Armed Feds Prepare For Showdown With Nevada Cattle Rancher

[bryant.coleman]

Where is the embarrassment in the video?

I was talking about the embarrassment which was caused to the anti-BLM movement. Check the video, he was almost acting like an unofficial spokesman for the movement.

[niothor]

Where is the embarrassment in the video?

I was talking about the embarrassment which was caused to the anti-BLM movement. Check the video, he was almost acting like an unofficial spokesman for the movement.

You know , with your views about the us government and constant criticism , I have the right to wonder , right ?

But the support for both  VanDerBeek and Bundy will go down after this.

‘‘The only thing worse than tyranny is anarchy, and we certainly recognize that,’’ Bundy said.

Too late...

[counter]

Well this is news to me.  I had no clue the shooter was that the ranch.  This does have an essence of anarchy to it at the moment.  World seems to be getting crazier by the minute.  Obviously the is an ever evolving story and I much to catch up on.  All I can say now is something seems very odd about the shooting.

[tvbcof]

Ya, so I was just gazing into my crystal ball, and I thought I'd let all my new-found friends from this thread know how things will turn out in Bundy-land.

An anonymous wealthy donor shows up and pays Bundy's past fees.  Sharp-eyed viewers might notice that Bundy has not done anything terribly wrong, nor have any of his family.  He's been an annoying pain-in-the-ass but there is no law against that.  He's also been the gift that keeps on giving to us on the left by telling tall tails that are easily dismissed, making absurd arguments which are trivial to shoot down, making out-of-the-blue and over-the-top racial comments which just happened to be timed to royally screw his political supporters, etc and just happened to be caught by a reporter who happened to be around.  That might make a certain small segment of analysts say 'hmmm...', but not a lot.

In short, Bundy will be leasing land from the BLM for his somewhat reduced herd next year and paying the fees like all the rest of the Ranchers.  His problem which have been building for 20+ years will be resolved and behind him.

Close enough: http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2014/07/blm_wont_back_up_claim_rancher.html

One marker for a modern U.S. psy-op seems to be that a group who serves as a primary party gets something of value out of the deal.  In the Sandy Hook one, for instance, the Baha'i faith already had their 'unity project' set up in Newtown and it got a big kick (and shit-loads of money) out of the deal.  The 'parents' of the 'dead kids' inevitably displayed this utterly bizarre attitude and way of speaking in their countless interviews so it is pretty clear that most of them were Baha'i.

Anyway, I'll leave the rest below for the enjoyment of the reader.  As someone pointed out above, it seems that the Las Vegas shooting may (or may not) have already validated one of my predictions.  The latest Snowden leaks show how mass analysis of social media and DARPA funded experiments involving active manipulation by Facebook do occur.  It would be almost inconceivably that this did not occur in this Bundy case.  I'll wager that the algorithms have ground on a decent amount of the data provided by this very thread on this very forum even.

There are a contingent of people who really are 'milita' and at least in their own minds 'patriots'.  They were stirred by the cause, packed up their guns, and drove on out to NV.  Some of them were there for the showdown with the BLM.  They are now in a shit-load of trouble and they've got no way out.  Most of them have already packed up and gone home, but they will be quietly picked up by the cops in the coming months.

There are a contingent of individuals who worked formally worked on this psyop.  They will vanish into the ether that they came out of it.

There are a contingent of individuals who are still potentially useful in future psyops.  Lots of them just happened to miss the goings-down during the 'showdown'.  They might continue on in their present capacity.

Then there are the general public.  They'll be left with a general discomfort about the 2nd amendment and the dangers of certain 'extreme' groups.  The label 'extremist' will be more effective when pinned on the chest of future adversaries, and laws which protect 'the people' from various dangers (and guns in particular) will be easier to pass.

Most of the general public was mainly unaware or apathetic about this event.  Those who were not will have records added to their dossiers deep within the NSA databases detailing how actively they researched things, what web-sites they looked at, what they wrote on various forums, etc, etc.

[hologram]

World need more freedom lovers like this guy...

[tvbcof]

...
Anyway, I'll leave the rest below for the enjoyment of the reader.
...

<snip - predictions>

Then there are the general public.  They'll be left with a general discomfort about the 2nd amendment and the dangers of certain 'extreme' groups.  The label 'extremist' will be more effective when pinned on the chest of future adversaries, and laws which protect 'the people' from various dangers (and guns in particular) will be easier to pass.

<snip - predictions>

Whadaya know!  A bunch of these today when I check Google News:  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/10/cliven-bundy-report_n_5574512.html

[tvbcof]

Ya, so I was just gazing into my crystal ball, and I thought I'd let all my new-found friends from this thread know how things will turn out in Bundy-land.

An anonymous wealthy donor shows up and pays Bundy's past fees.  Sharp-eyed viewers might notice that Bundy has not done anything terribly wrong, nor have any of his family.  He's been an annoying pain-in-the-ass but there is no law against that.  He's also been the gift that keeps on giving to us on the left by telling tall tails that are easily dismissed, making absurd arguments which are trivial to shoot down, making out-of-the-blue and over-the-top racial comments which just happened to be timed to royally screw his political supporters, etc and just happened to be caught by a reporter who happened to be around.  That might make a certain small segment of analysts say 'hmmm...', but not a lot.

In short, Bundy will be leasing land from the BLM for his somewhat reduced herd next year and paying the fees like all the rest of the Ranchers.  His problem which have been building for 20+ years will be resolved and behind him.

There are a contingent of people who really are 'milita' and at least in their own minds 'patriots'.  They were stirred by the cause, packed up their guns, and drove on out to NV.  Some of them were there for the showdown with the BLM.  They are now in a shit-load of trouble and they've got no way out.  Most of them have already packed up and gone home, but they will be quietly picked up by the cops in the coming months.

There are a contingent of individuals who worked formally worked on this psyop.  They will vanish into the ether that they came out of it.

There are a contingent of individuals who are still potentially useful in future psyops.  Lots of them just happened to miss the goings-down during the 'showdown'.  They might continue on in their present capacity.

Then there are the general public.  They'll be left with a general discomfort about the 2nd amendment and the dangers of certain 'extreme' groups.  The label 'extremist' will be more effective when pinned on the chest of future adversaries, and laws which protect 'the people' from various dangers (and guns in particular) will be easier to pass.

Most of the general public was mainly unaware or apathetic about this event.  Those who were not will have records added to their dossiers deep within the NSA databases detailing how actively they researched things, what web-sites they looked at, what they wrote on various forums, etc, etc.

Well, wadayaknow?

  http://www.biologicaldiversity.org/news/press_releases/2015/bundy-02-26-2015.html

Not exactly as I predicted, but the net affect is the same.  Bundy's cattle are happily munching on what little vegetation grows in that desert and I think it's fair to suspect that this is in thanks for a job well done on the part of the Bundy clan.  I'd rate it as one of the most successful domestic psy-ops (which became legal due to the 2013 NDAA) because probably only 0.01% of the population even suspects it as possible.

Since this thread started I've personally moved much farther to the right on a lot of issues and in particular land use issues on account of me personally being extorted by my state's DEQ.  I don't change my stance on the Bundy issue one iota and stand by everything I said on this thread.  Why?  Consistency.  I am a strong believer in property rights and always have been even when I was much more left-leaning.  The land Bundy's cattle are using belongs to the Federal govt.  It is there right to do whatever the fuck they please with it more or less.

I think the Feds own to much land and that we as a society should move that in the other direction, but that's the way it is in the here and now.  Bundy's activities were not achieving this goal at all and caused significant regressions on multiple fronts.  Further, I strongly suspect that this was more by design than by accident.

[TECSHARE]

Well, wadayaknow?

  http://www.biologicaldiversity.org/news/press_releases/2015/bundy-02-26-2015.html

Not exactly as I predicted, but the net affect is the same.  Bundy's cattle are happily munching on what little vegetation grows in that desert and I think it's fair to suspect that this is in thanks for a job well done on the part of the Bundy clan.  I'd rate it as one of the most successful domestic psy-ops (which became legal due to the 2013 NDAA) because probably only 0.01% of the population even suspects it as possible.

Since this thread started I've personally moved much farther to the right on a lot of issues and in particular land use issues on account of me personally being extorted by my state's DEQ.  I don't change my stance on the Bundy issue one iota and stand by everything I said on this thread.  Why?  Consistency.  I am a strong believer in property rights and always have been even when I was much more left-leaning.  The land Bundy's cattle are using belongs to the Federal govt.  It is there right to do whatever the fuck they please with it more or less.

I think the Feds own to much land and that we as a society should move that in the other direction, but that's the way it is in the here and now.  Bundy's activities were not achieving this goal at all and caused significant regressions on multiple fronts.  Further, I strongly suspect that this was more by design than by accident.

They have a name for when people refuse to change their stance regardless of their change in understanding of the facts, confirmation bias.

If I am not mistaken, the "federal lands" Bundy's cattle are grazing upon were originally property of the Bundy family, given up to the federal government with the explicit condition that he, and his family, in perpetuity be allowed to graze the lands free of fees. Why is it that the rights of the federal government should be maintained, but it is ok to disregard the protections afforded to the Bundy family under that agreement?

As far as this being a psyop, I am in agreement with you on this part, however that does not mean Bundy himself is complicit. IMO this served as sort of a honeypot to lure in reactionaries and militiamen so they could be identified, as well as gauging the public response to such actions, and perhaps even a way to influence people into supporting such actions from the federal government. This could have all easily been set up around him without any complicity on his part as a captive participant.

[tvbcof]

They have a name for when people refuse to change their stance regardless of their change in understanding of the facts, confirmation bias.

If you are accusing me of confirmation bias, wrong.  The facts have not changed one iota.  And consequently my position has not either.

Due to my research of the last year I believe it even more likely that there was slimyness on the part of Reid and the eco-scammers which I never doubted to begin with (as I've stated on this thread), but that does not change the facts about property rights.

If I am not mistaken, the "federal lands" Bundy's cattle are grazing upon were originally property of the Bundy family, given up to the federal government with the explicit condition that he, and his family, in perpetuity be allowed to graze the lands free of fees. Why is it that the rights of the federal government should be maintained, but it is ok to disregard the protections afforded to the Bundy family under that agreement?
...

Ya, well, your are mistaken.  Drastically.  The land was never owned by the state of Nevada and never by the inbred freaks who took up residence there.  Bundy tried to make some hereditary claim that he inherited some right to the land through his ancestors.  Sorry, but this is America and not some feudal middle-ages European thing we've got going here. and Bundy never did even try to cough up any paperwork to substantiate his ludicrous position.  Anyway, due to the breeding patterns of the people in that neck of the woods, anyone could make the same claim that Bundy was trying to make a go of.

[TECSHARE]

words

The facts have not changed, but your understanding of them has, yet you still cling to the same conclusions. Sounds like confirmation bias to me. Additionally I think you are far to easily dismissing his claims. Here is some additional information on his claims to grazing rights. IMO this is beynd Cliven Bundy's rights, it is also an issue of states rights.

"In 1993, to “protect” the tortoise (among other things), “the Bureau of Land Management designated hundreds of thousands of acres of federal land for strict conservation efforts”—efforts entailing “the elimination of livestock grazing” in certain areas, the Post reports. The BLM “purchased” “grazing privileges from cattle ranchers who formerly used BLM land,” but Bundy family members refused to “willingly sell their grazing privileges,” the Post reports."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2014/04/30/cliven-bundy-is-a-racist-but-federal-ownership-of-state-land-is-still-a-serious-problem/
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/04/cliven-bundy-bureau-of-land-management-10-things-to-know-105735.html
https://www.theobjectivestandard.com/2014/04/cliven-bundy-cattle-standoff-consequence-illegitimate-government-claims-land/

[tvbcof]

words

The facts have not changed, but your understanding of them has, yet you still cling to the same conclusions. Sounds like confirmation bias to me. Additionally I think you are far to easily dismissing his claims. Here is some additional information on his claims to grazing rights. IMO this is beynd Cliven Bundy's rights, it is also an issue of states rights.

"In 1993, to “protect” the tortoise (among other things), “the Bureau of Land Management designated hundreds of thousands of acres of federal land for strict conservation efforts”—efforts entailing “the elimination of livestock grazing” in certain areas, the Post reports. The BLM “purchased” “grazing privileges from cattle ranchers who formerly used BLM land,” but Bundy family members refused to “willingly sell their grazing privileges,” the Post reports."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2014/04/30/cliven-bundy-is-a-racist-but-federal-ownership-of-state-land-is-still-a-serious-problem/
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/04/cliven-bundy-bureau-of-land-management-10-things-to-know-105735.html
https://www.theobjectivestandard.com/2014/04/cliven-bundy-cattle-standoff-consequence-illegitimate-government-claims-land/

Most of your links say what I said.  #2 in politico is just wrong and this is easily ascertained.  Bundy's daddy bought the 160 acre melon patch in the 1940's and Bundy himself only got the cows in the 50's or some such (after watching J.R. Ewing on 'Dallas' or some such one supposes.)  The Taylor Grazing Act started before both of these things:

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grazing_rights_in_Nevada#Federal_rangeland_laws

Bundy's only claim is that he is a Mormon and there were Mormon's in the area before the state was chartered.  And his grandmother was from  the general area when she was born.  Laughable.  Bundy tried to argue that everyone is mistaken and this is state property (not fed) because the law is crystal clear and not favorable to his position.  If wishes were horses then beggars would ride.  Frankly, I wish it was state property myself but at this point it just isn't so.  Sad day for Bundy.

Now it appears that Bundy does have water rights which do exist, are extremely valuable, and he worked his ass off for them.  I've defended these rights in this thread and believe that he should be handsomely compensated for them if the Feds change their land use priorities.  I suspect he and others would be screwed on this if the eco-rat-bastards have their way.  That would be wrong in my book no matter how much I despise the guy.

The concept of Feds "purchasing" his "rights" makes no sense.  They may have wished to buy up the remainder of his lease.  If so, he should have taken the money because when the lease is up, it's up and any quasi-claim to run his cattle would be poof.  That happened years ago.  Bundy got desperate and tried to invent bullshit laws out of whole cloth.  What I cannot stand about these 'sovereign citizen' types is that all of their deep philosophical bullshit happens to be extremely self-serving and rediculous.  Even worse than the greenies!  If people want to knuckle down and do the hard work of effecting political change, God bless.  I may even be involved myself in something like state's rights.  If they want to pull shit out of their ass and threaten anyone who calls them on it, good ridence.  In Bundy's case I still think there is a very good chance that he was working with the Feds hand-n-glove and now taking his payola.  In that case he is about as loathsome as a human can get.

edit - fix link.  From link:

Prior to the enactment of the TGA, an open-range system existed on public domain land.[8] The TGA was enacted by Congress to prevent overgrazing of rangelands,[9] and authorized the permitted use of lands designated as available for livestock grazing while specifying that grazing permits convey no right, title, or interest to such lands.

[Troonetpt]

This man represents what Americans are; the feds represent obozo’s gestapo and smell blood. I’m sure Harry Reid would not intervene unless he could make a buck off of it. Where’s the governor, the militia and the local Sheriff? The Sheriff has A LOT of authority against the feds if he has the stones to use it. My prayers for Mr. Bundy and his family.

[tvbcof]

Ya, so I was just gazing into my crystal ball, and I thought I'd let all my new-found friends from this thread know how things will turn out in Bundy-land.
...
In short, Bundy will be leasing land from the BLM for his somewhat reduced herd next year and paying the fees like all the rest of the Ranchers.  His problem which have been building for 20+ years will be resolved and behind him.
...
There are a contingent of individuals who are still potentially useful in future psyops.  Lots of them just happened to miss the goings-down during the 'showdown'.  They might continue on in their present capacity.

Then there are the general public.  They'll be left with a general discomfort about the 2nd amendment and the dangers of certain 'extreme' groups.  The label 'extremist' will be more effective when pinned on the chest of future adversaries, and laws which protect 'the people' from various dangers (and guns in particular) will be easier to pass.

Most of the general public was mainly unaware or apathetic about this event.  Those who were not will have records added to their dossiers deep within the NSA databases detailing how actively they researched things, what web-sites they looked at, what they wrote on various forums, etc, etc.

Now that the Bundy / Malheur wildlife refuge psy-op is pretty well wrapped up with extraction of the formal operatives I thought I'd take another victory lap around my predictions to add to my collection.

What is awfully heartening to see is that lots and lots of people saw this hoax from quite early on.  Very much unlike the original Bundy Ranch affair.

I get pretty much all of my news on important subjects from the alt media these days.  The main reason for this is that the corporate media is 100% unreliable while there are nuggets of truth and critical thinking displayed by individuals in the alt media.  It can be damn difficult to pick them out however.  Some shills spend considerable effort building a reputation and make very few mis-steps in doing so.  The Malheur hoax was valuable in this regard.  It was big enough for some of the shills to blow their cover on.  <cough-ProfessorDoom1-cough>

In this latest psy-op Pete Scamshilli was very active which was enough to tip a fair number of people off right out of the gate.  Interestingly 'Sheriff Mack' was no where to be seen.