megashira1
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August 16, 2014, 06:25:38 PM |
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Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. You trust BTER more than CRYPTI devs at this point in time?  |
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rtrtcrypto
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August 16, 2014, 06:25:43 PM |
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Great - so no product and no money back! Great decision making  Again, it appears people are misunderstanding the severity of the situation BTER finds itself in. They will not survive this. So, they will either be extremely honest and give the XCR team their (our) money - or they will take off with it. I would still love to hear the devs backup plan in case of a complete heist of the 750 btc that BTER holds. Would it be game over? Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. |
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twistelaar
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August 16, 2014, 06:29:18 PM |
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Is it safe to keep my Crypti @ BTER?
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megashira1
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Activity: 1146
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August 16, 2014, 06:29:49 PM |
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Great - so no product and no money back! Great decision making Again, it appears people are misunderstanding the severity of the situation BTER finds itself in. They will not survive this. So, they will either be extremely honest and give the XCR team their (our) money - or they will take off with it. I would still love to hear the devs backup plan in case of a complete heist of the 750 btc that BTER holds. Would it be game over? Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. Yes people seem to think bter running is completely out of the equation. It is a huge probability at this point. Essentially were banking on good faith from bter. |
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megashira1
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Activity: 1146
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August 16, 2014, 06:30:16 PM |
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Is it safe to keep my Crypti @ BTER?
you have no other option |
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SyRenity
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August 16, 2014, 06:32:07 PM |
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I would still love to hear the devs backup plan in case of a complete heist of the 750 btc that BTER holds. Would it be game over?
Following being presented by Bter internal details, we are confident they will uphold their part of the deal, and provide us with the raised funds following the launch. We are preparing a method to give the community peace of mind regarding these funds, and will post it's details once ready. |
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megashira1
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Activity: 1146
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August 16, 2014, 06:33:58 PM |
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I would still love to hear the devs backup plan in case of a complete heist of the 750 btc that BTER holds. Would it be game over?
Following being presented by Bter internal details, we are confident they will uphold their part of the deal, and provide us with the raised funds following the launch.
We are preparing a method to give the community peace of mind regarding these funds, and will post it's details once ready.Ok, this is good. |
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rtrtcrypto
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August 16, 2014, 06:37:11 PM |
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THIS IS GREAT! Awaiting details... I would still love to hear the devs backup plan in case of a complete heist of the 750 btc that BTER holds. Would it be game over?
Following being presented by Bter internal details, we are confident they will uphold their part of the deal, and provide us with the raised funds following the launch. We are preparing a method to give the community peace of mind regarding these funds, and will post it's details once ready. |
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Sparky_eMunie
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August 16, 2014, 06:38:05 PM |
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will bter die? what do u think guys?
BTER is a well established exchange with a good international reputation. It should survive because the hacker apparently did not use TOR to disguise his IP address. If this surprising newflash proves correct, he should be picked up fairly quickly and forced to return the NXT. End of controversy. The hacker is just a kid who is (following the heist and subsequent blackmail) very seriously out of his depth. If located in any countries who subscribe to the European Arrest Warrant Scheme (that is, most countries including Ukraine but not Russia) he will be lifted and extradited by Interpol. If US based, heaven knows what they will do to him. Put him on death row probably. At very least, they will be keen to take pictures of his johnson. Well at the moment the numbers still look good for Bter just 10 BTC off of Bittrex  What is the link to this statistic? |
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cryptozim
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August 16, 2014, 06:39:50 PM |
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Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. You trust BTER more than CRYPTI devs at this point in time? In this situation you have to trust someone. You either trust Bter not to run off with the BTC, or you trust the Crypti devs not to run off with the BTC. Those are the only options. In this case, my opinion is for the devs to keep their word on one thing. Something that haven't been very good at so far. |
BTC: 15h26g3SUu6iXUi1phv5FHmASc5hDeGHpJ | LSK: 840098997497226041L | CSC: cMsbRGMLzu7Ss8L7Vv6osksUyt5P322uxS
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rtrtcrypto
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August 16, 2014, 06:43:13 PM |
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I don't agree at all. But, to each his own. The devs have been very open to the community and have shown their hand almost every time things have gotten tough. BTER has proven to be incompetent - DEVS here have not. I will take over eager and a bit slow over incompetent ANYDAY. Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. You trust BTER more than CRYPTI devs at this point in time? In this situation you have to trust someone. You either trust Bter not to run off with the BTC, or you trust the Crypti devs not to run off with the BTC. Those are the only options. In this case, my opinion is for the devs to keep their word on one thing. Something that haven't been very good at so far. |
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samsmith16
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August 16, 2014, 06:50:14 PM |
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Quantum, As for SubStrata, the so called Master(bater) of the Universe, it is obvious that he is just an adolescent investing his allowance so he can buy another game for his X-box. He is unwilling to learn from those of us with experience, and insists on peeing on the electric fence for himself. You cant train a pig by wrestling him in the mud, because the pig likes it. As for the price of BTC falling: BTC is being sold to raise capital. The BTC price has closely followed the stock markets, where margin trading is the rule. For those that do not know what margin trading is, it means you pay 10% of the price and borrow the 90% balance at 2% interest. This allows a trader to buy 10 times as much stock for the same stake. If the stock rises, the trader either sells and pays the loan, or lets it ride. Since a trader has to maintain the 10% equity in the stock, if the price falls, he must come up with more cash to maintain the 10% level. This is called a "margin call". Bad part is that to fund a margin call, a trader will sell some of the stock, which causes the stock price to fall further, which necessitates further margin calls, and more selling, more margin calls, more selling, etc............ Anyway, the stock markets have reached what is called a "SIX SIGMA" event. That means an event with a chance of billions to one of happening. What it is is complicated, but it is very real. The smart money is exiting the market entirely, or is investing in physical silver, gold, or mining stocks. Oil futures are also popular due to the coming war and the expected $200 a barrel price for crude. There will be much happening in the world soon, affecting both the BTC price and XCR by default. Now that it has been revealed that the MH17 plane was shot down by a Ukranian AirForce fighter with cannon fire and an air-to-air missile, the fuse has been lit on the Russian Front. Cybercurrency will play an even more important role in the future. BTC broke the barriers, but just like MySpace, Lycos, and tape players, something better, faster, and cheaper always comes along and edges the old out. XCR has a great chance at being the one that bumps BTC off the top. Litoshi, have you studied complexity theory, like chaos and fractal market theory? Taleb, Mandelbrot, and Edgar Peters have written some good books on the subject. Your outlook is very similar to my own. This is the second time in 12hrs I'm seeing the words "SIX SIGMA" I totally unrelated fields... The first place was talking about LEAN as well... I must look in to this all... Where is a good place to start? |
▐ Royalties▐ pays interest on Term Deposits up to 15%!! Yes even Cold Storage!! |
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samsmith16
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August 16, 2014, 06:52:23 PM |
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will bter die? what do u think guys?
BTER is a well established exchange with a good international reputation. It should survive because the hacker apparently did not use TOR to disguise his IP address. If this surprising newflash proves correct, he should be picked up fairly quickly and forced to return the NXT. End of controversy. The hacker is just a kid who is (following the heist and subsequent blackmail) very seriously out of his depth. If located in any countries who subscribe to the European Arrest Warrant Scheme (that is, most countries including Ukraine but not Russia) he will be lifted and extradited by Interpol. If US based, heaven knows what they will do to him. Put him on death row probably. At very least, they will be keen to take pictures of his johnson. Well at the moment the numbers still look good for Bter just 10 BTC off of Bittrex What is the link to this statistic? |
▐ Royalties▐ pays interest on Term Deposits up to 15%!! Yes even Cold Storage!! |
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rtrtcrypto
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August 16, 2014, 06:54:37 PM |
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to START: http://www.amazon.com/The-Misbehavior-Markets-Financial-Turbulence/dp/0465043577/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1408215259&sr=8-1&keywords=mandelbrotQuantum, As for SubStrata, the so called Master(bater) of the Universe, it is obvious that he is just an adolescent investing his allowance so he can buy another game for his X-box. He is unwilling to learn from those of us with experience, and insists on peeing on the electric fence for himself. You cant train a pig by wrestling him in the mud, because the pig likes it. As for the price of BTC falling: BTC is being sold to raise capital. The BTC price has closely followed the stock markets, where margin trading is the rule. For those that do not know what margin trading is, it means you pay 10% of the price and borrow the 90% balance at 2% interest. This allows a trader to buy 10 times as much stock for the same stake. If the stock rises, the trader either sells and pays the loan, or lets it ride. Since a trader has to maintain the 10% equity in the stock, if the price falls, he must come up with more cash to maintain the 10% level. This is called a "margin call". Bad part is that to fund a margin call, a trader will sell some of the stock, which causes the stock price to fall further, which necessitates further margin calls, and more selling, more margin calls, more selling, etc............ Anyway, the stock markets have reached what is called a "SIX SIGMA" event. That means an event with a chance of billions to one of happening. What it is is complicated, but it is very real. The smart money is exiting the market entirely, or is investing in physical silver, gold, or mining stocks. Oil futures are also popular due to the coming war and the expected $200 a barrel price for crude. There will be much happening in the world soon, affecting both the BTC price and XCR by default. Now that it has been revealed that the MH17 plane was shot down by a Ukranian AirForce fighter with cannon fire and an air-to-air missile, the fuse has been lit on the Russian Front. Cybercurrency will play an even more important role in the future. BTC broke the barriers, but just like MySpace, Lycos, and tape players, something better, faster, and cheaper always comes along and edges the old out. XCR has a great chance at being the one that bumps BTC off the top. Litoshi, have you studied complexity theory, like chaos and fractal market theory? Taleb, Mandelbrot, and Edgar Peters have written some good books on the subject. Your outlook is very similar to my own. This is the second time in 12hrs I'm seeing the words "SIX SIGMA" I totally unrelated fields... The first place was talking about LEAN as well... I must look in to this all... Where is a good place to start? |
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Litoshi
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August 16, 2014, 07:04:07 PM |
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Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. You trust BTER more than CRYPTI devs at this point in time? In this situation you have to trust someone. You either trust Bter not to run off with the BTC, or you trust the Crypti devs not to run off with the BTC. Those are the only options. In this case, my opinion is for the devs to keep their word on one thing. Something that haven't been very good at so far. We only need Bter to stay in business for a week. That will give us all time to get our personal wallets and withdraw our XCR, and for the devs to get their 750BTC, minus the escrow fee of 1%. After that.... who cares. |
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cryptozim
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August 16, 2014, 07:06:06 PM |
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Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. You trust BTER more than CRYPTI devs at this point in time? In this situation you have to trust someone. You either trust Bter not to run off with the BTC, or you trust the Crypti devs not to run off with the BTC. Those are the only options. In this case, my opinion is for the devs to keep their word on one thing. Something that haven't been very good at so far. We only need Bter to stay in business for a week. That will give us all time to get our personal wallets and withdraw our XCR, and for the devs to get their 750BTC, minus the escrow fee of 1%. After that.... who cares. Exactly. |
BTC: 15h26g3SUu6iXUi1phv5FHmASc5hDeGHpJ | LSK: 840098997497226041L | CSC: cMsbRGMLzu7Ss8L7Vv6osksUyt5P322uxS
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Quantumtangles
Member
Offline
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
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August 16, 2014, 07:07:26 PM
Last edit: August 16, 2014, 07:20:44 PM by Quantumtangles |
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Quantum, As for SubStrata, the so called Master(bater) of the Universe, it is obvious that he is just an adolescent investing his allowance so he can buy another game for his X-box. He is unwilling to learn from those of us with experience, and insists on peeing on the electric fence for himself. You cant train a pig by wrestling him in the mud, because the pig likes it. As for the price of BTC falling: BTC is being sold to raise capital. The BTC price has closely followed the stock markets, where margin trading is the rule. For those that do not know what margin trading is, it means you pay 10% of the price and borrow the 90% balance at 2% interest. This allows a trader to buy 10 times as much stock for the same stake. If the stock rises, the trader either sells and pays the loan, or lets it ride. Since a trader has to maintain the 10% equity in the stock, if the price falls, he must come up with more cash to maintain the 10% level. This is called a "margin call". Bad part is that to fund a margin call, a trader will sell some of the stock, which causes the stock price to fall further, which necessitates further margin calls, and more selling, more margin calls, more selling, etc............ Anyway, the stock markets have reached what is called a "SIX SIGMA" event. That means an event with a chance of billions to one of happening. What it is is complicated, but it is very real. The smart money is exiting the market entirely, or is investing in physical silver, gold, or mining stocks. Oil futures are also popular due to the coming war and the expected $200 a barrel price for crude. There will be much happening in the world soon, affecting both the BTC price and XCR by default. Now that it has been revealed that the MH17 plane was shot down by a Ukranian AirForce fighter with cannon fire and an air-to-air missile, the fuse has been lit on the Russian Front. Cybercurrency will play an even more important role in the future. BTC broke the barriers, but just like MySpace, Lycos, and tape players, something better, faster, and cheaper always comes along and edges the old out. XCR has a great chance at being the one that bumps BTC off the top. Litoshi, have you studied complexity theory, like chaos and fractal market theory? Taleb, Mandelbrot, and Edgar Peters have written some good books on the subject. Your outlook is very similar to my own. This is the second time in 12hrs I'm seeing the words "SIX SIGMA" I totally unrelated fields... The first place was talking about LEAN as well... I must look in to this all... Where is a good place to start? Sigma certainty may be compared to flipping coins and calculating the odds of the same side (heads or tails) continuously landing sunny side up. But this is somewhat misleading. In fact, five-Sigma describes a p-value or probability of 3 x 10(-7). That is to say, it describes something highly improbable. So what is the improbable 'thing' that it describes? P-values are used to test the probability of hypotheses being correct. There is always a null hypothesis (that X and Y are not to any extent related to one another) and a research hypothesis (that X and Y are correlated). Researchers always assume the null hypothesis as a starting point and then apply a dataset from experimental observations to see whether or to what extent the null hypothesis is improbable. When the first data relating to the Higgs Boson emerged from the particle accelerator at CERN, the null hypothesis was immediately under challenge because (as I recollect) 3-Sigma evidence brought the null hypothesis into doubt right from the starting blocks. When a fuller data set emerged, 5-Sigma certainty was announced, effectively annihilating the null hypothesis. The effect of this was that the Higgs Boson could confidently be confirmed to the waiting world as having been experimentally observed. 6-Sigma certainty is even more stringent. It may be said to overegg an already statistically certain pudding. However, as an emphatic, it forms as useful an addition to vernacular as expletives. Instead of saying that something is absolutely fucking certain, one may say instead that the null hypothesis which opposes it has been demonstrated incorrect by a 6-Sigma dataset. Edit: One of the BTER research hypotheses published by someone here present is that BTER will fold due to NXT heist losses. That is to say, they assert a correlation between the NXT heist and the imminent collapse of BTER. I disagree because the null hypothesis (that is, the hypothesis that there is no correlation between the NXT heist and the failure of BTER) has not been satisfactorily challenged. Accordingly it is logical to assume that BTER will continue to be a leading global exchange and that the NXT issue will be resolved satisfactorily. If any evidence to the contrary exists (note my use of the word 'evidence'...and for the avoidance of doubt, conspiracy theories are not the same thing as conspiracy facts), pray grace us with same or, following the injunction of Wittginstein, whereof you do not know, thereof say nothing. |
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rtrtcrypto
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August 16, 2014, 07:09:41 PM |
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But THEY DON'T HAVE A WEEK.  Why cant CRYPTI devs just demand the escrow from BTER and be done with them? Everyone in the community would vote in favor of that.
Not true. I would vote against it. Devs don't get the BTC until they've delivered a product. That was the deal. Enough deals have changed since the original announcement. You trust BTER more than CRYPTI devs at this point in time? In this situation you have to trust someone. You either trust Bter not to run off with the BTC, or you trust the Crypti devs not to run off with the BTC. Those are the only options. In this case, my opinion is for the devs to keep their word on one thing. Something that haven't been very good at so far. We only need Bter to stay in business for a week. That will give us all time to get our personal wallets and withdraw our XCR, and for the devs to get their 750BTC, minus the escrow fee of 1%. After that.... who cares. |
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bitcoinpaul
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August 16, 2014, 07:13:13 PM |
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We only need Bter to stay in business for a week. That will give us all time to get our personal wallets and withdraw our XCR, and for the devs to get their 750BTC, minus the escrow fee of 1%.
After that.... who cares.
Well, gox made it several days, too  |
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PilotofBTC
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1001
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August 16, 2014, 07:16:47 PM |
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Just to play devil's advocate. Couldn't Bter show you anyone's BTC address and say it's theirs? As I'm sure there are quite a few people that use the site and have large BTC holdings..
This has crossed our minds when doing a team conference yesterday, we will ask Bter for a solution. Solution is simple. Say they should send you 0.123456 BTC from that address as a test. Simpler solution, they can sign a message using the PK of that account. That's what signing was designed for. |
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