[UNMODERATED] CLUSTERCOIN Topic [OPEN DISCUSSION]

[Epimetheus]

Just ask yourself this question:"If you were the dev behind CLSTR and you see this mess, what would you do?". Just be reasonable. If you are an honest guy you would probably say "Well, if people do not trust me or the project anymore I don't want their money" or maybe "get the btc in parts while development progresses in time to gain trust". But the dev does not even want to think about a step towards the investors. He is just worried about getting the BTC Think...

[forzendiablo]

im taking out money from bittrex right now, this exchange is too risky at this point

[Epimetheus]

Chris/OCminer, you two are always thoughtful in your responses so I welcome a discussion with you on why you think its a scam. You guys know where you can find me. I will not engage in this discussion on this forum after this post.  

Here's what I do know as a fact, please find me and discuss if you have more facts.

* Our ICO terms stated in the original ANN said the dev must deliver a working wallet, blockchain and blockchain explorer.  This is more than requested by some other ICO terms.
* the ICO is based on the premise that the funds were to be used for future developments of the project. Not what was available today.  This was clearly stated in the ANN.
* the whitepaper was laid out along with the source code of the available wallet for everyone to decide before investing in the ICO.

None of these things have changed since people decided to invest based on their research.  In fact, the dev has already agreed add additional requirements by doing PoD (not going to get into the validity of it, but it is another way to raise the bar).  Bittrex makes no guarantees beyond ensuring that the coins you have purchased arrive in your wallet.

The other anecdotal things I've seen is:

* 3 accounts created in a one month period (how many accounts were created during the bitcoin hype period?)
* said accounts were part of giveaway threads (how many accounts were part of the giveaways?)
* dev isn't responsive enough (do you know how much time WE have spent engaged with the community with people that insist on FUD).

This is the data I have.  In the world where FUD allows for market manipulation, we have to operate on facts.  And, as I have stated many times, everyone has agreed to hold funds until PoD is completed.

thanks,
Richie

Here's the problem:
"* Our ICO terms stated in the original ANN said the dev must deliver a working wallet, blockchain and blockchain explorer.  This is more than requested by some other ICO terms." ---> And why is that? The obvious issue is if you set a bar so low that anyone without a wallet/blockchain/blockchain explorer can open an ICO on your site, there is obviously something wrong with your site. How much time do you think will pass before you get branded as the cryptostocks of alt ICOs?

I had a discussion with Richie over this post via PM. Here's what he has to say:

1) The bar is low yes, but that is what it is.  If you think it is too low, then do not be a part of the ICO.  The alternative is people do ICOs on BCT and things like $STACK happen where users have no chance at all.  We DO NOT want to police things.  We are an escrow service.  I don't know how to say that to make it any clearer.

My interpretation from this is bittrex is going to allow anyone with a whitepaper and idea (but zero coding skills) to sell their ICOs while using the bittrex logo (read allow exploiting the brand name). All in the name of getting volume to the exchange.

Bittrex has set themselves up for major headaches.  Their best bet is to walk away from ICOs immediately.

They will lose the trust of many customers if they release the fund and it turns out to be a scam as expected.

[hashtag101]

imagine if bittrex releases the funds and the dev dissapears, they would be ruined, aswell as they would get sued. i hope they are thinking of all this aswell.
their is quite a good bit of evidence that this could be a big scam, and if bittrex doesnt responsibly listen to the community and ends up releasing the funds and it turns out to be a scam, they are just as in on the scam as the scammers, them being enablers of the scam and will have much legal trouble because it could have been prevented

No sorry, go back to law school.

IF Bittrex doesnt' release the funds they can be sued, the terms will be met.

They are the escrow, they are not supposed to decide on what is right or wrong with the future of the coin, or what the dev did in the past.

There is an agreement, in black and white, they read the agreement, and if the agreement was met they release the money, if it was not met, they return the money.

They are the escrow, not the crypto police. it is a legal problem, its a contract, and it must be followed

you guys are grasping at straws here and blaming the wrong people

[fox19891989]

imagine if bittrex releases the funds and the dev dissapears, they would be ruined, aswell as they would get sued. i hope they are thinking of all this aswell.
their is quite a good bit of evidence that this could be a big scam, and if bittrex doesnt responsibly listen to the community and ends up releasing the funds and it turns out to be a scam, they are just as in on the scam as the scammers, them being enablers of the scam and will have much legal trouble because it could have been prevented

No sorry, go back to law school.

IF Bittrex doesnt' release the funds they can be sued, the terms will be met.

They are the escrow, they are not supposed to decide on what is right or wrong with the future of the coin, or what the dev did in the past.

There is an agreement, in black and white, they read the agreement, and if the agreement was met they release the money, if it was not met, they return the money.

They are the escrow, not the crypto police. it is a legal problem, its a contract, and it must be followed

you guys are grasping at straws here and blaming the wrong people

PPL get scammed, that will be also criminal, in US btc is legal money

[jdh015232]

imagine if bittrex releases the funds and the dev dissapears, they would be ruined, aswell as they would get sued. i hope they are thinking of all this aswell.
their is quite a good bit of evidence that this could be a big scam, and if bittrex doesnt responsibly listen to the community and ends up releasing the funds and it turns out to be a scam, they are just as in on the scam as the scammers, them being enablers of the scam and will have much legal trouble because it could have been prevented

No sorry, go back to law school.

IF Bittrex doesnt' release the funds they can be sued, the terms will be met.

They are the escrow, they are not supposed to decide on what is right or wrong with the future of the coin, or what the dev did in the past.

There is an agreement, in black and white, they read the agreement, and if the agreement was met they release the money, if it was not met, they return the money.

They are the escrow, not the crypto police. it is a legal problem, its a contract, and it must be followed

you guys are grasping at straws here and blaming the wrong people

oh ya show me a signed agreement between bittrex and the dev and than you are correct. but since their is no binding agreement, and upon the discovery of NEW FACTS from the community pointing out extremely suspicious behavior from the likes of the dev that this could just be an elaborate scam, bittrex is now responsible as the escrow agent more than anyone to make the right decision. what is the dev going to do, sue bittrex?? he will never win anything because he never even developed anything. however the community coming together against bittrex if they decide to release the funds and it does turn out to be a scam, would be devastating

[prospecta]

imagine if bittrex releases the funds and the dev dissapears, they would be ruined, aswell as they would get sued. i hope they are thinking of all this aswell.
their is quite a good bit of evidence that this could be a big scam, and if bittrex doesnt responsibly listen to the community and ends up releasing the funds and it turns out to be a scam, they are just as in on the scam as the scammers, them being enablers of the scam and will have much legal trouble because it could have been prevented

No sorry, go back to law school.

IF Bittrex doesnt' release the funds they can be sued, the terms will be met.

They are the escrow, they are not supposed to decide on what is right or wrong with the future of the coin, or what the dev did in the past.

There is an agreement, in black and white, they read the agreement, and if the agreement was met they release the money, if it was not met, they return the money.

They are the escrow, not the crypto police. it is a legal problem, its a contract, and it must be followed

you guys are grasping at straws here and blaming the wrong people

Actually I have already discussed this with richie.  There is NO legal contract or agreement in place, just an informal over the internet agreement between an anonymous "dev" and Bittrex.

The "dev" has no grounds for complaint if he is not given the 350 BTC as he has no legally binding contract in place, no signature...nothing.

[galaxy]

you people have no concept of what an escrow is.

You people are blaming Bittrex??


That is the stupidest thing I have seen here on this forum in all long time.

[balk]

there is still only 1 address mining this coin...the devs... it will only take 1.5TH to do a 51% attack...if everyone started mining for 15 mins if would raise difficulty level up so dev would be unable to keep the blockchain going..you would end up with a non syncing wallet and maybe a better chance of a refund

[jdh015232]

you people have no concept of what an escrow is.

You people are blaming Bittrex??


That is the stupidest thing I have seen here on this forum in all long time.

its not about blame anymore. its about WE KNOW NOW theirs a big possibility this is just A SCAM, and WE CAN STOP IT FROM HAPPENING STILL. now that we know this, BITTREX is responsible as the escrow agent to every single investor WAY MORE than to some "anonymous DEV"

[hashtag101]

you people have no concept of what an escrow is.

You people are blaming Bittrex??


That is the stupidest thing I have seen here on this forum in all long time.

its not about blame anymore. its about WE KNOW NOW theirs a big possibility this is just A SCAM, and WE CAN STOP IT FROM HAPPENING STILL. now that we know this, BITTREX is responsible as the escrow agent to every single investor WAY MORE than to some "anonymous DEV"

You people are retarded

I lost money too, but to blame Bittrex is beyond retarded

[galaxy]

It is your fault, not Bittrex

I would lost total faith in Bittrex if they didn't release the money if the terms are met

[chilli89]

imagine if bittrex releases the funds and the dev dissapears, they would be ruined, aswell as they would get sued. i hope they are thinking of all this aswell.
their is quite a good bit of evidence that this could be a big scam, and if bittrex doesnt responsibly listen to the community and ends up releasing the funds and it turns out to be a scam, they are just as in on the scam as the scammers, them being enablers of the scam and will have much legal trouble because it could have been prevented

No sorry, go back to law school.

IF Bittrex doesnt' release the funds they can be sued, the terms will be met.

you're nuts if you think a scammer would try sue them, he would be better off hanging himself

[Chris001]

It is your fault, not Bittrex

I would lost total faith in Bittrex if they didn't release the money if the terms are met

Exactly, you guys are putting the blame of the exchange and that is not the right thing to do

I lost a shitload of BTC out of this deal, but Bittrex is just doing thier job.

We bought a bad product. Plain and simple. I blame myself for failing to do the proper research, period.

Look in the mirror guys, that is the person to blame here, US


And the dev, of course.

Im pissed as hell about this but your anger is clouding your ability to think rational here

[Epimetheus]

imagine if bittrex releases the funds and the dev dissapears, they would be ruined, aswell as they would get sued. i hope they are thinking of all this aswell.
their is quite a good bit of evidence that this could be a big scam, and if bittrex doesnt responsibly listen to the community and ends up releasing the funds and it turns out to be a scam, they are just as in on the scam as the scammers, them being enablers of the scam and will have much legal trouble because it could have been prevented

No sorry, go back to law school.

IF Bittrex doesnt' release the funds they can be sued, the terms will be met.

you're nuts if you think a scammer would try sue them, he would be better off hanging himself

+1

[Chris001]

there is still only 1 address mining this coin...the devs... it will only take 1.5TH to do a 51% attack...if everyone started mining for 15 mins if would raise difficulty level up so dev would be unable to keep the blockchain going..you would end up with a non syncing wallet and maybe a better chance of a refund

Now this is someone who is using their brain.

Pretty good idea!!

A lot better than just aiming your anger in the incorrect direction!!

Can we do this idea?

[Chris001]

guys

http://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/#money-transfer

this is website for consumer protection in the USA

I have filed my complaint
and I urge you guys all to do the same
RAMI and RICHIE don't give a shit as long they keep making money
the only way they are going to listen to people and treat us like customers is to have pressure put on them from above
if enough people that have been scammed start sending complaints bittrex will be in trouble
this has gone too far now
and i wont allow them to get away with it

This is the most asinine thing I have ever read in a long time. Good luck with that.

 

[hashtag101]

there is still only 1 address mining this coin...the devs... it will only take 1.5TH to do a 51% attack...if everyone started mining for 15 mins if would raise difficulty level up so dev would be unable to keep the blockchain going..you would end up with a non syncing wallet and maybe a better chance of a refund

Now this is someone who is using their brain.

Pretty good idea!!

A lot better than just aiming your anger in the incorrect direction!!

Can we do this idea?

Yes, let's do this. Should we start a thread for this? Start a PM chain. I think this might work, what do the rest of you thik?

[balk]

there is still only 1 address mining this coin...the devs... it will only take 1.5TH to do a 51% attack...if everyone started mining for 15 mins if would raise difficulty level up so dev would be unable to keep the blockchain going..you would end up with a non syncing wallet and maybe a better chance of a refund

Now this is someone who is using their brain.

Pretty good idea!!

A lot better than just aiming your anger in the incorrect direction!!

Can we do this idea?

i suggest setting a deadline date/time and have a community mining attack...people power will win

[stormia]

The market has been disabled for over a day now.. was that part of the terms of their agreement? I don't think so.. Something is obviously wrong with the coin and so the ICO should be returned.