Advertising spam is not allowed

[Lucky Cris]

Can I show an example of where this system has a negative effect?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=702380.0

The dev has added pools to the list here in an order they feel is appropriate. To anybody visiting the thread for the first time all they will get to see is that list of pools in the OP.

Firstly, there are no details about any of the pools - what fees they charge, any unique qualities, any special benefits miners may want to take advantage of etc etc

Secondly, I've been watching the list as pools were being added over time. The order of the list seems to be based on nothing but the dev's idea of which he feels are the best/largest/most important pools. We were running before Dedicated and were added 4th in the list. Dedicated open a pool and are added right at the top. This is fine, it's the dev's coin and he can organize his post how he sees fit. But it's just not a fair summary for miners. Most likely 90% of people will just click the first one in the list and not bother with the rest - even though they may get a better deal mining in one of the other pools.

And wait, https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=702380.msg8178047#msg8178047
Is that not "advertising spam"?? Or is it OK for the dev to post it?

Looks like you're number 5 on the list now.

While I like the idea of less spam, this could be handled with more precise. This new policy is just going to allow the monopolization of pools as is. No doubt coin devs are going to take full advantage of this - instead of listing coins for free on the announcement... they'll be a nice hefty fee associated with it. How can smaller pools or p2pool compete?

[pandacoin]

Here, nobody give a fuck about your scamcoins pool advertisements. If you need exposure, buy ad slots. Don't cry when you banned for free advertisement.

[Lucky Cris]

An example of why this rule was desperately needed: http://imgur.com/7IY0ows

It's still unreasonable snce you don't minimise the restriction to only permit such posts. The posts in your picture are clearly only intended to advertise a pool. They use glossy colors, bold letters, urls, and bold formatting. They're there only to draw attention and end up taking space in posts and end up making discussion harder.
A one line post to update the status of a pool is nothing like that. Just a damn regular post. I can't get why pool OPs would be banned for such a post.

Right. Which is why we'll now begin to see the coin devs posting it for them as MineP.it pointed out. Not saying coin devs taking bribes... but if a pool op offered a few coins to have them post in the thread... is that fair?

[KeyserSozeMC]

Here, nobody give a fuck about your scamcoins pool advertisements. If you need exposure, buy ad slots. Don't cry when you banned for free advertisement.

You're absolutely right.

Pay BTC5-7 for nothing.

[MineP.it]

An example of why this rule was desperately needed: http://imgur.com/7IY0ows

It's still unreasonable snce you don't minimise the restriction to only permit such posts. The posts in your picture are clearly only intended to advertise a pool. They use glossy colors, bold letters, urls, and bold formatting. They're there only to draw attention and end up taking space in posts and end up making discussion harder.
A one line post to update the status of a pool is nothing like that. Just a damn regular post. I can't get why pool OPs would be banned for such a post.

Right. Which is why we'll now begin to see the coin devs posting it for them as MineP.it pointed out. Not saying coin devs taking bribes... but if a pool op offered a few coins to have them post in the thread... is that fair?

Whatever angle you look at it from it's bullshit really.
Further mining centralization for the big pools, dev's have more work to do (especially at launch when they're busy enough as it is), miners have less information and will have less updates regarding pool operations.

If a user from MineP.it came on instead of me and posted that we had a pool running - would they be banned too?
What if someone posted that xxxxxxpool was offline? Would that result in a banning?

It's all so vague and tbh I'm nervous posting anything at all now incase I'm banned for saying something that could be construed as an advertisement.

[Lucky Cris]

An example of why this rule was desperately needed: http://imgur.com/7IY0ows

It's still unreasonable snce you don't minimise the restriction to only permit such posts. The posts in your picture are clearly only intended to advertise a pool. They use glossy colors, bold letters, urls, and bold formatting. They're there only to draw attention and end up taking space in posts and end up making discussion harder.
A one line post to update the status of a pool is nothing like that. Just a damn regular post. I can't get why pool OPs would be banned for such a post.

Right. Which is why we'll now begin to see the coin devs posting it for them as MineP.it pointed out. Not saying coin devs taking bribes... but if a pool op offered a few coins to have them post in the thread... is that fair?

Whatever angle you look at it from it's bullshit really.

If a user from MineP.it came on instead of me and posted that we had a pool running - would they be banned too?
What if someone posted that xxxxxxpool was offline? Would that result in a banning?

It's all so vague and tbh I'm nervous posting anything at all now incase I'm banned for saying something that could be construed as an advertisement.

You asking me? Hell if I know! But how could they not be under this rule... one can just easily say it's paid advertising, an alt account, whatever. So there's really no way to distinguish between a genuine post versus a paid advert.

[MineP.it]

An example of why this rule was desperately needed: http://imgur.com/7IY0ows

It's still unreasonable snce you don't minimise the restriction to only permit such posts. The posts in your picture are clearly only intended to advertise a pool. They use glossy colors, bold letters, urls, and bold formatting. They're there only to draw attention and end up taking space in posts and end up making discussion harder.
A one line post to update the status of a pool is nothing like that. Just a damn regular post. I can't get why pool OPs would be banned for such a post.

Right. Which is why we'll now begin to see the coin devs posting it for them as MineP.it pointed out. Not saying coin devs taking bribes... but if a pool op offered a few coins to have them post in the thread... is that fair?

Whatever angle you look at it from it's bullshit really.

If a user from MineP.it came on instead of me and posted that we had a pool running - would they be banned too?
What if someone posted that xxxxxxpool was offline? Would that result in a banning?

It's all so vague and tbh I'm nervous posting anything at all now incase I'm banned for saying something that could be construed as an advertisement.

You asking me? Hell if I know! But how could they not be under this rule... one can just easily say it's paid advertising, an alt account, whatever. So there's really no way to distinguish between a genuine post versus a paid advert.

Nah not asking you heh. But seems as though you're the only one listening 

[ThePeePs]

An example of why this rule was desperately needed: http://imgur.com/7IY0ows

It's still unreasonable snce you don't minimise the restriction to only permit such posts. The posts in your picture are clearly only intended to advertise a pool. They use glossy colors, bold letters, urls, and bold formatting. They're there only to draw attention and end up taking space in posts and end up making discussion harder.
A one line post to update the status of a pool is nothing like that. Just a damn regular post. I can't get why pool OPs would be banned for such a post.

Right. Which is why we'll now begin to see the coin devs posting it for them as MineP.it pointed out. Not saying coin devs taking bribes... but if a pool op offered a few coins to have them post in the thread... is that fair?

Whatever angle you look at it from it's bullshit really.

If a user from MineP.it came on instead of me and posted that we had a pool running - would they be banned too?
What if someone posted that xxxxxxpool was offline? Would that result in a banning?

It's all so vague and tbh I'm nervous posting anything at all now incase I'm banned for saying something that could be construed as an advertisement.

You asking me? Hell if I know! But how could they not be under this rule... one can just easily say it's paid advertising, an alt account, whatever. So there's really no way to distinguish between a genuine post versus a paid advert.

Nah not asking you heh. But seems as though you're the only one listening 

All of us that run pools or P2Pools are listening, it's the MODS that aren't listening! If they are, then it would be nice if they answered any of the questions that have been asked to get clarification on the new very vague rule.

Side node, I PM'd a dev about adding my P2Pool to the OP list for his coin two days ago.  Still waiting to be added, and dont have any hash.  Looks like the the little Pools and P2Pool OP's are now SOL to get hash these days. 

[SecondsOld]

It is clear to me that the vast majority of members strongly oppose this rule, where a pool owner can not even state that they have added a pool for a coin.  That is absurd.  I understand it may be a few mods MO, but what about the people whom the forum is serving?  Can the mods open a poll and let the masses voices be heard?  Let's see what the numbers say.

[SecondsOld]

Ok guys i got an idea. And i will start working on it to solve all that problems.

Next to our coins i will create a way so pool owners can add their pool to coin.  Devs can then recommend them later on when they are online.

You as a pool owner can later on change info about your coin pool.

usefull for user:
- pool url
- description
- fee

Did i forget anything? Or what do you think about that solution.

AltcoinCalendar.info
PS: i will probably be banned because i have advertised:)

No good bud.  Miners want to find pool information IN THE COIN THREAD...not on your website.

[nonocoin]

support ,no spam advertising.

[DougB62]

support ,no spam advertising.

I hate spam as much as the next guy, but this rule is overreaching and completely unfair, to both pool ops and miners. I am always aware that most of the time, all of the pools are not listed in the OP, and always search the thread pages for a better option. With this rule, I no longer have that choice without PM'ing every pool op that I want to check on. And I have NO CHOICE as far as finding some new pool that may have sprung up, unless they are in the OP. Seems a bit oligarchical to me. I was under the impression that the whole cryptosphere was against control, collusion, and suppression. Maybe I misinterpreted. 

[miningpoolhub]

Can you clarify what type of inform is possible?

As I am running a pool, how can I tell our pool is running some XXX coin pool to XXX coin miners?
Do I have to PM to XXX coin author and wait to see until he adds my pool to list?
And what can I do when we add some new function or changed fee or something?


Pools are not same. Some pool have special feature like auto profit switching, auto exchanges.
And their fees are different. Pool changes, and pool need to inform their news to miners.

Actually I just posted some post to our major coin threads to inform we have added auto profit switching and auto exchange feature just some minutes ago.
I don't think I have spammed, just wanted to inform them.

Do I have to delete them?
I am a bit surprised that I unintentionally spammed.

Please tell us detailed guide like "Pool OPs can only post one time per pool, and one more to major pool changes like account merging or new feature addition"

[SecondsOld]

spam

noun

1. irrelevant or inappropriate messages sent on the Internet to a large number of recipients.

Above is the official definition of the term "spam".  

I contest that when a pool operator posts one-time that they have created a pool so that miners can mine a particular coin, that post is both highly relevant and appropriate to the coin thread.  As a miner, this is perhaps the move relevant information that can be posted in a thread, and is often my sole purpose for visiting a coin thread.  Therefore, this act is not advertising "spam" and should be permitted!  Who's with me?

[MineP.it]

spam

noun

1. irrelevant or inappropriate messages sent on the Internet to a large number of recipients.

Above is the official definition of the term "spam".  

I contest that when a pool operator posts one-time that they have created a pool so that miners can mine a particular coin, that post is both highly relevant and appropriate to the coin thread.  As a miner, this is perhaps the move relevant information that can be posted in a thread, and is often my sole purpose for visiting a coin thread.  Therefore, this act is not advertising "spam" and should be permitted!  Who's with me?

Everyone apart from the mods I think

[alani123]

Mods don't seem like they're willing to be cooperative. Hell, they avoid even to interact with people in this post anymore. I'm starting to think that there's another reason behind this shady and overly general decision rather than just limiting spam.

[TheCoinFinder]

Can you clarify what type of inform is possible?

As I am running a pool, how can I tell our pool is running some XXX coin pool to XXX coin miners?
Do I have to PM to XXX coin author and wait to see until he adds my pool to list?
And what can I do when we add some new function or changed fee or something?


Pools are not same. Some pool have special feature like auto profit switching, auto exchanges.
And their fees are different. Pool changes, and pool need to inform their news to miners.

Actually I just posted some post to our major coin threads to inform we have added auto profit switching and auto exchange feature just some minutes ago.
I don't think I have spammed, just wanted to inform them.

Do I have to delete them?
I am a bit surprised that I unintentionally spammed.

Please tell us detailed guide like "Pool OPs can only post one time per pool, and one more to major pool changes like account merging or new feature addition"

I think that the following is true:

PM OPs to add your pool to coin thread

Provide a link to your Mining thread in your SIG

Advertise your mining thread on your pool's page maybe header/footer so people know where to look for updates

Get / use twitter

[Lucky Cris]

spam

noun

1. irrelevant or inappropriate messages sent on the Internet to a large number of recipients.

Above is the official definition of the term "spam".  

I contest that when a pool operator posts one-time that they have created a pool so that miners can mine a particular coin, that post is both highly relevant and appropriate to the coin thread.  As a miner, this is perhaps the move relevant information that can be posted in a thread, and is often my sole purpose for visiting a coin thread.  Therefore, this act is not advertising "spam" and should be permitted!  Who's with me?

Everyone apart from the mods I think

Not everyone... I don't care for the sheer number of spam, but I do think the vagueness and the way this rule is being implemented should be rethought. Yes, just knowing an exchange listed a coin is informative.., and definitely there's a need to know which pools supports the coin; beneficial, but there are pros and cons either way.

Relevant and appropriate are both subjective terms... What's appropriate for one might not be for another. I consider all the weekly ads I get from store spam.. Okay, maybe not the one I get from Dillard's, but that's my point. Point is, the mods feel they're looking out for the best interest of the community as a whole. Do I agree something should be done to lower the number of spam, sure. Do I think this is the best way, nope.

Here's a thought for the mods ... Maybe the forum can add a new type if member... For those who are advertising their service. Or even provide an option (like a check mark when you post) so that marketing posts can be easily identified by everyone. Of course this will only be effective if users are allowed to filter posts (don't display solicitation posts for example). Oh, also gotta throw a few supporting rules in there... Anybody caught/reported not labeling their post as solicitation gets 3 strikes, or some shit like that. Anyway, I'm sure you guys get the idea.

Yes, this requires a little work to implement at first, but in the long run it pacifies both sides and it's sustainable. Lot less work for the mods if you ask me. But whatever.

[SecondsOld]

I think the real issue is not pool operators stating they they have set up a pool, but legitimate spam.  Posts like the below are much more inappropriate and irrelevant than a pool operator stating that they have created a pool for a coin:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=713003.msg8179584#msg8179584

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=683567.msg8178396#msg8178396

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=675631.msg8178348#msg8178348

[minerpools]

spam

noun

1. irrelevant or inappropriate messages sent on the Internet to a large number of recipients.

Above is the official definition of the term "spam".  

I contest that when a pool operator posts one-time that they have created a pool so that miners can mine a particular coin, that post is both highly relevant and appropriate to the coin thread.  As a miner, this is perhaps the move relevant information that can be posted in a thread, and is often my sole purpose for visiting a coin thread.  Therefore, this act is not advertising "spam" and should be permitted!  Who's with me?

Everyone apart from the mods I think

+1000 over 90% of the people on this thread should agree.