Blowing the lid off the CryptoNote/Bytecoin scam (with the exception of Monero)

[drawingthemoon]

Well the entire Bytecoin thing has been exposed again and again. The OP has done it himself several times. The difference this time is he is now attacking the only other CN coin of significance which is Boolberry. It was announced in the BBR thread that it was soon going to be rebranded, which is a good idea.

But let's track this down a bit more.

it doesn't matter that Sabelnikov can shovel bullshit features into his poorly named cryptocurrency,

Monero is streets ahead, partly because of the way they're developing the currency, but mostly because the "core devs" or whatever they're called are made up of reasonably well-known people. That there are a bunch of them (6 or 7?) plus a bunch of other people contributing code means that they're sanity checking each other.

Yah that doesn't make it monero truthing at all because you know they are "core devs or whatever they are called", you know because he doesn't keep track of them as there aren't enough threads to keep track of what they are called.

And that fake fight stuff between amjuarez and zoidberg, genius stuff   it spilled over to the cryptonote forum. Very nice  


Monero is hands down the best CN coin, no doubt. But excessive fucking shilling and arrogance will kill it. Arrogance and fucktardness killed Litecoin. Everything that happened in Litecoin can be traced to the arrogance of the community. The short sightedness to think that they can be Bitcoin, and everything they did revolved around it.

I see similar characteristics building in Monero. Remember, it is about consensus and comes with congeniality amongst various other factors. You cannot simply repel others with short sightedness of shitting everything and everyone else into oblivion by force. Do NOT overshill and don't try hard to come off as only subtly trying to sell Monero. There is little to no subtlety left. It is coming off as desperation day by day.

[Este Nuno]

My initial impression is that the crypto_zoidberg association with CN pretty hazy. I'm not really seeing it. But it's possible of course.

Other than that this was really interesting.

It boggles my mind why the CN developers would develop this technology and then do such stupid things. Really, really, dumb of them.

[djarot]

Thank you for your time and effort.
 
Large scandals always stack around a prominent technology. However, before you start blaming Bytecoin, CryptoNote, or any other party for all the things you do not like in this world, I suggest you also read this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory

It explains perfectly why it is so tempting to believe in villains being responsible for all humanity's problems. Be critical, think yourself. To my taste, your claim is way out of all propotions...

[Jungian]

Thank you for your time and effort.
 
Large scandals always stack around a prominent technology. However, before you start blaming Bytecoin, CryptoNote, or any other party for all the things you do not like in this world, I suggest you also read this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory

It explains perfectly why it is so tempting to believe in villains being responsible for all humanity's problems. Be critical, think yourself. To my taste, your claim is way out of all propotions...

Lol, wuut? "Blaming CryptoNote for all things in the world". Are you trolling now?

There claims are out of proportion how? They fit perfect in line with what we know about Bytecoin.

[Este Nuno]

Thank you for your time and effort.
 
Large scandals always stack around a prominent technology. However, before you start blaming Bytecoin, CryptoNote, or any other party for all the things you do not like in this world, I suggest you also read this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory

It explains perfectly why it is so tempting to believe in villains being responsible for all humanity's problems. Be critical, think yourself. To my taste, your claim is way out of all propotions...

Not really. He provided pretty strong evidence that the CN people and the BCN people are connected. Even after the CN people explicitly denied it.

[dawie]

Good thread.  Bump.  Thx for the efforts OP.

[Brilliantrocket]

The only thing Monero has going for is its name. I would not be surprised at all if it lost out to Boolberry in the long run. They've made some really impressive changes over Monero. It also seems like they are more committed to addressing bloat.

I don't understand this obsession with bloat. We've discussed this - at length. A linear improvement doesn't solve the underlying problem, it only delays its effect by a very short period of time. BBR's changes do not prune the blockchain, they provide a (relatively) meaningless linear reduction. It won't help mobile phones run BBR clients, so from our perspective it is a change that we are not willing to make. That does not deflect from BBR's change, I have the greatest respect for the work they've done, it is just that the change they've made is like me trying to use a cup as a bilge pump on a capsizing boat - it's not a solution to bloat on any level, and is not only ineffectual but may put users at risk (supposition, don't take this as anything more than a hunch).

There are two types of devices when it comes to cryptocurrency: those that can run a full node (20gb, 120gb, makes no difference), and those that can't (mobile phones, tablets). There is no middle ground. It's pointless catering to the "I'm happy with 20gb, but woah buddy, 120gb is crazy" crowd, because there are only 100 of them in the world and they're all on this forum:) So we're ignoring blockchain bloat as a non-issue for full nodes (as it is with Bitcoin) and we're addressing the matter of extremely-lightweight-clients in a completely different manner. That we choose not to use some half-measure as an intermediary should not be indicative of anything except that we don't do half measures;)

Even if it is just a linear reduction, I see it as movement in the right direction. Boolberry has a weird name and a smaller team, but I think it makes sense to hold some.

[ikanunaki]

rethink-your-strategy

Before publishing your research, bytecoin diff was about 72,000,000, then has increased 25% (about 90.000.000).

This is-your-strategy?

[yAmAdA]

It is fascinating to see all these puzzle pieces laid out so clearly. You did good detective work.

[counter]

I thought people already new Bytecoin had a shady history and that is why it hasn't bee getting attention like other similar coins.  I appreciate the work and info but I think it would have been more helpful atleast a month ago.  Doesn't make it not valuable just bad timing I guess.  Thanks for the info and work you putting into making us all aware.

[Jungian]

I thought people already new Bytecoin had a shady history and that is why it hasn't bee getting attention like other similar coins.  I appreciate the work and info but I think it would have been more helpful atleast a month ago.  Doesn't make it not valuable just bad timing I guess.  Thanks for the info and work you putting into making us all aware.

Agreed, but some of info here was new. And also it's complied into one post, instead of an ongoing battle in the threads.

[djarot]

Thank you for your time and effort.
 
Large scandals always stack around a prominent technology. However, before you start blaming Bytecoin, CryptoNote, or any other party for all the things you do not like in this world, I suggest you also read this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory

It explains perfectly why it is so tempting to believe in villains being responsible for all humanity's problems. Be critical, think yourself. To my taste, your claim is way out of all propotions...

Not really. He provided pretty strong evidence that the CN people and the BCN people are connected. Even after the CN people explicitly denied it.

They never denied it: http://bitcoinbarbie.com/cryptonote-open-source-technology-concept/

As we’ve mentioned before, CryptoNote team was not interested in building a currency. That is when Bytecoin developers took the lead. They are the team of top notch p2p and cryptocurrency developers, which have been contributing to the sphere for quite some time. They finalized our cryptographic and currency prototypes and coded a beautiful solution to represent CryptoNote.

So PDF v.1 that is on the website could have been created after PDF v.2. Considering that the timespan between the two papers is almost 1 year, the first version could have been lost and then re-created from the second one, with potential mistakes of course. Who can tell! After all, it's the world with human factor in charge.

This fact is disturbing per se. However, my point is you're trying too hard to take noise for signals and identify the patterns that don't exist...

The claim is that Bytecoin either tricked or somehow deceived CryptoNote, created at least 6 forks (including Monero), promoted them, built a community around them. Some of the mentioned coins (Boolberry, duckNote, Fantomcoin) are so far from Bytecoin, you'd have to hire a separate dev team just to keep it going. If this is true what else are those "guys" can be responsible for?

I'm sorry I'm not buying it. It's just a common sense underpinned by Hanlon's razor:

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

It's more likely that these guys are just not really from within the forum community and that is pretty much it.

This may as well be CryptoNote's PR. Such an attention to all the coins and the mysteries around them...

[Este Nuno]

Thank you for your time and effort.
 
Large scandals always stack around a prominent technology. However, before you start blaming Bytecoin, CryptoNote, or any other party for all the things you do not like in this world, I suggest you also read this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory

It explains perfectly why it is so tempting to believe in villains being responsible for all humanity's problems. Be critical, think yourself. To my taste, your claim is way out of all propotions...

Not really. He provided pretty strong evidence that the CN people and the BCN people are connected. Even after the CN people explicitly denied it.

They never denied it: http://bitcoinbarbie.com/cryptonote-open-source-technology-concept/

As we’ve mentioned before, CryptoNote team was not interested in building a currency. That is when Bytecoin developers took the lead. They are the team of top notch p2p and cryptocurrency developers, which have been contributing to the sphere for quite some time. They finalized our cryptographic and currency prototypes and coded a beautiful solution to represent CryptoNote.

So PDF v.1 that is on the website could have been created after PDF v.2. Considering that the timespan between the two papers is almost 1 year, the first version could have been lost and then re-created from the second one, with potential mistakes of course. Who can tell! After all, it's the world with human factor in charge.

This fact is disturbing per se. However, my point is you're trying too hard to take noise for signals and identify the patterns that don't exist...

The claim is that Bytecoin either tricked or somehow deceived CryptoNote, created at least 6 forks (including Monero), promoted them, built a community around them. Some of the mentioned coins (Boolberry, duckNote, Fantomcoin) are so far from Bytecoin, you'd have to hire a separate dev team just to keep it going. If this is true what else are those "guys" can be responsible for?

I'm sorry I'm not buying it. It's just a common sense underpinned by Hanlon's razor:

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

It's more likely that these guys are just not really from within the forum community and that is pretty much it.

This may as well be CryptoNote's PR. Such an attention to all the coins and the mysteries around them...

So they claim that they're not Bytecoin but they also corroborate Bytecoin's lies regarding launch?

[rethink-your-strategy]

So PDF v.1 that is on the website could have been created after PDF v.2. Considering that the timespan between the two papers is almost 1 year, the first version could have been lost and then re-created from the second one, with potential mistakes of course. Who can tell! After all, it's the world with human factor in charge.

Did you even read a fucking word I wrote? The v1 whitepaper and the v2 whitepaper have bullshit dates. Here and here. If the v1 whitepaper was lost why not just publish it and say "we lost the original, but this is what it looked like"? Why take the v2 whitepaper and strip parts out of it and then wind your system date back to fake signatures on both of the fucking whitepapers?

If it was just the v1 whitepaper it would be one thing. But the v1 and the v2 whitepaper have fake dates. This is purposeful and deceitful fuckery, and there is absofuckinglutely no reason for the CryptoNote developers to have done this except to try and lend support to the Bytecoin premine scam. How can you even try and explain it as anything else?

[smooth]

They never denied it: http://bitcoinbarbie.com/cryptonote-open-source-technology-concept/

As we’ve mentioned before, CryptoNote team was not interested in building a currency. That is when Bytecoin developers took the lead. They are the team of top notch p2p and cryptocurrency developers, which have been contributing to the sphere for quite some time. They finalized our cryptographic and currency prototypes and coded a beautiful solution to represent CryptoNote.

I'm glad you reminded me of that interview because it was one of the most damning bits of evidence against the legitimacy of this so-called cryptonote and unfortunately the OP seems to have missed it:

This test coin was presented to a large number of influential people in educational, scientific, and gaming industries, who eventually became the first miners of Bytecoin. I believe this “circle of a few” affected the way the currency developed during the next year and why the information was slow to spread. It is not in the nature or business of these participants to post on the Web, so all the mining teams grew in number through word-of-mouth only.

Really?!

1. A "large number of influential people" knew about this and none of them has ever mentioned it?

2. A "large number of influential people" knew about this and not a single one can be identified now and confirm that to be the case?

3. "It is not in the nature or business of these participants to post on the Web."' In what universe do people in the educational and scientific industries not post on the web? They invented the damn web you idiots.

4. "Mining teams" We know from the analysis of reputable and credible experts (including on this thread) that the mining algorithm was deliberately deoptimized to simulate a fake two-year blockchain. If (and I doubt it, as in I'm virtually 100% sure it didn't happen) the mining actually happened over two years, only a handful of computers (<10) were involved. There were no "mining teams."

After that interview I was certain that cryptonote was a scam. Before that I only suspected. As I posted a few months ago, the more these people keep talking the more they will out their own scam. And they did.

[Este Nuno]

They never denied it: http://bitcoinbarbie.com/cryptonote-open-source-technology-concept/

As we’ve mentioned before, CryptoNote team was not interested in building a currency. That is when Bytecoin developers took the lead. They are the team of top notch p2p and cryptocurrency developers, which have been contributing to the sphere for quite some time. They finalized our cryptographic and currency prototypes and coded a beautiful solution to represent CryptoNote.

I'm glad you reminded me of that interview because it was one of the most damning bits of evidence against the legitimacy of this so-called cryptonote and unfortunately the OP seems to have missed it:

This test coin was presented to a large number of influential people in educational, scientific, and gaming industries, who eventually became the first miners of Bytecoin. I believe this “circle of a few” affected the way the currency developed during the next year and why the information was slow to spread. It is not in the nature or business of these participants to post on the Web, so all the mining teams grew in number through word-of-mouth only.

Really?!

1. A "large number of influential people" knew about this and none of them has ever mentioned it?

2. A "large number of influential people" knew about this and not a single one can be identified now and confirm that to be the case?

3. "It is not in the nature or business of these participants to post on the Web."' In what universe do people in the educational and scientific industries not post on the web? They invented the damn web you idiots.

4. "Mining teams" We know from the analysis of reputable and credible exports (including on this thread) that the mining algorithm was deliberately deoptimized to simulate a fake two-year blockchain. If (and I doubt it, as in I'm 100% sure it didn't happen) the mining actually happened over two years, only a handful of computers (<10) were involved. There were no "mining teams."

After that interview I was certain that cryptonote was a scam. Before that I only suspected. As I posted a few months ago, the more these people keep talking the more they will out their own scam. And they did.

It's amazing they were able to create the technology and manage to fail so hard at their scam attempt.

I'd suspect one or more people behind CN fall within the autistic spectrum. The clear disconnect from how others would receive their attempts yet still being able to produce novel tech shows a clear imbalance in their mental faculties.

[Vanderi]

Hey great work, which amount of should not be understated, on the OP.

Thanks, man it will be easy to just reference to this thread in the future.

Even BrilliantRocket seems a bit stumped, which is something. Not much, but still.

Thanks.

[rethink-your-strategy]

Looks like the shilling in the Bytecoin sub-reddit hasn't stopped.

The clustering is fucking hilarious!

[lunokhod2]

Looks like the shilling in the Bytecoin sub-reddit hasn't stopped.

The clustering is fucking hilarious!

last act of desperation...

[kbm]

Looks like the shilling in the Bytecoin sub-reddit hasn't stopped.

The clustering is fucking hilarious!

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...wat  

also, 578 readers ..

Maximum shilling is in effect!

It's funny to see what less than probably five people can do with a little bit of time. Imagine if 600+ people on any other subreddit were to try out the same tactic?