Bitcoin has reached the tipping point

[devphp]

But it's not the tipping point after which it grows exponentially, no. It's the tipping point where people start fleeing it en masse to other technologies and undervalued cryptos. After all, why would you buy Bitcoin if you can buy something cheaper, which does the same, or even better - if you can buy something cheaper which does the same and then a few other things. Bitcoin was the bootstrapping crypto, now is the time for other technologies to take its place. It won't happen overnight, but the process has begun.

why would you buy dollars when you can buy Zimbabwe dollars cheaper?

does the same thing right?

Cheaper is just part of the argument (see: a few other things). Then again Zimbabwe dollar doesn't do the same (doesn't have as many use cases) as USD, that comparison is completely invalid.

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[raskul]

No, oil doesn't qualify, although it can be said it is more stable than Bitcoin, but you wouldn't want to sustain value with oil, unless you can buy and keep yourself a personal tanker )

sorry, you are wrong.
you can buy and sell oil in the exact same way that you can buy and sell bitcoin.

I am sure there are people who bought in oil at $110 per barrel. today it is ~$85 per barrel.
so, in your hypothesis  :

It either sustains value for everyone, or it doesn't and can be grouped into the same 'scam' category.

the same applies to oil.
I am pointing out that you continually contradict yourself, and am not correlating the price of oil with the price of bitcoin (before you begin that argument).

If you bought into bitcoin at $1000, then that was your free minded choice to do so.
If you sold out lower than you bought, then that also, was your free minded choice to do so.

just, don't expect people to believe that it was Bitcoins fault that you lost money, it wasn't.

anyway, it's been fun debating this with you. i have things to do. so i'll bid you good luck on your endeavours, whatever they may be.

You can still use oil even though its price dropped to zero, but you can't use a crypto currency if its price goes to zero - crypto currencies have no intrinsic value. Oil does have intrinsic value and hence it can't be termed as scam even if it drops in price for some unlucky buyers, at least they can burn it to heat their house or something. That's why you can't compare crypto currencies with real commodities: cryptos (all of them with no exception) have this 'artificial' value that comes from use cases people invent for them, whereas oil has a 'built-in' use case AKA intrinsic value. Hence there is no contradiction here at all, you can't compare apples to oranges.

Have a nice day.

you do realise you have come full circle to become in agreement with the point of my own argument, don't you?

[vipgelsi]

I like it to funny.

[devphp]

you do realise you have come full circle to become in agreement with the point of my own argument, don't you?

No, not at all. Your argument (if we can call that an argument, because to me it looked like an ungrounded statement) was that there is Bitcoin and the rest are scam coins. Is that what you say I have come to agreement with? I don't see how I have come to agreement with that. Sure, Bitcoin might have more use cases now than others at this time, however, that 'the rest are scam coins' statement reveals lack of thought. If you meant something else where I'm now in agreement with you, please be more clear.

[devphp]

What are your predictions for Christmas? Would miners dump bitcoins to buy gifts for their loved ones and thus would Bitcoin re-test the $300-275 level (which still has an over 50% chance to hold) this December? Price action and order books look like selling pressure is gradually mounting.

[raskul]

What are your predictions for Christmas? Would miners dump bitcoins to buy gifts for their loved ones and thus would Bitcoin re-test the $300-275 level (which still has an over 50% chance to hold) this December? Price action and order books look like selling pressure is gradually mounting.

€303.

[arieq]

Well, the higher the price doesn't make people think it should go back but give them more confidence. People in BTC area is crazy, there's no fair price of BTC since it is only a token

[LiberyOrDeath]

It has reached it a long time ago.

[e-coinomist]

What are your predictions for Christmas? Would miners dump bitcoins to buy gifts for their loved ones and thus would Bitcoin re-test the $300-275 level (which still has an over 50% chance to hold) this December? Price action and order books look like selling pressure is gradually mounting.

Why 50% chance? Any numbers to back that up?
Will test the $100 level but next spring season.

[hack_]

Every institution will reach a point in its existence where its primary function becomes self-preservation and perpetuation, instead of serving human need.

Perhaps my views are incorrect but this is how the BTC ruled crypto space appears to me now. Development of anything that does not directly benefit BTC and it's whales is both passively and actively discouraged. You can barely get a conversation going to discuss anything that offers an alternative.

[teknohog]

What are your predictions for Christmas? Would miners dump bitcoins to buy gifts for their loved ones and thus would Bitcoin re-test the $300-275 level (which still has an over 50% chance to hold) this December? Price action and order books look like selling pressure is gradually mounting.

€303.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6eIBE7Bo3U

[xcapator]

Just hold guys, ignore the dip to $300 last month, it's just manipulation! Don't feed the whales and help the bitcoin economy, ignore the easy profit, holding long time will also make you money

[HCLivess]

I think bitcoin will worth 1200$ within 1 month.

Should be in 15 days according to Bank of America 

[Daedelus]

I disagree with a lot being said here. Bitcoins are still more useful than other crypto currencies due to its usability and higher price actually. Someone mentioned why use Bitcoin if we can get other cryptos for cheaper and still have the same usability. Well, first off, most other cryptos do not have the same usability on a practical level (forget the anonymity and other shenanigans for a moment). Major corporations are accepting them and the higher price makes it more practical. Unless you call practical using 1,000,000 crypto coins to pay for a can of soda. Also, there you go again, mentioning cheaper. Why does that matter? Everyone just wants to profit, but forget that. Look at it like a currency if you want Bitcoins, or any crypto to move far.

Bitcoins are at a very low point right now, price wise, not necessarily momentum wise if you look at the big picture.

Just because 1 Bitcoin is not worth what it used to be worth is not a bad thing. If it stabilized at $200, that would be fine by me and this consistent price further ensures usability and practicality to the masses whether its for purchasing items, or using it as an investment to store money.

I do not think that all other cryptos are silly, some have good value, and by some, I mean 2-4 of them.

Just my two cents.

Bitcoin is not useful to common folks and that's what counts. Crypto currencies need to find unique use cases to generate demand to be successful. Major corporations accepting them? There are not so many yet and all that serves is to milk the Bitcoin ecosystem for fiat, the price drops as a result. The right approach would be to make it a closed loop where Bitcoins that merchants accept for goods and services are used by them to pay back their suppliers, but no, this is not happening. Bitcoins are swapped for fiat immediately, this fiat leakage needs to be fixed before this ecosystem has a chance to be as dominating the world as some dream it should be.

Bitcoin still has to test below $300 again as mentioned a few posts above, and if that holds, that could be the low in this bear market. It can't go above $500 before it re-tests and doesn't break the below $300 (~$275) target it reached in October.

What is your plan if this bear market is to continue another 12 months?

Seems devphp was right. Bitcoin's tipping point was reach, $275 was tested and destroyed.

I never knew his reasoning for his prediction of a bear market until Oct 15 (I vaguely think it was due to anticipated fiat crisis, problems for a nation rolling over debt perhaps?). Shame devphp isn't around any more really.

[hack_]

seems we are back to the 2013 situation

[e-coinomist]

seems we are back to the 2013 situation

seems we are fast forwards to the 2015 situation

[gnargnar]

Bitcoin is not useful to common folks and that's what counts. Crypto currencies need to find unique use cases to generate demand to be successful. Major corporations accepting them? There are not so many yet and all that serves is to milk the Bitcoin ecosystem for fiat, the price drops as a result. The right approach would be to make it a closed loop where Bitcoins that merchants accept for goods and services are used by them to pay back their suppliers, but no, this is not happening. Bitcoins are swapped for fiat immediately, this fiat leakage needs to be fixed before this ecosystem has a chance to be as dominating the world as some dream it should be.

quoted for wow! spot on

[okbit]

Every institution will reach a point in its existence where its primary function becomes self-preservation and perpetuation, instead of serving human need.

Perhaps my views are incorrect but this is how the BTC ruled crypto space appears to me now. Development of anything that does not directly benefit BTC and it's whales is both passively and actively discouraged. You can barely get a conversation going to discuss anything that offers an alternative.

I agree with one exception. You are right that all the so called "innovation" coins don't add enough value to make them significant. But I do think there will be a few niche coins like Doge, AppleByte, Gulden that will do well in their niche and will actually lead more people to bitcoin.

[JayJuanGee]

The tipping point seems to be more apparent now, after 12 months of downward price pressures, and nearly another 12 months of fairly flat with plenty of ongoing BTC infrastructure developments in the meantime.