that strong evidence because rumors or feelings or point of view wont really be enough on drawing up conclusions that its fixed.

Just one arbitrator should be enough. So far, we would go for holydarkness, who was recommended to us first and signaled his willingness to participate.  Anyway, we are still investigating the matter and need a little bit more time...

Take your time with your investigation and dont forget to update if you have seen something with that digging.

[efialtis]

We will blacklist Fairlay first thing in the morning. We will then also go public about this on major industry portals.

Operations like this are the reason why the majority of the iGaming industry still considers crypto gambling/betting to be shady as hell, which in many cases is a valid claim.

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

Tagged them as well, not only can these people not be trusted. It`s quite ironic that they are the ones claiming abuse when it`s them abusing.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

We will blacklist Fairlay first thing in the morning. We will then also go public about this on major industry portals.

Operations like this are the reason why the majority of the iGaming industry still considers crypto gambling/betting to be shady as hell, which in many cases is a valid claim.

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

Tagged them as well, not only can these people not be trusted. It`s quite ironic that they are the ones claiming abuse when it`s them abusing.

Awesome, it's great to see you are taking action against such a strange behaviour.
People should be warned about this, not only here in our forum.
They way they handle this situation is just ridiculous and I have never seen anything like this before. It really is sad to see cause they looked like a well running site and I even considered joining them at some point in the past. But now it looks like I made a good decision not doing so.

[efialtis]

We will blacklist Fairlay first thing in the morning. We will then also go public about this on major industry portals.

Operations like this are the reason why the majority of the iGaming industry still considers crypto gambling/betting to be shady as hell, which in many cases is a valid claim.

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

Tagged them as well, not only can these people not be trusted. It`s quite ironic that they are the ones claiming abuse when it`s them abusing.

Blacklisted on both GOSU sites - sharing the story on industry portals shortly, too.

[un_rank]

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

They have had 5 pages of replies telling them they are in the wrong but have not bulged even a bit, they rather came back with a flimsy evidence from Instagram which should not get a second look and then deleted that when they did not get the "shocked" response they were expecting.

I will give them the room to reply before tagging them, but I do not fault you for doing it now, maybe that is the push they need to act professional.

- Jay -

[holydarkness]

[...]

Just one arbitrator should be enough. So far, we would go for holydarkness, who was recommended to us first and signaled his willingness to participate.

No, you will need at least 2, 3 will be perfect cause then you have a tie breaker, but 1 is no arbitration at all.

- Jay -

Hmm... somehow missed my name being mentioned and discussed here in between that crazy multi-threads discussion with uhh... one of the deadly sin. The fact that two people engaged in pyramid quote with my name [unfortunately] being in the earlier quote, that dragged along all the way down, certainly didn't help as my tg notification bot goes crazy.

Anyway, agree.

As I previously mentioned, when I "mediate", I simply ask questions until it became apparent who did what and who is who. I am not Solomon, I believe my wisdom is insufficient enough to make a final say that people has to follow. So if we leave that to me and only me, well... I think I don't have to paint it to us of what'll happen [hint: it involves the word "decade" and/or "eternity"].

[newfish1]

Anyway, agree.

Thank you for agreeing to this not easy task.

Seeing where this thing was going (before Gosu blacklisted them) and never having an intention to somehow harm Fairlay's reputation (because frankly speaking I really do like them a lot and I still think this whole thing is one big misunderstanding, because Fairlay guys are not really from betting industry, but rather IT specialists and Crypto guys), I made another attempt to prove to Fairlay that I am just a real big stakes gambler.

I offered them to bet a total of ridiculous amount of 10 BTC on Euro2024 games (the biggest market there is in the industry now) before I could withdraw.

My offer was refused and instead I was promised a "thorough investigation" by Fairlay (what kind of authority do they have to investigate anything across so many borders?), that will take God how much time. I will be notified when it is completed.

All of these, after they agreed on you, holydarkness, as the mediator.

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

[holydarkness]

Anyway, agree.

Thank you for agreeing to this not easy task.

Actually, that is me agreeing that one person, me, holding the final say is not a good thing.

[...]
All of these, after they agreed on you, holydarkness, as the mediator.

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

I don't think so.

Though they previously mentioned that they're looking for an experienced mediator and is in touch with Betting Integrity Unit, and seemingly voted me and efialtis out, not long after I made my post regarding it, they reached to me again through PM.

The content of the PM is, naturally, can't be disclosed, but I think it's safe to tell the gist of it, that they're still interested to have me overseeing it, and that they're [at least the impression that I get] weighting my competence through several questions.

I am interested to know about your betting strategy, that you've keep tight in your pocket all this time, and that you claimed to be a proof of your innocence. Perhaps we can go with that? See if it put thing back in motion? Given this thread seemingly stuck on a point and didn't move in any direction.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

Anyway, agree.

Thank you for agreeing to this not easy task.

Seeing where this thing was going (before Gosu blacklisted them) and never having an intention to somehow harm Fairlay's reputation (because frankly speaking I really do like them a lot and I still think this whole thing is one big misunderstanding, because Fairlay guys are not really from betting industry, but rather IT specialists and Crypto guys), I made another attempt to prove to Fairlay that I am just a real big stakes gambler.

I offered them to bet a total of ridiculous amount of 10 BTC on Euro2024 games (the biggest market there is in the industry now) before I could withdraw.

My offer was refused and instead I was promised a "thorough investigation" by Fairlay (what kind of authority do they have to investigate anything across so many borders?), that will take God how much time. I will be notified when it is completed.

All of these, after they agreed on you, holydarkness, as the mediator.

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

Dude, don't bother with them.
If they do this to you once, what would stop them to do it again and confiscate even higher amounts.
This is a lesson learned I would say.
Why don't you use betfair? Just because of crypto or any other reasons? I mean the markets are better at bf and obviously it's much safe as we have learned.
Or just use outright pinnacle, since they are somehow connected to them anyway, why bother using fl instead of the real deal? Pinnacle also accepts crypto payments by the way, if this is a big factor to you.

I think any site would be happy to take your business if you are willing to bet high numbers.

[Wapfika]

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

To simply put your issue in summary. They didn’t plan to pay even with this mediator shenanigans since they already have a verdict on your case regardless of the result.

By simply judging their action about permanently ban you due to the match fixed which they assumed. This casino doesn’t have plan to negotiate this but rather they are just finding a way to finally get a support. They failed to gain it using forum mediator so they will just keep looking for other mediators to delay this issue until everyone forgotten already.

@Efialtis feedback is the only good move here and will serve as receipt about this casino action.

[efialtis]

When they saw my post, they PMed me, asking me to reach out to them via a "secure connection".

1. They really seem to have some kind of "security" paranoia
2. I told them they could contact me via the official BTCGOSU email
3. Not heard anything from them yet

Let me be clear, as usual, I am not here to bash anyone, I am not here to bash brands, etc. When you act unreasonable and unprofessional though, then I say so and take action. Running a gambling affiliate business, I think that`s the least I can and have to do - sure, most operators would love all affiliates to be pure advertisers with no questions asked, but that`s not me and not the BTCGOSU`s reason for existence or else, it would be just another random affiliate platform - I am trying hard to do better than that.