[ANN][XCN] Cryptonite | 1st mini-blockchain coin | M7 PoW | No Premine

[teknohog]

I was slacking around and I was thinking about trying this out. I noticed there are only an handful pools. Besides 1GH the others seem to be rather small... either everyone is solo mining this or I'm missing something.
Any news of an open AMD miner BTW? I think this is holding back.

People just prefer mining at 1GH for a few different reasons, it's already been discussed a few times.

One reason being that the closed AMD miner is tied to that pool? It's worse than simply being closed source.

[CRYPTONAIRE]

The coin is secured by the blockchain, the blockchain is secured by the miners, and the block reward is what secures the miner's honesty and produces new money (inflation). But because of the hard limit on the coin supply and no mechanism for deflation, the production mechanism (block reward) must be nerfed over time until it becomes nothing. Once the block reward drops to the point where it's no longer profitable to mine coin, a critical security component will be lost. Miners who formerly helped secure the network are likely to turn against it and use their vastly superior cpu power to compromise the blockchain. This is the major design flaw of Bitcoin and most altcoins.

To secure a coin indefinitely, the production mechanism must never be nerfed. Instead of placing a hard limit on the coin supply, it's better to make it elastic- to enable it to inflate and deflate according to it's level of use. Mining is the mechanism for inflation so the only thing missing is a mechanism for deflation. Deleting the oldest unused transactions from the blockchain would be an appropriate mechanism for deflation as well as for reducing the size of the blockchain, but it would mean the coins expire- "use it or lose it".

Cryptonite is the only coin I know of right now that has a limited blockchain but it still has a hard supply limit and no mechanism for deflation. By unlimiting the supply and incorporating a mechanism for deflation, Cryptonite could win the coin race simply by outlasting all others.

Agree with every word!!

[nachoig]

The coin is secured by the blockchain, the blockchain is secured by the miners, and the block reward secures the miner's honesty and produces new coins. But due to the hard limit on the coin supply and the lack of any mechanism for deflation, the block reward must be nerfed over time until it becomes nothing. Once the block reward drops to the point where it's no longer profitable to mine, a critical security component will be lost. Miners who formerly helped secure the network are likely to turn against it and use their vastly superior cpu power to compromise the blockchain. This is the major design flaw of Bitcoin and most altcoins.

To secure the blockchain indefinitely, the block reward must never change. What's missing is a mechanism for deflation that, over time, seeks to match the rate of inflation. The simplest mechanism for deflation would be to remove old transactions that haven't been spent in a long time and add the coins back to the coinbase. By incorporating expiration dates on all transactions and keeping the mining reward constant until the very block in which the coin supply hits the upper limit, Cryptonite could win the coin race simply by outlasting all others.

Cryptonite isn't very different in this aspect. Like Bitcoin, it has a limited supply, see the OP. The only difference is that Cryptonite has a smoothier decrease in the rewards. But after some years, the only subsidy will come from transaction fees.

Anyway, there are some altcoins without limits in the supply.

I remember Satoshi said in some post that in 20 years, Bitcoin will have a lot of volume or no volume at all.

[bitfreak!]

To secure the blockchain indefinitely, the block reward must never change. What's missing is a mechanism for deflation that, over time, seeks to match the rate of inflation. The simplest mechanism for deflation would be to remove old transactions that haven't been spent in a long time and add the coins back to the coinbase.

That is essentially what we plan to do when we implement account tree pruning. Although it's not a high priority because the account tree will remain small for a long time and the block reward will remain high for a very long time. On a side note it's also possible to burn/recycle coins by sending them back to the coinbase account.

[darkota]

The only difference is that Cryptonite has a smoothier decrease in the rewards. But after some years, the only subsidy will come from transaction fees.

If Cryptonite can guarantee that transaction fees will always equal or exceed the loss in block reward, it should be fine. Otherwise it's unnecessary and detrimental to reduce the block reward until the entire coinbase had been tapped. And as a casual user, I'd rather not pay fees until it's absolutely necessary.

I remember Satoshi said in some post that in 20 years, Bitcoin will have a lot of volume or no volume at all.

Unless Bitcoin finds a way to shrink it's blockchain by at least 90%, it's going to have 0 volume in less than 5 years.

Not true, as you can run Lite-wallets..which makes downloading the entire blockchain unnecessary. Also, as technology advanves, computers will be able to hold more and more info(RAM, memory), which also makes downloading a blockchain not as much space-consuming.

[bitfreak!]

Not true, as you can run Lite-wallets..which makes downloading the entire blockchain unnecessary. Also, as technology advanves, computers will be able to hold more and more info(RAM, memory), which also makes downloading a blockchain not as much space-consuming.

Yes I highly doubt Bitcoin will die due to a huge blockchain but it will become increasingly centralized because of it. Cryptonite enables more robust decentralization because the average joe doesn't have to spend days synchronizing with the network, it's much easier for people to setup full nodes and help make the network stronger. It also makes blockchain bloat less of a concern, the maximum block size can be higher if people don't need to download the full blockchain in order to become a full node. There is a huge debate happening right now in the Bitcoin community over whether the max block size should be raised to 20MB (requiring a hard-fork), and you'd be amazed how many people are against the idea because they think it will cause the blockchain to become too large too quickly. Cryptonite solves this problem by having a dynamic max block size which changes organically to accommodate the current rate of transactions, but since people only need the last 10k blocks to become a full node there is much less concern about blockchain bloat.

[digicoin]

There is a possibility that autopruning will be included into 0.11. Then a Bitcoin full node may requires more or less than 1 Gb disk space

[bitfreak!]

There is a possibility that autopruning will be included into 0.11. Then a Bitcoin full node may requires more or less than 1 Gb disk space

Even in such a scenario some nodes must hold the full Bitcoin blockchain. The Bitcoin wiki mentions this fact on the scalability page:

Only a small number of archival nodes need to store the full chain going back to the genesis block. These nodes can be used to bootstrap new fully validating nodes from scratch but are otherwise unnecessary.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Scalability

The core issue here is that even if you prune your Bitcoin blockchain, you still need to download the full blockchain when you first join the network, and that will require "archival nodes" as the Bitcoin wiki calls them. The network is more centralized in such a scenario because a high amount of trust is placed on those few archival nodes to supply the correct blockchain history.

The clever thing about Cryptonite is that new nodes don't need to download the full blockchain, there is no need for archival nodes to bootstrap new nodes. This is essentially due to the fact that transactions aren't linked together with scripts, the inputs and outputs simply point to other addresses. Since the account tree provides a summary of all address balances everyone can forget about old transactions.

When a new node joins the Cryptonite network all it needs is the last 10k blocks, the header chain, and the account tree. New nodes don't need to download and process every transaction that ever occurred and then build a compressed list of unspent outputs like they do in Bitcoin because the account tree is a pre-processed balance sheet which is cryptographically linked to the block headers.

This video I made some time ago discusses this topic in more detail: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb0sAmQD0Dk

[digicoin]

Non-archival full nodes and archival ones reminds me of military. I don't how military is organized in your country but in my country it is as follows:

+ Regular troops (national level): the strongest, most competent, best equipped but biggest cost to maintain
+ Local troop (province level): less equipped, less competent. Acts as complimentary army when war happens

Why local troops when this country already has the strongest ones: regular troops?

+ Improve confidence at affordable cost

I do believe that non-archival nodes can act in the same way to "local troops".

Actually it is the Plan B that makes Bitcoin network more robust (decentralized) to some extent when the Plan A to increase archival nodes (like regular troops) requires huge amount of cost.

Theoretically, I don't know if non-archival full nodes and archival ones can work together to make 2-tier protection shield to Bitcoin network or not.

It looks like to me that Cryptonite network is actually composed of all non-archival full nodes. Cryptonite implementation has to remove features of programmable money/assets and some levels of security to solve blockchain bloat.


PS:
Some guys out there believe (not prove) that "withdrawal limit" doesn't bring security to the network. Is there any detailed document to explain how it works in decentralized manner?

[bitfreak!]

It looks like to me that Cryptonite network is actually composed of all non-archival full nodes. Cryptonite implementation has to remove features of programmable money/assets and some levels of security to solve blockchain bloat.

Yes that is pretty much correct. The most fundamental difference with Cryptonite is that old transactions can be forgotten forever because there is no such thing as spent and unspent outputs. All transactions become instantly spent the moment they are included in a block. So every single transaction can be forgotten by the network after a few weeks and new nodes only need the last weeks worth of transactions in order to become a full node.

Some guys out there believe (not prove) that "withdrawal limit" doesn't bring security to the network. Is there any detailed document to explain how it works in decentralized manner?

There is a page on our wiki which discusses the type of withdrawal limits used in Cryptonite. It allows merchants to accept 0-conf transactions with a much higher level of confidence than would be normally possible. It's not a perfectly secure solution to the 0-conf problem but it's much safer than accepting a 0-conf transaction which isn't secured by a withdraw limit.

[MrDjAK]

Have problems with win wallet.Now my wallet is on "5 hours behinde" and i have 5 connections over last 3h.I have try add nodes,delete evrything in app folder,then try with new wallet.dat but the same.Any help please?

[lacomepollos]

Have problems with win wallet.Now my wallet is on "5 hours behinde" and i have 5 connections over last 3h.I have try add nodes,delete evrything in app folder,then try with new wallet.dat but the same.Any help please?

I have that problem also

[bitfreak!]

Have you guys tried syncing with cryponited instead of Qt?

[MrDjAK]

Have you guys tried syncing with cryponited instead of Qt?

Yes.Can you put in rar all files from app data except your wallet.dat. and upload?Then i will put in my app data with mine .dat?

[bitfreak!]

Have you guys tried syncing with cryponited instead of Qt?

Yes.Can you put in rar all files from app data except your wallet.dat. and upload?Then i will put in my app data with mine .dat?

I can't right now but in a few hours I can. However I would suggest you try running cryptonite on a different computer or different operating system. Some Windows machines seem to have problems running cryptonite but it's usually just qt. How do you know that cryptonited was getting stuck too?

[jwinterm]

Have you guys tried syncing with cryponited instead of Qt?

Yes.Can you put in rar all files from app data except your wallet.dat. and upload?Then i will put in my app data with mine .dat?

I can't right now but in a few hours I can. However I would suggest you try running cryptonite on a different computer or different operating system. Some Windows machines seem to have problems running cryptonite but it's usually just qt. How do you know that cryptonited was getting stuck too?

I was just able to sync on win7 with 64 bit qt, but after several crashes and deleting contents of data dir once, but then after I was synced and closed qt window, it crashed again with something runaway error, but I was able to get synced with qt...

[Shadow_Runner]

Synced wallet without wallet.dat

https://mega.co.nz/#!ehRmGQ6R!tx7ZVck-z7027O-I_oLxG02XeHTIYurN2YT6iwTTYuM

https://www.virustotal.com/ru/file/b5b4dfe1b2f77269bd95f2cb1b7ea907b44681766b234a7591f6420d2f765b7e/analysis/1425150367/

Copy your wallet.dat to safe place, then delete Cryptonite folder in AppData\Roaming\
Copy Cryptonite folder from archive to roaming
Copy your wallet.dat there

Start wallet

[bybitcoin]

Is there any update to bitfreaks' encrypted web wallet? If yes, please re-post the link again.

[bitfreak!]

Is there any update to bitfreaks' encrypted web wallet? If yes, please re-post the link again.

No not yet, I've been sidetracked with BitShop updates and some other projects. I'm kind of putting it off because I know it's going to be a hassle for me to convert the existing brainwallet code into javascript which can correctly sign a cryptonite transaction. I'm still willing to pay up to half a bitcoin to anyone who can do it for me, as I mentioned a few pages back. But I'm going to give it a shot within a few days because I doubt anyone else is going to do it any time soon.

[bybitcoin]

Is there any update to bitfreaks' encrypted web wallet? If yes, please re-post the link again.

No not yet, I've been sidetracked with BitShop updates and some other projects. I'm kind of putting it off because I know it's going to be a hassle for me to convert the existing brainwallet code into javascript which can correctly sign a cryptonite transaction. I'm still willing to pay up to half a bitcoin to anyone who can do it for me, as I mentioned a few pages back. But I'm going to give it a shot within a few days because I doubt anyone else is going to do it any time soon.

This is an important component to represent cryptonite advantage as a decentralized mobile payment  service. Mini blockchain makes it possible to put everything in a browser, blockchain itself included.