⭐ Crypto.Games ⭐ Low House Edge ⭐ Wagering Contest ⭐ Daily Challenges ⭐

[Timetwister]

...

Anyway, I just invested some BTC on Crypto-Games and I see there's a quite substantial divest fee. Why is there a divest fee if I haven't even had any profits (I have just invested)?

...

From the Crypto-Games FAQ:

We charge additional divest fee for short-term investments. This is to prevent abuse. The fees are as shown below:
For investments younger than 7 days, there is a 0.3% divestment fee
For investments younger than 14 days, there is a 0.2% divestment fee
For investments younger than 21 days, there is a 0.1% divestment fee
For investments older than 21 days, there is no divestment fee
Divestment fee is calculated based on the total investment value, not on the profit/losses.

Basically you don´t have to worry about the divestment fee at all if you intend to invest for more than 3 weeks.
In general I think this system is absolutely fair and I actually prefer it to the "dilution fee" at competitor bustadice.

@Lutpin
Are there any plans to remove/add altcoins? Some of the currently used altcoins are barely seeing any betting activity.
Therefore it could potentially be in the interest of Crypto-Games to remove an unpopular altcoin in order to replace
it with a more popular one.

Thank you. I don't really understand the point of charging to divest, but it's fine. I planned to hold those BTC there for some time anyway.

It could be interesting if CLAM were added, which is already basically a cryptocurrency only used for gambling (at Just Dice, the oldest "crowsourced" casino that is still running).

[1714116238]

1714116238

[1714116238]

1714116238

[1714116238]

1714116238

[Lutpin]

In terms of effective bankroll, Safe Dice has a quite higher expected return.

And quite higher limits, which have proven to be fatal for investors in the past.
Referencing DiceSites as you did, SafeDice currently has a historical Profit/EV ratio of 38%

As an investor, you gotta know what you're looking for. Sites taking risks up to 10% of their bankroll for a single bet?
CG has other standards and mainly focuses on bankroll stability and security.

Thank you. I don't really understand the point of charging to divest, but it's fine. I planned to hold those BTC there for some time anyway.

Stability.

It could be interesting if CLAM were added, which is already basically a cryptocurrency only used for gambling (at Just Dice, the oldest "crowsourced" casino that is still running).

Unlikely, besides JD, clam has neither a usecase nor a reason for existence.

@Lutpin: Are there any plans to remove/add altcoins? Some of the currently used altcoins are barely seeing any betting activity.
Therefore it could potentially be in the interest of Crypto-Games to remove an unpopular altcoin in order to replace it with a more popular one.

One of those coins in question, PPC, was added solely based on user-votes back in 2015.
Replacing it with another "popular" coin might bring similar result eventually.

Don't get me wrong, I do not oppose listing new coins, or removing those that bring more costs than revenue.
But there's a few more things to consider than popularity/wagering volume.

[Crypto-Games.net]

Saturday's Bitcoin lottery (round 222) draw results:

Place	Nickname	Owned Tickets	Winning Ticket	Chance of winning	Reward in Bitcoin
1	diRe	10	63	6.329%	0.01264 BTC
2	Eega	13	68	8.228%	0.00237 BTC
3	NakedHiker	36	27	22.785%	0.00095 BTC

Congratulations winners


Last Slot Jackpot was 5-6 days ago. Give it a shot and win up to 5 BTC.




Catch the winning spirit!

[Timetwister]

In terms of effective bankroll, Safe Dice has a quite higher expected return.

And quite higher limits, which have proven to be fatal for investors in the past.
Referencing DiceSites as you did, SafeDice currently has a historical Profit/EV ratio of 38%

As an investor, you gotta know what you're looking for. Sites taking risks up to 10% of their bankroll for a single bet?
CG has other standards and mainly focuses on bankroll stability and security.

Letting investors risk 10 times Kelly is really stupid. Fortunately they changed that and now the average is "only" about 5.35 (only old accounts can set a kelly higher than 2). It sucks because as an investor you are diluted if you take a more reasonable risk level (2x Kelly is fine considering most of the wagered volume is in small bets).

About profit/EV, that's quite irrelevant, long term it will be 100%. Even though ideally you'd like players to make infinite small bets, and therefore having steady profits, you can't choose that, and it's good for the casino to let players make big bets. It's good as long as the casino can stand losing those bets (which obviously isn't the case for those investors that are leveraged 10:1). The variable edge feature there is quite interesting, as it lets players make very big bets (in relation to the bankroll) but by charging a very high edge, which makes it still sustainable for the casino.

How is the max payout set at Crypto-Games, is it 1 Kelly?

I appreciate that your threads are very active, that's one of the reasons why I have so far invested more in your casino than in Safe Dice, even though the expected returns seems much higher there.

[Lutpin]

How is the max payout set at Crypto-Games, is it 1 Kelly?

There's no Kelly criterion involved, the effective bankroll is the one available and every BTC in the bankroll is backed by 1 BTC in the cold wallets.
(I guess you could see that as 1x Kelly factor)

The max bet profit per bet on dice is set based on aged investments (those older than 7 days), and is 0.5% of the stable bankroll (only considering aged investments).
Those limits are lower than on most other sites (compared to their bankroll), but due to the amount of bankroll funds available, they still allow to offer very reasonable maxbet limits,
currently that's 7.88BTC profit per single bet (the max bet is fixed at 10x that number).

The variable edge feature there is quite interesting, as it lets players make very big bets (in relation to the bankroll) but by charging a very high edge, which makes it still sustainable for the casino.

In theory, that's true.
The practical example currently tells another story though.
Variance stays a b*tch.

Taking huge risks that might (are expected to) pay off still involves taking huge risks.
And nobody can guarantee that they pay off.


Edited to correct small mistakes (noted with strikeout and italic).

[Timetwister]

How is the max payout set at Crypto-Games, is it 1 Kelly?

There's no Kelly criterion involved, the effective bankroll is the one available and every BTC in the bankroll is backed by 1 BTC in the cold wallets.
(I guess you could see that as 1x Kelly factor)

The max bet on dice is set based on aged investments (those older than 7 days), and is 0.5% of the stable bankroll (only considering aged investments).
Those limits are lower than on most other sites (compared to their bankroll), but due to the amount of bankroll funds available, they still allow to offer very reasonable maxbet limits,
currently that's 7.88BTC profit per single bet.

I see you really value stability, but you are being a bit too conservative.

Setting max payout to 1 Kelly (the house edge, 0.8%) would be optimal in the case that every bet was trying to get that payout (which would be the case of maximum possible variance for the casino). As in practice most bets "target" small payouts, it's actually optimal to set a max payout bigger than 1 Kelly. Anyway, 1 Kelly would already be something completely safe and could attract more high rollers. So it would mean extra profits with no extra risk (just some more variance if bets against the max payout become a big part of the total wagered amount, which is very unlikely; but even in that case that extra variance would come with bigger expected returns for the casino, so long term it's something positive).

Something I don't understand is why you look at aged investments to calculate the max payout, instead of the current bankroll (unless it's because you can't constantly update the maximum payout for technical reasons). No matter when it has been invested it's still part of the bankroll. If people for some reason start withdrawing, the maximum payout would automatically be adjusted to 1 Kelly, so the casino would always be safe.

[Lutpin]

As in practice most bets "target" small payouts, it's actually optimal to set a max payout bigger than 1 Kelly.

I'm sorry, I made a mistake in my earlier post.
I wrote "the max bet" is set at 0.5%, when it should have been "the max profit per bet".
The max bet is fixed at 10x the max profit, allowing eg a 60BTC bet at x1.1 payout as we had it the last month.

I see you really value stability, but you are being a bit too conservative. Anyway, 1 Kelly would already be something completely safe and could attract more high rollers. So it would mean extra profits with no extra risk.

I didn't set that number (it's not my decision to make), and I personally wouldn't mind taking a little higher risk with my (personal) investment.
That being said, we see maybe 1 bet a month that comes close to the maximum limits, higher limits wouldn't net more profit if there are no bets being placed at that size.

Something I don't understand is why you look at aged investments to calculate the max payout, instead of the current bankroll (unless it's because you can't constantly update the maximum payout for technical reasons).

It provides a more stable max bet/max profit, which imo leads to a better user experience.

[Crypto-Games.net]

DOGE Lotto Round #110 will close in approx 9 hours!

Current prizes:
1st place:  84,400 DOGE
2nd place: 15,825 DOGE
3rd place: 6,330 DOGE

Total tickets bought so far: 422
Price per ticket: 250 DOGE

EV+ Lotto, 1% is added to total prize pool.


Leaders of our Wagering Contest after 10 days are listed in this post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1850986.msg26105594#msg26105594.








Catch the winning spirit!

[NiceSoft12]

Do you guys offer binary options and sports? Thanks for letting me know!

[Lutpin]

Do you guys offer binary options and sports? Thanks for letting me know!

Not at the moment, no.

[DarkStar_]

In terms of effective bankroll, Safe Dice has a quite higher expected return.

They also have had a lot more variance.

Anyway, I just invested some BTC on Crypto-Games and I see there's a quite substantial divest fee. Why is there a divest fee if I haven't even had any profits (I have just invested)?

It's a 0.3% fee, that goes down over 3 weeks till it's at 0. It's to discourage people 'day trading' their investments, and the reasoning behind it was wanting to have long term term investors I believe.

Also how often does my invested amount get updated? Generally in other places it updates in real time.

I think it's real time? Or every hour. Haven't checked my investment in a long time though as I don't really care about the P/L over a few hours.

[DogecoinMachine]

Anyway, I just invested some BTC on Crypto-Games and I see there's a quite substantial divest fee. Why is there a divest fee if I haven't even had any profits (I have just invested)?

It's a 0.3% fee, that goes down over 3 weeks till it's at 0. It's to discourage people 'day trading' their investments, and the reasoning behind it was wanting to have long term term investors I believe.

Yes, it's to encourage investors to have long term investments.

Also how often does my invested amount get updated? Generally in other places it updates in real time.

I think it's real time? Or every hour. Haven't checked my investment in a long time though as I don't really care about the P/L over a few hours.

It's updated every hour.

[eternalgloom]

Do you guys offer binary options and sports? Thanks for letting me know!

Not at the moment, no.

Lutpin, you have your username in your referral link, is that something everybody can do or is it something custom?
With me it's just random numbers and letters, can I just replace it with my username?

[DogecoinMachine]

Do you guys offer binary options and sports? Thanks for letting me know!

Not at the moment, no.

Lutpin, you have your username in your referral link, is that something everybody can do or is it something custom?
With me it's just random numbers and letters, can I just replace it with my username?

It's custom. Send me pm if you want to change it, but you'll have to change all your live links to new referral link.

[Crypto-Games.net]

Crypto-Games EV+ Lottery



Monday's Dogecoin lottery round 111 draw results:

Place	Nickname	Owned Tickets	Winning Ticket	Chance of winning	Reward in DOGE
1	Dram227	82	356	19.340%	84,800 DOGE
2	BoXXoB	141	307	33.255%	15,900 DOGE
3	Dram227	82	363	19.340%	6,360 DOGE

Litecoin Lotto round #23 will close in approx 8 hours!

Current prizes:
1st place:  0.536 LTC
2nd place: 0.101 LTC
3rd place: 0.040 LTC

Total tickets bought so far: 67
Price per ticket: 0.010 LTC

* No house edge on lotto, 1% is added to total prize pool



Bankroll of all coins combined has reached a total value of 2,801 BTC ($47,000,000) 




Catch the winning spirit!

[B4RF]

I got a question about the profit calculation of investments.

Lets say I invested 1btc and I already gained a profit of 0.5btc. Will my new profit/loss be calculated based on my initial 1btc or based on my total 1.5btc?
I saw this line in the FAQ: "Your P/L = (Total P/L) x (Your Bankroll %) x (0.7)"
So I would guess my bankroll of 1.5btc will be used but I would like to ask anyway just to be sure.

[joter85]

I got a question about the profit calculation of investments.

Lets say I invested 1btc and I already gained a profit of 0.5btc. Will my new profit/loss be calculated based on my initial 1btc or based on my total 1.5btc?
I saw this line in the FAQ: "Your P/L = (Total P/L) x (Your Bankroll %) x (0.7)"
So I would guess my bankroll of 1.5btc will be used but I would like to ask anyway just to be sure.

On your total 1.5  BTC

[nikisev]

Hi.
What about all the upcoming forks?
Will crypto-games support new coins? At least to withdraw to wallet?

[DogecoinMachine]

Hi.
What about all the upcoming forks?
Will crypto-games support new coins? At least to withdraw to wallet?

We'll give official announcement about this topic soon.


Important:
The website will be unavailable tomorrow, December 13th, starting at 7:00 UTC for a few hours. Thank you for understanding.

[DogecoinMachine]

An important step in bankroll security and announcement about future forks can be read on our blog.