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Question: Do you Accept Komodo ICO conversion vs Reject Komodo ICO conversion and fund new dev team?
Accept - 140 (68%)
Reject - 66 (32%)
Total Voters: 206

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Author Topic: BTCD is no more  (Read 1314724 times)
damiano
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August 18, 2014, 07:24:39 PM
 #3741

Do you have any idea or explanation how this Coin keept it's value in this bloody days?

There is close to nothing that makes this coin looking attractive to me personel but this observed price stability fact makes me very courious. That's an indication for value.

maybe a coin that actually makes bitcoin anon has some attraction? http://finance.yahoo.com/news/bitcoin-made-anonymous-bitcoindark-unprecedented-033200415.html

maybe tech that is somewhat understandable from DarkPaper? http://www.flipgorilla.com/p/23023990364728535/show#/23023990364728535/0

maybe availability of source code in realtime https://github.com/jl777/libjl777

maybe fantastic community that knows to HODL?

maybe 5% per year interest rate from staking?

maybe expectation of anon debit card?

maybe revenue sharing from InstantDEX and teleport fees?

maybe decentralized peer to peer sportsbook coming later this year?

Then again, it could just be random luck

James

That's a lot of maybe's.  I have been following BTCD recently due to the fact it had a huge rise in price and is still holding around there despite all these dumps going on.  It's definitely peaked my interest, but from what I can tell, BTCD's value has really only been dependent on promises made by the dev(s) so far.  I don't see any major feature releases yet.  Am I missing something?
Do you know what happened to keycoin?


Difficult to say the least.  There was a full on FUD attack (nasty one) which im sure helped drive it down to its current state.
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August 18, 2014, 07:28:09 PM
 #3742

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.

I also voted no. However, I took it as being a fee too. I would change that to a yes now that i know its a minimum balance and not a fee.

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jl777
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August 18, 2014, 07:29:31 PM
 #3743

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
Yes, just another incentive to HODL Smiley
I tend to keep coming up with such ideas.
I am just worried that if BTCD gets to three digits (fiat) it might be too expensive of a requirement. I guess we can always reduce the minimum deposit factor and this will do quite nicely to limit the M of 254 multisends. The wealthy can easily afford to keep a few hundred BTCD staking forever and most people wont need the M of 254 level privacy.

I estimate this would reduce the available trading supply of BTCD quite significantly, maybe too much. That is my concern, it might work too well and create artificial scarcity and that is not good.

James

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jl777
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August 18, 2014, 07:30:07 PM
 #3744

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
due to misunderstandings, should we reset the poll

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
rlhead7173
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August 18, 2014, 07:30:59 PM
 #3745

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
due to misunderstandings, should we reset the poll

Sure, why not!

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Azeh
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August 18, 2014, 07:32:04 PM
 #3746

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
due to misunderstandings, should we reset the poll

Sure, why not!

Poll Reset!  Please vote again, if you had already done so previously.

I'm in favor, however I think the 1 btcd number should be up for debate as well.  Maybe 0.5?  What if BTCD gets to $100 per coin?  Anything is possible.

If the poll ends up in favor of For, we can then always do a related poll afterwards.
jl777
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August 18, 2014, 07:36:49 PM
 #3747

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
due to misunderstandings, should we reset the poll

Sure, why not!

Poll Reset!  Please vote again, if you had already done so previously.

I'm in favor, however I think the 1 btcd number should be up for debate as well.  Maybe 0.5?  What if BTCD gets to $100 per coin?  Anything is possible.

If the poll ends up in favor of For, we can then always do a related poll afterwards.
I did predict BTCD marketcap > LTC marketcap at some point Smiley

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Trinibits
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August 18, 2014, 07:39:48 PM
 #3748

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
due to misunderstandings, should we reset the poll

Sure, why not!

Poll Reset!  Please vote again, if you had already done so previously.

I'm in favor, however I think the 1 btcd number should be up for debate as well.  Maybe 0.5?  What if BTCD gets to $100 per coin?  Anything is possible.

If the poll ends up in favor of For, we can then always do a related poll afterwards.

I voted yes but with a lower fee in mind for the same reason
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August 18, 2014, 07:40:36 PM
 #3749

I wouldn't charge too much for teleport. If the fee is high then so few people will use it that it might as well not exist. I can go for charging 1 btcd for max security setting but if the coin reaches 10 dollars or more then sending just a simple transfer would be pricey at 1 btcd per low setting teleport.

Would it be possible to charge a percent of the market cap rather than a coin amount?
anything is possible, but querying orderbooks is not good design for this
also, it is not a fee, just a requirement to have some BTCD to be able to use teleport facilities
sort of like being part of the club.

James

Ok, in that case it makes much more sense.  So essentially it gives more incentive for people to buy and hold btcd as it allows them teleport options.  I voted no, now that I understand it more clearly I vote yes.
due to misunderstandings, should we reset the poll

Sure, why not!

Poll Reset!  Please vote again, if you had already done so previously.

I'm in favor, however I think the 1 btcd number should be up for debate as well.  Maybe 0.5?  What if BTCD gets to $100 per coin?  Anything is possible.

If the poll ends up in favor of For, we can then always do a related poll afterwards.
I did predict BTCD marketcap > LTC marketcap at some point Smiley


or maybe the US Dollar implodes and spirals into hyperinflation Shocked
valarmg
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August 18, 2014, 07:41:53 PM
 #3750

Last night I came up with a way for increasing demand for BTCD, possibly by a lot, but it is a bit controversial. At least I think it is. With the current poll kind of tied and no clear mandate, I think it is time for a new poll.

As you know there will be ability to fragment each telepod into M of N pieces, with M needed to reconstruct on the receiving end. The higher the value of N, the better privacy and N can go to a crazy high number of 254. However such a number would create some load on the network, just bandwidth and not permanent, but still it is an issue.

So, I was thinking of requiring 1 BTCD per N, meaning if you need 1 BTCD to do 1 of 1 multisig, basically no multisig. if you have 10 BTCD, then you can use N of up to 10, etc. So to be able to fully utilize multisend (? not sure of name) you would need to have 254 BTCD. Doesnt sound like much, but with only 1.2 million BTCD this will create at most 4700 people that can do M of 254 multisend and realistically much less.

On the other hand, if even 100,000 people want to start teleporting (any currency not just BTCD) they would need at least 1 BTCD to do any teleporting of anything. This would create a hardcap of 1.2 million teleporters and realistically more like 100,000 as it is safe to say there are a lot of people with more than 1 BTCD, thus lowering the available BTCD. this is why it is controversial. I dont want to artificially limit teleporting and I think 1 BTCD requirement to enable teleport is not unreasonable.

This min 1 BTCD requirement would permanently take X BTCD off market where X is the number of people who are teleporting and actually X * Y, where Y is the average M of N level that people fund. If X is 10,000 and Y is 5, that just took 50,000 BTCD permanently off the market. Is this too drastic?

I just want to be sure. Can we have a poll?

James

I hate, hate, hate this idea. Why do you need to add artificial measures to raise BTCD's price? If BTCD is used, then the price will go up. Measures that make teleporting expensive (and 1 BTCD could easily become worth a lot) will just kill the coin long term. Imagine if BTCD had a marketcap the same as bitcoin. Each BTCD would be worth 6000 dolllars and if would be too expensive for most people to teleport. What would happen? BTCD teleporting would suck because so few people used it, and someone would clone BTCD, make it much cheaper to teleport and everyone would use the new coin and BTCD would fall off the map.

Imagine if twitter had decided to charge for tweets (even a fraction of a penny). That would be killing the goose that laid the golden eggs. I fear this would do the same to BTCD longterm.
jl777
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August 18, 2014, 07:46:10 PM
 #3751

Last night I came up with a way for increasing demand for BTCD, possibly by a lot, but it is a bit controversial. At least I think it is. With the current poll kind of tied and no clear mandate, I think it is time for a new poll.

As you know there will be ability to fragment each telepod into M of N pieces, with M needed to reconstruct on the receiving end. The higher the value of N, the better privacy and N can go to a crazy high number of 254. However such a number would create some load on the network, just bandwidth and not permanent, but still it is an issue.

So, I was thinking of requiring 1 BTCD per N, meaning if you need 1 BTCD to do 1 of 1 multisig, basically no multisig. if you have 10 BTCD, then you can use N of up to 10, etc. So to be able to fully utilize multisend (? not sure of name) you would need to have 254 BTCD. Doesnt sound like much, but with only 1.2 million BTCD this will create at most 4700 people that can do M of 254 multisend and realistically much less.

On the other hand, if even 100,000 people want to start teleporting (any currency not just BTCD) they would need at least 1 BTCD to do any teleporting of anything. This would create a hardcap of 1.2 million teleporters and realistically more like 100,000 as it is safe to say there are a lot of people with more than 1 BTCD, thus lowering the available BTCD. this is why it is controversial. I dont want to artificially limit teleporting and I think 1 BTCD requirement to enable teleport is not unreasonable.

This min 1 BTCD requirement would permanently take X BTCD off market where X is the number of people who are teleporting and actually X * Y, where Y is the average M of N level that people fund. If X is 10,000 and Y is 5, that just took 50,000 BTCD permanently off the market. Is this too drastic?

I just want to be sure. Can we have a poll?

James

I hate, hate, hate this idea. Why do you need to add artificial measures to raise BTCD's price? If BTCD is used, then the price will go up. Measures that make teleporting expensive (and 1 BTCD could easily become worth a lot) will just kill the coin long term. Imagine if BTCD had a marketcap the same as bitcoin. Each BTCD would be worth 6000 dolllars and if would be too expensive for most people to teleport. What would happen? BTCD teleporting would suck because so few people used it, and someone would clone BTCD, make it much cheaper to teleport and everyone would use the new coin and BTCD would fall off the map.

Imagine if twitter had decided to charge for tweets (even a fraction of a penny). That would be killing the goose that laid the golden eggs. I fear this would do the same to BTCD longterm.
it is not a fee, but a deposit requirement
The deposit should scale according to market value, so we can reset it if it goes above $10 or so
certainly nothing like $6000!
I just thought it would be strange to allow BTCD to teleport BTC for some BTC guy who didnt even have any BTCD

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jl777
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August 18, 2014, 07:47:37 PM
 #3752

The alternative is that I could charge teleport fees in BTCD, but that makes for much more complicated code

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threecats
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August 18, 2014, 07:49:39 PM
 #3753

I think it is a very reasonable idea if the fee is scaled with the growth of btcd value.
jl777
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August 18, 2014, 07:52:04 PM
 #3754

The alternative is that I could charge teleport fees in BTCD, but that makes for much more complicated code

If it is possible to have the poll for approx deposit amount cap, I think it will help. These fears of $6000 deposits are unfounded, BTCD is not like DRK!

I think anything over >$10, $10, $5, $1, 0.1, 0.01

something like that. keep in mind this would be cap and when market price exceeds it, we would need to update it with a new version

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
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August 18, 2014, 07:53:39 PM
 #3755

I think it is a great idea! It is not unlike having to have a minimum deposit in a savings account with a bank before they give you a loan. They will also earn interest on the BTCD just like a savings account.

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August 18, 2014, 07:55:46 PM
 #3756


I hate, hate, hate this idea. Why do you need to add artificial measures to raise BTCD's price? If BTCD is used, then the price will go up. Measures that make teleporting expensive (and 1 BTCD could easily become worth a lot) will just kill the coin long term. Imagine if BTCD had a marketcap the same as bitcoin. Each BTCD would be worth 6000 dolllars and if would be too expensive for most people to teleport. What would happen? BTCD teleporting would suck because so few people used it, and someone would clone BTCD, make it much cheaper to teleport and everyone would use the new coin and BTCD would fall off the map.

Imagine if twitter had decided to charge for tweets (even a fraction of a penny). That would be killing the goose that laid the golden eggs. I fear this would do the same to BTCD longterm.
it is not a fee, but a deposit requirement
The deposit should scale according to market value, so we can reset it if it goes above $10 or so
certainly nothing like $6000!
I just thought it would be strange to allow BTCD to teleport BTC for some BTC guy who didnt even have any BTCD


You are putting barriers in the way of usage. That will reduce the number of people using it, and thus reduce its effectiveness, while also reducing the amount of fees generated (plus encouraging others to make a copy and push their barrier-less version). If BTCD is cheaper for teleporting than bitcoin, that's a reason to use BTCD instead of bitcoin. If BTCD users are getting dividends from InstantDex and teleporting, it'll be gaining in value from that, plus getting loads of publicity. (That will draw bitcoin users to all the other features in BTCD, InstantDex,privatebet,etc.)

The key to adoption is making it as easy and cheap as possible to use. Adding an artificial requirement just in the hope of gain a price rise is a bad idea longterm.
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August 18, 2014, 07:58:58 PM
 #3757

I think it is a great idea! It is not unlike having to have a minimum deposit in a savings account with a bank before they give you a loan. They will also earn interest on the BTCD just like a savings account.
Yes, my idea is to force people to stake, then when they start getting dividends on top of the 5% staking, that could create another avid BTCD HODLer

so, the first step is to get people to stake with at least 1 BTCD, preferably 254 while the prices are not so high. Then they see staking income, then dividends, then maybe they decide they want to get more.

So it is not really to charge a big fee, more to increase the number of people staking, which also makes the network stronger with more nodes.

I just envisioned all these BTC guys teleporting, and they pay a small fee in BTC, but they never had to even have any BTCD and that just seemed wrong

James

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August 18, 2014, 07:59:49 PM
 #3758

The alternative is that I could charge teleport fees in BTCD, but that makes for much more complicated code

If it is possible to have the poll for approx deposit amount cap, I think it will help. These fears of $6000 deposits are unfounded, BTCD is not like DRK!

I think anything over >$10, $10, $5, $1, 0.1, 0.01

something like that. keep in mind this would be cap and when market price exceeds it, we would need to update it with a new version

Just the hassle of having to change into a new currency, storing stuff in a new wallet could turn away numerous potential users, who in turn won't then recommend it to others.
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August 18, 2014, 08:00:32 PM
 #3759


I hate, hate, hate this idea. Why do you need to add artificial measures to raise BTCD's price? If BTCD is used, then the price will go up. Measures that make teleporting expensive (and 1 BTCD could easily become worth a lot) will just kill the coin long term. Imagine if BTCD had a marketcap the same as bitcoin. Each BTCD would be worth 6000 dolllars and if would be too expensive for most people to teleport. What would happen? BTCD teleporting would suck because so few people used it, and someone would clone BTCD, make it much cheaper to teleport and everyone would use the new coin and BTCD would fall off the map.

Imagine if twitter had decided to charge for tweets (even a fraction of a penny). That would be killing the goose that laid the golden eggs. I fear this would do the same to BTCD longterm.
it is not a fee, but a deposit requirement
The deposit should scale according to market value, so we can reset it if it goes above $10 or so
certainly nothing like $6000!
I just thought it would be strange to allow BTCD to teleport BTC for some BTC guy who didnt even have any BTCD


You are putting barriers in the way of usage. That will reduce the number of people using it, and thus reduce its effectiveness, while also reducing the amount of fees generated (plus encouraging others to make a copy and push their barrier-less version). If BTCD is cheaper for teleporting than bitcoin, that's a reason to use BTCD instead of bitcoin. If BTCD users are getting dividends from InstantDex and teleporting, it'll be gaining in value from that, plus getting loads of publicity. (That will draw bitcoin users to all the other features in BTCD, InstantDex,privatebet,etc.)

The key to adoption is making it as easy and cheap as possible to use. Adding an artificial requirement just in the hope of gain a price rise is a bad idea longterm.
What if BTCD stakers got a discounted teleport fee?
the more BTCD you had, the cheaper it is to teleport BTC or any other coin?

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
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August 18, 2014, 08:01:20 PM
 #3760

I think the idea is grand as well.  Although, it sounds like the community (myself included) needs to be educated on the subject a little more before the poll would reflect accurate voting.  Just from the responses thus far, I've kinda gone back and forth in my mind already. I've yet to vote, but it seems there's going to be a good amount of input on this subject.  Maybe give it 24 hours or something like that.... I'd like to hear more from the community before I cast my vote  Smiley

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