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Author Topic: [∞ YH] solo.ckpool.org 2% fee solo mining USA/DE 255 blocks solved!  (Read 1514752 times)
PCComf
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November 11, 2015, 08:10:29 PM
 #3601

If my block was clearly first, why did it get orphaned?   just because they have a higher hashrate?
It was orphaned because the pool that decided which block would win was the same as the one that benefitted from winning.

EDIT: I also suspect that if another pool (such as Eligius) had orphaned the F2Pool blocks that came after that in favor of your block that a subsequent F2Pool block would not have agreed and we would have had a deeper fork. I think the problem here is that everyone is relying on bitcoin-core to do the right thing when it is entirely possible that a modified version is not playing by the same rules.
-ck (OP)
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November 11, 2015, 08:32:25 PM
 #3602

Yes that was the first orphan on this pool as kano said. I was saying a few blocks back that it was scary but it's also inevitable. This is one of the inevitable orphans due to the way bitcoin works - there is simply no way to relay blocks instantaneously everywhere in the world and avoid orphans 100%. The fact that it was actually solved by solo pool slightly earlier means it had nothing to do with slow block changes on our part. Even if we had a direct connection to f2pool, there is no way to transmit a block change from the usa to china in the milliseconds between the 2 pools solving blocks. It's also orphanged because f2pool choose theirs and then build on their own block and find the next one, forcing the issue.

Developer/maintainer for cgminer, ckpool/ckproxy, and the -ck kernel
2% Fee Solo mining at solo.ckpool.org
-ck
bkeenan
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November 11, 2015, 08:34:31 PM
Last edit: November 11, 2015, 08:51:19 PM by bkeenan
 #3603

This guy breaks it down pretty well I think. He talks about orphans at about 35 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sE7998qfjgk
So, even though you found your block first the network does not propagate the fact that you found the block until the other mine is already working on validating theirs - this is the reason that they did not recognize your block first and why the blockchain has forks and orphans. Then, whichever side of the fork (your block or his) validates their own block and finds the next block ends up being on the right side of the train tracks. I think. Which is bullshit because you found your block first.
Is this way off?
-ck (OP)
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November 11, 2015, 08:43:47 PM
 #3604

On our server the block was solved at 14:00:48.479Z, only 39 milliseconds later than yours.

The actual solve bitcoind confirmation time on the pool was:
[2015-11-11 14:00:47.133]
What kano posted was when his pool saw the block which was before yours.

Developer/maintainer for cgminer, ckpool/ckproxy, and the -ck kernel
2% Fee Solo mining at solo.ckpool.org
-ck
crunck
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November 11, 2015, 09:09:07 PM
Last edit: November 11, 2015, 10:09:05 PM by crunck
 #3605

I'm having  little play, with 130TH so far I have hit 756849921.60818958  fingers crossed Wink

Upto 1184813591.193218 now Smiley

.
.7 BTC  WELCOME BONUS!..
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.30+  ALTCOINS AVAILABLE..
kano
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November 11, 2015, 09:35:57 PM
 #3606

On our server the block was solved at 14:00:48.479Z, only 39 milliseconds later than yours.

The actual solve bitcoind confirmation time on the pool was:
[2015-11-11 14:00:47.133]
What kano posted was when his pool saw the block which was before yours.
Yeah there's random delays with data crossing the GFW
I get the impression f2pool doesn't use the relay network either
So when pools outside china see blocks found inside china (inside the GFW) is often slower.

I've also run testing on that with antpool and mining to antpool regularly sees blocks as much as 10 seconds sooner at the miner than the network, so I'm also not sure if there are other pool coded factors in that ...

This will become more apparent as block size increases.
Though, even though the blocks mined have been showing around 60% support for BIP100 for a while now - there's still no sign of the bitcoin devs doing anything about it ... as I've said for a while the bitcoind devs really don't give a crap about mining or the opinion of miners Tongue ... they all have their own agendas.

Pool: https://kano.is - low 0.5% fee PPLNS 3 Days - Most reliable Solo with ONLY 0.5% fee   Bitcointalk thread: Forum
Discord support invite at https://kano.is/ Majority developer of the ckpool code - k for kano
The ONLY active original developer of cgminer. Original master git: https://github.com/kanoi/cgminer
hopefullminer
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November 11, 2015, 09:38:38 PM
 #3607

I have been trying hard for this one.  When i saw that my stats had reset at ckpool, I thought, "no way, this is too good to be true", so I looked at blockchain, and sure enough, I did it!!

I went yelling through the house, waking everyone, "I just won $10,000"

and as i was trying to explain how I did this to my mom, I saw it had orphaned.




it was rental, I've spent about 5 btc over the past few days

Okay  This worked before so lets try it again.

In your honor of first orphan  I will mine in your name for 1 day.  If it hits we will split the block.


http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje


Hope for history to repeat


I know it is not much but i put my S5 and S3 maybe it will be that cherry on top
philipma1957
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November 11, 2015, 11:40:47 PM
 #3608

I have been trying hard for this one.  When i saw that my stats had reset at ckpool, I thought, "no way, this is too good to be true", so I looked at blockchain, and sure enough, I did it!!

I went yelling through the house, waking everyone, "I just won $10,000"

and as i was trying to explain how I did this to my mom, I saw it had orphaned.




it was rental, I've spent about 5 btc over the past few days

Okay  This worked before so lets try it again.

In your honor of first orphan  I will mine in your name for 1 day.  If it hits we will split the block.


http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje


Hope for history to repeat


I know it is not much but i put my S5 and S3 maybe it will be that cherry on top

so :

me, hopefullminer, and Fingolfin  along with wmtomlinso


 may the BTC karma gods be with us.

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.
 MΞTAWIN  THE FIRST WEB3 CASINO   
.
.. PLAY NOW ..
sloopy
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November 11, 2015, 11:56:38 PM
 #3609

On our server the block was solved at 14:00:48.479Z, only 39 milliseconds later than yours.

The actual solve bitcoind confirmation time on the pool was:
[2015-11-11 14:00:47.133]
What kano posted was when his pool saw the block which was before yours.
Yeah there's random delays with data crossing the GFW
I get the impression f2pool doesn't use the relay network either
So when pools outside china see blocks found inside china (inside the GFW) is often slower.

I've also run testing on that with antpool and mining to antpool regularly sees blocks as much as 10 seconds sooner at the miner than the network, so I'm also not sure if there are other pool coded factors in that ...

This will become more apparent as block size increases.
Though, even though the blocks mined have been showing around 60% support for BIP100 for a while now - there's still no sign of the bitcoin devs doing anything about it ... as I've said for a while the bitcoind devs really don't give a crap about mining or the opinion of miners Tongue ... they all have their own agendas.

Preach Kano
I understand exactly what you mean. I read so much about it I became nauseous.
Anyone who isn't familiar with some of your biggest bitcoin programming staff deposited under one company name...
Google blockstream and compare the employee list to the bitcoin programmers.
More than a couple, and it is a free country, but then listen and read what the conversations are when you can find them. The mailing list is the best place to start. Read from about June of this year forward, and then go back as far as you can and begin reading forward.
Extremely interesting.
Long reads, yes, but worth it for the history learned, mistakes saved, and future choices you may not be aware even exist.


On another note, I see a couple of mentions regarding custom bitcoinDs.
Doesn't this break us away from the programming team and more towards a pool operator / owner?
Some things are difficult to regulate and depend on the decisions of people. We will have fewer of those things in life as time goes on. For now you may still catch the occasional stack of newspapers where you drop your money in a can, pickup a rock, get your paper and go on, run a used tire shop for cash, sell T-shirts at concerts, or any sorts of things where there is a gray area. A place where decisions made by the management and ownership determine if it is a benefit to the community.

Outside looking in at a situation you wouldn't say a business is great just because it makes money. It must also have benefits for a (the) community who helps to make it successful. If you discovered the people running the show at that company were doing shady things to give themselves an advantage would that be ok as long as they were making good profits? Things that have byproducts like hurting their competition who do things correctly to help everyone to make more profit. Using the size of their company to leverage themselves in an even better position to tackle more situations to leverage their position.
What if you were making money based on their profits? Is it a little more OK then? Or, with the above scenario did you already assume you were in a position to be making profits while reading the question?

My main question was this:
I'm wondering if I could hear some follow up to custom bitcoinds'?
Specifically, if you guys were to make your own custom bitcoinD with that vein of feature-set, what would they be and why?
If everything is too much too list, please venture a guess at the more controversial ideas.

Well, but one caveat... For example, Kano and / or CK reply to this then they should use a mindset with a priority of being selfish and making changes benefitting them personally first.

How far is such a list from one which would better the entire bitcoin community, or at a minimum, the mining community?




More on topic in general I suppose is I am getting closer to putting one or more dedicated miners on this solo pool or selling them. I think the price drop pushes me to selling them but I am trying to justify half and half.
In a wishing world I would earn twice as much as needed so I could place half here, hah!
I must need to work harder! Giddyup.
 

Transaction fees go to the pools and the pools decide to pay them to the miners. Anything else, including off-chain solutions are stealing and not the way Bitcoin was intended to function.
Make the block size set by the pool. Pool = miners and they get the choice.
macbook-air
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November 12, 2015, 06:13:30 AM
 #3610

On our server the block was solved at 14:00:48.479Z, only 39 milliseconds later than yours.

The actual solve bitcoind confirmation time on the pool was:
[2015-11-11 14:00:47.133]
What kano posted was when his pool saw the block which was before yours.
Yeah there's random delays with data crossing the GFW
I get the impression f2pool doesn't use the relay network either
So when pools outside china see blocks found inside china (inside the GFW) is often slower.

I've also run testing on that with antpool and mining to antpool regularly sees blocks as much as 10 seconds sooner at the miner than the network, so I'm also not sure if there are other pool coded factors in that ...

This will become more apparent as block size increases.
Though, even though the blocks mined have been showing around 60% support for BIP100 for a while now - there's still no sign of the bitcoin devs doing anything about it ... as I've said for a while the bitcoind devs really don't give a crap about mining or the opinion of miners Tongue ... they all have their own agendas.

Take it easy. We've got 185 blocks orphaned so far.

-ck (OP)
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November 12, 2015, 12:05:52 PM
 #3611

Yeah there's random delays with data crossing the GFW
I get the impression f2pool doesn't use the relay network either
So when pools outside china see blocks found inside china (inside the GFW) is often slower.

I've also run testing on that with antpool and mining to antpool regularly sees blocks as much as 10 seconds sooner at the miner than the network, so I'm also not sure if there are other pool coded factors in that ...

This will become more apparent as block size increases.
Though, even though the blocks mined have been showing around 60% support for BIP100 for a while now - there's still no sign of the bitcoin devs doing anything about it ... as I've said for a while the bitcoind devs really don't give a crap about mining or the opinion of miners Tongue ... they all have their own agendas.

Take it easy. We've got 185 blocks orphaned so far.
There was nothing derogatory in his response. He was simply surprised that it took 5 seconds to propagate your block across the GFW to the relay server and assumed you're not using it.

Developer/maintainer for cgminer, ckpool/ckproxy, and the -ck kernel
2% Fee Solo mining at solo.ckpool.org
-ck
Ziploc
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November 12, 2015, 01:43:15 PM
 #3612

Thats how i hit 2 blocks and one orphan.   0.15 btc @ 300Th     all three hit within the first 5 minutes

I rented 0.35BTC 350Th...and nothing...

I also had 1.6-7 Peta for about 10 min.....LOL that was fun but nothing neither...

I must be very unlucky....LOL


BTW where is CK node located ? EU or USA
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November 12, 2015, 02:17:10 PM
 #3613

Thats how i hit 2 blocks and one orphan.   0.15 btc @ 300Th     all three hit within the first 5 minutes

I rented 0.35BTC 350Th...and nothing...

I also had 1.6-7 Peta for about 10 min.....LOL that was fun but nothing neither...

I must be very unlucky....LOL


BTW where is CK node located ? EU or USA

You are not unlucky.
You are regular)))

If everybody could find a block with only 0.35btc, this pool would oficially be magical!

Ive spent around 5btc for the last 2-3 months, and nothing.
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November 12, 2015, 02:33:51 PM
Last edit: November 12, 2015, 05:58:54 PM by armadora
 #3614

for Ckpool mining do i use nicehash or westhash for rent? or they are same performance for ckpool solo mining?
jacobmayes94
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November 12, 2015, 02:38:52 PM
 #3615

tbf the money used to rent hash could instead be put on a half decent rig or set of rigs and run for longer and you have something tangable that's worth something as well

Jacob
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November 12, 2015, 02:40:10 PM
 #3616

Thats how i hit 2 blocks and one orphan.   0.15 btc @ 300Th     all three hit within the first 5 minutes

I rented 0.35BTC 350Th...and nothing...

I also had 1.6-7 Peta for about 10 min.....LOL that was fun but nothing neither...

I must be very unlucky....LOL


BTW where is CK node located ? EU or USA

Dude you rent 350 TH with 0.35 and you expect to hit a block othwise you call it very unlucky?
Changes for hitting a block with 350 TH mining for a small period of time are very slim.
philipma1957
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November 12, 2015, 02:41:29 PM
 #3617

for Ckpool mining do i use nice hash or westhash for rent? or they are same performance for ckpool solo mining?

West hash should be better,but I have hit with either one.

Just use the cheapest price.

The Ckpool server is USA based that is why westhash should be better,but the latency edge is small.

If you want to base it on percent I would think less then 1.

So if price is .0075 at nice and 0.0076 at west , nice would be better.

If both are at .0075 west would be better.



.35  spent at .0072 is about 77 to 1 shot at a block.




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.
 MΞTAWIN  THE FIRST WEB3 CASINO   
.
.. PLAY NOW ..
Ziploc
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November 12, 2015, 02:48:53 PM
 #3618

Thats how i hit 2 blocks and one orphan.   0.15 btc @ 300Th     all three hit within the first 5 minutes

I rented 0.35BTC 350Th...and nothing...

I also had 1.6-7 Peta for about 10 min.....LOL that was fun but nothing neither...

I must be very unlucky....LOL


BTW where is CK node located ? EU or USA

Dude you rent 350 TH with 0.35 and you expect to hit a block othwise you call it very unlucky?
Changes for hitting a block with 350 TH mining for a small period of time are very slim.

I didn't say I was EXPECTING....just tried....it was running for +/- 3 days if I remember...and I think the cost was around 0.35...

It's a learning process....

because I'm still not convinced that slower machines even at equal hash speed have the same chances as faster ones...

If I recall well from scypt mining few years back......faster GPU were hitting blocks way more frequently that slower GPUs....

I still think this applies to asics also....

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November 12, 2015, 02:50:29 PM
 #3619

tbf the money used to rent hash could instead be put on a half decent rig or set of rigs and run for longer and you have something tangable that's worth something as well

Jacob


If I had a nickel for every time I've said this Smiley

Solo mining is alive and profitable!
Helped? Thanks! 1CXRFh4bDVFBsUzoHMMDbTMPcBP14RUTus
kano
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November 12, 2015, 03:27:30 PM
 #3620

...
because I'm still not convinced that slower machines even at equal hash speed have the same chances as faster ones...
...
It's simple maths.

Each hash you do currently has a one in 65848255179.70261383 x 2^32 chance of finding a block
(or 1 in 2.83x10^20)

So if you do 500Trillion x 3600 hashes (500TH/s for an hour) or 1000Trillion x 1800 hashes (1PH/s for half an hour),
in both cases you've done the same number of hashes thus the same chance of finding a block.

In both cases that's 1 chance in 157 of finding a block.
Of course it's all chances, no guarantees, but it is the same chances in the 2 cases.

These is no magical correlation between one hash and the next, that's the whole point of the sha256 hash algorithm.
Each hash has the same chance as the rest, no more and no less, and each hash result is 'randomly' independent of the previous.

Pool: https://kano.is - low 0.5% fee PPLNS 3 Days - Most reliable Solo with ONLY 0.5% fee   Bitcointalk thread: Forum
Discord support invite at https://kano.is/ Majority developer of the ckpool code - k for kano
The ONLY active original developer of cgminer. Original master git: https://github.com/kanoi/cgminer
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