🔥 GingerWallet.io - Desktop, Non-custodial, Open source | #CoinJoin

[ABCbits]

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

Can you explain more how the 2FA works? I've read the FAQ just now and it seems the user depends on your server to obtain encryption key which used to encrypt/decrypt user's wallet files. If my understand is correct, what would happen if user lose access to their 2FA or your server isn't accessible?

[NotATether]

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

Can you explain more how the 2FA works? I've read the FAQ just now and it seems the user depends on your server to obtain encryption key which used to encrypt/decrypt user's wallet files. If my understand is correct, what would happen if user lose access to their 2FA or your server isn't accessible?

Why does a wallet need 2FA?

It sounds like an implementation similar to Electrum x TrustedCoin, otherwise this makes no sense. Ginger wallet's website doesn't have a registration system.

[GingerWallet]

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

Can you explain more how the 2FA works? I've read the FAQ just now and it seems the user depends on your server to obtain encryption key which used to encrypt/decrypt user's wallet files. If my understand is correct, what would happen if user lose access to their 2FA or your server isn't accessible?

Yes, that's right, the server stores an encryption key. If the 2fa server is not available, the wallet is not available. The user can reset it with the original 12 seed word and password.
This is inconvenient, but still better than someone getting the unencrypted file and keylogging the password (unfortunately we know of such a case).

[GingerWallet]

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

Can you explain more how the 2FA works? I've read the FAQ just now and it seems the user depends on your server to obtain encryption key which used to encrypt/decrypt user's wallet files. If my understand is correct, what would happen if user lose access to their 2FA or your server isn't accessible?

Why does a wallet need 2FA?

It sounds like an implementation similar to Electrum x TrustedCoin, otherwise this makes no sense. Ginger wallet's website doesn't have a registration system.

I am not familiar with the Electrum's method of implantation, so I can't provide a direct comparison. As for Ginger, it does not involve any formal user registration. The "user ID," if you can even call it that, is simply a random sequence of bytes stored in 2fa_info.gws. This sequence is generated during the two-factor authentication (2FA) registration on the server side and contains no identifiable user information.

To simplify, the server merely responds to a predetermined random byte sequence (client-server ID) with another one (the wallet encryption key). This exchange ensures security without directly linking any user data to the process.

[JollyGood]

I did use Ginger Wallet once in the past because I wanted to know what the service was like and posted about it here mentioning the fee deductions and about wanting to test Open Coordinator if I used it again but that was on a previous version. Has anybody downloaded the latest version of Ginger Wallet either to coinjoin or to understand their 2FA or to simply take a look at it out of curiosity?

Why does a wallet need 2FA?

It sounds like an implementation similar to Electrum x TrustedCoin, otherwise this makes no sense. Ginger wallet's website doesn't have a registration system.

[ABCbits]

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

Can you explain more how the 2FA works? I've read the FAQ just now and it seems the user depends on your server to obtain encryption key which used to encrypt/decrypt user's wallet files. If my understand is correct, what would happen if user lose access to their 2FA or your server isn't accessible?

Yes, that's right, the server stores an encryption key. If the 2fa server is not available, the wallet is not available. The user can reset it with the original 12 seed word and password.
This is inconvenient, but still better than someone getting the unencrypted file and keylogging the password (unfortunately we know of such a case).

I see. I only can hope those who use that feature backup their 12 seed words and password properly. Although by doing that, user would lose label on their TX or UTXO which could lead to worsening privacy.

--snip--

Why does a wallet need 2FA?

It sounds like an implementation similar to Electrum x TrustedCoin, otherwise this makes no sense. Ginger wallet's website doesn't have a registration system.

I have no knowledge of the Electrumos method of implantation, so I have no basis for comparison. Ginger has no registration. The "user id", if you can call it that, is contained in 2fa_info.gws, a completely random sequence of bytes, generated during 2fa registration on the server side. It cannot and does not store any user information. If I want to simplify it a lot, all that happens is that the server responds to a fixed random byte sequence (clientserverid) with another one (wallet encyption key).

Your and Electrum 2FA works differently. Electrum 2FA refers to 2-of-3 multi-sig wallet, where user provide correct 2FA to get his TX signed. In case the user lose 2FA or TrustedCoin not available, he can use seed words which contain 2 master private keys.

[JollyGood]

It seems another alteration that was made in your latest release was on the config file but you did not announce it.

In the previous version it was easy to edit the config file to add an alternative coordinator by modifying the line "MainNetCoordinatorUri" and then restarting the client. After that the connection would be with the new coordinator but the way the new update works is that every time you change the coordinator and restart the client it reverts back to the Ginger Wallet default coordinator.

Why did you add that particular functionality to force anybody using Ginger Wallet to either use your default coordinator or basically not use the wallet at all?

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

[GingerWallet]

Solo with large coins?
The Ginger Wallet client provides more efficient management for users with larger coins. Instead of creating a large change output that requires multiple rounds to break down, Ginger splits the coin into 4-5 smaller parts in the first round.
These smaller parts align better with the denomination levels, resulting in a more efficient coinjoin process.
If you plan to use the Ginger coordinator, we recommend using our client to avoid these unnecessary decompositions.
Ginger can be installed independently without interfering with other clients or coordinators.

Give it a try!

https://gingerwallet.io

https://t.me/GingerWallet

[Pmalek]

<Snip>

It's weird that they would make a new post on the forum and completely neglect this question that you brought up.
I think the answer is pretty clear, isn't it? They charge a commission for coinjoins. Not for all, but for some. The wallet resets to the default coordinator because they want to continue charging coinjoin fees. That wouldn't be the case if you used a different coordinator. If it's all a mistake and the change was made by accident, GingerWallet is free to say so. 

[GingerWallet]

<Snip>

It's weird that they would make a new post on the forum and completely neglect this question that you brought up.
I think the answer is pretty clear, isn't it? They charge a commission for coinjoins. Not for all, but for some. The wallet resets to the default coordinator because they want to continue charging coinjoin fees. That wouldn't be the case if you used a different coordinator. If it's all a mistake and the change was made by accident, GingerWallet is free to say so. 

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

Apologies for the delayed response. Should you have any further questions, feel free to join our discussion in the Telegram group.

Thank you for your understanding.

https://gingerwallet.io
https://t.me/GingerWallet

[GingerWallet]

It seems another alteration that was made in your latest release was on the config file but you did not announce it.

In the previous version it was easy to edit the config file to add an alternative coordinator by modifying the line "MainNetCoordinatorUri" and then restarting the client. After that the connection would be with the new coordinator but the way the new update works is that every time you change the coordinator and restart the client it reverts back to the Ginger Wallet default coordinator.

Why did you add that particular functionality to force anybody using Ginger Wallet to either use your default coordinator or basically not use the wallet at all?

We added Two-Factor Authentication (2FA) in our new release for more protection!
You can download the new version and read more on our website. https://gingerwallet.io

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

Apologies for the delayed response. Should you have any further questions, feel free to join our discussion in the Telegram group.

Thank you for your understanding.

https://gingerwallet.io
https://t.me/GingerWallet

[Pmalek]

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

But if I wanted to use the GingerWallet with a different coordinator than the default one (your own), can I do that? If I can, then how? According to JollyGood, users have to restart their wallet after changing coordinator. When the wallet reloads, it goes back to the default coordinator.

[NotATether]

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

Theoretically we should still be able to switch the coordinator when we open Ginger Wallet since it is based off of Wasabi code and Wasabi already has this functionality.

[GingerWallet]

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

But if I wanted to use the GingerWallet with a different coordinator than the default one (your own), can I do that? If I can, then how? According to JollyGood, users have to restart their wallet after changing coordinator. When the wallet reloads, it goes back to the default coordinator.

Exactly. You can use Ginger Wallet only with the Ginger coordinator.

[GingerWallet]

Over the past two months, Ginger has focused on optimizing smaller coinjoins for greater effectiveness, resulting in higher anonscores per round. Please note that these improvements are only available when using the Ginger client.

Additionally, the latest Wasabi release no longer supports the free remix and friends don't pay features. This means that if you're using the latest Wasabi client, you’ll incur fees in situations where they shouldn’t apply, leading to higher costs. Therefore, Ginger strongly recommends using the Ginger client when participating with the Ginger Coordinator.

Both Wasabi and Ginger clients function independently and can be installed on the same system, allowing you to switch between them as needed.

If you have any questions, feel free to join our Telegram channel: https://t.me/GingerWallet

Happy Coinjoining!

[Pmalek]

Theoretically we should still be able to switch the coordinator when we open Ginger Wallet since it is based off of Wasabi code and Wasabi already has this functionality.

If everything with GingerWallet is open-source, then those who know how to code could code out the function that the wallet resets itself back to the default Ginger coordinator after a restart or just stick with Wasabi if they don't want to be forced to use the GingerWallet coordinator. Not that I am recommending one over the other.

[GingerWallet]

Theoretically we should still be able to switch the coordinator when we open Ginger Wallet since it is based off of Wasabi code and Wasabi already has this functionality.

If everything with GingerWallet is open-source, then those who know how to code could code out the function that the wallet resets itself back to the default Ginger coordinator after a restart or just stick with Wasabi if they don't want to be forced to use the GingerWallet coordinator. Not that I am recommending one over the other.

Certainly possible, but keep in mind that the two wallets begin to move to different directions regarding coinjoins. If you misunderstood something in your change or the protocol begins to differ and your client signs the transaction without all the outputs, even the free coordinator will gladly take your money.

[GingerWallet]

Exciting news! 🎉 Ginger Coordinator hit over 10 BTC in daily traffic yesterday! 🚀 Remember, CoinJoin is free for transactions under 0.01 BTC (around $635), plus free remixes, and friends don't pay! 🙌

Come hang out with us on Telegram: https://t.me/GingerWallet
Or check us out at gingerwallet.io! 🌐

[JollyGood]

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

But if I wanted to use the GingerWallet with a different coordinator than the default one (your own), can I do that? If I can, then how? According to JollyGood, users have to restart their wallet after changing coordinator. When the wallet reloads, it goes back to the default coordinator.

This has been 100% checked. The latest version of the Ginger Wallet reverts to the default Ginger Wallet coordinator no matter how many times you want to change to another option (for example Open Coordiantor) because editing the config file is not a problem but the settings only change when the wallet is restarted. The way Ginger Wallet have altered the open source code, it automatically reverts to the original config file including Ginger Wallet coordinator upon restart.

Hello,
I would like to clarify that we do not intend to assume responsibility for coordinators that we are unfamiliar with. Regarding the change you mentioned, please note that it is purely cosmetic. It simply made it more apparent that the client has always been connecting to the Ginger server, which was the case even before the mentioned update.

Theoretically we should still be able to switch the coordinator when we open Ginger Wallet since it is based off of Wasabi code and Wasabi already has this functionality.

In theory yes. That function was working in their initial release but they have modified the code in the latest release in order to force users to pay Ginger Wallet in order to use their coinjoin instead of allowing them an opportunity to select a different coordinator.

Exactly. You can use Ginger Wallet only with the Ginger coordinator.

And that will probably be the biggest problem you will face when trying to people to download the wallet.

[Pmalek]

<Snip>

If we leave the coordinator issue aside for now, what would be the advantage of using the GingerWallet compared to using Wasabi Wallet if someone wants to do coinjoins? It's a rebranded Wasabi product with certain tweaks and changes. If it doesn't offer anything revolutionary different and also forces you to stick with the default coordinator, I would see no reason to use it. Again, this is only if I was interested in touching anything related to Wasabi.

I agree with you that this change GingerWallet made can negatively impact the interest for their software. Kruw's coordinator has the biggest share of the traffic already.